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STATE OF ALABAMADEPARTMENT OF CONSERVATION

AND NATURAL RESOURCES

ADVISORY BOARD MEETING

March 12, 2011

Pages 1 through 166

PREPARED BY:

Haislip, Ragan, Green, Starkie & Watson, PC

Suite 505 - 500 Interstate Park DriveMontgomery, AL 36109Phone: 334.263.4455

Fax: 334.263.9167E-mail: [email protected]

Web address: www.haislipragan.com

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DCNR Advi sory Board Meet i ng DCNR Advi sory Board Meet i ng March 12, 2011

334. 263. 4455Hai sl i p, Ragan, Gr een, St ar ki e & Wat son, P. C.

Page 1

STATE OF ALABAMA DEPARTMENT OF

CONSERVATI ON AND NATURAL RESOURCES

ADVI SORY BOARD MEETI NG

Mar ch 12, 2011

* * * * * * * * * * * * *

TRANSCRI PT OF PROCEEDI NGS

* * * * * * * * * * * * *

Proceedi ngs t aken bef or e Tr acye

Sadl er Bl ackwel l , Cer t i f i ed Cour t Repor t er , ACCR

No. 294, and Commi ss i oner f or t he St at e of Al abama

at Lar ge, at Vest avi a Hi l l s Hi gh School , Vest avi a

Hi l l s, Al abama, on Sat ur day, Mar ch 12, 2011,

commenci ng at approxi mat el y 9: 00 a. m.

* * * * * * * * * * * * *

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Page 2

1 BOARD MEMBERS PRESENT:

2 Mr . Dan Moul t r i e, Chai r man Mr . Gunt er Guy, Commi ssi oner

3 Mr . Gai nes Smi th Mr . J ohn McMi l l an

4 Mr . Grady Har t zog Mr . Br ock J ones

5 Mr . Grant LynchMr . War r en St r i ckl and

6 Mr . Raymond J ones Mr . Bob Shi pp

7 Mr . Bi l l Hat l ey Mr . J oey Dobbs

8

9 * * * * * * * * * * * *

10 I NDEX

11

12 CALL TO ORDER 4

13 I NVOCATI ON 4

14 I NTRODUCTI ON OF BOARD MEMBERS 5

15 APPROVAL OF MI NUTES OF LAST MEETI NG 7

16 PUBLI C HEARI NG 17

17 Pete Bar ber 17 Avery Bat es 20

18 Paul Farmer 23 Mar k Kol i nski 25

19 Ri nar d Leonard 32 Bi l l y Smi t h 34

20 Randy Year gan 35 Cynt hi a Robi nson 3921 J ack Cr opp 46

Randal Chappel l 4922 Fr ank Fi ncher 53

23 ( I ndex cont i nued on next page)

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Page 3

1 I NDEX ( cont i nued)

2 Danny Foster 56 St eve Huf f aker 60

3 Mi chael Wade J ones 66 Don Kni ght 69

4 Loui e Mat tocks 74 Kel vi n Bai l ey 76

5 Scot t Cherones 78 Paul J ef f r eys 82

6 Mi chael Lat hem 90 Randy St . J ohn 92

7 J erome Boone 98 Susan Mor r ow 106

8 J ohnny Rober t s 108

Der r el l Wr i ght 1099 Mi ke Bagwel l 113

10 OLD BUSI NESS 117

11 Mot i on by Mr . St r i ckl and - Make 120 Bow- Mount ed Range Fi nder s Legal on Bows

12 Mot i on by Mr . Lynch - Appr oval of 128

13 Wi l dl i f e and Fr eshwat er Fi sher i es Recommendat i ons wi t h t he Amendment

14 Mot i on by Mr . Shi pp - Appr oval of 13015 Sal t wat er Angl er Regi str y Regul at i on

16 Mot i on by Mr . Har t zog - Appr oval of Wi r e 131 Basket s f or Congr essi onal Di st r i ct 2

17 Wi th Except i on

18 NEW BUSI NESS 153

19 Mr . Br ock J ones - Mot i on t o Appr ove Al l 162 Depar t ment Regul at i ons Si nce Last

20 Appr oval

21SELECTI ON OF DATE AND LOCATI ON OF 2011 165

22 SUMMER ADVI SORY BOARD MEETI NG

23

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Page 4

1 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: The March 12t h, 2011,

2 meet i ng of t he Conser vat i on Advi sor y

3 Boar d wi l l now come t o or der . I ' d l i ke

4 t o wel come ever yone t o Vest avi a Hi l l s

5 Hi gh School . The boar d i s gl ad t hat

6 you' r e abl e t o be her e t oday. The

7 i nvocat i on t oday wi l l be gi ven by

8 Mr . Bi l l Hat l ey.

9 Mr . Hat l ey.

10 MR. HATLEY: Let us pr ay. Fat her , we t hank

11 you f or t hi s great day, and i t i s our

12 pr ayer t hat you woul d be wi t h each

13 per son gat her ed her e t oday, bl ess, keep,

14 and di r ect and gui de t hem. And, Fat her ,

15 i n a speci al way we pr ay t oday f or t he

16 peopl e of J apan who have been af f ect ed

17 so gr eat l y by t he ear t hquake t hat has

18 f al l en upon t hem. We pr ay t hat you

19 woul d bl ess t hi s boar d. May al l of our

20 deci s i ons be benef i ci al and pl easi ng i n

21 t hy si ght . These t hi ngs we ask i n J esus

22 Chr i st ' s name and f or Hi s sake. Amen.

23 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Thank you, Mr . Hat l ey.

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1 The next or der of busi ness i s t he

2 i nt r oduct i on of t he boar d member s.

3 Fi r st I ' d l i ke t o i nt r oduce our

4 Commi ssi oner of Conser vat i on, Mr . Gunt er

5 Guy. Commi ssi oner .

6 Our assi stant commi ssi oner ,

7 Mr . Cur t i s J ones. Cur t i s.

8 Our Commi ssi oner of Agr i cul t ur e

9 ex- of f i ci o member , J ohn McMi l l an.

10 Our ot her ex- of f i ci o member ,

11 Dr . Gai nes Smi t h f r om t he Al abama

12 Ext ensi on Servi ce. Dr . Smi t h.

13 And t hen I ' d l i ke t o star t down on

14 t he end wi t h Mr . J ones. I f y' al l woul d

15 i nt r oduce your sel f and what di str i ct you

16 r epor t f r om.

17 MR. RAYMOND J ONES: Raymond J ones, Di st r i ct 5.

18 MR. STRI CKLAND: War r en St r i ckl and,

19 Hunt svi l l e, Congressi onal Di st r i ct 5.

20 MR. LYNCH: Gr ant Lynch, Tal l adega,

21 Congr essi onal Di st r i ct Number 3.

22 MR. BROCK J ONES: Br ock J ones, Tuscal oosa,

23 Di st r i ct 7.

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1 MR. HARTZOG: Gr ady Har t zog, Di st r i ct 2.

2 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Now, f r om t he ot her end,

3 Mr . Hat l ey.

4 MR. HATLEY: Bi l l Hat l ey, Di st r i ct 1, Gul f

5 Shores, Al abama.

6 MR. DOBBS: J oey Dobbs, Di st r i ct 6,

7 Bi rmi ngham.

8 MR. SHI PP: Bob Shi pp, Di str i ct 1, Mobi l e,

9 Al abama.

10 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Thank you very much. We

11 have one more t emporary member t oday

12 besi de me. My daught er i s t aki ng a

13 cl ass at Aubur n. She had t o at t end and

14 be par t of a publ i c meet i ng, so she

15 chose t he Advi sor y Boar d meet i ng. She

16 may r egr et t hat . I don' t know. Thi s i s

17 Ashl ey Moul t r i e.

18 Al l r i ght . The next order of

19 busi ness i s approval of t he

20 Febr uar y 5t h, 2011, Advi sor y Boar d

21 Mi nut es. Ar e t her e any changes t o t he

22 mi nut es?

23 ( No r esponse. )

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1 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: I f not , t he mi nut es st and

2 approved as read.

3 The next order of busi ness , I ' d l i ke

4 t o cal l on Commi ssi oner Guy f or hi s

5 comment s of ongoi ng acti vi t i es ar ound

6 t he s tat e of Al abama.

7 Commi ssi oner Guy.

8 COMMI SSI ONER GUY: Thank you, Dan. I

9 appreci ate i t . I j ust t hought I woul d

10 t ake a mi nut e t o t al k wi t h ever yone

11 t hat ' s her e br i ef l y about what i s goi ng

12 on i n Mont gomer y and a coupl e of t he

13 i ssues t hat I know ar e hi gh on a l ot of

14 peopl e' s l i sts, most l y bei ng ext endi ng

15 t he Febr uar y deer season and bai t i ng.

16 We wel come ever yone' s i nput i nt o

17 t hose i ssues bot h dur i ng t he week - - we

18 get a l ot of e- mai l s . We get a l ot of

19 phone cal l s. And we appr eci at e t hose.

20 We do hear what you say. We al so

21 appr eci at e t hose t hat ar e her e t oday and

22 what t hey mi ght say about t hose i ssues,

23 and we want t o hear f r om t hem. We want

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Page 8

1 t o know your posi t i ons.

2 At t he same t i me I want ed you t o

3 ki nd of know about some l egi sl at i on and

4 what pos i t i on I ' m t aki ng as your

5 commi ssi oner . I ' ve been i n of f i ce now

6 about 60 days. And, of cour se, i t ' s my

7 j ob t o do what ' s best f or bot h t he

8 hunt er s and t he peopl e, you know, t hat

9 are out t here - - t he publ i c and, al so,

10 f or t he nat ur al r esour ce, t he deer and

11 t he wi l dl i f e.

12 And so i n l ooki ng at t hose i ssues,

13 I ' ve commi t t ed t o st udy and get

14 appr opr i at e dat a and t o get sound

15 sci ence, get i nput f rom our l eaders i n

16 bi ol ogy and our pr of essor s and ot her

17 peopl e who ar e knowl edgeabl e about t hose

18 i ssues. We haven' t done t hat i n a

19 whi l e. I t needs t o be updat ed, and we

20 need t o l ook at t hat . And t hat ' s what I

21 have made a commi t ment t o do.

22 But unt i l we do t hat , I am not

23 commi t t ed t o t aki ng a posi t i on on t hat .

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Page 9

1 And so I ' m agai nst any l egi s l at i on t hat

2 woul d ext end deer season or l egal i ze

3 bai t i ng. That doesn' t mean I ' m f or i t .

4 I t doesn' t mean I ' m agai nst i t . I t

5 means t hat I want t o l ook at i t . I want

6 t o st udy i t . And what ever we do af t er

7 we st udy i t , i t wi l l be based on

8 i nf or mat i on t hat we can r el y on and

9 i nf ormat i on that al l of us can f eel

10 comf ort abl e wi t h. Because, l i ke I say,

11 we do need t o bal ance what ' s best f or

12 t he hunt er and, agai n, what i s best f or

13 t he natural resource.

14 So, anyway, we - - and I t hought i t

15 woul d be best j ust t o addr ess t hat now.

16 There i s a pi ece of l egi sl at ure - -

17 l egi sl at i on - - excuse me - - i n

18 Mont gomer y. And I have expr essed t o t he

19 l egi sl at i ve member s who ar e l ooki ng at

20 t hose mat t er s t hat same posi t i on. I ' ve

21 asked t hem t o j ust wai t , t o not do

22 anyt hi ng. Let ' s j ust not act on t hose

23 bi l l s unt i l we know what we need t o

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Page 10

1 know.

2 So, agai n, I t hi nk what ever ybody

3 says i s i mpor t ant . I have an opi ni on

4 j ust l i ke many of you have an opi ni on.

5 I f you hunt l i ke I do and l i ke you do,

6 you have opi ni ons on t hose i ssues. But

7 our opi ni ons al one shoul dn' t be t he onl y

8 t hi ng. Ther e i s good dat a out t her e.

9 Ther e i s good i nf or mat i on out t her e.

10 Ther e ar e peopl e out t her e t hat ar e

11 knowl edgeabl e about t hese t hi ngs. And

12 t her e' s no r eason why we can' t get i t .

13 So what I ' ve commi t t ed t o do i s put

14 t oget her a commi t t ee or commi t t ees,

15 what ever i s necessary. And I wi l l

16 address t hose i ssues. I ' ve t al ked wi t h

17 my depar t ment f ol ks i n conser vat i on.

18 They' r e al r eady i n t he pl anni ng st ages

19 of t hat . We' l l have peopl e bot h i nsi de

20 t he Depar t ment of Conser vat i on and

21 out si de t he Depar t ment of Conser vat i on

22 t hat wi l l be i nvol ved i n t hese i ssues.

23 So i t won' t be j ust Depar t ment of

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Page 11

1 Conser vat i on member s, and i t won' t be

2 j ust peopl e out si de t he Depar t ment of

3 Conser vat i on.

4 We' r e goi ng t o get i nput . We' r e

5 goi ng t o get - - i t ' s goi ng t o be

6 t ranspar ent . And, hopef ul l y, we' l l have

7 t he ki nd of i nf or mat i on t hat peopl e t hat

8 ar e on t hi s Advi sor y Boar d, peopl e i n

9 t he l egi sl at ur e, and mysel f can t hen use

10 t o make good deci si ons.

11 Thank you, Mr . Moul t r i e.

12 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Thank you, Commi ss i oner .

13 Al ong t hose same l i nes, t her e has

14 been so much scut t l ebut t about t he i ssue

15 of t he Febr uar y season. I t ook t he

16 l i ber t y of cont act i ng Auburn, t al ked t o

17 Dr . Di t chkof f and asked hi m f or a

18 cur r ent st at us i n hi s opi ni on as - - hi s

19 pr of essi onal opi ni on at Aubur n of t he

20 Febr uar y season. And I ' d l i ke t o r ead

21 hi s l et t er back. I t hi nk i t ' s pr et t y

22 spot - on.

23 I t says, t he recent modi f i cat i on of

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1 buck l i mi t s i n Al abama was par t i al l y

2 dr i ven by a desi re to posi t i vel y

3 i nf l uence bi ol ogi cal and soci al heal t h

4 of t he whi t e- t ai l ed deer popul at i on

5 acr oss t he stat e. I t was suggested t hat

6 r educi ng t he season l i mi t t o t hr ee bucks

7 woul d i ncrease t he number of ol der mal es

8 i n t he popul at i on and hel p t o creat e a

9 mor e bal anced sex r at i o t hat mor e

10 cl osel y r esembl ed t he nat ur al one- t o- one

11 r at i o t hat ' s f ound i n natur al

12 popul at i ons. These changes

13 t heor et i cal l y woul d have a posi t i ve

14 ef f ect i n r educi ng t he l engt h of t he

15 br eedi ng season, t her eby r esul t i ng i n

16 l ess rut - rel at ed nat ural mor t al i t y due

17 t o t he physi cal and physi ol ogi cal r i gors

18 of ext ended br eedi ng ef f or t of mal e

19 deer . Publ i shed dat a have suggest ed

20 t hat nat ur al mor t al i t y i n mal e deer

21 f ol l owi ng t he br eedi ng season can be

22 si gni f i cant .

23 The pr oposal t o ext end deer - hunt i ng

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1 season i nt o Febr uar y has t he pot ent i al

2 t o have negat i ve physi cal and

3 physi ol ogi cal consequences f or t he deer

4 her d i n Al abama. An ext ended deer

5 season wi l l l i kel y resul t i n i ncreased

6 hunt i ng mor t al i t y f or adul t mal e deer .

7 Reduced number s of mal e deer wi l l ser ve

8 t o dr i ve t he adul t sex r at i o away f rom

9 t he opt i mal one- t o- one st at e and t end t o

10 f avor f emal es. Thi s decr ease i n t he

11 number of br eedi ng mal es wi l l r educe

12 br eedi ng ef f i ci ency and r esul t i n some

13 f emal es not bei ng bred i n t hei r f i rst

14 est r ous cycl e. Femal e deer , when not

15 bred, wi l l re- ent er estr us ever y 28- 30

16 days unt i l t hey are bred. I f an

17 i ncreased number of f emal es ar e not br ed

18 dur i ng t hei r f i r s t est r ous cycl e, the

19 r esul t wi l l be an ext ended br eedi ng

20 season, whi ch can onl y ser ve t o i ncrease

21 rat es of nat ural mor t al i t y i n adul t

22 mal es due t o t he physi cal and

23 physi ol ogi cal r i gors of t he breedi ng

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1 season.

2 I ncreased hunt i ng success associ at ed

3 wi t h an ext ended hunt i ng season dur i ng a

4 per i od when mat ur e mal es ar e mor e

5 suscept i bl e t o har vest , i . e. , t he r ut ,

6 wi l l ser ve t o decr ease t he number of

7 mat ur e mal es i n t he popul at i on. Mat ur e

8 mal es ar e mor e ef f i ci ent br eeder s t han

9 younger mal es and ser ve t o decr ease t he

10 l engt h of t he br eedi ng season. Because

11 mat ur e mal es ar e mor e ef f i ci ent br eeder s

12 t han young i mmat ur e mal es, l ess f emal es

13 wi l l ent er a second estr ous cycl e i n

14 popul at i ons t hat have mat ur e mal es and

15 t he br eedi ng season wi l l be mor e

16 compr essed. Addi t i onal l y, t he pr esence

17 of mat ur e mal es i n a popul at i on ser ves

18 t o suppr ess br eedi ng ef f or t and

19 i nt ensi t y of younger mal es. Thi s

20 suppr essi on of br eedi ng ef f or t has a

21 posi t i ve ef f ect on body gr owt h and

22 ant l er devel opment of young mal es i n

23 subsequent year s. Because t hese

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1 i mmat ur e bucks put l ess ef f or t i nt o

2 breedi ng, t hey are i n bet t er condi t i on

3 f ol l owi ng t he br eedi ng season and do not

4 have t o put as much ef f or t i nt o

5 repl eni shi ng t hei r energet i c reserves.

6 The r esul t i s t hey can f ocus on body

7 gr owt h and ant l er devel opment i n

8 spr i ng/ summer as opposed t o r ebui l di ng

9 body r eser ves, and ant l er devel opment

10 and body r eser ves i n subsequent year s

11 wi l l be great er t han i f t her e had not

12 been mat ur e mal es i n t he her d.

13 I ncreased over al l buck har vest and

14 i ncreased har vest of mat ur e mal es can

15 creat e a cascadi ng bi ol ogi cal i mpact on

16 a deer herd. Whi l e our over al l

17 under standi ng of t hese i mpact s i s st i l l

18 evol vi ng, t he dat a t hat have been

19 col l ect ed on t he t opi c al l suggest t hat

20 t he r el at i onshi ps among sex r at i o, age

21 str uct ur e, popul at i on densi t y, and t he

22 br eedi ng season of whi t e- t ai l ed deer ar e

23 i nt r i cat el y l i nked wher e i mpact s on one

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Page 16

1 wi l l af f ect t he other s . As a r esul t ,

2 any pr oposal s r egar di ng changes t o deer

3 season, i . e. , l ength and bag l i mi t , i n

4 Al abama shoul d car ef ul l y consi der t he

5 body of sci ent i f i c i nf ormat i on rel at i ng

6 t o r epr oduct i on and management of

7 whi t e- t ai l ed deer . Addi t i onal l y, every

8 ef f or t shoul d be made t o pr oj ect changes

9 i n har vest pat t er ns due t o pr oposed

10 season modi f i cat i ons usi ng exi st i ng dat a

11 f r om Al abama and sur r oundi ng st at es.

12 Fai l ur e t o do so woul d be not hi ng shor t

13 of bi ol ogi cal l y i r r esponsi bl e.

14 I t hi nk t hat ' s good t o have anot her

15 sci ent i f i c opi ni on f r om a source as good

16 as Aubur n. And I apol ogi ze f or t he

17 wor di ness and t he l engt h of t hat , but i t

18 i s what i t i s.


20 busi ness i s t he publ i c hear i ng. When

21 your name i s cal l ed, pl ease come t o t he

22 mi cr ophone and gi ve your name and t he

23 subj ect you wi sh t o speak upon. I wi l l

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Page 17

1 r emi nd you t hat you may onl y speak at

2 t he t i me t hat you ar e cal l ed and any

3 i nter f erence wi l l not be tol erated.

4 Okay. The f i r s t speaker wi l l be

5 Mr . Pete Barber . Pet e.

6 MR. BARBER: Good mor ni ng, Mr . Chai r man,

7 Commi ssi oner , Commi ssi oner , Boar d

8 Member s. My name i s Pet e Bar ber . I ' m

9 t he pr esi dent of t he Al abama Seaf ood

10 Associ at i on. We r epr esent commer ci al

11 f i sher men, and we al so have char t er boat

12 f i shermen i n our organi zat i on.

13 I see a l ot of new f aces. I ' d l i ke

14 t o j ust t ake t hi s opport uni t y t o t hank

15 t hi s board f or al l t he consi derat i on

16 t hey' ve gi ven us i n t he past. And I

17 hope t hat a good r el at i onshi p wi l l

18 cont i nue, and I f eel conf i dent i t wi l l .

19 We' re bl essed i n t he stat e of

20 Al abama t o have an abundant mar i ne

21 r esour ce wel l managed by our

22 conser vat i on depar t ment t hat pr ovi des a

23 l i vi ng f or our commer ci al f i sher men and

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Page 18

1 out standi ng recreat i onal opport uni t i es

2 f or our recreat i onal f i shermen. Al l

3 t hat was j eopar di zed l ast Apr i l when t he

4 Deepwat er Hor i zon bl ew up.

5 We' re st i l l goi ng t hrough a

6 t rans i t i on phase. Thank t he Lord, i t

7 l ooks l i ke we' re goi ng t o survi ve. I t

8 l ooks l i ke al l t he worst - case scenar i os

9 were a l i t t l e bi t premat ure and

10 over stat ed. But one of t he t hi ngs

11 t hat ' s l i nger i ng i s a market res i stance

12 t o Gul f seaf ood. And l et me j ust ask

13 t hi s quest i on of t he boar d member s. How

14 many of you have a concern when i t comes

15 t o eat i ng Gul f seaf ood about t he

16 saf et y?

17 Let i t be so al l t he t i me. What we

18 have - - over t he l ast year s i nce t hi s

19 became an i ssue, we pr obabl y i nspect our

20 seaf ood pr oduct s by a f act or of at l east

21 t en mor e t han t hey' ve ever been

22 i nspected bef or e. The saf et y, as much

23 as we can det er mi ne, i s t her e.

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1 Unf or t unat el y, t here' s a l i nger i ng doubt

2 amongst t he seaf ood eat er s or pot ent i al

3 seaf ood eat ers i n t he rest of t he

4 count r y. As many as 35 per cent of t he

5 popul at i on j ust woul d not eat any

6 seaf ood f r om t he Gul f because of

7 concerns . I put a l ot of t hat on t he

8 medi a hype t hat accompani ed t he oi l

9 spi l l . And, hopef ul l y, over t i me - -

10 t hat number used t o be 70 per cent .

11 We' r e down t o 35. I n one pol l I saw

12 23. I t ' s t her e.

13 One of t he bi g di st r i but ors i n t he

14 New J er sey/ New Yor k ar ea basi cal l y t ol d

15 our crab- pi cker s down her e t hat he

16 di dn' t want t o t al k about a Gul f

17 product . That ' s a hard hi l l t o cl i mb.

18 And t hat ' s somet hi ng t hat we have t o

19 deal wi t h and we wi l l . But i t ' s j ust

20 somet hi ng I want ed t hi s commi t t ee t o be

21 awar e of and cer t ai nl y any i deas t hat

22 coul d hel p and j ust doi ng your own par t

23 i n consumi ng your 12. 2 pounds of seaf ood

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Page 20

1 a year and maybe uppi ng i t a l i t t l e

2 bi t .

3 Anyway, t hank you f or your t i me.

4 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Thank you, Mr . Bar ber .

5 The next speaker wi l l be Mr . Aver y

6 Bat es.

7 MR. BATES: My name i s Aver y Bat es. I ' m a

8 commer ci al f i sher man when t her e' s any

9 oyster s out t her e, and I ' mal so

10 vi ce- pr esi dent of Or gani zed Seaf ood

11 Associ at i on. But I ' ve been bef ore t hi s

12 boar d many t i mes over t he year s wi t h

13 concer ns of our commer ci al f i shi ng

14 i ndust ry.

15 Many t i mes t hi ngs j ust come up l i ke

16 maki ng gamef i sh st at us f or a number of

17 speci es j ust i n t he l ast t wo years. The

18 l ast t i me y' al l wer e her e i t was br ought

19 up about sheepshead. Last year i t was

20 al so br ought up about Spani sh macker el

21 and pompano. I t seems l i ke we ar e

22 speci es af t er speci es want i ng t o be

23 desi gnat ed as gamef i sh.

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Page 21

1 I n t he f ut ur e I hope y' al l

2 under st and t hat t hese seaf oods t hey' r e

3 t r yi ng t o t ake away i s t aken away f r om

4 you and ever ybody el se when t hey t r y t o

5 t ake t hese speci es away f r om us when

6 t here' s no bi ol ogi cal reason t o do

7 t hi s. So we want y' al l t o be awar e t hat

8 we do have const i t ut i onal r i ght s i n t hi s

9 st at e, and t he seaf oods ar e t he pr oper t y

10 of t he s tat e t o be hel d i n t rust f or t he

11 peopl e of t he stat e. And, al so, our

12 Const i t ut i on gi ves us cer t ai n pr oper t y

13 r i ght s.

14 We' ve had sever al seaf oods t aken

15 away f r om us i n t he past , and t hat hur t s

16 our i ndustr y, hur t s our busi nesses. So

17 i n t he f ut ur e when somebody comes t o you

18 r ecommendi ng cer t ai n seaf ood t o be t aken

19 away f r om you, l et - - I want you t o be

20 awar e t her e' s peopl e down t her e t hat

21 suppl i es t he mar ket s, t he r estaur ant s - -

22 i n f act , 20 percent of our nat ural - - or

23 our r esour ces t hat come t hr ough t he

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Page 22

1 st at e come f r om Mobi l e Count y, and

2 87 per cent of t hat i s seaf ood r un

3 t hr ough t he r estaur ant s. That ' s a bi g

4 par t of our i ncome. Bob sai d hi s son

5 has t wo r est aur ant s now. That ' s doubl e

6 t he t roubl e get t i ng seaf oods .

7 So we want t o mai nt ai n good heal t hy

8 seaf oods, whi ch we have i n t hi s stat e,

9 and we want t o have access t o t hem. So

10 when somebody t r i es t o t ake i t away f r om

11 us, be awar e t hat we want t o exer ci se

12 our const i t ut i onal pr opert y r i ght s and

13 not l et somebody exer ci se emi nent domai n

14 whi ch bel ongs t o ever ybody i n t he

15 st at e.

16 So t hank y' al l . We appreci at e y' al l

17 eat i ng seaf ood. We' r e get t i ng r eady t o

18 have a bi g seaf ood bash i n Mont gomer y

19 f or our l egi sl at ors . A number of y' al l

20 ar e i nvi t ed t o come, and you shoul d be

21 get t i ng i nvi t at i ons t hrough t he mai l .

22 Enj oy our l ocal seaf oods .

23 Mr . Guy, i t ' s ni ce t o have a new man

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Page 23

1 on boar d, and we' r e gl ad t hat you' r e

2 goi ng t o wor k wi t h us. Pet e sai d t hat

3 he' s t al ked t o you. I ' m gl ad t o meet

4 you. And I want t o meet our new

5 assi s tant commi ssi oner .

6 But we' r e j ust har d- wor ki ng peopl e

7 down t her e. We want t o keep ser vi ng and

8 wor ki ng f or t he st at e of Al abama and f or

9 our peopl e t o have j obs. J obs now i s a

10 pr emi um. We don' t need t o l ose t hem.

11 So keep us i n mi nd when somebody comes

12 bef or e you t r yi ng t o t ake seaf oods away

13 f rom us.

14 Thank you so much.

15 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Thank you, Mr . Bates.

16 The next speaker - - t he next speaker

17 wi l l be Paul Farmer .

18 MR. FARMER: Good mor ni ng, ever ybody. I ' m

19 Paul Far mer f r om Shel by Count y,

20 Al abama. And I j ust came t oday t o say

21 how I do not l i ke t he i dea of br i ngi ng

22 deer season t wo weeks i nt o Febr uar y.

23 Because I ' m a bi g r abbi t hunt er , and

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Page 24

1 we' re al ready str uggl i ng f or pl aces t o

2 r abbi t hunt dur i ng t he deer season as i t

3 i s.

4 I f eed - - i t cost s a l ot of money to

5 f eed al l t hem dogs al l year l ong t o

6 r eal l y get t o hunt t hem j ust t he mont h

7 of February. So I j ust want to l et

8 ever ybody know t hat we' d r eal l y l i ke

9 y' al l t o l ook i nto t hi s and t r y not t o

10 t ake no mor e t i me away f r om us.

11 I mean, I know we get t o hunt a

12 l i t t l e bi t i n Oct ober , but i t ' s so hot

13 i n October . You can onl y get a coupl e

14 of hour s ever y mor ni ng, and t hat ' s about

15 i t because i t ' s t oo hot t o hunt . Then

16 you have t o go home and pi ck t he t i cks

17 of f of you. So you . . .

18 So t hat ' s al l I needed. And real l y

19 I ' d l i ke f or y' al l t o j ust t ake i nt o

20 consi der at i on - - you know, t her e' s a l ot

21 of us smal l game hunt er s out t her e

22 t hat ' s f i ght i ng t he same bat t l e

23 everybody el se i s j ust t ryi ng t o f i nd

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Page 25

1 our pl ace i nt o t he hunt i ng. And we

2 don' t need to l ose any of our l i t t l e ol '

3 f our weeks we get i n Febr uar y.

4 Thank you.

5 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Thank you, Mr . Far mer .

6 The next speaker wi l l be Mar k

7 Kol i nski .

8 MR. KOLI NSKI : Good mor ni ng. My name i s Mar k

9 Kol i nski . I l i ve i n Lawrence Count y,

10 Al abama. I ' m t he Al abama pr ogr am

11 manager f or Wi l d Sout h.

12 Wi l d Sout h i s a 501( c) ( 3) non- prof i t

13 f or est pr ot ect i on or gani zat i on. We' ve

14 been i nvol ved i n f or est management on

15 t he Bankhead Nat i onal For est f or al most

16 20 year s, been a col l abor at i ve par t ner

17 wi t h t he Forest Servi ce f or t he l ast

18 seven or ei ght year s. We have hundr eds

19 of member s across t he st at e.

20 I ' m her e t hi s mor ni ng t o ask you t o

21 gi ve ver y ser i ous consi derat i on t o

22 changi ng t he game l aws on t he Bl ack

23 War r i or Wi l dl i f e Management Ar ea i n t he

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Page 26

1 Bankhead Nat i onal For est i n a way t hat

2 wi l l pr ovi de a much gr eat er r ange of

3 str at egi es and oppor t uni t i es and opt i ons

4 f or cont r ol l i ng f er al swi ne i n t hat

5 ar ea.

6 I n my wor k wi t h Wi l d Sout h, I do a

7 l ot of nat ural resources i nvent ory f or

8 t he Forest Servi ce f or t he l ast f i ve

9 year s, chai n sur veyi ng and - - wher e - - a

10 sur vey of al l t he wat er sheds i n t he

11 Bankhead. And i n 2009 and 2010 I

12 over saw/ super vi sed a nonnat i ve i nvasi ve

13 pl ant i nvent ory of t he i nt er i or of t he

14 Si psey Wi l der ness. The Si psey

15 Wi l derness, 25, 000 acres , i s t ot al l y

16 i ncl uded i n t he Bl ack Warr i or Wi l dl i f e

17 Management Ar ea. So I ' ve got pl ent y of

18 oppor t uni t y t o wi t ness t he ki nd of

19 damage t hat hogs can do.

20 The r esour ce i mpact - - t he negat i ve

21 r esour ce i mpact I shoul dn' t need t o t el l

22 you about . I mean, i t ' s been wr i t t en

23 about ext ensi vel y i n t he medi a. I t - -

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Page 27

1 t he i mpact on the soi l erosi on, t r ai l

2 damage. Nat i ve pl ant popul at i ons ar e

3 dest r oyed. Rept i l es and amphi bi ans.

4 I t ' s - - I mean, the l i st goes on. Mass

5 suppl i es f or your f avor i t e game speci es,

6 deer and tur key.

7 The cur r ent game l aws pr et t y much

8 have t he ef f ect on hogs of t r eat i ng t hem

9 l i ke a game speci es. You get a coupl e

10 of weeks t wi ce a year wher e f ol ks can go

11 out and hunt t hese f er al hogs, and t hey

12 get s i x mont hs of f ever y year j ust l i ke

13 ever y ot her game speci es. And i t ' s - -

14 I ' m her e t o ask you t o change t he l aws

15 i n t he shor t t erm t o al l ow oppor t uni t i es

16 f or cont r ol . They need t o be t r eat ed

17 l i ke t he nonnat i ve i nvasi ve speci es t hat

18 t hey ar e.

19 We have what ' s consi der ed a

20 l ow- densi t y popul at i on on t he - - i n t he

21 management ar ea and i n t he Bankhead.

22 But t hi s l ow- densi t y popul at i on

23 concent r at es i t sel f i n l ocal ar eas and

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Page 28

1 creat es ser i ous damage, and sooner or

2 l at er you' r e not goi ng t o have deer and

3 t ur key on t he Bankhead. The swi ne ar e

4 goi ng t o t ake over . I mean, t hi s i s a

5 di sast er - -

6 MS. NUMMY: Ti me.

7 MR. KOLI NSKI : - - i n t he maki ng.

8 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Sum i t up, pl ease, si r .

9 MR. KOLI NSKI : Sorr y i f I r an over .

10 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Mr . Kol i nski , di d you

11 speak at t he l ast boar d meet i ng on t hi s

12 same subj ect?

13 MR. KOLI NSKI : No, I have not . Thi s i s t he

14 f i r st t i me I ' ve spoken bef or e t he boar d.

15 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Very good. Thank you ver y

16 much.

17 Mr . Kol i nski . Mr . Kol i nski .

18 MR. STRI CKLAND: Mr . Kol i nski .

19 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: We' ve got one ot her - -

20 MS. NUMMY: Hey, i f we can hol d t he appl ause

21 unt i l af t er - -

22 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: You' ve got some quest i ons

23 f rom the board. Dr . St r i ckl and.

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Page 29

1 MR. STRI CKLAND: A coupl e of quest i ons.

2 What ' s your proposal , agai n, t o

3 cont r ol t he swi ne popul at i on i n t he

4 Bankhead?

5 MR. KOLI NSKI : Wel l , I don' t want t o be

6 speci f i c. I don' t want t o t el l t he

7 agency and al l how t o do t hei r j ob. But

8 game management l aws and r egul at i ons on

9 t he WMA need t o be changed i n or der t o

10 al l ow more f l exi bi l i t y f or t reat i ng thi s

11 speci es l i ke t he nonnat i ve i nvasi ve

12 speci es i t i s . We need t o be

13 aggr essi ve. We need t o be r el ent l ess.

14 And we need t o be creat i ve. And t hat

15 mi ght mean i mpact i ng some of t he ot her

16 user s of t he Wi l dl i f e Management Ar ea,

17 some of t he hunt er s, some of t he

18 r ecreat i ons, t he hi kers . And i t mi ght

19 make some l aw enf or cement of cur r ent

20 game l aws a l i t t l e more di f f i cul t . But

21 t hi s pr obl em, I t hi nk, j ust i f i es

22 i nconveni ences of t hi s sor t .

23 MR. STRI CKLAND: You know, i n my exper i ence - -

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Page 30

1 and t hi s i s pr obabl y somet hi ng t hat we

2 need t o have our bi ol ogi st s addr ess as

3 wel l i n t he game depar t ment .

4 You know, I agr ee wi t h you a hundr ed

5 percent . I f you l et the swi ne

6 popul at i on get out of hand, i t can br i ng

7 havoc on our veget at i on, you know,

8 part i cul ar l y your t ur keys and t hi ngs of

9 t hat nat ure. But , real l y, t he onl y good

10 way t o cont rol i t i s not by hunt i ng

11 t hem. I t ' s real l y by t r appi ng t hem.

12 And - - because hogs - - we al l know

13 t hey' r e ver y, ver y smar t ani mal s. And

14 once you put a l i t t l e bi t of pr essure on

15 t hem wi t h dogs, t hen t hey j ust go

16 noct ur nal .

17 MR. KOLI NSKI : Ri ght .

18 MR. STRI CKLAND: And once you get dogs and you

19 i ncrease t he human act i vi t y wi t h hunt i ng

20 t hem, you - - agai n, you di srupt t he

21 ot her , you know, nat ural wi l dl i f e.

22 MR. KOLI NSKI : That ' s wher e get t i ng creat i ve

23 can hel p. I t hi nk t here' s oppor t uni t i es

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Page 31

1 t o have or gani zed hunt s. You have a

2 communi t y t her e ar ound t he Bankhead t hat

3 i s ver y concer ned and ver y i nvol ved, and

4 bei ng abl e t o or gani ze i t and use t hose

5 peopl e ef f ect i vel y and creat i vel y - - I

6 t hi nk t here' s t hi ngs t o be done.

7 The Forest Servi ce i s wi l l i ng to

8 wor k wi t h t he agency and al l t o addr ess

9 t hi s, and t her e needs t o be some - - an

10 or gani zed meet i ng. Peopl e need t o si t

11 down. And I t hi nk t here' s a l ot of

12 possi bl e opt i ons out t here. And I

13 di dn' t come her e, you know, t o addr ess

14 any of t hem speci f i cal l y. I j ust - -

15 MR. STRI CKLAND: Thank you.

16 MR. KOLI NSKI : - - t hi nk we r eal l y need t o get

17 some act i on.

18 MR. STRI CKLAND: Okay. Appr eci at e i t .

19 MR. KOLI NSKI : Thank you.

20 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Thank you, Mr . Kol i nski .

21 Al l r i ght . The next speaker wi l l be

22 Ri nard Leonard.

23 MR. LEONARD: Good Mor ni ng, Mr . Chai r man,

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Page 32

1 Advi sory Boar d Member s. My name i s

2 Ri nar d Leonard. I ' m f rom El mor e Count y,

3 Al abama, and I bel ong t o Mi d Al abama

4 Beagl e Cl ub. And I do - - I want t o t ake

5 i t back t o what Paul has sai d t hi s

6 mor ni ng.

7 Our r abbi t season star t s 1 Oct ober ,

8 and i t ' s so hot you can' t hunt but f or a

9 coupl e of hour s i n t he mor ni ng. And I

10 do oppose ext endi ng t he deer - hunt i ng

11 season t o Febr uar y. Because, agai n,

12 t aki ng i t back t o Paul , February i s

13 our - - r eal l y t he smal l game hunt er ' s

14 t i me t o hunt because i t ' s real l y col d

15 and you can hunt al l day. And we f eed

16 14, 15 dogs al l year t o real l y enj oy

17 r abbi t hunt i ng dur i ng t he mont h of

18 Febr uar y. Because once deer season come

19 i n i n November , t he st al k hunt i ng and

20 t he gun season come i n, t he pr i vat e l and

21 i s l eased by most l y t he deer hunt er s,

22 and t hey don' t al l ow you t o come i n and

23 hunt .

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Page 33

1 But I do appl aud deer - hunt i ng cl ubs

2 f or al l owi ng us t he oppor t uni t y dur i ng

3 Febr uar y t o br i ng our r abbi t dogs i n and

4 hunt i n Febr uar y. But i f you ext end t he

5 deer - hunt i ng season i nt o Febr uar y, t hat

6 cut s us out . And I real l y bel i eve t he

7 smal l game hunt er s have j ust as many

8 r i ght s as t he bi g game hunt er s. And

9 t hat ' s wher e t he r abbi t hunt er s stand.

10 Thank you.

11 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Mr . Leonar d, your success

12 on r abbi t hunt i ng pr obabl y woul d go up

13 i f t hat r ed- and- whi t e hat was changed t o

14 an or ange- and- bl ue hat . J ust a

15 suggest i on. You may want t o t r y t hat

16 orange- and- bl ue hat .

17 MR. LEONARD: Wel l , Mr . Chai r man, one t hi ng

18 about i t t hough. Once I hi t t he woods,

19 i t i s an or ange cap.

20 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: That ' s good.

21 The next speaker wi l l be Mr . Bi l l y

22 Smi t h.

23 MR. SMI TH: Good mor ni ng.

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Page 34

1 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Mr . Smi t h.

2 MR. SMI TH: I ' m j ust about goi ng t o say t he

3 same t hi ng t hat Ri nar d sai d because I am

4 a r abbi t hunt er t oo. So I hunt down i n

5 El mor e Count y and Coosa Count y. Been

6 r abbi t hunt i ng al l my l i f e and I ' l l be

7 49 i n t wo weeks. And t hat ' s al l I ever

8 done i s j ust r abbi t hunt i ng.

9 J ust l i ke he sai d, i t ' s t oo hot t o

10 hunt when t he season st ar t i n

11 February - - i n - - I mean, i n Oct ober .

12 And t hen Febr uar y, you know, i t i s t he

13 t i me t o hunt because i t - - t he deer

14 hunt er s wi l l open up t he l and f or us.

15 You know, i t ' s pr obabl y 90 per cent of

16 t he deer hunt er s t hat , you know, l et us

17 go on t hei r l and.

18 I t al so hur t s t he quai l hunter s. I t

19 hur t s the squi r r el hunters . I t hur t s

20 ever ybody i f t he season be ext ended

21 i nt o - - i nt o t he Febr uar y year . So we' d

22 l i ke to keep our l i t t l e f our weeks.

23 Because f eedi ng t hem dogs i n t he

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Page 35

1 way - - as hi gh as ever yt hi ng has got

2 r i ght now, you can' t - - you can' t hardl y

3 f eed t hem. Mat t er of f act , I need t o

4 sel l some of y' al l some.

5 But t hat ' s al l I had. I j ust wanted

6 t o be seen and be hear d.

7 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Thank you ver y much,

8 Mr . Smi t h.

9 The next speaker wi l l be Mr . Randy

10 Year gan.

11 MR. YEARGAN: Good mor ni ng, Commi ssi oner , al l

12 t he boar d member s. Good t o see al l of

13 you agai n. I ' m Randy Year gan wi t h

14 Bowhunt er s of Al abama.

15 Fi r s t of al l , agai n, as I al ways t r y

16 t o do, I ' d l i ke t o t hank al l of you f or

17 al l t he t i me t hat you put i n l ooki ng

18 af t er our r i ght s and t ryi ng t o t ake care

19 of our r i ght s wi t h t he Depar t ment of

20 Conser vat i on and wor ki ng wi t h

21 ever ybody. And I know a l ot of you have

22 ot her j obs t o do and - - s i nce you' r e so

23 wel l pai d f or t hi s j ob i n deal i ng wi t h

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Page 36

1 us. But we appr eci at e what you do. We

2 j ust want ed you t o know t hat .

3 I want ed t o addr ess t he boar d f or

4 j ust a mi nut e about a subj ect t hat we' ve

5 had some peopl e ask us about our opi ni on

6 on, and t hat ' s bas i cal l y what I want t o

7 do i s j ust l et t he board know t he

8 Bowhunt er s Associ at i on' s opi ni on on t he

9 subj ect . And t hat ' s t he subj ect of

10 r ange f i nder s, t hese bow- mount ed r ange

11 f i nder s.

12 They' ve been ar ound f or a l ong

13 t i me. I n t he l ast coupl e of years

14 t hey' ve got t en mor e popul ar . And we' ve

15 been asked by di f f er ent peopl e, you

16 know, how do we f eel about t he r ange - -

17 t he bow- mount ed r ange f i nder s. As l ong

18 as i t i s a range f i nder t hat does not

19 proj ect any t ype of vi s i bl e l i ght or any

20 t ype of vi si bl e beam, as an associ at i on

21 we' r e not opposed t o bow- mount ed r ange

22 f i nder s.

23 We use r ange f i nder s ever y day

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Page 37

1 anyway. They' r e ei t her i n our pocket or

2 hung ar ound our neck. We don' t see any

3 reason why, l i ke I sai d, as l ong as i t

4 does not pr oj ect any t ype of l i ght , t hat

5 you coul d not mount i t on a bow. I f i t

6 makes a per son mor e ef f ect i ve and i t

7 makes f or a mor e et hi cal ki l l and you

8 want t o mount i t on a bow, we' r e not

9 opposed t o t hat .

10 So we' ve been asked, and I j ust

11 want ed t o addr ess t he boar d and l et t he

12 boar d know t hat we' r e not i n opposi t i on

13 of t hese r ange- mount ed bow f i nder s - - or

14 bow- mount ed r ange f i nder s. Excuse me.

15 So i f t hat subj ect i s t o come up i n t he

16 f ut ur e or what ever , I j ust want ed y' al l

17 t o know our posi t i on on i t . We' r e not

18 opposed t o i t , and we wi l l suppor t i t .

19 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Mr . Yeargan, whi l e we' ve

20 got you her e, how have t he hunt s at Oak

21 Mount ai n gone?

22 I know y' al l ar e conduct i ng t hose

23 now.

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Page 38

1 MR. YEARGAN: I t hi nk t hey' r e goi ng ver y

2 wel l . We had an unusual season t hi s

3 year . Ther e was al most a compl et e crop

4 f ai l ure of acorns i n t he park t hi s year ,

5 and t hat ' s pr obabl y 90 per cent of t he

6 f ood sour ce i n t hat par k ar e t he acor ns

7 up t her e. We ki l l ed 59 deer t hi s year

8 i n a ver y unusual year wher e t her e wer e

9 not near t he number s of deer i n t he par k

10 t hat t her e nor mal l y woul d be.

11 We had - - I don' t - - t hat I ' m aware

12 of , I don' t t hi nk we had a s i ngl e

13 i nci dent wi t h t he publ i c or wi t h any of

14 t he ot her user groups i n t he park. I ' m

15 not awar e of a si ngl e t hi ng. We wer e

16 very wel l accept ed. I t hi nk t hi ngs

17 wor ked out ver y wel l . We di dn' t have

18 any i ssues t hat wer e not - - we had a

19 coupl e of i ssues ear l y wi t h some peopl e

20 t hat mi ght have been dr i vi ng t oo f ast

21 and stuf f l i ke t hat i n t he par k, and we

22 addr essed t hose i mmedi at el y. And I

23 t hi nk ever yt hi ng was ver y wel l

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Page 39

1 r ecei ved. I t hi nk we had a successf ul

2 year consi der i ng t he s i t uat i on at t he

3 par k. I t hi nk i t went ver y wel l .

4 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Thank you, Mr . Yeargan.

5 MR. YEARGAN: You' r e wel come. Thank y' al l .

6 MR. STRI CKLAND: Hey, Randy. Hey, Randy.

7 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: We' ve got one quest i on.

8 Dr . St r i ckl and.

9 MR. STRI CKLAND: I ' m goi ng t o be put t i ng an

10 appl i cat i on i n f or Oak Mount ai n. You

11 guys ar e maki ng t hat deci si on; r i ght ?

12 MR. YEARGAN: Yes. We' l l t ake t hat i nt o

13 consi der at i on. Thank you.

14 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: The next speaker wi l l be

15 Cynt hi a Robi nson.

16 MS. ROBI NSON: Hel l o. Thank you f or seei ng

17 me. My name i s Cynt hi a Robi nson. I own

18 a nat ur al r esour ce management company i n

19 Nor t h Al abama, and our pr i mar y busi ness

20 i s wet l and restorat i on. I hel ped

21 establ i shed t he f i rst wet l and mi t i gat i on

22 bank i n Al abama i n Mor gan Count y, and

23 t hat was est abl i shed i n 1998. We now

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Page 40

1 have one i n Madi son Count y t hat ' s j ust

2 openi ng.

3 We don' t have a wi l d pi g/ f er al swi ne

4 pr obl em i n Madi son Count y, but at our

5 Mor gan Count y mi t i gat i on ar ea, whi ch i s

6 750 acr es, I got t o see f i r sthand what

7 happened. When we pur chased t he

8 pr oper t y, i t had a t housand head of

9 cat t l e on i t . So there was - - i t was

10 al l i n agr i cul ture and cat t l e grazi ng.

11 And we pl ant ed 160, 000 har dwood t r ees by

12 hand, bot t oml and har dwoods. And af t er

13 about t he t hi r d year , t he wi l d pi gs came

14 i n. And I was out t her e doi ng t he

15 moni t or i ng, so I saw f i r st hand what was

16 happeni ng.

17 I ' m sure t hat you al l know, you

18 know, what ki nd of dest r ucti on t hey

19 make. But what was r eal l y i nt er est i ng

20 about our si t uat i on i s t hat because we

21 had establ i shed t hi s f or wet l and

22 mi t i gat i on, t her e was a bi ndi ng

23 conser vat i on easement over t he ent i r e

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Page 41

1 pr oper t y and t her e was no hunt i ng

2 al l owed i n i t . And when we saw what

3 happened wi t h t he swi nes, we needed t o

4 change t hat . So we had t o get wi t h t he

5 i nt er agency r evi ew t eam and get al l of

6 t he f eder al and st at e agenci es t o agr ee

7 t hat we coul d br i ng i n hunt er s, whi ch we

8 wer e abl e t o do.

9 But I thi nk t hat the pi gs are j ust

10 ext r emel y smar t , j ust l i ke t he deer

11 ar e. They know when hunt i ng season i s

12 over and t hey come ar ound. And t he pi gs

13 ar e doi ng t he same t hi ng.

14 Our proper t y i s about - - I don' t

15 know - - 15 mi l es f r om Bankhead For est ,

16 and t her e' s a l ot of connect i ng

17 wat er sheds bet ween t he ar eas so t hat

18 t hey can t r avel back and f or t h. And I

19 don' t know. Maybe i t was about t wo

20 mont hs ago I r ead i n t he paper t hat

21 t her e was now open season on t he swi nes,

22 and I was real l y gl ad. I thi nk that - -

23 I t hought t hat anyt i me t hat t hey saw one

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Page 42

1 t hat t hey coul d ki l l i t . But I t al ked

2 t o some f r i ends at Bankhead For est and

3 f ound out t hat t hat di d not i ncl ude t he

4 Wi l dl i f e Management Ar eas. So i n my

5 exper i ence wi t h t he wi l d hogs, t hey know

6 wher e t hey can go and have pr ot ect i on.

7 So t hat ' s what t hey do.

8 So i f t here - - i f t he i ssue comes up

9 wher e you ar e l ooki ng at changi ng t he

10 r ul es f or t he Wi l dl i f e Management Ar eas,

11 I woul d say l et ' s get t he pi gs out

12 because, ot her wi se, t hey j ust come i n

13 and t ake over .

14 Thank you.

15 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Thank you, Ms. Robi nson.

16 The next speaker wi l l be J ack

17 Cr opp.

18 Hol d on. Hol d on. Hol d on.

19 MR. HARTZOG: Gar y, what i s t he Depar t ment

20 l ooki ng at about t r yi ng t o change t he

21 WMAs? What ar e y' al l ' s t hought s or

22 pl ans or . . .

23 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Mr . Moody.

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Page 43

1 MR. MOODY: I t hi nk t he boar d knows t hat t he

2 management ar ea i s i n par t ner shi p wi t h

3 t he U. S. For est Ser vi ce. And we wor k

4 very, very cl osel y wi t h t he U. S. Forest

5 Ser vi ce not onl y on t hi s i ssue but ever y

6 i ssue t hat comes up up t her e. Al l t he

7 nat i onal f or est i s not i n t he Wi l dl i f e

8 Management Ar ea. The par t of t he

9 nat i onal f orest outs i de the Wi l dl i f e

10 Management Ar ea has j ust as many pi gs as

11 Bankhead or a good popul at i on of pi gs.

12 The seasons ar e di f f erent . I t ' s not t he

13 season t hat ' s af f ect i ng t he pi gs and

14 everythi ng. I t ' s j ust t hey' ve got a

15 good popul at i on.

16 We are di scussi ng - - most of y' al l

17 know Fr ank Boyd who works wi t h t he USDA

18 Wi l dl i f e Ser vi ces. He' s been up t her e

19 sever al t i mes t o pr ovi de advi ce and

20 i nf or mat i on t o t he For est Ser vi ce on

21 t r aps and t r appi ng and met wi t h ci t i zens

22 gr oups on t r aps and t r appi ng. That i s

23 pr obabl y t he most ef f ect i ve way t o deal

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Page 44

1 wi t h t he popul at i on as a whol e i f we

2 want t o do t hat . We ar e i n di scussi ons

3 r i ght now wi t h t he For est Ser vi ce, and

4 i f t hey ar e wi l l i ng, we' r e wi l l i ng t o

5 per mi t i ndi vi dual s t o r un some t r aps i n

6 t he wi l der ness ar ea.

7 So t hat ' s sor t of wher e we ar e r i ght

8 now. But pi gs can be hunt ed up t her e

9 anyt i me t her e i s a hunt i ng season, and

10 we have a speci al hog- hunt i ng season up

11 t her e. So f r om August t o t he end of

12 t ur key season t her e i s hunt i ng pr essur e

13 on t he pi gs anyway.

14 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Mr . Moody, Commi ssi oner

15 has a quest i on.

16 COMMI SSI ONER GUY: Hel p me out her e. I sn' t

17 t her e an i ssue about get t i ng i nt o t he

18 Bankhead Nat i onal For est, l i ke t he

19 abi l i t y t o get vehi cl es i n t her e?

20 MR. MOODY: I n t he wi l der ness ar ea. I t ' s a

21 l arge area, 20 - - I f orget t he exact - -

22 20- somet hi ng- t housand acres. Ther e ar e

23 no vehi cl es al l owed per i od f or any

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Page 45

1 purpose. So i t ' s al l wal k- i n. And that

2 i s a l i mi t i ng f act or on put t i ng pressure

3 on - -

4 COMMI SSI ONER GUY: Tr appi ng.

5 MR. MOODY: - - t hat popul at i on wi t h t r appi ng

6 or hunt i ng or anyt hi ng el se. I mean,

7 you j ust - - i t ' s j ust a l ong ways i n and

8 a l ong ways out and i t ' s ver y

9 di f f i cul t . Hor ses can go i n and wagons

10 can go i n, but no mot or i zed vehi cl es.

11 COMMI SSI ONER GUY: Do you t hi nk t he For est

12 Ser vi ce woul d al l ow an agency or woul d

13 work t o hel p get t raf f i c i ns i de t here

14 di f f er ent , you know, t han t he publ i c?

15 MR. MOODY: No. And I say t hat because t he

16 wor k t hat Fr ank di d, t hey had t o

17 hand- car r y ever yt hi ng i n and out .

18 COMMI SSI ONER GUY: They woul dn' t make any

19 except i on even f or our peopl e?

20 MR. MOODY: No. I mean, we' l l ask agai n and

21 we wi l l i nqui r e.

22 COMMI SSI ONER GUY: Pl ease do.

23 MR. MOODY: But i t ' s our under st andi ng t hat

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Page 46

1 t hey' r e bound by a nat i onal l aw t hat

2 t hey' r e deal i ng wi th. I t ' s not t he

3 l ocal peopl e up t here so much. I t ' s

4 j ust the f ederal l aw that they' re

5 wor ki ng under . But we wi l l i nqui r e.


7 much.

8 The next speaker wi l l be J ack Cr opp.

9 MR. CROPP: Mr . Chai r man, Member s of t he

10 Boar d, Mr . Guy, Member s of t he

11 Conser vat i on Depar t ment , my name i s J ack

12 Cr opp, and I ' m f r om Pel l Ci t y i n

13 St . Cl ai r Count y, Di st r i ct 2. Fi r st of

14 al l , l et me say t hat t hose of us who

15 enj oy usi ng t he Al abama out door

16 r esour ces appr eci at e what y' al l do f or

17 us. We t hank you.

18 I ' m sure t hat you' ve heard a l ot of

19 peopl e i n Al abama say t hat i f you need

20 t o bai t t o ki l l a deer i n Al abama, you

21 pr obabl y need t o f i nd your sel f anot her

22 hobby. There' s a l ot of t rut h t o t hat ,

23 but t he r eal i t y i s, i f you di scount al l

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Page 47

1 the deer t hat ' s ki l l ed i n f ood pl ot s ,

2 over t rophy rocks, sal t l i cks, and ot her

3 l egal means of bai t i ng, t her e woul dn' t

4 be many l ef t . So I ' d l i ke t o see y' al l

5 go ahead and l egal i ze bai t i ng, l i ke

6 t hey' ve done i n a l ot of ot her st at es,

7 bef or e t he l egi sl at ur e comes up wi t h

8 somet hi ng t hat can' t nobody under st and.

9 Now, I don' t t hi nk t her e' s any doubt

10 i n anybody' s mi nd t hat Dr . St r i ckl and i s

11 a pr of essi onal and exper t ar cher y

12 hunt er . And Dr . St r i ckl and t ol d me a

13 coupl e of year s ago t he r eason he was

14 opposed t o shoot i ng a t ur key wi t h a

15 cr ossbow was because we needed t o

16 pr ot ect t hem. And mor e r ecent l y t he

17 Al abama Out door Yout h quot ed

18 Dr . St r i ckl and as sayi ng t hat an ar r ow

19 was not desi gned t o ki l l a t urkey.

20 Gent l emen, i f t hose ar e t he cases,

21 t hen you need t o ban al l ar cher y hunt i ng

22 f or t urkeys. But , ot her wi se, I woul d

23 l i ke t o see you gi ve t he crossbow t he

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Page 48

1 same st at us as any ot her ar cher y

2 equi pment and t ake t hat t ur key- hunt i ng

3 r est r i ct i on of f .

4 You know, a l ot - - i n cl osi ng, a l ot

5 of f ol ks qui t hunt i ng when t hey get

6 ol der because t hey f eel l i ke t he

7 chal l enge i s a l i t t l e more t han t hey

8 want t o put up wi t h. And I not i ce t hat

9 i n some of t hese Wi l dl i f e Management

10 Ar eas you have ar eas set asi de wher e t he

11 exper i ence i s not qui t e as chal l engi ng

12 f or t he handi cap. I ' d l i ke t o see you

13 make t hose ar eas avai l abl e t o t he

14 el der l y as wel l , and you coul d cal l t hem

15 ar eas f or t he el der l y and ot her handi cap

16 hunt er s.

17 That ' s al l I have. Thank you.

18 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Thank you, Mr . Cr opp.

19 Dr . St r i ckl and, woul d you l i ke a

20 chance t o r espond t o your comment s?

21 MR. STRI CKLAND: J ack, do you know my weapon

22 of choi ce f or t ur keys?

23 MR. CROPP: Beg your par don?

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Page 49

1 MR. STRI CKLAND: Do you know my weapon of

2 choi ce f or t ur keys?

3 My weapon of choi ce - -

4 MR. CROPP: Pr obabl y a shot gun.

5 MR. STRI CKLAND: - - i s a 12- gauge

6 t hr ee- and- a- hal f i nch Magnum HEVI - Shot ;

7 okay?

8 MR. CROPP: Okay. I use

9 t wo- and- three- quar t er s .


11 Mr . Cr opp.

12 The next speaker wi l l be Randal

13 Chappel l .

14 MR. CHAPPELL: Good mor ni ng, Mr . Chai r man,

15 Mr . Commi ssi oner , Member s of t he Boar d.

16 My name i s Randal Chappel l . I l i ve i n

17 Bl ount Count y. I hunt i n Lamar Count y

18 and have f or about t he past seven year s

19 now. And I want t o addr ess t he boar d

20 about t he ext ensi on of t he - - t he

21 possi bi l i t y of t he ext ensi on of t he deer

22 season i nt o Febr uar y and t he bai t i ng

23 i ssue.

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Page 50

1 As Commi ssi oner Guy ment i oned, t he

2 l egi s l at i on whi ch has been put i nt o

3 ef f ect i n Mont gomer y, Senat e Bi l l Number

4 124, does say t o ext end t he season and

5 al so t o al l ow bai t . I ' m i n opposi t i on

6 t o t hi s, t o both of t hese poi nt s .

7 And t here was an ar t i cl e i n t he

8 Bi r mi ngham News l ast week i n whi ch t he

9 cosponsor of t hat bi l l ment i oned t hat he

10 had spoke wi t h Commi ssi oner Guy about

11 t hi s. And i n t hat ar t i cl e i t ment i oned

12 t he possi bi l i t y of cl osi ng t he deer

13 season f or up t o t hr ee weeks i n

14 December , even t hough t hat i s not

15 ment i oned i n t he bi l l . And I ' m st rongl y

16 opposed t o t hat .

17 Wher e we hunt i n Lamar Count y, we

18 see some good r ut act i vi t y at t he end of

19 December , f i rst part of J anuary.

20 Cl osi ng t hat season t he f i r s t par t of

21 December woul d t ake away our pr er ut

22 per i od, whi ch i s, as you know, a

23 r ewar di ng t i me t o hunt . And I woul d

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Page 51

1 hat e t o l ose t hat .

2 I al so bel i eve t hat ext endi ng t hat

3 season i nt o l at e February, i f i t was

4 done on a st at ewi de basi s and i f i t was

5 not a buck- onl y season, t her e woul d be a

6 l ot of pr egnant does t hat woul d be

7 suscept i bl e t o bei ng har vested.

8 Al so, I woul d t hi nk t hat t he l ease

9 pr i ces - - t hi s was addressed i n t he l ast

10 meet i ng accor di ng t o t he mi nut es, whi ch

11 I ' ve read. And I bel i eve i t was

12 Mr . Hat l ey. There' s a good possi bi l i t y

13 t hat l ease pr i ces coul d r eal l y j ump and

14 hur t t hose of us t hat ar e t he aver age

15 hunt er by havi ng such a l at e season i n

16 whi ch ot her hunt er s f r om out of stat e

17 coul d possi bl y come i n and dr i ve up our

18 l and l ease pr i ces.

19 And anot her r eason i s as t he smal l

20 game hunt er s ar e so gr eat l y pr esent i ng

21 her e, t he smal l game season i s i n

22 Febr uar y. I qui t smal l game hunt i ng and

23 I t ook up bow hunt i ng. I ' m l ooki ng t o

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Page 52

1 get back i nt o t hat . I have a young

2 daught er . Hopef ul l y, i n anot her t hr ee

3 or f our year s I want t o i nt r oduce her t o

4 t he woods. I bel i eve smal l game hunt i ng

5 i s t he best way t o do t hat i nstead of

6 si t t i ng st i l l and qui et i n a deer

7 stand. I don' t want t hat ar ea t o be

8 crowded when I ' m i nt r oduci ng her t o t he

9 hunt i ng spor t t o car r y on t hat l egacy.

10 Al so, the bai t i ng i ssue. By

11 l egal i zi ng bai t i ng, some say i t wi l l

12 j ust l evel t he pl ayi ng f i el d. I

13 di sagr ee. I bel i eve t her e ar e many who

14 woul d not do i t st i l l , but t hen you

15 woul d have t hose t hat don' t do i t now

16 because t hey' r e l aw- abi di ng ci t i zens

17 t hat woul d st ar t doi ng i t t o compet e

18 wi t h t hei r nei ghbor s. That woul d even

19 hur t mor e, I bel i eve.

20 And i f t he - - I don' t know what t he

21 f i ne i s. I ' ve been t ol d i t ' s about 250

22 bucks. I f t hat f i ne was j acked way, way

23 up, t hen I bel i eve t hat woul d hel p cut

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Page 53

1 out some of t hat bai t i ng as wel l as a

2 di scl ai mer on t hese busi nesses t hat sel l

3 cor n hot and heavy dur i ng t he deer

4 season t hat - - t o r emi nd peopl e t hat i t

5 i s i l l egal .

6 Al so, I j ust want t o t hank you f or

7 t he good j ob t hat you' ve done t hr ough

8 t he year s t aki ng t hese t hi ngs i nt o

9 consi der at i on and - - so t hat f ami l y and

10 f r i ends of t he l egacy of hunt i ng can

11 cont i nue on i n a good way. And t hank

12 you f or pr ot ect i ng t he r esour ces of

13 Al abama t he way t hat you have t hr ough

14 t he year s. Thank you.

15 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Thank you ver y much.

16 The next speaker wi l l be Fr ank

17 Fi scher .

18 MR. FI NCHER: That ' s Fi ncher . That ai n' t

19 Fi scher . I t ' s Fi ncher . Fi ncher .

20 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Fi ncher .

21 MR. FI NCHER: Fr ank Fi ncher .

22 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Excuse me, si r .

23 MR. FI NCHER: Al l r i ght . But I r epr esent t he

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Page 54

1 dog hunt er s i n sout hwest Al abama, t he

2 mai n t hi ng, t he rabbi t hunt ers . I wrot e

3 a l i t t l e t hi ng her e. I ai n' t t hat good

4 a speaker , now, so bear wi t h me. I

5 t hi nk ever yt hi ng I wr ot e down her e has

6 done been br ought bef or e you her e about

7 t he r abbi t hunt er s.

8 What I di dn' t wr i t e i s about t he hog

9 hunt i ng. Up t her e at Scot ch, t he Del t a

10 wher e we had t he dog hunt , we ki l l ed a

11 bunch of hogs up t her e wi t h t hem dogs

12 and shoot i ng - - you know, shoot i ng t hem

13 wi t h buckshot . And, l ook, I can t el l

14 you f r om exper i ence at Scot ch and t he

15 Upper Del t a, i f you got hogs, t hen you

16 don' t have no deer . Deer i s not goi ng

17 t o st ay wher e you have hogs.

18 And I have been t o - - ever y t i me

19 Dr . Smi t h had a semi nar on hog hunt i ng

20 i n t he sout h par t of Al abama I ' ve been

21 t o i t . I ' ve got a coupl e of t housand

22 dol l ars ' wort h of hor se panel s , t r ap

23 gates. And I can tel l you,

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Page 55

1 Dr . St r i ckl and, i t ' s har d t o t r ap a

2 hog. A deer , i t don' t do - - a deer

3 ai n' t near about as smar t as a hog. I

4 f ound t hat out r eal f ast . The best way

5 t o ki l l t hemhogs i s wi t h t hem hogs - - I

6 mean, wi t h t he dogs and a shot gun.

7 And i f you - - what I ' m t r yi ng t o

8 say, i f you ext end t hi s deer season out

9 i nto Febr uar y, I ' m def i ni t el y agai nst

10 t hat , whi ch t hat ' s r eal l y done been

11 br ought up. I got hog hunt er s t hat ' s

12 wai t i ng on t he 1st of Febr uar y t o go hog

13 hunt i ng. You can' t - - you cannot dog

14 hunt wi t h hogs, r abbi t s, anyt hi ng dur i ng

15 t he dayt i me when deer season i s i n,

16 especi al l y t hi s dog season.

17 And, now, you can t ake - - I wi sh you

18 woul d put - - gi ve us anot her f ew days on

19 t hat dog season at Scot ch and t he Upper

20 Del t a wher e t hem hogs i s t hi ck, and

21 maybe we can ki l l some of t hem. I ' ve

22 seen a l ot of t hem ki l l ed i n bot h pl aces

23 t hi s l ast year . That ' s al l .

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Page 56

1 Wai t a mi nut e. Can I say one mor e

2 t hi ng?

3 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Yes, si r .

4 MR. FI NCHER: Y' al l l ast year come up wi t h t he

5 suppl ement al f eed and i t di ed on deer .

6 And I don' t own a l ot of l and, but I got

7 br ot her s and f ami l y and we got a l ot of

8 l and i n sout h Al abama. And I wi sh y' al l

9 woul d br i ng t hat up and get t he

10 suppl ement al f eed. You know, I was her e

11 l ast year when i t got - - i t got conf used

12 t her e and i t di ed. And I wi sh you woul d

13 br i ng t hat back up because t hat ' s - - we

14 need i t .

15 Thank you.


17 The next speaker wi l l be Danny

18 Fost er .

19 MR. FOSTER: Good mor ni ng, gent l emen. I ' m

20 Danny Foster f r om Pel l Ci t y, Al abama,

21 St . Cl ai r Count y. Thi s i s t he f i r st

22 boar d meet i ng I ' ve ever been t o.

23 What got me here, I ' m j ust a l i t t l e

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Page 57

1 deer hunter , and I don' t - - a l ot of

2 t i mes we r ead t hi s stuf f . And, you

3 know, t hey say you can go on l i ne - -

4 t hi s gent l eman over her e went on l i ne

5 and got t hi s bi l l . What we got - - what

6 got me here was thi s l i t t l e ar t i cl e i n

7 t he Bi r mi ngham News on Sat ur day, 3- 5.

8 I t t al ked about cl osi ng t he season t hr ee

9 weeks i n December .

10 And I don' t know - - I know al l t hese

11 gent l emen know t hat t he r ut happens at

12 di f f erent t i mes i n Al abama. I hunt i n

13 Randol ph Count y. Our pr oper t y l i ne, t he

14 Al abama l i ne, and t he Geor gi a l i ne on

15 one sect i on of our l and i s al l t he

16 same.

17 Now, I don' t know how al l t hese deer

18 wer e st ocked, but my poi nt i s, my

19 br other ki l l ed a bi g ei ght - poi nt - - I ' ve

20 been down t her e 20 year s. He ki l l ed a

21 bi g ei ght - poi nt on December t he 6t h. I

22 seen a bi g ei ght - poi nt chasi ng a doe on

23 December t he 26t h. And I t hi nk t hat ' s

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Page 58

1 about when i t ends. And I ' m not f or

2 ext endi ng t he season and I ' m sur e not

3 f or cl osi ng i t .

4 I got a l ot of money t i ed up i n

5 equi pment . We got l eased l and. We t r y

6 t o f eed t hem soybeans and i r on cl ay peas

7 i n t he summer . And I don' t want t o be

8 si t t i ng at home when t he bucks - -

9 ever ybody knows t hat ' s when you got your

10 best chance at shoot i ng a good buck,

11 dur i ng t he r ut . And whi l e our s r ut , you

12 can pr obabl y go r i ght on t o Chamber s

13 Count y and t he r ut i s goi ng t o be t he

14 end of J anuar y. But f or me and t hr ee

15 guys I hunt wi t h, our s i s December t he

16 6t h ever y year t i l l about December t he

17 26t h. And I j ust don' t want t o l ose

18 that . That ' s why I ' m her e.

19 Thank you, si r s.

20 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Thank you. We' ve got a

21 quest i on. Commi ssi oner Guy.

22 COMMI SSI ONER GUY: Mr . Fost er , who i s quot ed

23 i n t hat ar t i cl e?

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Page 59

1 Not me, I know. Who' s quot i ng about

2 cl osi ng - -

3 MR. FOSTER: Wel l , i t says Senat or What l ey has

4 i nt roduced t he bi l l , and Senat or - - and

5 I don' t know i f I can say hi s name. I t

6 st ar t s wi t h a "K" .

7 COMMI SSI ONER GUY: Keahey.

8 MR. FOSTER: Keahey.

9 COMMI SSI ONER GUY: Okay.

10 MR. FOSTER: He' s - - I t hi nk he' s a democrat i c

11 cosponsor . Basi cal l y, I ' m l i ke t he

12 ot her gent l eman. I don' t want - - I

13 don' t t hi nk we need our l egi sl at or s and

14 stuf f maki ng our l aws. I thi nk i t ' s

15 come out good wi t h y' al l get t i ng

16 r ecommendat i ons f r om bi ol ogi st s and

17 st uf f and t he advi sor y boar d maki ng

18 t hem.

19 Thank you.

20 COMMI SSI ONER GUY: Thank you, si r .

21 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Mr . Fost er , I not i ce t he

22 name of your hunt i ng cl ub i s Dead Exe

23 Hunt i ng Cl ub. I s t her e any - - how di d

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Page 60

1 t hat name come about ?

2 MR. FOSTER: I t ' s t he Dead Eye Hunt i ng Cl ub.

3 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Oh, okay. We have a

4 mi sspel l i ng.

5 MR. FOSTER: I pi cked t he name Dead Eye - -

6 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: I j ust want ed t o make

7 sur e - -

8 ( Uni nt el l i gi bl e por t i on. )

9 MR. FOSTER: When you' r e i n Vi et nam, you l ear n

10 t o shoot wel l .


12 much.

13 Okay. The next speaker wi l l be

14 Steve Huf f aker .

15 MR. HUFFAKER: Good mor ni ng, Mr . Chai r man,

16 Mr . Commi ssi oner , Member s of t he Boar d.

17 Thi s i s my f i r s t t i me here, so y' al l

18 bear wi t h me. I ' m not as el oquent as

19 t hese f ol ks t hat wer e bef or e me, so I ' m

20 goi ng t o pr obabl y r ead a pr epar ed speech

21 i f you don' t mi nd.

22 As admi ni st r at or - - excuse me. I ' m

23 f r om Bal dwi n Count y, Bay Mi net t e,

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Page 61

1 Al abama, t oo, by t he way.


3 MR. DEAN: Si r , excuse me. I ' m sor r y. Woul d

4 you mi nd readi ng t hat j ust a l i t t l e bi t

5 s l ower so she can get t hi s.

6 MR. HUFFAKER: Sl ower . Sur e. I ' m sor r y. I

7 t al k t oo f ast . I was t ryi ng t o get my

8 t hr ee mi nut es i n.

9 MR. DEAN: That ' s okay. We' l l gi ve you a

10 coupl e - -

11 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: We' r e goi ng t o gi ve you

12 t i me.


14 MR. HUFFAKER: I ' l l s tar t over i f t hat ' s okay.

15 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: That wi l l be f i ne.

16 MR. HUFFAKER: As admi ni st r at or of t he Websi t e

17 Ext enddeer season. com, I have r ead over

18 4, 000 e- mai l s i n f avor of ext endi ng deer

19 season t o have t he oppor t uni t y t o hunt

20 t he r ut mai nl y i n sout h Al abama. We' ve

21 r ecei ved t hese e- mai l s i n appr oxi mat el y

22 30 days and had, al so, over 1, 000 vi si t s

23 on our Facebook page. Thi s i s a

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Page 62

1 gr assr oot s campai gn. We haven' t spent

2 any money i n adver t i si ng. Ther e ar e

3 t hree poi nt s I woul d l i ke t o t al k about

4 i n my al l ot t ed t i me.

5 The f i r st bei ng I ' ve hear d f r om

6 di f f erent peopl e t hat we are f or t hi s i f

7 i t doesn' t hur t t he resource. The

8 r esponse t hat we woul d have t o t hat i s

9 we ar e sur r ounded by st at es t hat t hei r

10 deer season goes t hr ough t he r ut and i n

11 some cases t he post - r ut . Then you

12 consi der t he st at e of Texas t hat has t he

13 l argest whi t e- t ai l ed herd i n t he

14 cont i nent al Uni t ed St at es. Al l of t hese

15 st at es' r esour ces have not been har med

16 by hunt i ng t he rut or t he post - rut .

17 Al so, wher e I hunt i n Monr oe Count y,

18 f ar mer s i n a t en- mi l e r adi us have been

19 i ssued over 500 per mi t s each year t o

20 t ake deer out t hat damage t hei r crops.

21 How many peopl e woul d t hat f eed i f t hey

22 wer e har vest ed i n t he ext ended season

23 r ather t han l ef t t o r ot i n t he f i el ds?

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Page 63

1 The second poi nt i s f r om an economi c

2 standpoi nt . Hunt i ng i s a

3 bi l l i on- dol l ar - pl us busi ness i n

4 Al abama. Hunt er s spend t housands of

5 dol l ar s i n l eases, management of t hei r

6 propert i es, and ot her rel at ed i t ems.

7 Wi t h a t hr ee- buck l i mi t and many cl ubs

8 and i ndi vi dual s pr act i ci ng QMA

9 r ecommendat i ons, t hey' r e l et t i ng t he

10 young bucks wal k so t hat t hey wi l l have

11 t he oppor t uni t y t o ki l l a mat ur e buck.

12 And t hey ar e not r eapi ng t he r ewar ds of

13 har vest i ng a mat ur e buck si nce t hey' r e

14 not get t i ng t o hunt t he rut .

15 Many cl ubs ar e havi ng a har d t i me

16 f i l l i ng t hei r member shi ps, and l odges

17 ar e hur t i ng. Thi s cont i nues and many of

18 our hunt er s ar e qui t t i ng t he spor t or

19 goi ng t o ot her stat es t o hunt . The

20 out - of - stat e hunt er s, who cont r i but e a

21 l ar ge por t i on of t he DCNR' s f undi ng, ar e

22 consi der i ng no l onger hunt i ng i n

23 Al abama, and many of t hem ar e goi ng t o

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Page 64

1 ot her st at es wher e t hey can hunt t he r ut

2 and have t he oppor t uni t y t o ki l l

3 wi l dl i f e.

4 Al so, t he mer chant s and vendor s of

5 t he stat e coul d cert ai nl y use t he ext r a

6 r evenue t hat t hi s woul d gener at e.

7 Ther e' s a l ot of suppor t f or char gi ng an

8 addi t i onal f ee t o hunt t he ext ended

9 season. Thi s woul d gener at e t housands

10 of dol l ar s whi ch woul d hel p DCNR' s

11 f i nanci al stat us, pl us possi bl y al l ow

12 f or r ai ses f or game war dens and

13 bi ol ogi s ts , whi ch i s needed.

14 Al so, i n r egar ds t o economi cs, one

15 of t he maj or i nsur ance compani es i n t he

16 stat e j ust r el eased a t wo- year study

17 t hat showed a 25- per cent i ncrease i n

18 deer- vehi cl e acci dent s at a cost of

19 $85 mi l l i on. They al so f ound t hat t her e

20 was a one- i n- 200 chance t hat a wr eck

21 wi l l occur i nvol vi ng a deer .

22 The thi rd and f i nal poi nt i s that

23 di scussi on has been t her e needs t o be

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Page 65

1 mor e st udy done or we need t o f or m a

2 commi t t ee t o l ook at t hi s bef or e i t can

3 be consi der ed or r ecommended. I pr esent

4 t o you t oday somewher e over 4, 000

5 e- mai l s i n t hat box f r om hunt er s who

6 have exper i ence f r om f i ve t o 50 year s.

7 I f you j ust t ake t he l ow end of t hat of

8 f i ve years, i t gi ves you approxi mat el y

9 20, 000 years of st udy. Wi t h t rai l

10 camer as and QMA and ot her t echnol ogy,

11 you have an educat ed and i nf or med hunt er

12 t oday. The onl y t hi ng I ask you i s t o

13 have t he same oppor t uni t y t hat al l t he

14 ot her st at es have i n t he - - and gi ve us

15 i n t he sout h an oppor t uni t y t o hunt t he

16 r ut .

17 Thank you ver y much f or your t i me.


19 Mr . Huf f aker .

20 The next speaker wi l l be Mi chael

21 Wade J ones.

22 MR. J ONES: Mr . Chai r man, Commi ssi oner , and

23 Al l Boar d Member s, I oppose t he t wo- week

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Page 66

1 ext ended season i n Febr uar y, f i r st of

2 al l , because I ' m a count ry boy. Thank

3 God I ' m a count r y boy. Ol ' Bocephus

4 sai d i t best . I t ' s j ust a f ami l y

5 t r adi t i on.

6 We al l l i ke r abbi t hunt i ng, and we

7 under stand t hat - - bei ng f rom t he sout h,

8 50 year s ol d, we al ways have smal l game

9 hunt i ng. When t hey t ook - - when t hey

10 t ook you of f your f eet and put you i n

11 t he ai r , t hey t ook t he hunt i ng out of

12 hunt i ng. You' re s i t t i ng t here wai t i ng.

13 Now you' r e not hunt i ng.

14 So I woul d l i ke t o say t hat when

15 you' r e r unni ng dogs and you' r e hunt i ng,

16 you have t o r espect your f el l ow man.

17 You' r e hunt i ng wi t h peopl e i n t he st ands

18 t aki ng shot s at you. You want t o hunt

19 when you f eel i n t he envi r onment t hat

20 you ar e saf e.

21 So I woul d l i ke f or t he board

22 member s and ever yone el se t o r eal i ze

23 t hat we al l par t i ci pat e i n hunt i ng. We

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Page 67

1 al l l i ke hunt i ng. We woul dn' t do i t i f

2 we di dn' t l i ke i t . So when we get out

3 t her e t o hunt , we want t o f eel saf e.

4 Fi r st of al l , put r espect i ve peopl e - -

5 you don' t want t o be shot at . You don' t

6 want your dogs t o be shot .

7 Fr om t he pr essur e t hat t he dogs

8 have - - t he r abbi t have on t hem as f ar

9 as t he pr edat or s, your coyot es, your

10 f oxes, t hey don' t r un l i ke t hey used

11 t o. They r un l ong and st r ai ght now.

12 And t hat way, i f you got 2500 acres of

13 l and t o hunt , t hey mi ght veer of f on

14 somebody el se l and. The r abbi t never

15 come t o wher e i t was f i r st j umped at .

16 So we got t o t ake t hat i nt o

17 consi der at i on.

18 But a per son hunt i ng, i f your dog - -

19 i f your dogs run across hi s hunt , he' l l

20 say t hat you i nt er r upt ed hi s hunt and

21 he' s got an at t i t ude. But t he dog, t hey

22 don' t r eal l y know t he boundar y t hat

23 t hey' r e goi ng t o r un on and you don' t

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Page 68

1 want t hem t o r un on. You want t hem t o

2 make t he ci r cl e and come back.

3 So we - - we r espect - - our deal

4 about r abbi t hunt i ng, you r espect

5 peopl e. You don' t want t o t ake - - I

6 ai n' t got t he st at i st i cs of how many - -

7 or how much r evenue i t br i ng i n because

8 I ' m so count ry t hat i t don' t make no

9 di f f er ence. Mi ne i s - - my r evenue i s a

10 bag l i mi t of ei ght rabbi t s per day.

11 Ei ght rabbi t s per day wi l l not equal t o

12 t he meat of one bi g buck. But we' r e

13 doi ng i t because i t ' s somet hi ng t hat you

14 l i ke and t hat ' s somet hi ng t hat you want

15 t o cont i nue.

16 So t hat ' s why I ' m standi ng here

17 t oday i s I don' t want an ext ensi on. I

18 want t o st i l l get t he bag l i mi t of ei ght

19 a day. Thank you.

20 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Thank you, Mr . J ones.

21 Okay. The next speaker wi l l be Don

22 Kni ght .

23 MR. KNI GHT: Good mor ni ng, gent l emen. I ' m Don

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Page 69

1 Kni ght , pr esi dent of t he Al abama Dog

2 Hunt er s Associ at i on and a hunt er .

3 Boy, I was al l set t o f i r e of f about

4 t he ext endi ng of deer season wher e we

5 wer e opposed t o i t because my phone has

6 been l i t up si nce t hat ar t i cl e came out

7 i n t he paper l i ke a bl i nki ng Chr i stmas

8 t ree l i ght f rom rabbi t hunters , coon

9 hunt er s.

10 You got t o st op and t hi nk about t he

11 coon hunt er s t oo. They have a l ot of

12 t hei r compet i t i ons i n Febr uar y because

13 t he l and i s avai l abl e. So cons i der

14 t hem. You' ve got t he squi r r el hunt er s.

15 And you' ve hear d some gr eat speeches

16 t oday f rom t he rabbi t hunt ers . I don' t

17 t hi nk t hat needs t o be gone i nt o any

18 f ur t her .

19 But I want t o t hank you ver y much

20 f or - - Commi ssi oner , Dan, al l of you

21 f el l ows - - f or l ooki ng i nto t hi s t hi ng

22 l i ke you ar e. I f i t ' s a bi ol ogi cal

23 r eason t o do somet hi ng wi t h t he deer

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Page 70

1 herd, we wi l l be i n suppor t of i t . Our

2 bi ol ogi cal peopl e have done us a gr eat

3 j ob. I t hi nk t hat ' s t he reason we' ve

4 got a her d l i ke we' ve got t oday. And I

5 t hi nk t hey need t o be commended. They

6 need t o be l i st ened t o. And what t hei r

7 opi ni on i s by t he f act s t hat t hey get

8 needs t o make t he deci si on.

9 As f or t he season, I bel ong t o a

10 cl ub i n Tal l adega Count y. I t ' s ki nd of

11 l i ke t he gent l eman sai d. Our r ut comes

12 i n somewhere between December t he 9t h

13 and t he 12t h ever y year when we' r e st i l l

14 hunt i ng up there.

15 My dog cl ub i s i n Bar bour Count y.

16 You can go across 431 t owar d t he r i ver

17 and you can shoot deer i n t he r ut i n

18 November t hat come out of Geor gi a.

19 That ' s t he way t hey' ve been put i n t her e

20 and st ocked and al l . You can come over

21 f i ve mi l es t o wher e we dog hunt and t hey

22 don' t come i n t i l l J anuary. So, you

23 know, wher e woul d you dr aw t he l i ne i n

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Page 71

1 breaki ng up t he count i es?

2 I mean, you' ve got t o st op and t hi nk

3 about dove season, t he compl i cat i ons,

4 t he pr obl ems, peopl e want i ng t he l i ne

5 moved, peopl e - - you' r e goi ng t o have

6 t he same t hi ng agai n i f you ext end t hi s

7 season. But I want ed t o go i nt o t hat .

8 Dan, does t hi s i ncl ude my

9 dog- hunt i ng t i me t oo? I had t wo of t hem

10 down ther e.

11 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Don, you have enough

12 t enur e t hat we' r e goi ng t o al l ow you t o

13 cont i nue speaki ng.

14 MR. KNI GHT: I ' ve been her e t oo l ong.

15 Okay. On t he dog- hunt i ng i ssues,

16 Mr . Gr ady, t he Bi g Hor n Cl ub has sent me

17 t hei r maps. They have sent me a l i st i ng

18 of t hi ngs t hey i nt end t o do and t r y t o

19 of f set any probl em t hey have. Al l t he

20 t hi ngs t hat t hey' r e t ryi ng t o do has t o

21 do wi t h account abi l i t y and

22 r esponsi bi l i t y, whi ch i s what we want

23 t hem t o do. I ' m wai t i ng on t he map f r om

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Page 72

1 t he opposi t i on t hat don' t want t he dog

2 hunt i ng over t her e. As soon as I get

3 t hem, we' l l set t l e down. We' l l put t hem

4 t oget her . We wi l l t r y t o come up wi t h

5 maybe some ar eas t hat we don' t need t o

6 dog hunt i n t her e t o stop t hese

7 pr obl ems. We' r e goi ng t o set down and

8 cont i nue t o wor k on t hese pr obl ems, and

9 we appreci at e y' al l gi vi ng t hem t he t i me

10 t o get t hese i ssues stopped.

11 On anot her i ssue wi t h t he dog

12 hunt i ng i n t he nor t hwest count i es and

13 al l t hat ' s been cl osed down, I ' ve got t en

14 sever al cal l s l at el y - - mat t er of f act ,

15 I ' ve got a l ot of cal l s l at el y - - of

16 peopl e t hat ar e di sgr unt l ed. Now, we

17 had peopl e j ust qui t hunt i ng when we di d

18 away wi t h t hose hunt i ng - - dog hunt i ng

19 up t her e.

20 These peopl e are st i l l st i l l hunt i ng

21 at t hi s t i me, but what i t has done t o

22 t hem i s br oke up t hei r f ami l y at mospher e

23 at t hei r hunt i ng cl ub. Previ ousl y you' d

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Page 73

1 get t oget her wi t h 50 of your f r i ends

2 t hat you' ve been gr owi ng up wi t h and

3 r unni ng dogs and have a bi g soci al

4 i ssue. Now i t ' s got t o t he poi nt t hat

5 t hey' ve had t o - - t o be abl e t o l ease

6 t hei r l and, t hey' ve had t o br i ng i n a

7 l ot of peopl e f rom out s i de. Now, over a

8 per i od of t i me maybe i t wi l l get back

9 t hat way. But i n t hat per i od of t i me

10 you' re l osi ng a l ot of hunters .

11 I want t o j ust ask you, when t hese

12 cl ubs come i n and ask f or a per mi t i n

13 t hose count i es, pl ease gi ve i t st r ong

14 consi der at i on. We need t o get t hese

15 peopl e back hunt i ng as qui ck as we can.

16 I f any i ssues come up, pl ease f eel f r ee

17 t o cal l me. I wi l l work on t hem. I

18 wi l l hel p any way I can. Take

19 consi der at i on f or our rabbi t hunt ers ,

20 our squi r r el hunt ers , and our j ust

21 over al l peopl e t hat hunt . We need t o

22 get mor e peopl e hunt i ng, not l ess peopl e

23 hunt i ng.

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Page 74

1 Thank you ver y much.

2 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: The next speaker i s Loui e

3 Mat t ocks.

4 MR. MATTOCKS: Good morni ng, Gent l emen.

5 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Speak i nt o t he mi cr ophone,

6 pl ease, Mr . Mat t ocks.

7 MR. MATTOCKS: I s t hat bet t er ?

8 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: That ' s bet t er .

9 MR. MATTOCKS: Oh, okay. My name i s Loui e

10 Mat t ocks. I ' m f r om out s i de of

11 Beaur egar d, whi ch i s on t he Lee

12 Count y/ Russel l Count y/ Macon Count y

13 l i nes. And I ' ma r abbi t hunter .

14 And you mi ght want t o know what I

15 want t o t al k about t oday, and t hat ' s I ' m

16 agai nst t he ext ensi on of deer season

17 i nt o Febr uar y. We j ust hear d t he

18 prel i mi nary repor t basi cal l y t hat - - on

19 t he ef f ect on t he deer popul at i on. And

20 everybody' s poi nt ed out - - t her e' s

21 not hi ng I can say except t o r epeat what

22 has al r eady been sai d her e.

23 I do t hi nk t hat some of t he deer

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Page 75

1 hunt ers are short s i ght ed i n t hi s . We - -

2 t he deer - - t he wi l dl i f e of Al abama

3 shoul dn' t be a r evenue sour ce. That

4 shoul dn' t be t he pr i mar y r eason. And

5 when we st ar t br i ngi ng i n - - I know we

6 have out - of - st at e hunt er s, and I know

7 t her e' s a pi l e of t hem. We had a l ease

8 t hat was l ost t wo year s ago. The

9 management company - - t he l ease went

10 f r om $8 t o $12 an acre. And t he deer

11 hunt er s who l et us r abbi t hunt on i t

12 dur i ng deer season, a l ot of t hem

13 deci ded t hey coul dn' t af f ord i t

14 anymor e. The l ease was gone. And now

15 we see Fl or i da t ags pul l i n al l t he

16 t i me. That ' s j ust t he way i t i s.

17 I don' t - - I t hi nk t he l andowners

18 who hunt and t he deer hunt er s - - i f you

19 go i nt o Febr uar y, what you' r e goi ng t o

20 have happen i s peopl e get out of

21 hunt i ng. Mysel f , I ' l l have t o sel l my

22 pack. Li ke t he gent l eman sai d, I spend

23 a l ot of money on t hem ever y year . And

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Page 76

1 f or t wo weeks out of t he year when t he

2 br i ar s are greeni ng up and i t get s

3 warmer , i t ' s j ust not wor t h i t . And at

4 t hat poi nt I ' l l pr obabl y qui t hunt i ng.

5 And f or t he deer hunt ers I ' d l i ke t o

6 say t her e' s no bet t er way t o scout t hei r

7 propert y and f i nd t hat bi g buck. I

8 mean, when you can' t f i nd hi m f r om t he

9 stand, a r abbi t hunt er ' s pr obabl y goi ng

10 t o be abl e t o t el l you what t hi cket he' s

11 goi ng t hr ough and why he sees your st and

12 bef or e you see hi m.

13 That ' s r eal l y al l I have t o say.

14 Thank you.


16 The next speaker i s Kel vi n Bai l ey.

17 MR. BAI LEY: Good mor ni ng. I ' d l i ke t o t hank

18 you f or t he oppor t uni t y t o come and

19 l i st en. I come t o you as a l andowner .

20 I own about 120- acre f ar m i n Bl ount

21 Count y, Al abama, j ust a l i t t l e nor t h of

22 Oneont a. I ' m a bow hunt er .

23 The pr obl em I have year af t er year

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Page 77

1 i s dog hunt er s. They usual l y come i n

2 t her e - - t hey usual l y come out about

3 seven o' cl ock i n t he mor ni ng. I spend

4 al l year l ong get t i ng my pr oper t y

5 ready. I scout . I ' ve got stands

6 pl aced. I know wher e my deer ' s

7 r unni ng. I know wher e t hey ar e. And

8 usual l y t hey' l l get some ki nd of

9 per mi ssi on f r om somebody t hat owns l i ke

10 t en acres, and t hey' l l l et l oose about

11 t en dogs on i t .

12 Wel l , t he reason t hey do t hat i s

13 because you can see t he deer goi ng

14 ar ound my pr oper t y, j umpi ng acr oss t he

15 r oad, what ever , as t hey go out t hr ough

16 t here. So what they' l l do i s t hey' l l

17 get on t hat t en acres and r un t hei r dogs

18 across my propert y.

19 Me, as a l andowner , t hat ' s a

20 vi ol at i on of my r i ght s. Dog

21 t r espassi ng - - I know t hey don' t know

22 Engl i sh. I know t hey can' t r ead. But

23 i n my eyes t hat ' s j ust l i ke a per son

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1 t r espassi ng. You know, t hey have dogs.

2 They shoul d do ever yt hi ng t hey can f or

3 t hei r l i vel i hood and t he wel l - bei ng of

4 t hat dog j ust l i ke we do as chi l dr en - -

5 or f or our chi l dr en.

6 So what I ' d l i ke to see done i s i f

7 Bl ount Count y or even t he nor t her n par t

8 of Bl ount Count y coul d - - t her e coul d be

9 some ki nd of r estr i ct i on t her e sayi ng

10 t hat i f you don' t own or have a l ease of

11 at l east 500 acr es, t hen you shoul dn' t

12 be al l owed t o r un dogs. And t hat ' s

13 r eal l y al l I have t o say.

14 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Very good. Thank you,

15 Mr . Bai l ey.

16 MR. BAI LEY: Thank you.

17 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: The next speaker i s Scot t

18 Cher ones.

19 MR. CHERONES: Commi ssi oner Guy, Mr . Moul t r i e,

20 how ar e y' al l ? Advi sor y Boar d Member s.

21 My name i s Scot t Cher ones. I ' m f r om

22 Hel ena, Al abama.

23 How you doi ng, Br ock?

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1 I happen t o own some l and and hunt

2 i n Chi l t on Count y, however , and j ust

3 want ed t o echo t he l ast speaker ' s

4 chal l enges wi t h speci f i cal l y deer dog

5 hunt i ng. And we have a t er r i bl e pr obl em

6 t hat i s j ust out of cont rol wi t h dog - -

7 deer dogs dur i ng t he stal k- hunt i ng

8 season t r aver si ng ot her peopl e' s

9 pr oper t i es. And i t i s a - - r eal l y, I

10 want you guys t o know t hat , you know, we

11 r espect t he r i ght s of t he dog hunt er s t o

12 hel p car r y on t hat t radi t i on. That ' s

13 t he r eason t hat t hi s i s an al l owed

14 pr act i ce i n t he stat e of Al abama,

15 obvi ousl y, because i t ' s such a

16 wel l - root ed t radi t i on. But t he i ssues ,

17 at l east i n our part of t he count y, ar e

18 - - have t o do wi t h ot her l andowner s'

19 r i ght s and t he i nf r i ngement of t hose

20 r i ght s . I t ' s j ust a t er r i bl e pr obl em.

21 I n the same t radi t i on l i ne of

22 t hi nki ng, I have had a very di f f i cul t

23 t i me get t i ng my own f ami l y br ought up i n

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1 the t r adi t i on of st i l l hunt i ng, whi ch i s

2 how I l ear ned how t o deer hunt , because

3 al most ever y t i me I ' m on a deer st and or

4 t r yi ng t o t each my chi l dr en how t o hunt

5 t her e ar e deer dogs r unni ng al l over my

6 proper t y and di st urbi ng our abi l i t y t o,

7 you know, hunt i n a way t hat we woul d

8 l i ke t o hunt . I real l y know of no ot her

9 ar ena wher e one gr oup' s act i ons i nf r i nge

10 so t er r i bl y on anot her gr oup' s act i ons

11 and i t ' s al l owed and even encour aged as

12 i t i s i n t he stat e of Al abama and, i n

13 par t i cul ar , i n my ar ea of Chi l t on Count y

14 wher e I own pr oper t y and hunt .

15 But I r eal l y - - t hat ' s t he mai n

16 poi nt s. I j ust - - you know, my mot her

17 i s a bi r d wat cher , and she' s even had

18 i ssues wi t h t he deer dogs di st ur bi ng her

19 abi l i t y on my pr oper t y t o do t hat .

20 Because she' s concer ned about t hese dogs

21 bar ki ng, wor r i ed t hat t hey' r e goi ng t o

22 bother her . I mean, i t ' s j ust a real l y

23 bi g pr obl em i n t hat ar ea. And sever al

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Page 81

1 of my adj acent l andowner s and even

2 nei ghbor s not adj acent ar e her e t oday

3 wi t h t he same i ssue.

4 Anyway, t hat ' s al l I have t o say,

5 l et you guys be awar e of . Thank you.

6 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Thank you, Mr . Cher ones.

7 Mr . Cher ones, I t hi nk I was r eadi ng

8 t hr ough t he di f f er ent ei t her compl ai nt s

9 of t he peopl e f or dog deer hunt i ng or

10 agai nst deer hunt i ng. Was i t you t hat

11 had t he compl ai nt t hat peopl e wer e st i l l

12 dog deer hunt i ng i n t he l ast t wo weeks

13 of J anuar y when i t was supposed t o be

14 banned? I s t hat cor r ect ?

15 MR. CHERONES: No. That ' s one of my nei ghbors

16 who wi l l al so speak. I wasn' t t her e at

17 t hat t i me t o wi t ness i t , but t hat was on

18 t he same - - i n t he same gener al ar ea

19 t hat I ' m - - where my proper t y i s.

20 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Okay. Very good. Thank

21 you.

22 The next speaker wi l l be Paul

23 J ef f r eys.

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1 MR. J EFFREYS: Excuse me. I ' m not used t o

2 st andi ng st i l l whi l e I speak.

3 I t hi nk I need t o probabl y st ar t

4 si gni ng up under ot her t opi cs because I

5 usual l y come up her e i n t he di scussi on

6 agai nst dog deer hunt i ng, but t her e' s

7 been ot her t opi cs come up t hat I ' m - -

8 t hat I ' m al so i nt erested i n. And my

9 wi f e i s al ways - - al l t he t i me on me

10 t hat I need t o l i st some of my

11 credent i al s. And I ' m not too wel l at

12 t oot i ng my own hor n or bl owi ng my own

13 whi st l e, but I ' m goi ng t o gi ve thi s a

14 shot and see how i t goes.

15 But , anyway, not t o r ead str ai ght

16 of f a resume, I am an i nst ruct or at

17 Mi ssi ssi ppi St at e Uni vers i t y Col l ege of

18 For est Resour ces. I have a bachel or ' s

19 degr ee i n f or estr y. I have a master ' s

20 degree i n f orest genet i cs. I ' m a

21 pendi ng Ph. D. st udent i n f or est r y wi t h a

22 mi nor i n ext ensi on educat i on. So I have

23 a l ot of conservat i on educat i on

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1 backgr ound. I al so have r ecei ved a l ot

2 of wi l dl i f e management educat i on.

3 So I chose Mi ssi ssi ppi State

4 Uni vers i t y j ust because i t was i n t he

5 pr oxi mi t y of my home, not t o choose i t

6 over Auburn. But i t was j ust a l i t t l e

7 bi t cl oser . So I di dn' t want t o - - I

8 don' t want t o ruf f l e any f eat hers. And,

9 by t he way, we di d hel p wi t h t he

10 anal ysi s of the di r t f r om the t rees at

11 Toomer ' s Cor ner . So I j ust want t o make

12 t hat cl ear . Our l ab hel ped wi t h t hat ;

13 okay?

14 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Appr eci at e i t .

15 MR. J EFFREYS: So I hear a l ot f r om

16 Mi ssi ssi ppi hunt er s about t hei r hunt i ng

17 season. And I ' ve hear d some peopl e t al k

18 about changi ng or cl osi ng dat es i n t he

19 mi ddl e of t he deer season. And a l ot of

20 my col l eagues i n of f i ce, t hey' re

21 Mi ssi ssi ppi hunt er s. I - - act ual l y, I

22 have a l i cense - - Mi ssi ssi ppi l i cense.

23 I hunt over t her e al so.

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1 But t hey r eal l y f uss and compl ai n

2 ever y year about t hei r spl i t seasons and

3 what t hey' r e - - what t hey have t o put up

4 wi t h. Because t hey st ar t muzzl e l oadi ng

5 and t hen t hey go t o r i f l e and t hen t hey

6 st op and go back t o pr i mi t i ve and t hen

7 go back t o r i f l e. And t hey t al k about

8 how l ucky we ar e because we have j ust

9 t he st r ai ght season and t hat our season

10 ends when i t ' s supposed t o. And t hat

11 i s - - t hat ' s somet hi ng t hat t hey envy us

12 about .

13 Anot her t hi ng i s Mi ssi ssi ppi has

14 l engt hened t hei r deer season i n t he

15 sout h par t of t he st at e because of t he

16 rut . I t goes t o February t he 15t h, I

17 bel i eve. And I work upstai r s f rom t he

18 wi l dl i f e depar t ment , and I know

19 Dr . Demar ai s down t her e, our wi l dl i f e - -

20 or deer researcher .

21 And I can ask t he bi ol ogi sts here.

22 I f I ' mnot mi staken, I t hi nk t he r ut i s

23 act ual l y t r i ggered f rom t he dayl i ght

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1 gl eaned f rom t he deer ' s eye. So i t ' s

2 not - - i t ' s probabl y a genet i c probl em

3 more t han i t i s - - you know, and i t ' s

4 pr obabl y goi ng l onger because we have

5 t oo many does. They' r e j ust not get t i ng

6 bred. I t ' s st ar t i ng at t he same t i me.

7 We have such a bad - - or such an of f set

8 r at i o t hat we cannot - - t hat t he bucks

9 ar e unabl e t o br eed t he does i n t hat

10 amount of t i me.

11 So f or once I ' d l i ke t o commend - - I

12 t al ked t o Don Kni ght . I act ual l y agr ee

13 wi t h hi m. I don' t t hi nk we need t o

14 l engt hen t hi s deer season. And I woul d

15 l i ke t o encour age al l of y' al l t o l i st en

16 t o our bi ol ogi sts because t hat ' s what - -

17 you know, my educat i on i s i n r esear ch.

18 I ' ve done dat a anal ysi s. And we base a

19 l ot of our - - ever yt hi ng we do i s based

20 on number s and dat a t hat ' s col l ected.

21 We go i n t he f i el d and col l ect - -

22 I know. I ' ve got t o f i ni sh up.

23 - - dat a t hat ' s bei ng col l ected i n

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Page 86

1 t he f i el d. So i t ' s al l - - i t i s based

2 on t hat . And we need t o - - bef or e we

3 make any r ash deci si ons about

4 l engt heni ng t he deer season, we need t o

5 l ook at t he dat a and real l y t ry t o key

6 i n on what i s t he probl em - - I mean,

7 what i s causi ng i t t o go i nt o Febr uar y

8 and cor r ect i ng t hat and maybe br i ngi ng

9 t he breedi ng per i od back.

10 I don' t t hi nk i t ' s somethi ng that - -

11 I don' t - - i t ' s not t he deer changi ng.

12 I t ' s not t he genet i cs changi ng i n t he

13 deer . Because i t ' s been t hat way f or

14 t housands and t housands of year s ever

15 si nce, you know, God creat ed t hem. But

16 what we need t o wor k on i s seei ng what

17 we - - somet hi ng has changed i n t hei r

18 dai l y r out i ne t hat has caused t hem t o go

19 i nt o Febr uar y t o br eed. And what we

20 need t o do i s we need t o l i st en t o our

21 bi ol ogi st s and see what we can do t o

22 br i ng t hat back.

23 Okay. I ' m al so a l andowner and

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Page 87

1 hunt er i n Lamar Count y. We enj oy our

2 ban t hat we r ecei ved on dog deer

3 hunt i ng. And t al ki ng about number s,

4 t hey don' t l i e. We do not have any

5 compl ai nt s f r om l andowner s. We went

6 down t o f our . So l et ' s l ook at t hose

7 numbers and see how t hat has worked over

8 t he past f ew year s. And t hat ' s been a

9 success story. So I j ust ask t hat y' al l

10 mai nt ai n our ban i n our nor t hwest

11 count i es.

12 Thank you.

13 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Thank you, Mr . J ef f r eys.

14 MR. BROCK J ONES: Mr . Chai r man?

15 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Yes. I ' ve got t wo

16 quest i ons. Mr . J ones f i r s t . Mr . Brock

17 J ones.

18 MR. BROCK J ONES: I f we coul d get Chr i s Cook

19 t o addr ess t he i ssue of whet her t her e i s

20 a t r end i n hi s study so f ar on t he r ut

21 extendi ng i nto February or i f i t ' s

22 j ust - - t hi s past year j ust happened t o

23 be an of f year t hat t hat happened t o

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Page 88

1 t ake pl ace.

2 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Mr . J ones, we' r e goi ng t o

3 go i nto t hat i n a l at er par t of t he - -

4 t hei r di vi si on i s goi ng to present a

5 repor t on t hat . I s t hat goi ng t o be

6 adequat e t o pr esent t hen - -

7 MR. BROCK J ONES: Sur e.

8 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: - - so we can expedi t e

9 goi ng t hr ough t he publ i c sect i on?

10 Thank you.

11 Mr . Hat l ey.

12 MR. HATLEY: Paul , what does t he acr onym ASLC

13 st and f or ?

14 MR. J EFFREYS: Al abama Spor t sman' s and

15 Landowner ' s Counci l . And when I f i r st

16 st ar t ed comi ng down her e back when I was

17 j ust a young' un - - and you wer e pr obabl y

18 a f ew year s younger your sel f - - t hat was

19 t he name of our or gani zat i on. And we - -

20 I st i l l do - - I wor k wi th t hat gr oup.

21 So I am i n t hei r organi zat i on, and we

22 do - - we ar e suppor t i ng t he l andowner ' s

23 pr oper t y r i ght s when i t comes t o

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Page 89

1 t r espassi ng.

2 And, i f I coul d, can I - - I was not

3 sayi ng t hat i t was j ust an of f year wi t h

4 t he deer . I ' m sayi ng i t has progressed

5 over t i me t hat our - - our deer

6 popul at i on has got t en so skewed t o one

7 si de wi t h buck- doe r at i o t hat t he bucks

8 are j ust not - - you know, t hey can' t

9 handl e t he pressure.

10 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: We' l l have a ver y good

11 repor t on t hat here shor t l y.

12 MR. J EFFREYS: Thank you.

13 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Very good. Thank you.

14 MR. HARTZOG: When you di d your soi l sampl e of

15 t he Aubur n soi l , di d you r ecommend mor e

16 poi son?

17 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Let me cl ear t he r ecord on

18 t hat . That was Mr . Gr ady Har t zog.

19 Thank you, Mr . J ef f reys.

20 The next speaker wi l l be Mi chael

21 Lat hem.

22 MR. LATHEM: Good mor ni ng, gent l emen. I ' m

23 Mi chael Lat hem. I ' m a nei ghbor of Scot t

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Page 90

1 Cher ones. We' r e i n Chi l t on Count y east

2 of 65, bet ween 65 and Lake Mi t chel l .

3 And I woul d l i ke t o echo hi s

4 comment s about t he nat ur e of t he dog

5 hunt i ng i n our area of t he count y. I t

6 seems t o be an i ncreasi ng pr obl em wi t h

7 dogs r unni ng across our pr oper t y and

8 bei ng - - t he dogs are bei ng

9 i ndi scr i mi nant l y l et out on ver y smal l

10 t r act s and r unni ng across our l and, and

11 i t ' s t aki ng t he enj oyment out of hunt i ng

12 f or me and my f ami l y. And I have young

13 boys, and t hey' ve j ust about qui t goi ng

14 because j ust about ever y t i me we go t hi s

15 exper i ence i s hamper ed by dogs r unni ng

16 i n ar ound us.

17 I ' ve had sever al conver sat i ons wi t h

18 dog hunt er s i n t he ar ea, and t hey don' t

19 seem t o car e t hat t hei r dogs ar e

20 crossi ng pr opert y l i nes and i nf r i ngi ng

21 on our l and. Agai n, t hey f eel l i ke t hat

22 i t ' s al l t hei r l and. And i t ' s har d t o

23 change t he at t i t ude. And t r yi ng t o

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Page 91

1 r espect t hem and get t hem t o t r y t o

2 change behavi or has been di f f i cul t , but

3 we ar e t r yi ng t o do t hat i n a ver y

4 const r uct i ve way. I woul d ask you guys

5 t o consi der changi ng t he l aw and

6 r estr i ct i ng t he dog hunt i ng i n t hat ar ea

7 i f at al l possi bl e.

8 Thank you.

9 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Mr . Lathem, Commi ssi oner

10 Guy asked a quest i on t hat - - i s t hi s one

11 par t i cul ar cl ub t hat i s gi vi ng y' al l

12 pr obl ems or dog hunt i ng i n gener al i n

13 t hat ar ea?

14 MR. LATHEM: I t ' s har d f or me t o say. I don' t

15 know al l t he i ndi vi dual s . And I don' t

16 want t o be conf r ont at i onal wi t h t he

17 i ndi vi dual s. I know wher e t hey put

18 t hei r dogs out and - - but I don' t know

19 exact l y who t hey ar e. I ' ve t al ked t o

20 sever al of t hem. And one was a member

21 of t he cl ub, and one was not a member of

22 t he cl ub. And i t ' s not j ust dur i ng t he

23 dog season t hat t he dogs ar e out

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Page 92

1 r unni ng. I t ' s bef or e t he season and

2 af t er t he season. So I can' t answer

3 t hat quest i on.

4 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: So, Mr . Lat hem, i t was you

5 t hat had pr obl ems wi t h t he dogs r unni ng

6 dur i ng J anuar y or somebody el se?

7 MR. LATHEM: That ' s not my compl ai nt . That ' s

8 goi ng t o be anot her i ndi vi dual . But I

9 di d see i t happen.

10 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Okay. Very good. Thank

11 you.

12 The next speaker wi l l be Randy

13 St . J ohn.

14 MR. ST. J OHN: Mor ni ng, gent l emen. I ' m Randy

15 St . J ohn f r om Chi l t on Count y. Mi ckey

16 Lat hem and Scot t Cher ones ar e my

17 nei ghbor s. I ' m act ual l y i n bet ween

18 t hem. They own par cel s on bot h si des of

19 me. We manage cl ose t o a t housand acr es

20 bet ween t he t hree of us, I ' d say. I ' m

21 t he smal l est pr oper t y owner of t hem.

22 I ' m t he one t hat - - wel l , act ual l y,

23 Set h, a f r i end of mi ne t hat was wi t h me,

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Page 93

1 he act ual l y i s t he one t hat got t he

2 dog. But we had t wo dogs t he l ast

3 weekend of deer season i n J anuar y t hat

4 we caught r unni ng does. And t he - - I

5 cal l ed t he game war dens f i r st when I got

6 t he dogs i n t he a. m. hours, I ' d say, 10,

7 11 a. m. We di dn' t get no r esponse f r om

8 t hem. At about , I want t o say, t hr ee or

9 f our o' cl ock bef or e i t got dar k,

10 I cal l ed t he dog owner t o l et hi m know

11 t hat I had hi s dogs. And he come out

12 t her e, and he commenced t o t el l i ng me

13 t hat t hey had t ur ned t hem l oose on a

14 pi ece of pr oper t y about 20 t o 30 acres.

15 I t ' s al most t wo mi l es f r om wher e we wer e

16 at . And he sai d t hat t hose dogs wer e

17 r unni ng t hr ee bi g does, t hat t hey t ook a

18 shot at t hem and he di dn' t hi t t hem

19 and - - excuse me - - and t he dogs wer e

20 j ust r unni ng.

21 I sai d, wel l , t hose does happened t o

22 be on my pr oper t y. Mat t er of f act , t hey

23 about pl owed over Set h t r yi ng t o get

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Page 94

1 away f r om t he dogs. And he act ual l y was

2 abl e t o cat ch t he dogs. And we' r e

3 near l y t wo mi l es f r om wher e he t ur ned

4 t he dogs out .

5 And t he quest i on was, i s i t a

6 par t i cul ar cl ub? No, si r . I t ' s a cl ub

7 and a pr i vat e l andowner t hat has wr i t t en

8 per mi ssi on t o t hese dog hunt er s t o al l ow

9 t hem t o hunt on t hei r pr oper t y i n smal l

10 parcel s of l and. I t hi nk i t ' s under 500

11 acres . I don' t bel i eve 500 acres i s

12 suf f i ci ent f or dog hunt i ng. I t hi nk i t

13 needs t o be i n t he t housands of acres.

14 I ' ve caught dogs i n - - I catch

15 anywher e f r om si x t o t en dogs dur i ng t he

16 season. I l i ve at t he end of t he road.

17 I l i ve - - t hat ' s my per manent addr ess.

18 I know t hat - - I cat ch anywher e f r om si x

19 t o t en dogs a year . These i ndi vi dual s

20 t ur n t hei r dogs l oose on t he ot her s i de

21 of t he cr eek on - - near t he pr oper t y

22 l i ne, i f not on a road access, and t hei r

23 dogs j ust i nstant l y come our di r ect i on.

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Page 95

1 I don' t know - - I don' t know why or , you

2 know, i f i t ' s j ust t he way t he deer

3 t ravel comi ng t o us f rom t he cr eek.

4 Some of t he dogs have r adi o col l ar s on.

5 Some of t hemdon' t .

6 The dog hunt er s have no concer n of

7 us as pr i vat e pr oper t y owner s. They

8 have no desi r e t o wor k wi t h us. Thei r

9 at t i t ude i s I ' ve l i ved her e al l my

10 l i f e. I can do what I want t o do. I ' ve

11 owned t hi s pr oper t y. My f ami l y has

12 owned t hi s l and. You know, you movi ng

13 here, i t doesn' t bot her us, and we' l l

14 r un our dogs when we want t o. That

15 seems t o be t he gener al at t i t ude of

16 ever y dog hunt er t hat I ' ve r un i n t o.

17 I know t hat t her e may be good dog

18 hunt ers out t here. I ' m not sayi ng

19 t her e' s not . But i n t he ar ea t hat we

20 have t hey' r e out of cont rol . They' re

21 r ut hl ess. They t hr ow t r ash on t he

22 r oads. They - - i f t hey cat ch a game

23 war den i n t he ar ea, t hey have CB

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Page 96

1 radi os. They' l l r adi o t o thei r buddi es

2 sayi ng, hey, t he f ox i s i n t he hen house

3 or what ever . And t hey act str ai ght f or

4 a l i t t l e whi l e t i l l t he game warden

5 l eaves t he ar ea.

6 I ' ve had a game war den t el l me t hat

7 when he does cat ch one on t he r oad or

8 near t he r oad t hat he has a f i ne, but

9 al l of hi s buddi es pi t ch i n a hat and

10 col l ect the f i ne, and i t don' t cost them

11 t en or $12 a pocket book. And i n my

12 opi ni on t hat ' s - - t hat ' s j ust car el ess.

13 And I - - I mean, I ' m st r i ct l y

14 opposed t o dog hunt i ng i n our ar ea i n

15 Chi l t on Count y. And l i ke Mi ckey sai d,

16 we' r e bet ween I - 65 and Lake Mi t chel l ,

17 f r om Lay Dam t o Mi t chel l Dam. And i t ' s

18 j ust - - i t ' s out of cont r ol . I t ' s j ust

19 r i di cul ous.

20 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Mr . St . J ohn, t wo t hi ngs.

21 The Commi ssi oner had asked who' s zone

22 you were i n - - or di st r i ct you wer e i n,

23 and you had t al ked t o Mr . Dobbs; i s t hat

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Page 97

1 cor r ect ?

2 MR. ST. J OHN: Cor r ect , yes , s i r .

3 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: So you have appr oached t he

4 boar d?

5 MR. ST. J OHN: Yes.

6 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: The t wo weeks t hat t hey

7 wer e hunt i ng i n J anuar y when t he season

8 was cl osed and you cal l ed t he war den,

9 di d he make a case on t hat ?

10 MR. ST. J OHN: I don' t know - - I never di d get

11 a war den t o t he house - - or t o our

12 l ocat i on. I j ust had a warden say,

13 l ook, i f you have anot her pr obl em, cal l

14 me. And he' s t ol d me about t he i ssues

15 t hat ' s he had wi t h t r yi ng t o t r ack t hem

16 down and hi s mor e concer n was peopl e

17 spot l i ght i ng at ni ght and hunt i ng at

18 ni ght mor e t han i t was on dog hunt er s.

19 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Al l an, have you had any

20 knowl edge of dog hunt i ng dur i ng t he

21 cl osed par t of t he season, t he l ast t wo

22 weeks? Has t hat been any ki nd of

23 pr obl em?

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Page 98

1 MR. ANDRESS: I ' m not awar e of anyt hi ng i n

2 t hi s par t i cul ar ar ea.

3 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Okay. Very good.

4 COMMI SSI ONER GUY: How about t al ki ng t o

5 Mr . Andr ess bef or e you l eave t oday

6 concer ni ng t hat .

7 MR. ST. J OHN: Yes, s i r . Thank you, s i r .


9 much.

10 MR. ST. J OHN: Thank you.

11 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Al l r i ght . The next

12 speaker i s Mr . J er ome Boone.

13 MR. BOONE: Good mor ni ng. I ' m J er ome Boone

14 f r om - -

15 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Speak i nt o t he mi cr ophone,

16 pl ease, Mr . Boone.

17 MR. BOONE: I ' m f r om Tal l apoosa Count y. I ' m

18 t he pres i dent of t he Hi gh Hi l l

19 Conser vat i on Cl ub, a dog- hunt i ng cl ub.

20 And I ' d l i ke f or y' al l t o reconsi der t he

21 vot e y' al l made at t he f i r st meet i ng on

22 put t i ng Tal l apoosa Count y on a per mi t

23 syst em. We wasn' t abl e t o def end

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Page 99

1 oursel f . I ' ve been t o a l ot of these

2 meet i ngs, and I ai n' t never seen a

3 deci si on made on t he f i r st meet i ng.

4 Usual l y i t ' s t he t hi r d meet i ng.

5 And t he boy t hat ' s vi ce- pr es i dent of

6 t he cl ub, he owns 75 acr es t hat ' s

7 adj oi ni ng t he l ady t hat ' s compl ai ned

8 about dogs r unni ng on her pr oper t y. I

9 don' t per sonal l y know t he l ady. I know

10 her mot her and f at her . And she want ed

11 t o bow hunt on i t whenever . We sur r ound

12 t hei r proper t y t ot al l y. I woul d have

13 been mor e t han gl ad t o have wor ked out a

14 schedul e wi t h her f or her t o hunt her

15 pr oper t y and nobody bot her i ng her .

16 And when I seen who she was speaki ng

17 f or , I got a sher i f f ' s repor t on one of

18 t he guys t hi s past season wher e he

19 caught t he boy' s dog. And i t was hi s

20 yar d dog. He l i ves by hi s pr oper t y.

21 And t he f i r st quest i on he asked, i sn' t

22 your uncl e J er ome Boone?

23 And i t ' s a vengeance t hi ng. And

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Page 100

1 I - - I mean, I chal l enge y' al l t o check

2 out what t hese peopl e i s sayi ng because

3 i t j ust - - we al l l i ve t her e. We cut

4 our member shi p t hi s t i me t o hal f of what

5 we was doi ng. I t al ked t o Mi chael

6 East . He sai d t he smoot hest hunt i ng

7 season he had. Then I get down her e at

8 t he f i r st meet i ng, and I was a coupl e of

9 mi nut es t oo l at e t o s i gn up t o speak.

10 And, you know, what was t ol d - - i t was

11 mor e or l ess t he same gr oup t hat came

12 l ast year except t hey got a di f f er ent

13 speaker .

14 And I j ust - - I j ust wi sh y' al l

15 woul d r econsi der . I i nvi t e y' al l t o

16 hunt wi t h us and be gl ad f or any of

17 y' al l t o come down and t al k t o t he

18 peopl e t hat l i ve i n t he communi t y. Let

19 t hem t el l you. I t ai n' t - - i t i sn' t

20 l i ke the peopl e that ' s l i vi ng t here i s

21 compl ai ni ng. I t ' s t he ones t hat ' s

22 comi ng i n and l easi ng Al abama Power

23 Company l and.

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Page 101

1 Our cl ub does not j oi n t he

2 Tal l apoosa Ri ver . The power company has

3 l and bet ween our l and and t he Tal l apoosa

4 Ri ver . And I ' ve l i ved t here al l my

5 l i f e. I ' m a f our t h- gener at i on dog

6 hunt er , and t hat ' s wher e i t began.

7 Ther e' s t hr ee dog- hunt i ng cl ubs f r om

8 Camp ASCCA, t he East er Seal s, t o

9 Hor seshoe Bend Nat i onal Mi l i t ar y Par k.

10 And t hat ' s wher e dog hunt i ng began when

11 t he f i rst deer was ever put i n

12 Tal l apoosa Count y. And al l we want t o

13 do i s run our dogs.

14 And t her e' s pl ent y of power company

15 l and acr oss Tal l apoosa Ri ver t hat ' s not

16 l eased. I mean, i f you' re t otal l y

17 agai nst dog hunt i ng, don' t want t o be

18 ar ound i t , why do you come and l ease a

19 pi ece of pr oper t y i n t he mi ddl e of dog

20 hunt i ng? I don' t understand i t . I

21 r eal l y don' t .

22 We had a gr oup f r om Randol ph Count y

23 t hat came down and l eased f r om t he power

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Page 102

1 company. Ki l l ed over 30 of our dogs.

2 We f i nal l y deal t wi t h t he power company

3 and got t hem moved out . But t hey l ef t

4 t he count y t hat t hey had got t en dog

5 hunt i ng done away wi t h and come t o our

6 count y. Thi ngs l i ke that I don' t

7 under st and. I r eal l y don' t .

8 And I f ound out who shot my dog l ast

9 year . I had a dog t hat - - r i ght bef ore

10 t he Euf aul a meet i ng. Cost me

11 450- somet hi ng- dol l ar s t o have hi s l eg

12 amput ated. I t ol d the sher i f f ' s

13 depar t ment , t ol d t he game war den. And

14 t he boy t hat - - was st andi ng t her e when

15 t he guy done i t . And I don' t know. We

16 can' t get no hel p. Can' t get no hel p.

17 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Mr . Lynch, I bel i eve t hi s

18 i s your di st r i ct .

19 MR. LYNCH: Mr . Boone, t hi s was di scussed

20 extensi vel y l ast year at al l the

21 meet i ngs. I had di scussi ons wi t h you

22 and ot her f ol ks on t he ot her si de of t he

23 i ssue, had di scussi ons wi t h t he of f i cers

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Page 103

1 t hat ar e over t hat ar ea, had di scussi on

2 wi t h t hem agai n pr i or t o comi ng t o our

3 f i rst meet i ng t hi s year wher e i t was

4 br ought up agai n. And we vot ed on i t

5 based upon t he f act t hat i t had been

6 ext ensi vel y di scussed t he year bef or e.

7 The l ast t hi ng you and I t al ked

8 about at t he l ast meet i ng l ast year ,

9 when nobody came t o speak agai nst i t ,

10 you sai d i t ' s not f ai r t o put i t i n when

11 nobody i s speaki ng agai nst i t . I t ol d

12 you at t hat t i me I agr eed wi t h t hat . So

13 we di dn' t vot e on t hat . But I t ol d you,

14 al so, t hat i f we di dn' t see i mpr ovement

15 and t her e wasn' t a di f f erent at t i t ude

16 t hat t he next st ep woul d have t o be t o

17 go t o t he per mi t system.

18 Now, you' r e not goi ng t o be t ol d you

19 can' t hunt wi t h dogs. You' r e j ust goi ng

20 t o have t o hunt under t he way t he per mi t

21 system i s set up. So we di dn' t t ake

22 away your r i ght t o hunt wi t h dogs on t he

23 pr oper t y you' r e hunt i ng on, but we want

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Page 104

1 you t o get al ong wi t h your nei ghbor s i n

2 a bet t er manner so we can cont i nue

3 f or war d i n bot h si des get t i ng al ong. So

4 t hat ' s what we' re aski ng.


6 MR. BOONE: May I say somet hi ng?

7 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Ver y qui ckl y, Mr . Boone.

8 MR. BOONE: I woul d j ust l i ke - - can you t el l

9 me who ar e my nei ghbor s I don' t get

10 al ong wi t h?

11 I mean, I - - I get al ong wi t h al l my

12 nei ghbor s. Thi s i s not goi ng t o stop.

13 I can t el l you t hat t hey' ve done sai d

14 i t . Al l t hey want t o do i s do away wi t h

15 i t , and t hi s i s t he f i r st st ep.

16 MR. LYNCH: Y' al l have got t he per mi t syst em

17 t o pr ot ect you. Al l you have t o do i s

18 go by t he gui del i nes of t he per mi t

19 syst em. And as l ong as you adher e t o

20 t hat , you can cont i nue t o do what you' r e

21 doi ng.

22 MR. BOONE: What ' s t he - - i f t hey st i l l cat ch

23 your dog, t hen what ' s t he - - what i s - -

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Page 105

1 I mean, how many t i mes do t hey have t o

2 cat ch your dog or what ?

3 I di dn' t even have a dog t hi s year

4 because t hey f i ni shed poi soni ng t he r est

5 of mi ne l ast summer .

6 MR. LYNCH: You can wor k wi t h your of f i cer s,

7 and t hey' l l be t he ones t hat wi l l wor k

8 wi t h you on whet her or not t he gr oups

9 are get t i ng al ong. That ' s why i t ' s set

10 up t hat way. The peopl e t hat ar e on t he

11 ground - - I ' m not down t here al l t he

12 t i me. They ar e. They' r e t he f ol ks t hat

13 know t hat ar ea bet t er t han anybody

14 el se. They know t he l andowner s t hey' r e

15 deal i ng wi t h. They know t he dog- hunt i ng

16 and t he hunt i ng cl ubs t hey' r e deal i ng

17 wi t h. And t hat ' s what t hey do.

18 MR. BOONE: We' ve got one of our of f i cer s

19 that ' s t otal l y agai nst dogs.

20 MR. LYNCH: Wel l , that ' s who you have t o wor k

21 wi t h.

22 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Mr . Boone, t hank you.

23 The next speaker i s Susan Mor r ow.

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Page 106

1 MS. MORROW: Chai r man, Commi ss i oner , Members

2 of t he Boar d, good mor ni ng. I ' m Susan

3 Morr ow f rom Mobi l e Count y. I t hi nk al l

4 of you about know me by now.

5 I am here. I am a dog hunt er and

6 al so a st al k hunt er . And we have 39

7 management ar eas i n t he st at e of

8 Al abama. Four we ar e al l owed t o dog

9 hunt on. And I woul d l i ke t o see mor e

10 dog days on our management ar eas.

11 And, al so, I woul d l i ke t o br i ng up

12 t he f act - - I wr ot e al l of y' al l a

13 l et t er - - i f you haven' t got i t , you

14 wi l l be get t i ng i t - - about ext endi ng

15 deer season.

16 I hunt i n several count i es, and t he

17 r ut i s happeni ng. You know, i t has a

18 l ot t o do wi t h weat her , I guess . I

19 don' t r eal l y under stand what t he r ut i s ,

20 I guess, compar ed t o t he - - some of t he

21 peopl e ar e sayi ng t hey want t o hunt t he

22 r ut . But I ' m not f or i t because i t wi l l

23 hur t t he r abbi t hunt er s, and I don' t see

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Page 107

1 t he need f or i t . I guess what I ' m

2 t r yi ng t o say i s i f i t ' s not br oke,

3 don' t f i x i t . And thi s has been - - as

4 l ong as I can r emember , t he season has

5 been the way i t i s. And i f i t ' s not

6 br oke, don' t f i x i t .

7 And I di d br i ng some mor e names,

8 si gnat ur es, suppor t i ng dog hunt i ng and

9 woul d l i ke mor e days on t he management

10 areas. And I woul d appr eci at e i t i f

11 y' al l coul d l ook at t hi s.

12 Thank you.

13 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Thank you, Ms. Mor r ow.

14 MR. HARTZOG: Gar y.

15 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Mr . Har t zog.

16 MR. HARTZOG. At , I t hi nk, t he l ast meet i ng

17 when Susan spoke we t al ked about t he

18 possi bi l i t y of t he Depar t ment l ooki ng at

19 some mor e days. Have y' al l come up wi t h

20 anyt hi ng?

21 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Mr . Moody.

22 MR. MOODY: We have not set t he management

23 ar ea seasons yet or made

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Page 108

1 r ecommendat i ons. We' ve asked our st af f

2 t o l ook at maki ng some ext r a days.

3 One t hi ng t hat Ms. Mor r ow br ought up

4 at t he l ast meet i ng was conf l i ct i ng

5 dat es on a coupl e of di f f erent

6 management ar eas, and I t al ked wi t h t he

7 s taf f . Some of t hat i s done

8 i nt ent i onal l y t o keep cr owds i n cont r ol

9 wi t hi n l andowner expectati ons on t hose

10 pr oper t i es so we don' t have pr obl ems

11 wi t h nei ghbor i ng l andowner s and have t oo

12 many peopl e on one ar ea at a t i me. So

13 t her e' s some t hi ngs t o wor k out , but we

14 ar e l ooki ng at t r yi ng t o see what we can

15 do.

16 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Thank you, Mr . Moody.

17 The next speaker i s J ohnny Rober t s.

18 MR. ROBERTS: Thank you f or al l owi ng me t o

19 speak. I ' m an advocat e of al l hunt i ng

20 and f i shi ng pr i vi l eges. But t here' s

21 cer t ai n hunt i ng pr i vi l eges t hat are

22 comi ng under at t ack, and I bel i eve i t ' s

23 based upon bi g money and l obbyi st s.

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Page 109

1 Dog hunt i ng dur i ng deer season has

2 been a t r adi t i on i n Al abama f or as l ong

3 as I ' ve been hunt i ng. That ' s 1967. I ' m

4 60 year s ol d, and I woul d hat e t o see

5 t hi s t r adi t i on go t o t he waysi de. Once

6 you star t i nf r i ngi ng on dog hunt i ng,

7 r abbi t hunt i ng, coon hunt i ng, and

8 squi r r el hunt i ng, t he dog wi l l be next .

9 Thank you.


11 The next speaker i s Der r el l Wr i ght .

12 I f y' al l wi l l hol d your appl ause

13 unt i l t he end, pl ease.

14 Der r el l Wr i ght .

15 MR. WRI GHT: Good mor ni ng. I ' m a gunsmi t h.

16 I ' m a member of t he Amer i can Gunsmi t hi ng

17 Associ at i on, an NRA member . I enj oy al l

18 t ypes of hunt i ng.

19 The maj or i t y of my r epai r s ar e on

20 shot guns. The maj or i t y of my sal es ar e

21 shot guns. I f we out l aw buckshot , I ' m

22 goi ng t o be - - I ' m goi ng t o have a l ar ge

23 i nvent or y t hat ' s goi ng t o be har d t o

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Page 110

1 l i qui dat e. I t hi nk i t wi l l af f ect a l ot

2 of ot her busi nesses al so. Ther e' s not

3 ver y much t hat can go wr ong wi t h a

4 bol t - act i on r i f l e.

5 I have t hr ee dogs. I spend ar ound a

6 t housand dol l ar s a year i n dog f eed. A

7 l ot of peopl e have l arger packs of

8 dogs. And t hat ' s a l ot of money t hat ' s

9 goi ng t o be l ost out of t he economy. I

10 t hi nk dog owner s spend a l ot of money i n

11 t he st at e of Al abama t hat ' s not bei ng

12 r ecogni zed.

13 Peopl e wi t hout t he mi ni mum acreage

14 won' t be abl e t o put on a man dr i ve.

15 Nobody i s goi ng t o want t o be out t her e

16 i n t he cut over wal ki ng t hr ough when

17 ever ybody' s got hi gh- power ed r i f l es. I

18 t hi nk t hat woul d be danger ous. I t hi nk

19 i t woul d be a saf et y i ssue. And Al abama

20 i s most l y cut over now. I t ' s most l y

21 pi ne.

22 I t hi nk t her e shoul d be some ki nd of

23 compr omi se. The maj or i t y of t he peopl e

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Page 111

1 t hat want t o st op dog hunt i ng ar e

2 hunt i ng over bai t , so t hey' re basi cal l y

3 br eaki ng t he l aw al r eady. And I don' t

4 t hi nk i t woul d be qui t e f ai r .

5 I t hi nk we need t o gi ve our

6 conser vat i on of f i cer s t he r esour ces t hey

7 need t o enf or ce t he l aws t hat ar e

8 al r eady on t he books. They' r e

9 over whel med. They have bi g ar eas t o

10 cover . I t hi nk we have some f i ne

11 of f i cer s i n our di st r i ct .

12 Hunt i ng wi t h a dog i s hunt i ng wi t h a

13 dog. I f you ar e goi ng t o r egul at e our

14 hunt i ng deer dogs, ever y dog shoul d be

15 r egul at ed i n t he same manner . Tel l i ng a

16 man t hat he can' t hunt wi t h hi s dogs,

17 t hat ' s un- Amer i can. I bel i eve t hat i f

18 t he peopl e t hat wr ot e t he Const i t ut i on

19 woul d have t hought t hat i t woul d have

20 come t o t hi s, t hi s pr obabl y woul d have

21 been wr i t t en i nt o t he Second Amendment .

22 And some peopl e don' t have t he

23 l uxur y of owni ng mul t i pl e guns. I do.

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Page 113

1 up t her e.

2 J ust af t er t he meet i ng here - - i n

3 Mont gomer y i n Febr uar y, t her e was an

4 ar t i cl e t hat came out i n t he Decat ur

5 Dai l y on Febr uar y 10t h whi ch I woul d

6 l i ke t o make a f ew quot es out of , i f I

7 coul d.

8 Thi s i s f rom Dr . Char l es Borden f rom

9 Moul t on, Al abama. He says, al ong many

10 of the creeks, i t of t en l ooks l i ke a

11 t i l l er has been t hr ough t he ar ea f or

12 per haps a hundr ed yar ds. Dr . Bor den i s

13 a sevent h- gener at i on f ami l y member who

14 l i ves i n t he Bankhead, and he says

15 t hey' re destr oyi ng a l ot of our nat i ve

16 veget at i on and cont r i but e t o soi l

17 er osi on.

18 And I al so have a quot e her e f r om

19 Ms. Al l i son Cochr an, whi ch i s t he

20 bi ol ogi st t her e on t he Bankhead

21 di st r i ct . She says, thei r popul at i ons

22 i n t he Bankhead ar e i ncr easi ng r api dl y,

23 and we need hel p bef or e t he pr obl em get s

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Page 114

1 any wor se. And t hat was Al l i son of

2 t he - - t he bi ol ogi st wi t h t he Nat i onal

3 For est Ser vi ce t her e.

4 And I have a quot e her e f r om Mr . Ron

5 Eaks, whi ch i s the bi ol ogi st i n that

6 di st r i ct . He i s our di st r i ct

7 bi ol ogi st . And, you know, he says t hat ,

8 of cour se, t he pi gs ar e not aggr essi ve

9 t owar d peopl e but wi l l eat anyt hi ng t hat

10 doesn' t eat t hem, i ncl udi ng pl ant s and

11 ot her ani mal s. He says, t hey r oot up

12 t he f i el ds, nat i ve pl ant s, t he whol e

13 ni ne yar ds. And he says, any ani mal

14 t hey run i nt o, such as nest i ng bi rds, i f

15 t he hen i s cr azy enough t o s i t t her e,

16 t hey wi l l eat her and her eggs. And I

17 don' t know how many of y' al l know

18 Mr . Ron, but he' s a bi g t ur key hunt er .

19 And I t al ked wi t h hi m t hi s week, mat t er

20 of f act .

21 And I al so got a quot e her e f r om

22 Mr . Bar r y Bai r d t hat says t hat hunt er s

23 have not ki l l ed enough wi l d hogs t o

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Page 115

1 j ust i f y addi ng any number of days t o t he

2 hunt i ng season, whi ch t hat t el l s me t hat

3 t here' s got t o be ot her al t ernat i ves

4 t hat we can use t o cont r ol t hese pi gs.

5 And I bel i eve I addr essed ever y one

6 of y' al l on the board by l et ter af ter

7 t he Febr uar y meet i ng stat i ng what I f el t

8 l i ke needed t o be done, you know, on

9 some of t he - - al l ow dogs. I t al ked

10 wi t h Mr . Moody t hi s mor ni ng. And I

11 want ed t o ver i f y - - somet hi ng t hat had

12 been br ought t o me was t he f act t hat you

13 can go i n t her e dur i ng squi r r el season,

14 r abbi t season - - what ever smal l game i s

15 i n t her e, you ar e al l owed t o hunt t hem

16 wi t h dogs, whet her i t be squi r r el ,

17 r abbi t s, dur i ng - - i n t he WMA and - - but

18 t he pi gs ar e not al l owed t o be hunt ed

19 wi t h dogs. I t hi nk t hat ' s goi ng t o be

20 one of t he st r ongest asset s t hat we' r e

21 goi ng t o have. Because I used t o hunt

22 dogs f or years. I ' ve had rabbi t dogs,

23 squi r r el dogs, and deer dogs. The dogs

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Page 116

1 wi l l f i nd t hose hogs.

2 The hogs have become educat ed. And,

3 you know, I ' ve t al ked t o a l ot of

4 hunt er s i n t he l ast f ew mont hs. They' r e

5 seei ng t he si gns, but t hey' r e not seei ng

6 t he hogs. And, you know, t hese pi gs ar e

7 get t i ng educated.

8 And, al so, one ot her qui ck t hi ng. I

9 t al ked wi th the f orest - - act i ng f orest

10 super vi sor f or t he St at e of Al abama,

11 Ms. Ter i Cl eel and, at t he Mont gomer y

12 of f i ce. And she t ol d me t hat she i s

13 mor e t han wi l l i ng t o l ook i nt o some of

14 t he game l aw changes t o addr ess t hi s

15 i ssue and she i s mor e t han wi l l i ng t o

16 si t down at t he t abl e wi t h some of her

17 bi ol ogi sts f rom t he Forest Servi ce and

18 maybe addr ess some of t he boar d or some

19 of t he conser vat i on - - Mr . Moody or

20 whoever , and si t down at a t abl e

21 di scussi on and see what we can do about

22 t hi s mat t er .

23 So, you know, I want t o say t hi s,

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Page 117

1 t hat i f y' al l don' t r emember anyt hi ng

2 I ' ve sai d t oday, t hat , you know, I want

3 t o see somet hi ng done about t hi s

4 s i t uat i on. They' re dest royi ng our

5 f orest s . And I ' m not goi ng away. Y' al l

6 wi l l see me agai n. I mean, I ' l l be at

7 t he next meet i ng. And I ' m goi ng t o get

8 up and I ' m goi ng t o speak about t he hogs

9 at the next meet i ng.

10 I t hank y' al l f or your t i me.



13 busi ness i s ol d busi ness. I ' l l st ar t

14 wi t h t he i ssues t hat I show f rom t he

15 l ast meet i ng.

16 I ' d l i ke f or someone f rom Wi l dl i f e

17 and Fr eshwat er Fi sher i es t o r un back

18 down t he l i st of what ' s bei ng pr oposed

19 t o be appr oved t oday.

20 Mr . Har der s.

21 MR. HARDERS: I bel i eve seasons and bag l i mi t s

22 may be f i r st .

23 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Yes. And I t hi nk we' l l - -

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Page 118

1 Mr . Dean, we can appr ove t hese as a

2 l ump, al l of t hei r i t ems?

3 MR. DEAN: That ' s cor r ect .

4 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Okay. Go ahead. We' l l

5 pr esent t hem al l .

6 MR. HARDERS: Okay. Seasons and bag l i mi t s.

7 We have no changes t o what we

8 r ecommended t he l ast t i me and seek

9 appr oval of what we submi t t ed.

10 The dove and duck opt i ons f or zones

11 and spl i t s. J ust a r emi nder , we need

12 boar d appr oval . We have t o l et t he Fi sh

13 and Wi l dl i f e Servi ce know af t er t hi s

14 meet i ng what Al abama' s r ecommendat i ons

15 ar e goi ng t o be. And, agai n, what we

16 have now, what we' ve r ecommended, gi ves

17 us t he best opt i on no mat t er what t he

18 dat es ar e chosen f or t he seasons. So

19 t hat ' s t he wi dest r ange of opt i ons we

20 have now.

21 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Okay.

22 MR. HARDERS: And t he l ast t wo - - t he l ast

23 t wo - - t he l ast meet i ng, t he l ast t wo

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Page 119

1 r egul at i ons, t he hunt er orange

2 r equi r ement s and t he cl ar i f i cat i on on

3 devi ces on bows. That was t he ot her

4 i ssue.

5 Consumer pr i ce i ndex adj ust ment on

6 t he hunt i ng and f i shi ng l i cense. We

7 present ed l ast t i me t he resul t s of t hat

8 and r ecommend your appr oval on what we

9 submi t t ed.

10 And I bel i eve t hat ' s al l we have.

11 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Okay, Mr . Har der s. Thank

12 you.

13 I s t here any conver sat i on f rom t he

14 boar d on any of t hese si x i t ems?

15 MR. STRI CKLAND: Mr . Chai r man.

16 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Dr . St r i ckl and.

17 MR. STRI CKLAND: Yes. Coul d I addr ess one

18 i ssue and, par t i cul ar l y, af t er hear i ng

19 Mr . Year gan' s di scussi on and t he

20 posi t i on stance on l aser r ange f i nder s

21 on a bow and ar r ow?

22 I t hi nk t he cur r ent regul at i on wi l l

23 make l aser r ange f i nder s i l l egal on bow

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Page 120

1 and ar r ow i n t he st at e of Al abama.

2 MR. HARDERS: I t cl ar i f i es t hat t hey al r eady

3 ar e i l l egal , i f I ' m get t i ng t hat r i ght .

4 MR. STRI CKLAND: I f I may, Mr . Chai r man, may

5 I make a mot i on at t hi s t i me?

6 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Yes, si r .

7 MR. STRI CKLAND: May I make a mot i on t o amend

8 or revi se t he cur r ent regul at i on t hat

9 wi l l no l onger make bow- at t ached l aser

10 range f i nders i l l egal i n the st ate of

11 Al abama, agai n, part i cul ar l y af t er

12 hear i ng t he st at ement of t he ABA?

13 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: There i s a mot i on t o make

14 bow- mount ed r ange f i nder s l egal on

15 bows. I s t her e a second?

16 MR. HATLEY: Second.

17 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Mr . Hat l ey.

18 Al l di scussi on.

19 Any di scussi on, Mr . Har der s?


21 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Members of t he Boar d, any

22 ot her di scussi on?


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Page 121

1 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Okay. There i s a mot i on

2 t o be vot ed on, agai n, t o make r ange

3 f i nder s on bows l egal .

4 Mr . Dean, you' l l work out t he

5 appr opr i at e l anguage whi chever way i t

6 goes, I suggest .

7 Al l t hose i n f avor rai se your hand.

8 ( Al l boar d member s r ai se hands. )

9 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Okay. Let i t be

10 r ecogni zed - - and I have t o go down

11 t hrough and l i s t each one.

12 Mr . Raymond J ones i s f or .

13 Dr . Warr en St r i ckl and i s f or . Mr . Grant

14 Lynch i s f or . Mr . Brock J ones i s f or .

15 Mr . Grady Har t zog i s f or . Mr . Bi l l

16 Hat l ey i s f or . Mr . J oey Dobbs i s f or .

17 Dr . Bob Shi pp i s f or .

18 The t wo opposed - - oh, bot h ar e

19 f or .

20 Okay. Let i t be shown t hat t he vot e

21 i s total of the board f or . Mot i on

22 car r i es.

23 Okay. Commi ssi oner Guy.

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Page 122

1 COMMI SSI ONER GUY: Dr . St r i ckl and, so ar e you

2 j ust aski ng that - - and I know i t ' s

3 passed, but you' re aski ng - - j ust so our

4 f ol ks ar e cl ear and under stand, you' r e

5 sayi ng r ange f i nder s on bows i s what - -

6 what you ar e want i ng t o make sur e i s - -

7 MR. STRI CKLAND: Yeah. Speci f i cal l y l aser

8 r ange f i nder s onl y. I t hi nk Mr . Year gan

9 el oquent l y pr esent ed t he posi t i on

10 st at ement of t he ABA t hat di sal l owed or

11 woul d not l i ke t o see l aser - proj ect ed

12 devi ces on bows. Range f i nder s onl y.

13 Does t hat answer your quest i on?

14 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: To cl ar i f y, I t hi nk what

15 t he Commi ssi oner i s sayi ng i s, you don' t

16 want anyt hi ng t hat ' s goi ng t o pr oj ect

17 and show a l i ght down f i el d, but t o r ead

18 a - - somet hi ng t hat ' s i nvi si bl e t o gi ve

19 you a comput at i on of yar dage, t hat i s

20 per mi ssi bl e. I s t hat what you' r e aski ng

21 f or , Dr . St r i ckl and?

22 MR. STRI CKLAND: That ' s cor r ect , Mr . Chai r man.

23 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Okay. Any ot her

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Page 123

1 di scussi on?

2 Mr . Dobbs.

3 MR. DOBBS: For cl ar i f i cat i on f or me on t he

4 dove season, t he spl i t s f or t he dove

5 season - - or r at her t he nor t h and sout h

6 zoni ng, as I r ead t hr ough t hese mi nut es

7 and as I l ooked at t he r ecommendat i ons

8 or t he wi shes t hat you have r epor t ed f or

9 t he f eds , t he U. S. Fi sh and Wi l dl i f e

10 Ser vi ce, t hey have r ecommended or woul d

11 l i ke t o see one season, not a - - not

12 spl i t zones. Am I cor r ect i n what I

13 r ead?

14 MR. HARDERS: They al l ow us t o choose t o have

15 t wo zones f or doves. Based on our i nput

16 f r om t he past f r om hunt er s, t hey woul d

17 r at her see us have t wo zones. So t hat ' s

18 what we woul d r ecommend.

19 MR. DOBBS: But t he U. S. Fi sh and Wi l dl i f e

20 Ser vi ce, of cour se, t hey gi ve us t he

21 opt i on of t hat . But I di d read

22 somewher e wher e t hey sai d t hey woul d

23 l i ke t o see one - - one season. Am I

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Page 124

1 wr ong? Di d I mi sread t hat ?

2 MR. HARDERS: They may - - Davi d, i s t hat - -

3 t hey may pref er t hat f or t hei r

4 pr ef er ence, but t hat ' s not what we nor

5 our hunt er s pr ef er . And t hey gi ve us

6 t he opt i on t o have t wo.

7 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Can y' al l cl ar i f y t hat a

8 l i t t l e more? I s t hat cor r ect , Davi d?

9 J ust so t he boar d has f ul l

10 under st andi ng of what t hey' ve asked

11 and - -

12 MR. HARDERS: Yeah. Maybe Davi d Hayden.

13 MR. HAYDEN: From t he st andpoi nt of t he Fi sh

14 and Wi l dl i f e Servi ce, anal yzi ng al l t he

15 dat a and so f or t h t hat ' s col l ect ed ever y

16 year - - f rom t hei r st andpoi nt , anal yzi ng

17 t hat dat a wi t h one zone per st at e i s

18 easi er t han anal yzi ng i t f rom mul t i pl e

19 zones i n the state. So f or them i t

20 woul d be easi er t o anal yze i t f or one

21 zone. However , t hey do al l ow t wo

22 zones.

23 MR. DOBBS: Agai n, woul d you cl ar i f y f or me,

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Page 125

1 t hen, as I r ead, why t he t wo zones? I s

2 i t because of t he t op- sown wheat , t he

3 pl ant i ng dates, j ust f or me?

4 MR. HAYDEN: The zones ar e al l owed so t hat t he

5 hunt er s wi t hi n t he stat e ar e of f er ed t he

6 best oppor t uni t y t o har vest t he bi r ds

7 whi l e t hey' r e t her e. So i f you have a

8 l ong stat e l i ke Al abama or Mi ssi ssi ppi

9 or I l l i noi s , wherever i t may be, havi ng

10 t wo zones al l ows you t o put days i n

11 nor t h and sout h, f or exampl e, t hat i s

12 advant ageous f or t he hunt er s.

13 MR. DOBBS: Assumi ng t hat t hese ar e mi gr at or y

14 bi r ds and t hey' r e comi ng down f r om nor t h

15 t o sout h, t he sout h woul d get t hem l at er

16 on i n t he year . That ' s why t he season

17 i n t he sout her n zone begi ns l at er i n t he

18 year ?

19 MR. HAYDEN: Yes, si r . That ' s t he gener al

20 f eel i ngs of - - bot h of t he hunt ers , t he

21 publ i c, and t he desi r e t hat we have

22 f ound of t he hunt er s of Al abama.

23 MR. DOBBS: Okay. I j ust - - t hi s i s somet hi ng

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Page 126

1 t hat I want t o br i ng up t o di scuss and

2 cont i nue t o di scuss t hi s.

3 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Di d t hat expl ai n i t enough

4 f or you, Mr . Dobbs?

5 MR. DOBBS: Yes, i t di d.

6 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Okay.

7 MR. DOBBS: Thank you ver y much.

8 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Any ot her di scussi on?

9 MR. HARTZOG: Gar y.


11 MR. MOODY: Yes.

12 MR. HARTZOG: Gar y, I t hi nk at t he l ast

13 meet i ng or maybe t he meet i ng bef or e we

14 t al ked about dur i ng t he st al k season of

15 deer t hat buckshot was excl uded. And we

16 t al ked about ki ds and al l t hat mi ght be

17 usi ng buckshot dur i ng st al k hunt i ng and

18 the possi bi l i t y of r ei nstat i ng - - you

19 know, not pr ohi bi t i ng buckshot dur i ng

20 stal k hunt i ng. I s t her e any . . .

21 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Mr . Moody, do you have any

22 r epor t ?

23 MR. MOODY: No. I don' t even r emember t he

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Page 127

1 di scussi on, Gr ady. I ' m s or r y.

2 MR. HARTZOG: Somebody got up and spoke, and

3 t hey t al ked about t he buckshot . And

4 t hen I br ought i t up and asked, because

5 especi al l y wi t h ki ds shoot i ng, you know,

6 not necessar i l y a hi gh- power ed r i f l e,

7 not havi ng t he buckshot .

8 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Coul d y' al l l ook at t hat

9 and r epor t on t hat at t he next meet i ng,

10 Mr . Moody?

11 MR. MOODY: Be gl ad t o.

12 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: I s t hat al l r i ght ,

13 Mr . Har t zog?

14 MR. HARTZOG: Okay.

15 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Al l r i ght . Mr . J ones,

16 Raymond J ones.

17 MR. RAYMOND J ONES: J ust t o cl ar i f y, t he spl i t

18 zones of t he dove season gi ves us t he

19 great est - - gi ves t he hunt er s of t he

20 st at e of Al abama t he gr eat est degr ee of

21 f l exi bi l i t y?

22 MR. HARDERS: That i s cor r ect.

23 MR. RAYMOND J ONES: Al l r i ght . Thank you.

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Page 128

1 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Any ot her di scussi on?

2 ( No r esponse. )

3 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Okay. As a package, t hi s

4 whol e package, can I get a mot i on t o

5 appr ove wi t h t he amendment made t o i t ?

6 MR. LYNCH: So made.

7 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: We' ve got - - I have a

8 mot i on. Do I have a second?

9 MR. RAYMOND J ONES: Second.

10 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: I have a second.

11 The mot i on i s t hat we appr ove al l

12 t he Wi l dl i f e and Freshwat er Fi sher i es '

13 r ecommendat i ons wi t h t he amendment t hat

14 Mr . Dean wi l l make t o t he r ange f i nder .

15 Al l t hose i n f avor ?


17 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Al l opposed?


19 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Let t he r ecor d show al l

20 af f i r med i t . Thank you ver y much.

21 Mr . Har der s, go ahead.

22 MR. HARDERS: Under ol d busi ness we had some

23 ot her i t ems, but - -

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Page 129

1 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: I ' m goi ng t o cal l on y' al l

2 i n j ust a mi nut e.

3 MR. HARDERS: Okay.

4 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Ver y good. Okay. Next ,

5 i f I can get Mr . Bl ankenshi p f r om Mar i ne

6 Resour ces.

7 MR. BLANKENSHI P: The onl y i t em t hat we had i n

8 ol d busi ness f r om t he l ast meet i ng was

9 f or appr oval f or t he Sal t wat er Angl er

10 Regi s t ry regul at i on. And I t hi nk

11 Dr . Shi pp may have a mot i on t o t hat

12 ef f ect .

13 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Dr . Shi pp.

14 MR. SHI PP: Yes, si r . Mr . Chai r man, I make a

15 mot i on t hat t he pr oposed r egul at i on

16 concer ni ng t he Sal t wat er Angl er Regi st r y

17 t hat was pr esent ed by t he Mar i ne

18 Resour ces Di vi son at t he Febr uar y 5t h,

19 2011, Conser vat i on Advi sor y Boar d

20 Meet i ng be appr oved by t he Conser vat i on

21 Advi sory Board.

22 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: I s t her e a second?

23 MR. HATLEY: Second.

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Page 130

1 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: We have a mot i on and a

2 second, t he mot i on bei ng t hat t he

3 Sal t wat er Angl er Regi str y r egul at i on be

4 appr oved as pr esent ed bef or e. I s t her e

5 any di scussi on?

6 ( No r esponse. )

7 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Bei ng no di scussi on, t he

8 mot i on t o be vot ed on i s t he Sal t wat er

9 Angl er Regi st r y r egul at i on as pr esent ed

10 bef or e. Al l t hose i n f avor , a show of

11 hands.





16 af f i rmat i ve t o pass. Mot i on car r i es.

17 Thank you ver y much,

18 Mr . Bl ankenshi p.

19 The next i t em of ol d busi ness i s t he

20 wi r e basket pr ovi s i on. Mr . Har t zog.

21 MR. HARTZOG: Yes, si r . Davi d and I wor ked i t

22 out because we had a f ew l i t t l e

23 compl i cat i ons because of t he t wo

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Page 131

1 i mpoundment s t hat went out si de of my

2 di str i ct . And Davi d had t o r ewor k t he

3 mot i on and I t hi nk has f or war ded i t t o

4 ever ybody. So I ' d l i ke t o make a mot i on

5 t hat wi r e basket s be appr oved f or my

6 Congr essi onal Di st r i ct 2 excl udi ng t he

7 ar eas t hat Davi d def i ned i n t he t wo

8 publ i c l akes.

9 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Redef i ned as per

10 Mr . Dean - -

11 MR. HARTZOG: Ri ght .

12 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: - - i s t he mot i on. I s

13 t here a second?

14 MR. RAYMOND J ONES: Second.

15 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: We have a mot i on and a

16 second. Any di scussi on?


18 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Mr . Har t zog, do you f eel

19 i t ' s necessar y f or Mr . Dean t o di scuss

20 t hose changes t o i t , or i s t he boar d

21 comf or t abl e wi t h t hat ?

22 MR. HARTZOG: I t hi nk t he boar d may be

23 comf or t abl e wi t h t hat .

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Page 132

1 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Okay. The mot i on t o be

2 vot ed on i s t he wi r e basket pr ovi s i on

3 wi th cl ar i f i cat i on f r om Mr . Dean. Al l

4 t hose i n f avor ?



7 ( No r esponse. )


9 af f i r mat i ve. Mot i on car r i es.

10 The next i t em of ol d busi ness i s we

11 have a Febr uar y r ut season bi ol ogi st

12 r epor t . Mr . Moody. Mr . Chr i s Cook.

13 Woul d you l i ke t o br i ef t he boar d on

14 t hat , pl ease, si r .

15 And I ' d l i ke t o say I got a very

16 good r epor t on Mr . Cook. Mr . Cook i s

17 cur r ent l y conduct i ng a f et us st udy. And

18 some of t he l andowner s i nvol ved gave

19 ver y, ver y hi gh mar ks on Mr . Cook,

20 Commi ssi oner , and what a good j ob he was

21 doi ng.

22 MR. COOK: I ' m Chr i s Cook wi t h t he Di vi si on of

23 Wi l dl i f e and Freshwat er Fi sher i es.

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Page 133

1 I t hi nk each of y' al l have been

2 pr esent ed wi t h a r epor t summar i zi ng t he

3 dat a t he Wi l dl i f e sect i on has col l ect ed

4 concer ni ng r ut dat es, concept i on dat es,

5 i f you wi l l , ar ound the st ate. Thi s i s

6 somet hi ng we' ve been wor ki ng on si nce

7 1995. Real l y stepped i t up l ast year .

8 Col l ect ed f rom, I t hi nk, 28 s i t es around

9 t he st at e. So we' r e t r yi ng t o f i l l i n

10 some gaps we have i n our dat a, t r yi ng t o

11 get a cl ear er pi ct ur e of what ' s goi ng on

12 concer ni ng r ut dat es and what not .

13 The r epor t i n t he back has a summar y

14 of dat a we col l ect ed. That has i t

15 br oken down by a summar y f or al l t he

16 year s t aken f r om each ar ea and t hen a

17 year - by- year br eakdown f r om t he ar eas we

18 have mor e t han one year of dat a. Al so

19 i n t hat r epor t i s some i t ems t o - - we

20 woul d l i ke f or you t o consi der when

21 you' r e r evi ewi ng t he dat a, j ust some

22 t hi ngs t o keep i n mi nd, such as sampl e

23 s i ze f rom some of t he s i t es, regar di ng

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Page 134

1 t he number of year s t he dat a has been

2 t aken f r om t hat s i t e or t he number of

3 year s i t was t aken dur i ng t he

4 col l ect i ons, and some ot her t hi ngs

5 regardi ng t he var i at i on f rom year t o

6 year t hat we' ve seen on si t es t hat we' ve

7 col l ect ed mul t i pl e year s of dat a and

8 j ust several ot her i ssues rel at ed t o t he

9 dat a.

10 Have y' al l - - I don' t know i f y' al l

11 have had t i me t o r evi ew i t .

12 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Mr . Cook, you' r e doi ng a

13 great j ob on t hi s . I want t o be very

14 cl ear on t hi s. I t ' s a ver y

15 cont rovers i al i ssue. I t ' s goi ng t o be a

16 ver y ongoi ng i ssue. Now woul d be a

17 gr eat t i me t o ask any ot her quest i ons of

18 Mr . Cook of t hi s i ssue.

19 Ri ght now t her e' s ongoi ng f et us

20 st udi es t hat we have past dat a t o - - how

21 many year s back, Mr . Cook?

22 MR. COOK: We have dat a t hat I ' ve act i vel y

23 been par t i ci pat i ng i n si nce ' 95.

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Page 135

1 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Compar abl e dat a t o see - -

2 and cor r ect me i f I mi sstate i t - - that

3 we wi l l be abl e t o see what has happened

4 s i nce t hat previ ous t i me and wi l l gi ve

5 us mor e concl usi ve advi ce on how t o

6 manage t he season or about t he season.

7 Any ot her quest i ons f r om t he boar d

8 f or Mr . Cook?

9 ( No r esponse. )

10 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Very good. Thank you,

11 Mr . Cook.

12 Okay. Mr . J ones. Mr . Br ock J ones.

13 MR. BROCK J ONES: Chr i s, f r om what I gat her i n

14 t he s tudy at t hi s poi nt i n t i me, t he

15 r ange of t he r ut f rom t he studi es t hat

16 have been conduct ed so f ar i s basi cal l y

17 December t o Febr uar y. I s t hat pr et t y

18 much what you - -

19 MR. COOK: I t r anges - - t her e' s - - t her e' s a

20 coupl e of i sol at ed popul at i ons t hat

21 actual l y have mean concept i on dat es i n

22 l at e November , Bankhead Nat i onal For est

23 bei ng t he pr i mar y one, al l t he way t o - -

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Page 136

1 a f ew si t es t hi s past year di d have mean

2 concept i on dat es i n t he f i r st f ew days

3 of February. A l ot of t hose si tes, t hat

4 was t he f i r st year we' ve col l ect ed dat a

5 f rom t hose s i t es. So we' re want i ng t o

6 cont i nue col l ect i ng dat a - - you know,

7 t hree t o f i ve year s woul d be

8 pref er r ed - - j ust to t r y to account f or

9 any var i at i on t hat we' re l i abl e t o see.

10 One of t he si t es we' ve col l ect ed a

11 bunch of dat a f r om, Bar bour WMA, j ust

12 f or your i nf or mat i on, t hi s past year we

13 had t he l at est dat e t hat we' ve had down

14 t her e - - l at est aver age dat e. So we

15 don' t - - don' t know i f t hat was

16 somet hi ng t hat was across t he - - you

17 know, a br oad r egi on of t he stat e or i f

18 t hat ' s j ust a - - somet hi ng at Barbour .

19 So col l ect i ng more dat a wi l l cl ear a l ot

20 of t hat up.

21 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Mr . J ones, any f ur t her

22 quest i ons?

23 MR. BROCK J ONES: Of cour se, we obvi ousl y have

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1 opposi t i on f r om t he smal l game hunt er s

2 f or t he ext ensi on. But f rom a

3 bi ol ogi cal st andpoi nt , i f i t ' s deci ded

4 t hat t her e i s enough ext ensi ve r ut i nt o

5 February and you' r e shi f t i ng t hi ngs,

6 what i s t he pot ent i al negat i ve of

7 shi f t i ng t he season t o mi d Febr uar y

8 and - -

9 MR. COOK: A l ot of t hi ngs wer e addr essed i n

10 Dr . Di t chkof f ' s l et t er . You know, t he

11 i mpact i t ' s goi ng t o have on what was - -

12 t he pr ogr ess t hat was - - appear s t o be

13 bei ng made wi t h t he t hr ee- buck l i mi t as

14 f ar as r educi ng t he number of bucks

15 bei ng ki l l ed. You know, ext endi ng i nt o

16 Febr uar y, you' r e not onl y maki ng t hem

17 mor e suscept i bl e due t o some of t he

18 r ut t i ng act i vi t i es and put t i ng mor e

19 str ess on t hem, but you' re al so - -

20 you' r e hunt i ng i nt o a t i me when f ood

21 sources are at t hei r - - get t i ng t o t hei r

22 l owest poi nt dur i ng t he year . So you' r e

23 compoundi ng t hi ngs by doi ng t hat .

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1 So j ust - - you know, even i f you

2 t ake some of f t he f r ont end, you know,

3 i t ' s t aken of f an equal t wo- week por t i on

4 at t he f r ont end or maybe even t hr ee

5 weeks, pr obabl y i s not compar abl e t o

6 addi ng t wo weeks at t he end as f ar as

7 t he i mpact i t ' s goi ng t o have on t he

8 resource. A l ot of t hose t hi ngs are - -

9 al l need to be consi dered i f thi s i s - -

10 comes up i n t he f ut ur e.

11 MR. BROCK J ONES: So i t ' s your opi ni on t hat

12 mor e st udy needs t o be made?

13 MR. COOK: Def i ni t el y. I mean, we' ve got t o

14 l ook at al l t he angl es and al l t he

15 i ssues i nvol ved. I t ' s not bl ack and

16 whi t e and j ust dr awi ng a l i ne and sayi ng

17 t hat we' l l hunt i n Febr uar y her e and we

18 won' t her e.

19 As you' l l see i n the repor t , the

20 i nf l uence of t he st ocki ng sour ce, wher e

21 t hose deer came f r om when we r est ocked

22 t hem has a - - i s a pr i mary - - or pr i mary

23 i nf l uence on when t hey' r e r ut t i ng. Most

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1 of t he deer came f r om Cl ar ke Count y. So

2 we have deer t hat r ut i nt o l at e J anuar y,

3 you know, scat t er ed al l over t he stat e.

4 Ther e' s no cl ear l i ne. So i t r eal l y

5 cl ouds t he i ssue.

6 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Mr . J ones.

7 MR. BROCK J ONES: Thank you.

8 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Commi ss i oner .

9 COMMI SSI ONER McMI LLAN: I woul d be i nt er est ed

10 i n havi ng a copy of t he Di t chkof f

11 l et t er , and I woul d suggest t hat maybe

12 we al l - -

13 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: I wi l l have t hat

14 di st r i but ed at t he - - I ' l l gi ve i t t o

15 Commi ssi oner Guy, and he can di st r i but e

16 i t amongst ever yone.

17 MR. STRI CKLAND: Mr . Chai r man.

18 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Yes, si r . Dr . St r i ckl and.

19 MR. STRI CKLAND: Coul d I addr ess Chr i s?

20 Chr i s , t here' s one ot her quest i on

21 I ' d l i ke t o ask.

22 So at t hi s t i me based on, you know,

23 your r esear ch - - and I - - I may be

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1 put t i ng you on t he spot - - but woul d i t

2 be your r ecommendat i on t o l eave t he

3 season as i t i s now or t o consi der an

4 ext ensi on?

5 I t hi nk t hat ' s what we want t o

6 know.

7 MR. COOK: As i t i s r i ght now, I woul d

8 r ecommend l eavi ng i t as i t i s because

9 of , you know, t he need t o get mor e

10 data. So as i t i s r i ght now, I coul dn' t

11 wi t h a cl ear consci ence r ecommend

12 ext endi ng i t i n one ar ea over anot her or

13 any ar ea i n t he stat e r i ght now. But ,

14 you know, t hat may change. But r i ght

15 now, no, I woul dn' t r ecommend i t .

16 MR. STRI CKLAND: Thank you ver y much.

17 Excel l ent j ob.

18 MR. COOK: Thank you.

19 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Thank you ver y much. Any

20 ot her quest i ons f r om t he board?

21 MR. BROCK J ONES: One l ast quest i on.

22 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Yes. Mr . J ones, Br ock

23 J ones.

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1 MR. BROCK J ONES: How much mor e t i me i s needed

2 i n your opi ni on t o come up wi t h enough

3 dat a t o make a r ecommendat i on?

4 MR. COOK: Wel l , t he t hi ng about i t i s , t hi s

5 i s - - t hi s coul d - - t her e' s a need t o

6 col l ect dat a f r om now on. Now, as we

7 get more dat a, i t ' s goi ng t o be

8 cl ear er - - t he pi ctur e i s goi ng t o

9 become cl ear er , but t her e' s al ways goi ng

10 t o be quest i ons t hat ' s goi ng t o need t o

11 be answer ed wi t h t hi s because of al l

12 t hose compoundi ng f actor s, t he st ocki ng

13 sour ce. And, you know, we have

14 popul at i ons t hat we' ve ment i oned t oday,

15 popul at i ons wi t hi n count i es t hat have

16 r ut dat es t hat may be as much as t wo

17 months di f f er ent .

18 So t ryi ng t o f i gure out t hi ngs such

19 as how bi g an ar ea of i nf l uence t hat

20 t hese ot her stocki ng sour ces have, al l

21 t hat stuf f i s somet hi ng t hat i s goi ng t o

22 be ongoi ng. But , you know, on t he - - at

23 l east on t he si t es t hat we wer e abl e t o

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1 do a l ot of col l ect i ons on i ni t i al l y

2 down i n sout hwest Al abama t hi s year , you

3 know, anot her coupl e of year s, t hi s year

4 and anot her year , wi l l s tar t t o cl ear

5 t hi ngs up.

6 So, you know, i deal l y, I woul dn' t

7 say any l ess t han t wo year s f r om now on

8 a l ot of t hi s st uf f . Now, i n some par t s

9 of t he st at e we have a pr et t y good i dea,

10 but t her e' s a l ot of areas we don' t .

11 And we st i l l need t o col l ect t he dat a.

12 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Mr . Cook, al l of t hi s i s

13 cur r ent l y evol vi ng and changi ng because

14 of t he t hr ee- buck l i mi t and havi ng l ess

15 bucks shot i n a year . I s t hat a corr ect

16 st at ement ?

17 MR. COOK: Wel l , i t possi bl y i s. You know,

18 t hat ' s anot her f l ui d t hi ng t hat we' re

19 goi ng t o have t o cont i nue moni t or i ng,

20 t he i mpact of t he t hr ee- buck l i mi t .

21 And, you know, I don' t know how much of

22 a broad ef f ect t hat wi l l have on

23 concept i on dat es.

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1 My f eel i ng i s i t ' s not goi ng to be

2 t hat bi g of an i nf l uence. I t may be,

3 but i t may not be. Because t hat ' s - -

4 t he i nf l uence of t he sex rat i os i s

5 r eal l y goi ng t o be di ct at ed mor e on

6 pr oper t y- bypr oper t y basi s, based on

7 what t hat l andowner or hunt i ng cl ub i s

8 doi ng on t hat pr oper t y. And, you know,

9 t her e' s t he pr oper t y maybe i n t he past

10 t hat j ust shot any buck t hat t hey want ed

11 t o shoot and now we' r e goi ng st r i ct l y by

12 t he new r egul at i ons. You know, t hey may

13 be i mpacted. But t he pr oper t i es t hat

14 al r eady had l i mi t s i n pl ace, you know,

15 t hey wer e al r eady bei ng conser vat i ve on

16 what bucks t hey shot , i t ' s pr obabl y not

17 goi ng to af f ect them.

18 So t o say i t ' s goi ng t o be a br oad

19 across- t hest at e i mpact, you know, we

20 don' t know. J ust have t o l ook at - -

21 cont i nue l ooki ng at t hat as wel l . So

22 i t ' s j ust - - i t ' s a never - endi ng

23 pr ocess.

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1 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Ver y good. Any other

2 quest i ons f rom the board?

3 Yes, Mr . Dobbs.

4 MR. DOBBS: I f we coul d add mor e t ool s t o your

5 t ool chest i n t he f or m of some t ype of

6 har vest i nf or mat i on, car cass t ags or

7 anyt hi ng, t hat ' s goi ng t o hel p you?

8 MR. COOK: I t woul d def i ni t el y hel p us

9 moni t or , you know, t he i mpact s of t he

10 deer har vest . As f ar as t he concept i on

11 dat es and what not , t he onl y way t o

12 real l y get t hat ki nd of i nf ormat i on i s

13 t hr ough what we' r e doi ng now, you know,

14 and i t woul dn' t be i nf l uenced by car cass

15 t ags or anythi ng.

16 But t hose ot her t hi ngs, you know,

17 al l t hat can add t o - - you know, t he

18 dat a t hat coul d be col l ect ed by t hese

19 ot her met hods woul d add t o our knowl edge

20 of what ' s goi ng on and hel p us st ay

21 pr obabl y bet t er i nf or med of t he

22 condi t i on of t he deer acr oss t he stat e

23 and - -

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1 MR. DOBBS: I t woul d hel p you as wel l even

2 segment t hat i nf or mat i on by uni t s or

3 di vi si ons or however you want ed t o do

4 i t ?

5 MR. COOK: Ri ght . I t def i ni t el y woul d gi ve

6 you a bet t er i dea t han what - - t he

7 i nf or mat i on we have now.

8 MR. DOBBS: Thank you.

9 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Any ot her quest i ons?


11 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Mr . Cook, t hank you ver y

12 much f or your report .

13 The next or der of ol d busi ness i s

14 dog deer days st agger ed at WMAs.

15 Mr . Moody.

16 MR. MOODY: Basi cal l y what I sai d ear l i er . I

17 coul d r ei t er at e i t .

18 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: J ust r ei t er at e i t so - -

19 MR. MOODY: Yeah, I ' l l be gl ad t o.

20 You know, j ust t o r est at e what we

21 want t o do, t her e' s some l andowner

22 expect at i ons on some of t he l and t hat we

23 manage t o keep t hi ngs wi t hi n a cer t ai n

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1 l i mi t and not causi ng pr obl ems f or t hei r

2 nei ghbor s. And so t hat ' s one r eason

3 some of t he season dat es ar e set t he

4 same. But we ar e l ooki ng now t o see how

5 we can adj ust t hat or add dat es or move

6 some dat es ar ound wi t hout i ncreasi ng

7 conf l i ct s f or nei ghbors around t he

8 management ar eas.

9 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Thank you. Any other

10 quest i ons f rom t he board?


12 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Thank you, Mr . Moody.

13 The next i t em i s t he proper t y l i nes

14 as a saf et y i ssue. Mr . Andr ess i ssued a

15 l et t er t o t he boar d. I t hi nk al l t he

16 boar d got i t and saw t he i t ems he

17 l i st ed.

18 Commi ssi oner , I ' d l i ke t o ask you,

19 woul d you assume t o f ur t her l ook i nt o

20 t hi s as a saf et y i ssue, concern f r om a

21 saf et y standpoi nt ? Woul d t hat be f ai r ?

22 COMMI SSI ONER GUY: Absol ut el y.

23 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Very good. Okay. Any

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1 other ol d busi ness?

2 Okay. The next or der of busi ness i s

3 new busi ness. I ' l l st ar t wi t h Wi l dl i f e

4 and Fr eshwat er Fi sher i es on open

5 t r appi ng season f or f ur bear er s and t he

6 r est of t hat gr oupi ng.

7 MR. ANDRESS: Yeah. You shoul d have bef or e

8 you a - - i f you don' t mi nd, I ' l l st ar t

9 wi t h t he nongame r egul at i ons. Wi l l t hat

10 be al l r i ght ?

11 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Yes.

12 MR. ANDRESS: Do you have t hat ?

13 I t seeks t o add a number of speci es

14 t o t he nongame wi l dl i f e pr ot ect i on

15 r egul at i on. Unl ess you have any

16 speci f i c quest i ons about any speci f i c

17 speci es, I ' l l j ust move al ong.

18 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Okay. J ust move al ong.

19 We' l l es tabl i sh t hi s as a group, al so,

20 and t he next meet i ng we' l l vot e on t hi s

21 as a gr oup al so.

22 MR. ANDRESS: Okay. And t he bi ggest t hi ng

23 you' l l see i n t her e i s on t owar d t he

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1 end. Ther e' s a subst ant i al amount of

2 l anguage t hat has been r emoved, and t hat

3 l anguage was - - deal t wi t h t he har vest

4 of t ur t l es - - l egal har vest of t ur t l es.

5 And t hat l anguage was i ncor por at ed i nt o

6 and consol i dat ed wi t h t he Tur t l e

7 Cat cher / Deal er / Far mer r egul at i on, whi ch

8 you al so have. And t hat ' s t he

9 subst ant i al amendment t o t hat

10 r egul at i on. And t hen we si mpl y

11 consol i dat ed t hat l anguage i nt o an

12 exi st i ng regul at i on t hat al r eady deal t

13 wi th l egal t ur t l e har vest .

14 Any quest i ons about t hat ?


16 MR. ANDRESS: The next r egul at i on - - pai r of

17 r egul at i ons have t o do wi t h t he

18 desi gnat i on of f ur bear er s and wi t h t he

19 t r appi ng season. What t hi s one does i s

20 r emove t he spot t ed skunk or ci vet cat

21 f r om that l i st . I t had been i dent i f i ed

22 as a speci es of speci al concer n, and i t s

23 number s i n Al abama ar e consi der ed t o be

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Page 149

1 ext r emel y l ow now. And so t hat was

2 r emoved f rom t he f urbear er l i s t and f rom

3 t he t r appi ng season t o af f or d i t some

4 pr ot ect i on.

5 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Who i dent i f i ed t hat ,

6 Mr . Andr ess?

7 MR. ANDRESS: I t hi nk i t was i dent i f i ed by t he

8 Fi sh and Wi l dl i f e Servi ce and by - -

9 per haps I may have t o r ef er t o Gar y t o

10 i dent i f y t hat exact . . .

11 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: And t hat ' s basi cal l y

12 what ' s cal l ed a pol ecat , Mr . Moody?

13 MR. MOODY: Yeah. That ' s been a l ong- st andi ng

14 i ssue. And i t was i dent i f i ed f i r s t i n

15 our nongame symposi um back sever al year s

16 ago, and we' ve cont i nued t o l ook at i t .

17 One of t he r esear cher s wi t h Aubur n i s

18 doi ng some wor k on t hat . And, qui t e

19 t rut hf ul l y, he can' t even f i nd one t o

20 t r ai n t he dogs on t he scat and scent and

21 stuf f . I mean, t hey' re j ust very, very

22 r ar e. So I doubt many of t hem ar e bei ng

23 caught by t r apper s j ust because t hey' r e

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1 not t her e. But i t j ust af f or ds t hem

2 pr ot ect i on.

3 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Okay. Ver y good. Al l

4 r i ght , Mr . Andr ess.

5 Okay. Any ot her quest i ons on t hose

6 f our i t ems f rom the board?

7 ( No r esponse. )

8 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Any other new busi ness

9 f r om t he boar d?

10 Dr . Shi pp.

11 MR. SHI PP: Yeah. I have been cont act ed by

12 t he mayor s of Or ange Beach and Gul f

13 Shor es. And t hey have r equest ed t hat we

14 consi der removi ng gi l l net s f rom t he

15 f r ont beaches. I t ' s a ver y compl i cat ed

16 i ssue. And what I ' d l i ke i s f or Chr i s

17 Bl ankenshi p, as a star t er , t o descr i be

18 what t he cur r ent r egul at i ons ar e, and

19 t hen I t hi nk we open f or di scussi on and

20 t hen per haps at t he next meet i ng as wel l

21 i nvi t e some mor e publ i c t est i mony.

22 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Mr . Bl ankenshi p.

23 MR. BLANKENSHI P: The gi l l - net f i sher y i s our

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Page 151

1 most hi ghl y r egul at ed f i sher y t hat we

2 have i n t he Mar i ne Resour ces Di vi si on,

3 and t he r egul at i ons t hat we have come

4 about af t er several - - mul t i pl e years of

5 wor k t hat was done si nce t he ear l y

6 ' 90s.

7 Cur r ent l y on t he beaches t hat

8 Dr . Shi pp i s t al ki ng about , t hose areas

9 are - - gi l l nets can' t be used i n the

10 Gul f or even possessed i n t he Gul f at

11 al l on weekends f r om Mar ch 15t h t hr ough

12 Labor Day. So t hey' r e cl osed al t oget her

13 on t he weekends. They can onl y be used

14 ni ght t i me hour s onl y f r om Mar ch 15t h

15 t hr ough May 15t h, so - - and t hen f r om

16 May 15t h t hr ough Oct ober 2nd i n t he ar ea

17 f r om Ol d Lagoon Pass, whi ch woul d be t he

18 ar ea of Gul f Shor es and Or ange Beach.

19 So f r om May 15t h t hr ough Oct ober 2nd

20 t hey' r e cl osed al t oget her f or t he use of

21 gi l l net s i n t hat ar ea.

22 So t hey are al ready hi ghl y

23 r estr i ct ed. The onl y t i mes t hat t hey' re

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1 al l owed f or use i n the Gul f

2 Shor es/ Or ange Beach ar ea i s ni ght t i me

3 onl y Mar ch 15t h t o May 15t h and t hen

4 f r om Oct ober 2nd t hr ough t he r est of t he

5 year i s t he onl y t i me t hat t hey' re

6 al l owed t o use t hem.

7 Or j ust as an i nf or mat i onal not e, we

8 have - - used t o have a gi l l - net f i shery

9 wi t h about 500 f i sher men t hat had

10 l i censes t hrough l egi sl at i on i n t he

11 ear l y ' 90s and t hen r ecent l y compl et ed a

12 gi l l - net buyout pr ogr am. That number i s

13 down t o 86 f i sher men. Onl y about 70 of

14 t hose act ual l y have l andi ngs.

15 And l ast year was t he f i r s t f ul l

16 year af t er t he gi l l - net buyout wher e 47

17 peopl e sol d t hei r l i censes - - l ast year

18 was t he f i r st f ul l year of f i shi ng - -

19 now, some of t hi s i s compl i cat ed because

20 of t he oi l spi l l . But t he usual number

21 of t r i ps wher e peopl e have l andi ngs i s

22 bet ween f our and 5, 000 t r i ps per year

23 wi t h gi l l - net l andi ngs. Last year we

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Page 153

1 wer e ar ound a 2300- t r i p r ange, so about

2 hal f of the hi stor i c numbers .

3 I ' l l be gl ad to answer any - - that ' s

4 j ust a br i ef over vi ew. Our gi l l - net

5 r egul at i on, as I say, i s ver y

6 compl i cat ed t o go t hr ough.

7 MR. SHI PP: Chr i s, t her e' s t he per cept i on

8 about t he quar t er - mi l e of f t he beach.

9 Coul d you address t hat or cl ar i f y i t ?

10 MR. BLANKENSHI P: Wi t hi n a quar t er - mi l e of f

11 t he beach i s wher e most of t he f i shi ng

12 act i vi t y t akes pl ace wi t h Spani sh

13 macker el , l adyf i sh, and bl ue r unner s,

14 some of t he ot her speci es. And t hat ' s

15 wher e t hey' r e mai nl y t ar get ed on t he

16 Gul f beaches i s wi t hi n t hat quar t er t o

17 hal f a mi l e, dependi ng on wher e t he

18 sandbar s ar e l ocat ed, how cl ose t o t he

19 shor e t hey ar e.

20 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Most of t he l et t er s I saw

21 come i n, Mr . Bl ankenshi p, wer e

22 addr essi ng t he Spani sh macker el , t hat

23 t her e' s a l ar ge bypr oduct cat ch on t hat

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1 al so. I s t hat r i ght ?

2 MR. BLANKENSHI P: I mean, t her e i s - - I mean,

3 you have l adyf i sh, Spani sh macker el ,

4 bl ue runner s al l i n t hat area. Now,

5 t hey are f ai r l y - - they can be f ai r l y

6 sel ect i ve on what t hey t ar get i n school s

7 of Spani sh macker el . They wi l l have

8 some bycat ch of bl ue f i sh or ot her

9 t hi ngs.

10 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Yes, Mr . Lynch.

11 MR. LYNCH: What ' s t he commer ci al val ue of a

12 l adyf i sh?

13 MR. BLANKENSHI P: Mr . Pet e Bar ber i s her e t hat

14 coul d pr obabl y gi ve a bet t er est i mat e.

15 But t hey ar e pr obabl y i n t he 40 t o 60 or

16 80- cent r ange. I t depends on t he si ze

17 and t he t i me of year and t he demand.

18 Woul d that be f ai r ?

19 MR. BARBER: ( I naudi bl e) t hey al so have a bai t

20 component . Some of i t goes t o f i sh

21 meal . J ust a f ood i t em f or t he Or i ent al

22 speci f i cal l y ( i naudi bl e) .

23 MR. LYNCH: Thank you.

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Page 155

1 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Any ot her - -

2 MR. SHI PP: Yeah. Woul d you make a

3 di st i nct i on bet ween t he speci es t hat ar e

4 caught i n t he gi l l - net f i shery and t he

5 speci es t hat ar e commonl y pr esent i n our

6 super mar ket s l i ke Wi nn- Di xi e and

7 Br uno' s .

8 MR. BLANKENSHI P: I ' m sorr y. I di dn' t

9 under st and.

10 MR. SHI PP: I n ot her wor ds, t he speci es t hat

11 are t aken i n t he gi l l - net f i shery, how

12 ar e t hey t he same or di f f er ent t han t he

13 f i nf i sh t hat ar e f or sal e i n t he

14 supermarket s?

15 The reason i s t hat t her e' s a

16 per cept i on t hat much of our f i nf i sh

17 seaf ood comes f rom our gi l l - net

18 f i sher i es. And as Pet e j ust ment i oned,

19 t hat ' s not t he case.

20 I f I can expand on i t a l i t t l e bi t ,

21 t he gi l l - net f i shery does not t ake - -

22 does not capt ur e sal mon, does not

23 capture grouper , t una, t i l api a. Al l of

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1 t hose come f r om a di f f er ent sour ce. Our

2 gi l l - net f i sher y i s pr i mar i l y Spani sh

3 macker el , mul l et , and some of t he ot her

4 l esser speci es; i sn' t t hat r i ght ?

5 MR. BLANKENSHI P: You know, our pr i mar y

6 l andi ngs f rom t he gi l l net s are Spani sh

7 macker el , mul l et , and menhaden.

8 Menhaden i s not used as a f ood sour ce

9 pr i mar i l y. I t ' s pr i mar i l y used f or

10 ot her t hi ngs.

11 But Spani sh macker el , mul l et ,

12 bl uef i sh, sheepshead, you know, t hey ar e

13 used as a f ood sour ce - - maybe not as

14 pr eval ent her e i n our super mar ket s

15 because of consumer choi ce and ot her

16 f act ors . But our f i sher i es, ot her t han

17 menhaden, i s pr i mar i l y f or f ood f i sh.


19 Mr . Bl ankenshi p.

20 Mr . Har der s, di d you mi ss anyt hi ng

21 on t he open t r appi ng season f or

22 f urbearers? Are y' al l compl et e on al l

23 y' al l ' s r epor t s?

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1 Mr . Pugh.

2 MR. PUGH: Mr . Chai r man, t her e' s actual l y

3 anot her new busi ness i t em, game ani mal

4 r esearch pr oposal . And I ' d l i ke t o ask

5 Mr . Moody t o - -

6 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Yes. Pl ease di scuss t hat .

7 I don' t see i t l i sted on the f orm, but

8 l et ' s di scuss i t .

9 MR. MOODY: Thank you, Mr . Chai r man. And I

10 t hi nk y' al l al l have thi s proposal i n

11 your packet .

12 What we ar e pr oposi ng t o do i s

13 creat e a f und i n par t ner shi p wi t h Aubur n

14 School of Forest ry and Wi l dl i f e

15 Resources - - or Wi l dl i f e Sci ences t o

16 speci f i cal l y t ar get game ani mal s and

17 game ani mal r esear ch, t he r esear ch

18 pr i or i t i es t hat we have t hat woul d l ead

19 t o management i mpl i cat i ons not onl y on

20 our l ands but on pr i vat e l andowner

21 l ands.

22 We' r e pr oposi ng t o f und t hat i n par t

23 f rom f unds f rom t he Her i t age Li cense.

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1 And i f y' al l wi l l r ecal l , t he l ast t i me

2 a l i cense i ncr ease - - or l i cense

3 adj ust ment was creat ed by t he

4 l egi s l at ur e, a new l i cense was cr eat ed,

5 whi ch i s t he Wi l dl i f e Her i t age Li cense.

6 And t he r evenue f r om t hat by l aw says

7 the f i r s t hal f - mi l l i on dol l ar s has t o be

8 used f or r esear ch and t he boar d has t o

9 appr ove t he di r ect i ng of t hat spendi ng.

10 So f ar t he l i cense has onl y

11 gener at ed a l i t t l e over $50, 000. We' r e

12 pr oposi ng t o use $30, 000 now. Thi s

13 woul d be t he f i r st expendi t ur es f r om

14 t hat f und. The Aubur n School of

15 For estr y and Wi l dl i f e has agr eed t o

16 mat ch t hat 30, 000, so t her e we go t o

17 60. And t hen we' r e goi ng t o be seeki ng

18 addi t i onal mat chi ng f unds f r om f eder al

19 sour ces and ot her sour ces. So

20 pot ent i al l y t hi s pot coul d grow f ai r l y

21 subst ant i al and we coul d f und sever al

22 r esear ch pr oj ect s.

23 So t hat ' s our r equest t o you t o

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Page 159

1 approve t hi s f i r s t expendi t ure f rom t he

2 Her i t age Li cense f und t o st ar t t hi s

3 r esear ch.

4 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: That ' s ver y good. The

5 l i st i s ver y compr ehensi ve and ver y wel l

6 done i n my opi ni on, Mr . Moody.

7 MR. MOODY: Thank you.

8 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Any ot her quest i ons f r om

9 the boar d on that ?

10 MR. MOODY: J ust t o be speci f i c, Mr . Chai r man,

11 that l i st i s a suggested t i t l e t hat

12 we - - you know, we say i n t her e i t ' s not

13 absol ut el y t he end of i t . We' r e hopi ng

14 t o do a l ot mor e t han t hi s i n maki ng

15 some of t hese changes back and f or t h. I

16 don' t want t o mi sl ead anybody.

17 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Okay. Any ot her

18 quest i ons?

19 Yes, Mr . Har t zog.

20 MR. HARTZOG: One t hi ng I ' d l i ke t o add t o

21 t hat l i st , Gar y. I know t he Depar t ment

22 has l ooked at i t f or several years. But

23 wi t h t he bear r el ocat i on i nt o t he nor t h

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Page 160

1 del t a and bef or e t he Depar t ment never

2 had any f unds when t hey wer e want i ng t o

3 move t hose bear s out of - - was i t Hel l ' s

4 Swamp - - what ' s t he name of t hat swamp?

5 MR. MOODY: Hel l ' s Cr eek Swamp, I t hi nk.

6 MR. HARTZOG: Yeah. Move t hose out and t r y

7 r el ocat i on. And I know t hey di d some

8 st udi es up i n Ar kansas on t he Whi t e

9 Ri ver about bear r el ocat i on. But t hat ' s

10 an i ssue, f rom what I underst and f rom

11 t he bear commi t t ee of AWF - - t hat ' s a

12 bi g concer n now because of i ncreasi ng

13 number s down t her e, and t hose need t o

14 be . . .

15 MR. MOODY: J ust ver y br i ef l y - - and we' l l be

16 gl ad t o l ook at t hat , and I cer t ai nl y

17 don' t have any opposi t i on t o t hat . One

18 of t he concer ns t hat we' ve got i s publ i c

19 r eact i ons i n t he communi t i es wher e

20 ani mal s may be r el ocat ed. I t ' s one

21 t hi ng t o put a deer i n a communi t y,

22 anot her t hi ng t o put a bear . And t hat

23 does creat e anxi et y. And we' ve

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Page 161

1 di scussed t hat some wi t h t he Feder at i on

2 and ot hers . That ' s t he bi ggest nut , I

3 t hi nk, t hat we' ve got t o get ar ound,

4 so - - but we' l l be gl ad t o l ook at i t .

5 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Any ot her quest i ons?

6 ( No r esponse. )

7 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Any other new busi ness?

8 MR. HARTZOG: Can I make a mot i on?


10 MR. HARTZOG: To appr ove t he r equest s of t he

11 Depar t ment .

12 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Okay. That wi l l have t o

13 be done t he next t i me.

14 MR. HARTZOG: Thi s i s not r egul at i ons.

15 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Oh, okay. Okay. But i t

16 st i l l has t o be di scussed t hi s meet i ng,

17 and t he next meet i ng we' l l appr ove t hat .


19 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: I t st i l l has t o be done

20 t he same pr ot ocol .


22 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Okay. We' ve got a mot i on

23 t hat we need appr oved. Who has t hat

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Page 162

1 mot i on t hat I gave t o somebody bef or e

2 t he meet i ng?

3 MR. DEAN: Br ock. Mr . Br ock J ones.

4 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Can you i nt r oduce t hat

5 mot i on, pl ease?

6 MR. BROCK J ONES: The mot i on t o appr ove al l

7 depar t ment r egul at i ons si nce t he l ast

8 appr oval .

9 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Thi s i s a st andar d

10 housekeepi ng bi l l . Ther e' s a mot i on t o

11 appr ove. I s t her e a second?

12 MR. LYNCH: Second.

13 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Mr . Lynch. Ther e' s a

14 mot i on and a second t o appr ove. Al l

15 t hose i n f avor ?




19 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Show t he mot i on was a

20 hundr ed- per cent af f i r med and t he mot i on

21 car r i es.

22 Any ot her new busi ness?

23 MR. HARTZOG: Mr . Chai r man?

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Page 163

1 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Yes, Mr . Har t zog.

2 MR. HARTZOG: Ol d busi ness, new busi ness, j ust

3 cont i nui ng busi ness. Forever Wi l d i s

4 st i l l an i mpor t ant i ssue that i s out

5 t her e. The house commi t t ee vot ed i t out

6 of commi t t ee t o put i t on t he f l oor .

7 I t ' l l pr obabl y go t o t he f l oor af t er t he

8 spr i ng br eak sessi on. We st i l l need you

9 t o cal l your l egi sl at or s i n suppor t of

10 t hi s.

11 Wi t hout For ever Wi l d a l ot of t he

12 pl aces f or us t o hunt wi l l be t aken

13 away. The opposi t i on i s st i l l f i ght i ng

14 us har d. I f you happen t o get a Robo

15 phone cal l sayi ng - - t hey gi ve you t he

16 l i t t l e wor d bl i ps or what ever t hat make

17 i t sound l i ke you ought t o be agai nst

18 For ever Wi l d and says punch "one" i f you

19 want t o cal l your l egi s l at or . Go ahead

20 and punch "one. " And when your

21 l egi sl ator answer s , t el l hi m you' r e i n

22 suppor t of For ever Wi l d i nstead of

23 agai nst , so . . .

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Page 164

1 But , anyway, we need t o st ay on t op

2 of t hi s. I t ' s got t o go bef or e t he

3 senat e commi t t ee. I t has not gone t o

4 t he senat e commi t t ee yet . But For ever

5 Wi l d has got t o be r enewed f or t hi s

6 stat e t o have t he l ands f or our publ i c

7 t o enj oy i n t he f ut ur e.

8 CHAI RMAN MOULTRI E: Thank you, Mr . Hart zog.

9 One ot her i t em of new busi ness. We

10 appr eci at e Vest avi a Hi gh School al l owi ng

11 us t o have t hi s meet i ng her e. Hopef ul l y

12 we' l l have f ut ur e meet i ngs her e.

13 Commi ssi oner Guy has made t wo ni ce

14 pr ocl amat i ons f or t he pr i nci pal and t he

15 super i nt endent . And we' l l make - -

16 t hey' r e not i n at t endance t oday, but

17 we' l l make sur e t hey get t hem and ar e

18 r ecogni zed. Thank you, Commi ssi oner

19 Guy, f or t hat .


21 busi ness i s t he dat e and l ocat i on of t he

22 next advi sor y boar d meet i ng. The dat e

23 wi l l be May 14, 2011, and t he l ocat i on

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Page 165

1 wi l l be Lakepoi nt St at e Park i n

2 Euf aul a.

3 Bei ng t here' s no f ur t her busi ness of

4 t hi s meet i ng, t hi s meet i ng i s adj our ned.

5 ( Meet i ng adj ourned at

6 appr oxi mat el y 11: 30 a. m. )

7 * * * * * * * * * *

8 REPORTER' S CERTI FI CATE

9 * * * * * * * * * *

10 STATE OF ALABAMA:

11 MONTGOMERY COUNTY:

12 I , Tracye Sadl er Bl ackwel l , Cer t i f i ed

13 Cour t Repor t er and Commi ssi oner f or t he St at e of

14 Al abama at Lar ge, do her eby cer t i f y t hat I r epor t ed

15 t he f or egoi ng pr oceedi ngs of t he St at e of Al abama

16 Depar t ment of Conser vat i on and Nat ur al Resour ces

17 Advi sor y Boar d Meet i ng on Mar ch 12, 2011.

18 The f or egoi ng 164 comput er - pr i nt ed pages

19 cont ai n a t r ue and cor r ect t r anscr i pt of t he

20 proceedi ngs hel d.

21 I f ur t her cer t i f y t hat I am nei t her of

22 ki n nor of counsel t o t he par t i es t o sai d cause nor

23 i n any manner i nt er est ed i n t he r esul t s t her eof .

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1 Thi s 11t h day of Apr i l 2011.

2

3

4 _ ___ ____ ___ ___ ____ ___ ___ ___ Tr acye Sadl er Bl ackwel l

5 ACCR No. 294Expi r at i on dat e: 9- 30- 2011

6 Cer t i f i ed Cour t Repor t erand Commi ss i oner f or t he St ate

7 of Al abama at Lar ge

8

9

10

11

Cab 2011 Mar

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