Becoming a Full Time Trader (Trading for Living)

7/25/2019 Becoming a Full Time Trader (Trading for Living)

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BECOMING A FULL TIME TRADER (Trading for Living)10 February 2016

07:51 AM

I planning to start Full time Trading some time in Jan - 2016, I have been active in Mudraa since last 5

years and currently posting my calls and views through my thread.

I am presently trading with my Job since last 8-10 yrs. and don't find much time to see the news and

track the market, though i spend atleast 1- 2 hrs on daily basis for research in the evening but no time

to sit in the terminal and trade with charts on. I generally take positional calls because of the time

constraints.

I am looking forward to Honest reviews from FULL TIME TRADERS before i plunge into it. Please

advice me on this issue as there may be full time traders trading with the philosophy of 'Trading for

Living'. What is the capital requirement?. Elaborate advice is highly appreciated.

Thank you in advance.

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1st & foremost rule of trading : Never hide anything from the family. it becomes ones moral

responsibility to convince / seek support / blessings from the closest. Trading is business. As with any

business, if one approaches with proper business plan, one can reduce possibility of failure.

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I trust it is absolutely possible to thrive on Trading / Investing and related activities. A few thingsthough:

I would request to develop a back office. Also a bevy of like minded people .If u are from my place, I

would have gladly joined you;

It must be ensured that you have stashed in enough to help you in rainy days as well as provide youaround 2 years time before the earning from Stock market is used for Bread and Butter;

The sum to be used should not be small amount. A corpus of 5-6 Lakhs INR would help you.

Hope to know how you are sailing in days to come.

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Very true non of your family members and friends will support you to trade for living, It is purely ones

own decision like one enters or exits a trade. But it is not as simple either, because its a very big

decision.

I have postponed a bit though i am not ruling it out, as i have great zeal and passion for markets. I

hope i will succeed in my endeavours. Please pray for my sucess.

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Very interesting thread Rajdeep - I have been giving quitting my day job for trading for the sameresons i.e. a passion for trading. I have started trading with a capital of 10,000 Rs in Nov 2015therefore feel the decision of taking it full time might be too soon.

I would love to trade index, commodities and forex - everything is awesome. In the event you do

become a full time trader do keep posting here - May be after a couple of years of experience I might

consider this and contact you to ask for some guidance.

In the words of Dr. Alexander Elder :


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1st Target is Long Term Survival

2nd Target is steady growth of capital

3rd Target is high profit plays.

Personally I am in phase 1 where all my focus is to survive index trading for 1 year withg a max loss

of 10% of starting balance. Given your experience you might be in phase 2 where you must try to

target 10% ROCE YoY.

Best of luck with your decision - I understand this is a tougher than going long or short :P. My family

does not know I trade, when I casually used the word stock market they associate it as legitimate

gambling :P so have never spoken again. My point being that you might not necessarily find much

support from friends and family, coupled with the uncertainity of the market you need to make sure

you are confident!

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This topic cant stop me of interfearing,hope others not mind.

I am a full time trader since 3 years,though running or helping in Family business too, but tarding is

my Passion & now my Prime Business.

Now the Question of thread owner Did we can earn our Bread Butter from Trading???

My answer Yes offcourse.

But for it you have to keep this as a business not like a hobby or part time money making machine.

Did U beacme overnight millionear???

I suppose NO.

But in Long Run says 5-10 years Yes U can fetch sufficient Capital to say that U did some thing in

your Life.

Now comes Capital Requirement

A minimum of 5 lac Capital is must for any full time tarding a/c.

But best will be 10 lac.

Out of this divide 50% in working Capital & rest 50% for other business requirements.

here other requirement coming as Loss from tarding, so keep 50%in reserve.

How muchto earn?

It depends on individual capacities & Capablities both.

But my view a weekly 10% of Capital employed is sufficient enough if trading in F&O.

For Cash segment a monthly 10% will be OK.

Now to achieve this much accuracy one should be very much consistent in his trading.

Profits & Losses are part of game, but emotional stability is a must for any business to RUN speciallyTrading.

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Stockmarket involved a 1% financial, & 99% emotional. so this purely emotional game, if u have

controling power in your emotions then join this game.

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Ayan I am asking about capital requirement and its adequacy, as a Full time trader may need to trade

in both Nifty and stock futures.

Presently I rarely trade in stock futures, I trade in Nifty only.

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You have been giving calls on index n stock.......you are better judge to do justice to ur self...

based on ur performance u think,how good u il be as a trader......but be true to ur self...

it is personal now....

By going on ur trading ideas u il only know how much capital is needed to trade ur ideas....

coz u have been thru it in mudraa thru ur own calls....

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here is the questionnaire in reply to Sunil K:

well Sunil. There is no straight Can or Cannot answer. It is like starting a Business. Try anwering this

to yourself.

Q) Can you start a business?

A) Yes.

Q) Will you be successful in your business endeavor?

A) May be / May be Not

Q) How well are you equipped to run your business?

A) Good/Moderate/Not at all

Q) How do you intend to Support yourself during business Start-up period, say especially, when you

have staff to handle and staff salary to pay each month? irrespective of the fact that you may not get a

salary? (This is just a theoritical representation, as substantial amount by way of loss will be involved

during trading)

A) Financially stable/ ill equipped/ not handled anything like this before so Dont Know

Q) Where do you see your business in 1 year/3 years/5 years?

A) Have some Idea / Have No Clue

Q) Do you know when to quit? what parameters you are using to assess this situation

A) Yes/No/Cant answer

Q) Do you really want to run the business? do you love it? do you like it? Do you want to make it

successful?

A) Yes/No


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Q) If you are married how do you intend to provide for your Family? support, if any to your parents

financial need?

Ok. Now a real piece of advice: If you Do want to Trade, join a brokerage company (even if it means

very low salary). This way you will get some income and at the same time, if you are really smart, you

will learn quickly.

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a) my article here in mudraa in the thread "so, you want to be a trader".

b) Also, i am copy here a reply i had given to Sunil K about starting trading as a career under thread

"From Trader's Desk-Trading Smart-Trend Identfication":

Best wishes

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a) Note : i trade full time (intra+positional both Index & equities). i dont wish to share how-i-trade,what-to-trade, when-to-trade, how-much-to-trade, more importantly when-to-exit a trade. Reason: for

me trading is a business and each one has to figure their strategy-pain-comfort zone, as one dress

size never fits all. i have been very proud of my education (top 0.1%) & have had a splendid

professional career (top 1%) including running businesses successfully. but trading has HUMBLED

me considerably. so you will understand how serious trading is. past successes in your personal &

professional career has no relevance in Trading.

my brief notes are intended to provide a general guideline-direction to serious minded individuals who

wish to pursue trading as a career. i have used the words trading & investing interchangeably to drive

my points.

i am not a profilific writer. i would rather spend time trading than writing and answering questions. no

puns intended and dont take me wrong.

I suggest you print this and hang it in front of your computer!!!

Hope this helps both the new & the experienced traders.

i am sharing my experience in mudraa, since mudraa was my first (& probably the last) online trading

forum where i have been passively active.

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a) Trading IS a SKILL. you need to ACQUIRE it by working on it continuously. If you have not put in a

minimum 5,000 hours into learning about trading & investing and another 15,000 hours practising

what your have learnt, you are better off with either :

- Keeping your money in a fixed deposit

- go for a renowned Mutual Fund which invests in blue chip companies

ELSE, YOU WILL LOOSE ALL YOUR MONEY TO TRADERS LIKE

ME. GAURANTEED. Remember, i am not being egoistic or having a heavy-head. this is a fact.


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if you dont know how to play tennis and play against Pete Sampras, you know who will win the match.

dont you? Even if the coach who trains Sampras agrees to mentor you, even then, you know who has

to put in all the hard work. dont you?

Literally, keep a clock of how many hours you have put into learing & practising.

b) Trading is NOT Gambling. You will make money once you have become a seasoned trader.

Gamblers dont have any control over exposure; traders control money exposed & risked and know

their bets.

c) You can make an occassional 1000% return p.a with Rs 100. dont get misguided. if you can make

a consistent 50%-100% return p.a with large amounts of investment, this is the way to go. If you make

a net profit of 30% p.a in any business, that is stupendous. Dont believe me, go look at 20 years

balance sheet of top notch companies around the world. you will know what i mean. KEEP YOUR

EXPECTATIONS IN PLACE first before trading.

d) if you are NEW to trading and have Rs 1 lakh to invest :

- complete step (a)

- AVOID recommendations/tips from all sources such as TIP(GANG)STERS including run-off-the mill

fly-by-nights & renowned brokerages & websites & forums. REMEMBER brokerage firms are

BROKERS. They will always-only serve their personal interests. So do your own research, ALWAYS.

if you itch to seek TIPS, go to step-(a)

- do paper-trade and DOUBLE your money on paper. if you cant do this, you will never be able to do

this real time with real money.

- once you are confident, invest Rs 25,000 out of Rs 1 lakh and begin investing. Increase your

position ONLY out of PROFITS from this Rs 25,000. Remember, on paper you had doubled your

money, havent you? PLAY WITH THE MARKET's MONEY. DO NOT under any circumstance

draw extra money from balance Rs 75,000. If you do that, you are gambling with money. If you keep

loosing from Rs 25,000, considerably reduce the POSITION size and amount invested and go to step-

(a). THen double your money from that small position.

- if the devil inside you commands you to use paid services-free services, STOP trading immediately

as you have already lost your head & becoming desperate to make money to meet household

expenses. go back to step-(a)

(e) BEST of the traders have win-loss ratio of about 30% : 70% of the number of trades. SO FORGET

90% ACCURACY SCAMS and it means nothing. DONT aim TO MAKE PROFIT in every TRADE. It is

impossible. You will be amazed how much money you can make even when you are right less than

30% of the trades you do. Trick is to get out of wrong trades quickly without EGO. Approach each

trade with a mindset that it will result in LOSS. Dont think that each new trade is going to make you

the next Billionaire. it will be a lot easier this way. else go to step-(a)

(f) when you are wrong ADMIT it. Dont blame your sister, brother, parents, friends, OPERATOR,

BROKER, STOPLOSS trigger hunters, PETS, Tipsters, for your loss. Take responsibility of your

actions. Else go back to step-(a)

(g) NO-ONE can predict future direction of ANY MARKET. market place is always CHAOTIC. If you

ask for direction of the market, direction of stocks/futures you have taken a position, Targets


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(1,2,3,...n), Levels (Buy/Sell), YOU ARE GAMBLING. GET OUT OF ALL YOUR POSITIONS

immediately as NOW is the GOOD time to EXIT and go back to step-(a)

(h) DONT Waste your time arguing in FORUMS about WHO IS RIGHT, what position is right, which

direction is right, what closing rate is right. Trade & make money instead. if you still have time, spend

quality time with your family. Family is important and they are the reason you want to be alive.

(i) ARE you a PART-TIME Trader? : Either become a full time trader or go back to step-(a). You will

always get a HIGH when you make small profits and BLAME everyone else when you make loss.

(j) MONEY is your INVENTORY in this business. If you dont have inventory, GAME is OVER. so

preserve your MONEY and manage is wisely.

(k) TRADING is not for EVERYONE. ADMIT IT. There is no shame in it. The one who is laughing at

you in your failures is not going to support you/your family. do you get it?

(l) KEEP A TAB of your WEEKLY profit-loss. Analyse & improve continously each day. Most

unsuccessful traders spend 99% time basking in glory in 1 profit they made and less than 1% time in

losses they made in the other 100 trades. Be wise, do the opposite. You will learn faster. Keep a

logbook and meticulously enter your comments. If you dont do this, you will NEVER become a good

trader.

(m) if you are quitting a full time job to make trading as a career, and if you have a family(spouse,

children), save enough money to run your household for atleast 2 years. This will give you enough

time to settle down in your career as a trader so that you will not expect each & every trade you take

to cover for your household expenses. If you dont have savings, DO NOT TRADE. complete step-(a).

You need an emotional balance when you are at your trading desk. You had double the money on

paper, havent you? keep that confidence running ALWAYS.

(n) always think of RISK,RISK,RISK and managing Risk, as each new trade is different and Past

success in trading WILL NOT gaurantee success in the new trade.

(o) THERE IS NO HOLY GRAIL. The only holy grail is YOU. BELIEVE IT.

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b)

(I Strongly urge you to read my article on SO, YOU WANT TO BE A TRADER?? several times)

Pre-requisite 1 : DONT PREDICT THE MARKET DIRECTION. ALWAYS REACT TO IT.

Pre-requisite 2 : THROW AWAY ALL THE INDICATORS.

Pre-requisite 3 : USE YOUR EYES. TRAIN YOUR EYES TO SPOT.

Trend means different things to different people. Basic rule of trading, followed by the most

experienced, is TRADE WITH THE TREND. If you analyze your trades (provided you maintain

detailed log book), you will notice that most of the trading losses would have been when you had

taken position against trend.

Here is a SUPER-SIMPLE yet POWERFUL rule that will save you from 90% of losing tradesand

Increase your ODDS dramatically. This rule can be applicable whether you are DAY TRADER &

SHORT TERM TRADER, POSITIONAL TRADER, INVESTOR.


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Applicable to all ASSET CLASSES : Equity, F&O, Index, Bond, Commodity, others.

Rule 1 : If you want to take a LONG POSITION, ENSURE:

a) DAY TRADER & SHORT-TERM : Todays price is ABOVE Previous Day HIGH

b) POSITIONAL TRADER :Current WEEK Price is ABOVE Previous WEEK HIGH

c) INVESTOR : Current MONTH price is ABOVE Previous MONTH HIGH

Rule 2 : If you want to take a SHORT POSITION, ENSURE:

a) DAY TRADER : Todays price is BELOW Previous Day LOW

b) POSITIONAL TRADER :Current WEEK Price is BELOW Previous WEEK LOW

c) INVESTOR : Current MONTH price is BELOW Previous MONTH LOW

With the above rules, you are Automatically trading with the Trend and WITH the Majority of the

crowd. Dont complicate analysis. You are letting market confirm the direction and re-acting based onthat.

It will help you FILTER out all the CONTRA-AGAINST-THE-TREND positions.

If you feel that SOMEONE is pulling the market to TRAP you, trust me, there is NONE. Trust the

trend using the Simple Rule above and your money will be SAFE Whether you trade in Rs 1,000 or

Rs 10 crore .

TRADE SAFE. TRADE SMART. THE HOLY GRAIL AND GURU IS WITHIN YOU.

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I am a full time trader and I am earning gud from trading. I am still young and new to trading so still

did not create any wealth but I am in the right path. :)

If we talk about my education then its B.Tech and M.Tech. I belongs to a lower middle class family.

So it was some tough and hard decision for me. I have always trust on myself. I love to self learn new

things. So my this hobby: learn to new things make me enter in trading.

But all credit goes to my eleder bro, who opened trading account with Rs. 10,000 and ask me to look

it as he had no time due to his job and he always ask me to look his things as he is mine elder bro so

mine boss.:) I did not know ABCD also of trading, so I searched on internet some basic of stock

market and trading but I didnt know how to put Stop Loss. So my bro asked me to go to broker office

and understand. I went broker office like a professional student, formal dress, my lapy bag was on

my back and enter in broker office like going to attend interview. There were some operators who

place order for customers as its local branch office. There were some persons who looks like real

bull 80-100 kg weight 40-60 years old.. and one chair was not enough for their base :) actually they

were big traders from finacial strong background who do trade in 15-20 lots.

when I asked from operator to what is Stop loss and how to put it, that time one of them asked from

me about mine capital and when they got mine invested capital is just 10 thousand they just said in

joke like child go and do ur work.. its not child play, here crores rupees trade per day, U ll lose what u

have also. There style was not taunt type or hurting type.. just some lighter way. (Now I got they said

right, many small traders lost money) but I decide inside that I ll become big traders and ll show them

if in my place any other.. who also think same. its human nature :)


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I start trading self with small quantity ... daily 200-300 rupees profit or loss, then ask from my bro to

add more money so can buy more stocks and then some time profit and some time lost and end of

the month I finish 12-13 thousand loss. Then I stop to trading blindly and start to learn. Thanks to 21st

century so with laptop and internet connection, we can access whole world with one click. I read many

ebooks,watched thousands videos at youtube, articles and where I saw any chart or stock or trading

word.. I watched it. what I was learning there , I was applying in mine trading with 10-20 stock quantity

.. so my profit and loss was not more than 30-40 rupees. It was just for learning purpose. I gave 8-12

hours per day to learn trading. and finaly found and discoverd some trading methods. Its took more

than 6 months but I keep mine hard work continusly.

Day Trading: I watched a lots of videos for day trading, Indian and USA traders. I found most of indian

trading videos and strategy is just waste of time and waste of money. I learned Day trading from USA

traders and I found its very usefull. Now I have developed my trading style and I am happy with it.

Positional/Swing Trading: I love it, I self developed my positional trading style after some mistakes.

Now with 100% accuracy. Its combination of capital managment, risk manament and technicalanalysis. I use both Future and Options in my positional trading.

Long term investment: how to select stocks and mutual fund for long terms and how to book

continusly profit and how to add stock through SIP.

I use day trading money for my daily spent and Swing trading profit to invest in stocks and mutul

funds for long terms.

Now trading is mine love. Hope my journey will finish with Billions :)

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sir u have good knowledge of market i think u can earn handsome of amount in market but i fill if urearning nice amunt in market and u r having job with fixed salary i think u can earn in market (whichamount is not fix ) but u r having a fix salary income so u can do ur expence from ur salary incomeand u can create nice bankbalance from this income which is bonous i feel i m a ladies hair dresserand i do job i read ur post + i do trading

i will tell u as a frd do not quit ur job if u don't having prob at ur job place

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Booking loss is an art. Learn it first. If you succeed then only you can think of profit.

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From "Trading in the zone" by Mark Douglas

that is trade secret,,,simply follow the trend then 80 percent u will be winning and do not be greedy

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Most important is having a method and beliving it amd following it.Trade only with 40% of capital rest keep for emergency/ avg etc.

Most important is to keep away fear.

Becoming a Full Time Trader (Trading for Living)

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