Allan Nairn

8/22/2019 Allan Nairn

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ALLAN NAIRN

Articles from News and Comments and interviews to

Democracy Now!


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Contents

The Genocide Trial of General Efrain Rios Montt Has Just Been Suspended: ................................................................................ 2

Genocide Trial of Former Dictator Ros Montt Suspended After Intervention by Guatemalan President ............. ............ ............. .. 6

Allan Nairn Exposes Role of U.S. and New Guatemalan President in Indigenous Massacres ............ ............. ............ ............. ..... 11

A Crossing in the Cuchumatanes ................................................................................................................................................... 24

General Perez Molina is Tito ......................................................................................................................................................... 25

On the Margins of the Law -- But Inside the Palace ...................................................................................................................... 26

Guatemala: The decisive moment has arrived ............................................................................................................................... 27

The Guatemala Genocide Case: Testimony Notes Regarding Rios Montt ............. ............. ............. ............ ............. ............. ........ 28

A Formal Legal Mandate for a Criminal Investigation of Guatemala's Current President, Perez Molina ............ ............. ............. 39

Ros Montt Guilty of Genocide: Are Guatemalan President Prez Molina, U.S. Officials Next? ........... ............. ............. ............ . 40

Additional Evidence on Perez Molina ........................................................................................................................................... 49

Still Alive ...................................................................................................................................................................................... 50

Follow Guatemala's Lead: Convene a Genocide Case Grand Jury ................................................................................................ 51

Allan Nairn: After Ros Montt Verdict, Time for U.S. to Account for Its Role in Guatemalan Genocide ........... ............. ............. 53


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Breaking News

The Genocide Trial of General Efrain Rios Montt Has Just Been Suspended: Afirsthand behind-the-scenes account of how Guatemala's current President and

threats of violence killed the case

Allan Nairn

Guatemala City

Thursday, April 18, 2013

For a while it looked like Guatemala was about to deliver justice.

But the genocide case against General Efrain Rios Montt has just been suspended,

hours before a criminal court was poised to deliver a verdict.

The last-second decision to kill the case was technically taken by an appeals court.

But behind the decision stands secret intervention by Guatemala's current president

and death threats delivered to judges and prosecutors by associates of Guatemala's

army.

Many dozens of Mayan massacre survivors risked their lives to testify. But now the

court record they bravely created has been erased from above.

The following account of some of my personal knowledge of the case was written

several days ago. I was asked to keep it private until a trial verdict had been reached:

"It would be mistaken to think that this case redounds to the credit of Guatemala's

rulers.

It was forced upon them from below. The last thing they want is justice.

But they agreed to swallow a partial dose because political forces were such that they

had to, and because they thought that they could get away with sacrificing Rios Montt

to save their own skins.

I was called to testify in the Rios Montt case, was listed by the court as a 'qualifiedwitness,' and was tentatively scheduled to testify on Monday, April 15. But at the last

minute I was kept off the stand 'in order to avoid a confrontation with the

[Guatemalan] executive.'

What that meant, I was given to understand, was that Gen. Otto Perez Molina,

Guatemala's president, would shut down the case if I took the stand because my

testimony could implicate him.

Beyond that, there was fear, concretely stated, that my taking the stand could lead to

violence since given my past statements and writings I would implicate the'institutional army.'


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The bargain under which Perez Molina and the country's elite had let the case go

forward was that it would only touch Rios Montt and his codefendant, Gen. Mauricio

Rodriguez Sanchez. The rest of the army would be spared, and likewise Perez

Molina.

On that basis, Perez Molina, it was understood, would refrain from killing the Rios

Montt trial case, and still more importantly would keep the old officer corps from

killing prosecutors and witnesses, as well as hold off any hit squads that might be

mounted by the the oligarchs of CACIF (the Chambers of Agriculture, Commerce,

Industry and Finance). (Perez Molina has de facto power to kill the case via secret

intervention with the Constitutional and other courts.)

This understanding was seen as vital to the survival of both the case and those

involved in it. Army associates had already threatened the family of one of the lead

prosecutors, and halfway through the trial a death threat had been delivered to one of

the three presiding judges.

In the case of one of those threatened a man had offered him a bribe of one million

US dollars as well as technical assistance with offshore accounts and laundering the

funds. All the lawyer had to do was to agree to stop the Rios Montt case.

When that didn't work, the angle changed: the man put a pistol on the table and stated

that he knew where to find the lawyer's children.

But so far no trial people had actually been killed. Though things were tense, the

bargain was holding.

But to the shock of many and to world headlines in a press that had long under- and

mis- reported Guatemala's terror, everything changed on April 5 when Hugo Ramiro

Leonardo Reyes, a former army mechanic, testified by video from hiding that Perez

Molina had ordered atrocities.

Testifying with his face half-covered by a baseball cap he recounted murders by Rios

Montt's army and then unexpectedly added that one of the main perpetrators has been

Perez Molina who he said had ordered executions and the destruction of villages.

This had occurred, he testified, during the massacres around Nebaj when Perez

Molina was serving there as Rios Montt's field commander in 1982-83.

As it happened, I had also been there at that time and had encountered Perez Molina

who was then living under the code name Major Tito Arias.

I had interviewed him on film several times. On one occasion we stood over the

bodies of four captured guerrillas he had interrogated. Out of his earshot, Perez

Molina's subordinates told me how, acting under orders, they routinely captured,

tortured, and staged multiple executions of civilians.


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The trial witness's broaching of Perez Molina's past evidently angered the President.

He publicly denounced the witness and had him investigated

He then summoned the Attorney General. The word went forth that if the trial case

mentioned Perez Molina again, all previous understandings would be suspended.

Canceling the Rios Montt case would be the least of their worries: there would be hell

to pay.

The case went forward as originally agreed with Perez Molina. My testimony was

cancelled, and the court record was kept clear of any additional evidence that could

have further implicated the President.

Under Guatemalan law, a sitting President cannot be indicted. Perez Molina's term

ends in 2016.

This is one small but revealing aspect of the case. The massacre story is not yet over."

After the above private account was written, Guatemala's army and oligarchy rallied.

They started to feel that they had no political need to sacrifice Rios Montt. As Perez

Molina heard from the elite, his and Rios Montt's interests converged.

On April 16 Perez Molina said publicly that the case was a threat to peace. On April

18, today, the Rios Montt genocide case was suspended.

(Regarding Background Sources: For some of my filmed interviews with Perez

Molina see the documentary Skoop! directed by Mikael Wahlforss. EPIDEM,

Scandinavian television, 1983. Long excerpts from it, under the title Titulares de

Hoy, are available on the website of Jean-Marie Simon who was my colleague on the

film. Also see her photographs and narrative in her book Guatemala: Eternal Spring,

Eternal Tyranny, W.W. Norton, 1988.

For a detailed contemporaneous report of the Rios Montt massacres see my piece in

the April 11, 1983 The New Republic, "The Guns of Guatemala: The merciless

mission of Rios Montt's army." The piece quotes some of Perez Molina's army

subordinates and briefly mentions him as "Major Tito." At the time I wrote it and

worked on the film I did not know his real name.

YouTube excerpts from the film went viral in Guatemala during Perez Molina's 2011

presidential campaign. During the campaign Perez Molina was evasive about whether

he really was "Major Tito," though it later surfaced that he had admitted it years

before but had then attempted to obscure that admission.

Also see my piece in the April 17, 1995 The Nation, "C.I.A. Death Squad: Americans

have been directly involved in Guatemalan Army killings." The piece reports on US

sponsorship of the G-2, the Guatemalan military intelligence unit which picked targets

for assassination and disappearance and often did its own killings and torture. The


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piece names Perez Molina as one of "three of the recent G-2 chiefs [who] have been

paid by the C.I.A., according to U.S. and Guatemalan intelligence sources."

The piece adds that then-Colonel "Perez Molina, who now runs the Presidential

General Staff and oversees the Archivo, was in charge in 1994, when according to the

Archbishop's human rights office, there was evidence of General Staff involvement in

the assassination of Judge Edgar Ramiro Elias Ogaldez."

Likewise, at the time of The Nation article I still did not know that Perez Molina was

Tito.

For one aspect of the US role in supporting Rios Montt see my Washington Post

piece: "Despite Ban, U.S. Captain Trains Guatemalan Military," October 21, 1982,

page 1.

After the 1983 New Republic piece the Guatemalan army sent an emissary whoinvited me to lunch at a fancy hotel and politely told me that I would be killed unless I

retracted the article. The army murdered Guatemalans all the time, but for a US

journalist the threat rang hollow. The man who delivered the threat later became an

excellent source of information.)


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Genocide Trial of Former Dictator Ros Montt Suspended After

Intervention by Guatemalan President

Friday, April 19, 2013

_____________________________________________________________________

A historic trial against former U.S.-backed Guatemalan dictator Efran Ros Montt on

charges of genocide and crimes against humanity came to an abrupt end Thursday

when an appeals court suspended the trial before a criminal court was scheduled to

reach a verdict. Ros Montt on was charged in connection with the slaughter of more

than 1,700 people in Guatemalas Ixil region after he seized power in 1982. His 17-

month rule is seen as one of the bloodiest chapters in Guatemalas decades-long

campaign against Maya indigenous people, which resulted in the deaths of hundreds

of thousands. Thursdays decision is seen as a major blow to indigenous victims.

Investigative journalist Allan Nairn reported last night Guatemalan army associateshad threatened the lives of case judges and prosecutors and that the case had been

annulled after intervention by Guatemalas president, General Otto Prez Molina.

Ros Montt was the first head of state in the Americas to stand trial for genocide.

Nairn flew to Guatemala last week after he was called to testify in Ros Montts trial.

He was listed by the court as a "qualified witness" and was tentatively scheduled to

testify on Monday. But at the last minute, Nairn was kept off the stand "in order," he

was told, "to avoid a confrontation" with the president, General Prez Molina, and for

fear that if he took the stand, military elements might respond with violence. In the

1980s, Nairn extensively documented broad army responsibility for the massacres andwas prepared to present evidence that personally implicated Prez Molina, who was

field commander during the very Mayan Ixil region massacres for which the ex-

dictator, Ros Montt, had been charged with genocide.

_____________________________________________________________________

Juan Gonzalez: An historic trial against former U.S.-backed Guatemalan dictator

Efran Ros Montt on charges of genocide and crimes against humanity came to an

abrupt end Thursday when an appeals court suspended the trial before a criminal court

was scheduled to reach a verdict. Investigative journalist Allan Nairn reported last


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night Guatemalan army associates had threatened the lives of case judges and

prosecutors and that the case had been annulled after intervention by Guatemalas

president, General Otto Prez Molina.

Ros Montt was the first head of state in the Americas to stand trial for genocide.

He was charged in connection with the slaughter of more than 1,700 people in

Guatemalas Ixil region after he seized power in 1982. His 17-month rule is seen as

one of the bloodiest chapters in Guatemalas decades-long campaign against Maya

indigenous people, which resulted in the deaths of hundreds of thousands.

On Thursday, survivors of the genocide attempted to approach Ros Montt inside the

courtroom, screaming "Murderer!"

Amy Goodman: The trial took a surprising turn last week when Guatemalas current

president, General Otto Prez Molina, was directly accused of ordering executions. Aformer military mechanic named Hugo Reyes told the court that President Prez, then

serving as an army major and using the name Tito Arias, ordered soldiers to burn and

pillage a Mayan Ixil area in the 1980s.

Were going right now to investigative journalist Allan Nairn. He flew to Guatemala

City last week after wehe was called to testify in Ros Montts trial. He was listed

by the court as a "qualified witness" and was tentatively scheduled to testify Monday.

But at the last minute he was kept off the stand "in order," he was told, "to avoid a

confrontation" with the president, General Prez Molina, and for fear that if he took

the stand, military elements might respond with violence.

In the 80s, Allan Nairn had extensively documented broad army responsibility for the

massacres and was prepared to present evidence that personally implicated Prez

Molina, who was field commander during the very Maya Ixil region massacres for

which the ex-dictator, General Ros Montt, has been charged with genocide.

Allan Nairn, welcome to Democracy Now! Can you talk about the significance of the

latest developments, the annulling of the trial of Ros Montt?

Allan Nairn: Well, this trial was a breakthrough, not just for Guatemala, but for the

world. It was the first time that any nation had been able to use its domestic criminal

courts to try a former head of state for genocide. Dozens upon dozens of Mayan

survivors of the massacres risked their lives to come and testify. A massive

evidentiary record was put together, in my view, to proving a case of genocide against

General Ros Montt and his co-defendant, his former intelligence chief. A verdict was

just hours away. A verdict could have come today in the trial, but yesterday it was all

annulled after intervention by General Prez Molina, the current president, and the

Guatemalan military and oligarchy killed it.


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Juan Gonzalez: And, Allan, can you talk about what you learned in terms of the

threats to the judges andthe judge and the prosecutor and whats been their reaction,

even though theyve been sitting here now for several weeks in this trial?

Allan Nairn: In one case, one ofone of the lawyers involved in pushing the case

forward was approached by a man who offered him a million dollars if he would kill

the case against Ros Montt, a million U.S. dollars. He also said he would help him

launder the money, set up offshore bank accounts. The lawyer rejected that. The man

then took out a pistol, put the pistol on the table and said, "I know where your

children are." Another was approached on the street with awith a direct death

threat. Despite those threats, though, the case went forward. And now, after

[inaudible] to kill the case, the attorney general of Guatemala, the trial judge presiding

in the case are both vowing to try to go forward with it. Theyre vowing to continue

with the court hearing just a couple hours from now, even though theyve been told

they cant. So a direct political confrontation has been set.

Amy Goodman: Were talking to investigative journalist Allan Nairn. Hes in

Guatemala City. Were reaching him by Democracy Now! video stream. Listen

carefully. Its a little difficult to make out what he is saying. But, Allan, we wanted to

ask about why your testimony was canceled before the overall annulment of the trial

yesterday. Why was your testimony considered so dangerous?

Allan Nairn: I was given to understand that if I were called to the stand, two things

would happen. First, President Prez Molina would intervene to shut down the trial.

And secondly, there could be violence, particularly from retired military. The reasonwas that, as you mentioned in the introduction, one witness had already implicated

Prez Molina in the massacres. He was a field commander at that time. After that

testimony, Prez Molina called in the attorney general, and the word went out that if

he was mentioned again in the trial, if his name came up once, he would immediately

shut it down. Soand they knew that I could implicate Prez Molina further, because

I had met him in the highlands during the massacres when he was operating under a

code name. And I interviewed soldiers under his command who described how, under

orders, they executed and tortured civilians.

Juan Gonzalez: And, Allan, in terms of theof Prez Molina himself, you have asituation here, obviously, after the Central America accords, when some sort of

relative peace came to the region. How did Prez Molina rise to power, being one of

the underlings of Ros Montt and the military that visited such carnage and such

destruction on the people of Guatemala?

Allan Nairn: Well, the reason the military was doing those massacres in the first

place was to preserve a political and economic system under which there was 80

percent attrition in the area around Nebaj, which is where Prez Molina was stationed

and where, at the same time, there were world-class rich people running the

plantations, the banks, the industries. Those massacres were basically successful in


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crushing the population and crushing any resistance and in maintaining that system.

And within that system, Prez Molina was able to rise. He became a colonel. He

became the head of the G-2 military intelligence service during a time [inaudible]

Amy Goodman: Were having a little trouble hearing, Allan.

Allan Nairn:placed on the CIA payroll. At one point, an office under his control

was implicated in theat one point, an office under Prez Molinas control was

implicated in the assassination of a judge. He rose to general, and he was able to

become president. Thats thethats the Guatemalan system. Yet, remarkably, even

given that system, this movement from below of massacre survivors who refused to

give up, who insisted on trying to bring generals to justice, was able to generate this

trial, aided by people of integrity who had found their way into the Guatemalan

judiciary and prosecution system, and a trial was begun. They heard massive amounts

of evidence. I believe it was on the verge of giving a verdict, but then, at the last

minute, Prez Molina and the powers that be intervened.

Amy Goodman: Very quickly, Allan, we just have less than a minute, the attorney

general is a woman. The judge is a woman. They are saying theyre going to move

forward with this case, although it has been anulled, with a trial today? And what

about protests outside?

Allan Nairn: Well, protests are planned outside the court. The judge, Yassmin

Barrios, and the attorney general, Claudia Paz y Paz, both say theyre going to defy

this order to kill the case, which is extraordinary. You know, this indicates, I think,

that Guatemala has reached a higher level of civilization than the United States has.

Even though this case was killed in the end, its inconceivable that in the United

States a U.S. attorney, say, could indict a former U.S. president, could indict a George

W. Bush for what he did in Iraq and/or Afghanistan, or could indict an Obama, and

that this could proceed to trial and that massive amounts of evidence could be heard.

Thats not yet conceivable in the American legal system, but it happened here in

Guatemala, and it almost succeeded. It came very close. And now theres going to be

a popular reaction to try to continue that fight for law enforcement and justice.

Amy Goodman: And is it possible the trial will continue?

Allan Nairn: Excuse me?

Amy Goodman: Is it possible the trial will continue?

Allan Nairn: Well, I guess its possible, if JudgeJudge Barrios and the prosecutors

are physically allowed into the courtroom, that they could try to have the trial. But the

powers that be above them have now banned it, have now prohibited it. Ros Montt

and his lawyers may not show up. I dont know what will happen. This is a real

political crisis for Guatemala.


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Amy Goodman: Investigative journalist Allan Nairn, speaking to us from Guatemala

City. When we come back, we sat down with Allan before he left to go through the

history of this trial and also play the videotape of his interview with the current

president back more than 20 years ago when he was a major under Ros Montt, on

trial for genocide. Stay with us.

http://www.democracynow.org/

http://www.democracynow.org/2013/4/19/genocide_trial_of_former_dictator_ros
http://www.democracynow.org/http://www.democracynow.org/http://www.democracynow.org/2013/4/19/genocide_trial_of_former_dictator_roshttp://www.democracynow.org/2013/4/19/genocide_trial_of_former_dictator_roshttp://www.democracynow.org/2013/4/19/genocide_trial_of_former_dictator_roshttp://www.democracynow.org/


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Allan Nairn Exposes Role of U.S. and New Guatemalan President

in Indigenous Massacres


_____________________________________________________________________

In 1982, investigative journalist Allan Nairn interviewed a Guatemalan general named

"Tito" on camera during the height of the indigenous massacres. It turns out the man

was actually Otto Prez Molina, the current Guatemalan president. We air the original

interview footage and speak to Nairn about the U.S. role backing the Guatemalan

dictatorship. Last week, Nairn flew to Guatemala where he had been scheduled to

testify in the trial of former U.S.-backed dictator Efran Ros Montt, the first head of

state in the Americas to stand trial for genocide. Ros Montt was charged in

connection with the slaughter of more than 1,700 people in Guatemalas Ixil region

after he seized power in 1982. His 17-month rule is seen as one of the bloodiest

chapters in Guatemalas decades-long campaign against Maya indigenous people,

which resulted in the deaths of hundreds of thousands. The trial took a surprising turn

last week when Guatemala President Gen. Otto Prez Molina was directly accused of

ordering executions. A former military mechanic named Hugo Reyes told the court

that Prez Molina, then serving as an army major and using the name Tito Arias,

ordered soldiers to burn and pillage a Maya Ixil area in the 1980s. Click here to hear

our live update of the trial from Nairn in Guatemala City.

_____________________________________________________________________

Amy Goodman: This is Democracy Now!, democracynow.org, The War and Peace

Report. Im Amy Goodman, with Juan Gonzlez. We continue our coverage of thehistoric trial of former U.S.-backed Guatemalan dictator Efran Ros Montt on charges

of genocide and crimes against humanity. Allan Nairn joined us in our studio last

week before he flew to Guatemala. I began by asking him to describe just who Ros

Montt is.

Allan Nairn: Ros Montt was the dictator of Guatemala during 1982, '83. He seized

power in a military coup. He was trained in the U.S. He had served in Washington as

head of the Inter-American Defense College. And while he was president, he was

embraced by Ronald Reagan as a man of great integrity, someone totally devoted to

democracy. And he killed many tens of thousands of civilians, particularly in the


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Mayan northwest highlands. In this particular trial, he is being charged with 1,771

specific murders in the area of the Ixil Mayans. These charges are being brought

because the prosecutors have the names of each of these victims. They've been able to

dig up the bones of most of them.

Amy Goodman: Talk about how this campaign, this slaughter, was carried out and

how it links to, well, the current government in Guatemala today.

Allan Nairn: The army swept through the northwest highlands. And according to

soldiers who I interviewed at the time, as they were carrying out the sweeps, they

would go into villages, surround them, pull people out of their homes, line them up,

execute them. A forensic witness testified in the trial that 80 percent of the remains

theyve recovered had gunshot wounds to the head. Witnesses havewitnesses and

survivors have described Ros Montts troops beheading people. One talked about an

old woman who was beheaded, and then they kicked her head around the floor. They

ripped the hearts out of children as their bodies were still warm, and they piled them

on a table for their parents to see.

The soldiers I interviewed would describe their interrogation techniques, which they

had been taught at the army general staff. And they said they would ask people, "Who

in the town are the guerrillas?" And if the people would respond, "We dont know,"

then they would strangle them to death. These sweeps were intense. The soldiers said

that often they would kill about a third of a towns population. Another third they

would capture and resettle in army camps. And the rest would flee into the mountains.

There, in the mountains, the military would pursue them using U.S.-suppliedhelicopters, U.S.- and Israeli-supplied planes. They would drop U.S. 50-kilogram

bombs on them, and they would machine-gun them from U.S. Huey and Bell

helicopters, using U.S.-supplied heavy-caliber machine guns.

Amy Goodman: Lets turn to a clip of you interviewing a soldier in the highlands.

This is from a Finnish documentaryis that right? And when was this done? When

were you talking to soldiers there?

Allan Nairn: This was in September of 1982 in the Ixil zone in the area surrounding

the town of Nebaj.

Amy Goodman: Lets go to a clip of this interview.

Guatemalan Soldier: [translated] This is how we are successful. And also, if we

have already interrogated them, the only thing we can do is kill them.

Allan Nairn: [translated] And how many did you kill?

Guatemalan Soldier: [translated] We killed the majority. There is nothing else to do

than kill them.

Allan Nairn: [translated] So you killed them at once?


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Guatemalan Soldier: [translated] Yes. If they do not want to do the right things,

there is nothing more to do than bomb the houses.

Allan Nairn: [translated] Bomb? With what?

Guatemalan Soldier: [translated] Well, with grenades or collective bombs.

Allan Nairn: [translated] What is a collective bomb?

Guatemalan Soldier: [translated] They are like cannons.

Allan Nairn: [translated] Do you use helicopters?

Guatemalan Soldier: [translated] Yes.

Allan Nairn: [translated] What is the largest amount of people you have killed at

once?

Guatemalan Soldier: [translated] Well, really, in Solol, around 500 people.

Allan Nairn: [translated] And how do they react when you arrive?

Guatemalan Soldier: [translated] Who?

Allan Nairn: [translated] The people from the small villages.

Guatemalan Soldier: [translated] When the army arrives, they flee from their houses.

And so, as they flee to the mountains, the army is forced to kill them.

Allan Nairn: [translated] And in which small village did the army do that kind of

thing?

Guatemalan Soldier: [translated] That happened a lot of times.

Allan Nairn: [translated] Specifically, could you give me some examples where these

things happened?

Guatemalan Soldier: [translated] In Salquil, Sumal Chiquito, Sumal Grande, Acul.

Amy Goodman: When did you interview this soldier, Allan?

Allan Nairn: This was in September of 82.

Amy Goodman: What were you doing there?

Allan Nairn: Making a documentary for Scandinavian television.

Amy Goodman: So you have soldiers talking about killing civilians, the brutal

interrogations that they were engaged in. Why would they be telling you this? Youre

a journalist. Theyre talking about crimes theyre committing.


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Allan Nairn: Well, because this is their everyday life. They do this all the time. They

do it under orders from the top of the chain of command, at that time Ros Montt. And

they had hardly ever seen journalists at that time. It was very rare for an outside

journalist or even a local journalist to go into that area.

Amy Goodman: So lets take this to the current day, to the president of Guatemala

today, because at the same time you were interviewing these soldiers, you interviewed

the Guatemalan presidentat least the Guatemalan president today in 2013.

Allan Nairn: Yes, the senior officer, the commander in Nebaj, was a man who used

the code name "Mayor Tito," Major Tito. It turns out that that mans real name was

Otto Prez Molina. Otto Prez Molina later ascended to general, and today he is the

president of Guatemala. So he is the one who was the local implementer of the

program of genocide which Ros Montt is accused of carrying out.

Amy Goodman: This is a huge charge. I mean, right now, its an historic trial whenits 25 years after a past president is now being charged. Lets go to a clip of Otto

Prez Molina, the current president of Guatemala, but this is 1982 in the heartland

area of Quich in northwest Guatemala, northwest of Guatemala City. In this video

clip, Otto Prez Molina is seen reading from political literature found on one of the

bodies. This is your interview with him.

Mayor Otto Prez Molina: [translated] "The poor artisan fights alongside the

worker. The poor peasant fights alongside the worker. The wealth is produced by us,

the poor. The army takes the poor peasants. Together, we have an invincible force. All

the families are with the guerrilla, the guerrilla army of the poor, toward final victory

forever." These are the different fronts that they have.

Allan Nairn: [translated] So here they are saying that the army killed some people.

Mayor Otto Prez Molina: [translated] Exactly.

Amy Goodman: I mean, this is astounding. This is the current president of

Guatemala standing over these bodies. Tell us more.

Allan Nairn: Well, as one of the soldiers says in the sound in the background, the

Prez Molina interrogated these men. And soon after, they werethey were dead.

And one soldier told me off camera that in fact after Prez Molina interrogated them,

they finished them off.

Amy Goodman: This man, Prez Molina, the president, actually was going by a code

name at the time. When was it clear that this is Prez Molina? Though we have a very

clear shot of him.

Allan Nairn: For a long time, Prez Molina was trying to obscure his past and

apparently hide the fact that he played this role in a supervisory position during the

highland massacres. During the Guatemalan presidential campaign, which Prez


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Molina eventually won, about two years ago, I got calls while I was in Asia from the

Guatemalan press, from The Wall Street Journal, asking whether I could vouch for the

fact that Mayor Tito, the man in the video who I encountered in the northwest

highlands in the midst of the massacreswhether I could vouch for the fact that

Mayor Tito was in fact General Otto Prez Molina, the presidential candidate. And Isaid that I couldnt, just from looking at the current videos. You know, people can

change a lot visually over 30 years, so I said I couldnt be sure. It turns out thatand

during the campaign, when reporters would ask the Prez Molina campaign, "Is Prez

Molina Mayor Tito?" they would dodge the question. They would evade. They were

running from it. It turns out, though, we just learned this week, that Prez Molina had

admitted back in 2000 that he was Mayor Tito. But then, apparently afterward, he

thought better of it and was trying to bury it. And now, this is potentially trouble for

him. Hes currently president, and so, under Guatemalan law, he enjoys immunity.

But once he leaves the presidency, he could, in theory, be subject to prosecution, just

as Ros Montt is now being prosecuted.

Amy Goodman: That could be a serious motivation for him declaring himself

president for life.

Allan Nairn: Well, Ros Montt seized power by a coup, but one of the important facts

about the situation now is that the military men dont have the power that they used

to. The fact that this trial is happening is an indication of that. This trial is happening

because the survivors refused to give up. They persistedthe survivors have been

working on this for decades, pushing to bring Ros Montt and the other generals to

justice. They refused to give up. They got support from internationalsomeinternational human rights lawyers. And within the Guatemalan justice system, there

were a few people of integrity who ascended to positions of some authority within the

prosecutorial system, within the judiciary. And so, we now have this near-political

miracle of a country bringing to trial its former dictator for genocide, while the

president of the country, who was implicated in those killings, sits by.

Amy Goodman: Allan, this video that we have of you interviewing Prez Molina

again, as you said, he admitted to the Guatemalan newspaper, Prensa Libre, in 2000

that he used the nickname Titois quite astounding. So lets go to another clip, where

youre talking to him about the kind of support that he wants.

Allan Nairn: [translated] The United States is considering giving military help here

in the form of helicopters. What is the importance of helicopters for all of you?

Mayor Otto Prez Molina: [translated] A helicopter is an apparatus thats become of

great importance not only here in Guatemala but also in other countries where theyve

had problems of a counterinsurgency.

Allan Nairn: [translated] Like in Vietnam?


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Mayor Otto Prez Molina: [translated] In Vietnam, for example, the helicopter was

an apparatus that was used a lot.

Allan Nairn: [translated] Can you also use it in combat?

Mayor Otto Prez Molina: [translated] Yes, of course. The helicopters that aremilitary types, they are equipped to support operations in the field. They have

machine guns and rocket launchers.

Allan Nairn: [translated] What type of mortars are you guys using?

Mayor Otto Prez Molina: [translated] Theres various types of mortars. We have

small mortars and the mortars Tampella.

Allan Nairn: Tampella.

Mayor Otto Prez Molina: [translated] Yes, its a mortar thats 60 millimeters.

Allan Nairn: [translated] Is it very powerful? Does it have a lot of force to destroy

things?

Mayor Otto Prez Molina: [translated] Yes, its a weapon thats very effective. Its

very useful, and it has a very good result in our operation in defense of the country.

Allan Nairn: [translated] Is it against a person or...?

Mayor Otto Prez Molina: [translated] Yes, its an anti-personnel weapon.

Allan Nairn: [translated] Do you have one here?

Mayor Otto Prez Molina: [translated] Its light and easy to transport, as well.

Allan Nairn: [translated] So, its very light, and you can use it with your hand.

Mayor Otto Prez Molina: [translated] Exactly, with the hand.

Allan Nairn: [translated] Where did you get them?

Mayor Otto Prez Molina:[translated] These, we got from Israel.

Allan Nairn: [translated] And where do you get the ammunition?

Mayor Otto Prez Molina: [translated] Thats also from Israel.

Amy Goodman: So, this is, again, the current president, Prez Molina, of Guatemala,

the general you met in the highlands in 1982, asking for more aid. Talk about the

relationship between Guatemala then and the United States.

Allan Nairn: Well, the U.S. was the sponsor of the Guatemalan army, as it had been

for many decades, as the U.S. has and continues to sponsor dozens and dozens ofrepressive armies all over the world. In the case of Guatemala, if you go into the


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military academy and you see the pictures of the past presidents of military academy,

some of them are actually Americans. Theyre actual American officers there who

were openly running the Guatemalan military training. By the 80s, when the Ros

Montt massacres were being carried out, the U.S. Congress was under the impression

that they had successfully stopped U.S. military aid to Guatemala. But in fact it wascontinuing. The CIA had an extensive program of backing the G-2, the G-2, the

military intelligence service, which selected the targets for assassination and

disappearance. They eventhey even built a headquarters fora secret headquarters

for the G-2 near the Guatemala City airport. They had American advisers working

inside the headquarters. Out in the field, Guatemalan troops were receiving from the

U.S. ammunition, weapons.

And most importantly, the U.S., beginning under the Carter administration but

continuing under Reagan and after, asked the Israelis to come in and fill the gap that

was caused by congressional restrictions. So Israel was doing massive shipments ofGalil automatic rifles and other weapons. And Prez Molina, as you saw in the video,

actually had one of his subordinates come over and show me an Israeli-made mortar.

That mortar and the helicopters he was asking for from the U.S., those were the kind

of weapons they would use to bomb villages and attack people as they were fleeing in

the mountains. In listening to the testimony in the trial up to this moment, I was struck

by the fact that almost every witness mentioned that they had been attacked from the

air, that either their village had been bombed or strafed or that they were bombed or

strafed as they were fleeing in the mountains. This testimony suggests that the use of

this U.S. and Israeli aircraft and U.S. munitions against the civilians in the Ixil

highlands was actually much more extensive than we understood at the time.

Beyond that, beyond the material U.S. support, theres the question of doctrine.

Yesterday in the trial, the Ros Montt defense called forward a general, a former

commander of the G-2, as an expert witness on the defense side. And at the end of his

testimony, the prosecution read to this general an excerpt from a Guatemalan military

training document. And the document said it is often difficult for soldiers to accept

the fact that they may be required to execute repressive actions against civilian

women, children and sick people, but with proper training, they can be made to do so.

So, the prosecutor asked the Ros Montt general, "Well, General, what is yourresponse to this document?" And the general responded by saying, "Well, that training

document which we use is an almost literal translation of a U.S. training document."

So this doctrine of killing civilians, even down to women, children and sick people,

was, as the general testified, adopted from the U.S. Indeed, years before, the U.S.

military attach in Guatemala, Colonel John Webber, had said to Time magazine that

the Guatemalan army was licensed to kill guerrillas and potential guerrillas. And, of

course, the category of potential guerrillas can include anyone, including children.

And the point of guerrilla civilians is actually very important to understanding this.

Those bodies that Prez Molina was standing over in Nebaj in 1982 in the film wesaw, those were actually an exception to the rule, because the truth commission which


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investigated the massacres in Guatemala found that 93 percent of the victims were

civilians killed by the Guatemalan army. But there was also some combat going on

between the army and guerrillas. And in that case, in the video we saw, the bodies

Prez Molina was standing over were guerrillas, guerrillas that the army had captured.

And one of them in captivity had set off a hand grenade as a suicide act, butapparently, from what I saw and what the soldiers told me, apparently they survived

the blast, and they were then turned over to Prez Molina for interrogation. He

interrogated them, and then, as we saw, they turned up dead. But in the vast majority

of cases, they were civilians, completely unarmed people, who were targeted by Ros

Montts army for elimination.

And I asked Ros Montt about this practice on two different occasions, first in an

interview with him two months after he seized power in 1982, and then later, years

later, after he had been thrown out of power. And when I asked him in 82 about the

fact that so many civilians were being killed by the army, he said, "Look, for each onewho is shooting, there are 10 who are standing behind him," meaning: Behind the

guerrillas there are vast numbers of civilians. His senior aide and his spokesman, a

man named Francisco Bianchi, who was sitting next to him at this interview, then

expanded on the point. Bianchi said the guerrillaswell, the indigenous population

he called them "indios," which is a slur in Guatemalan Spanish

Amy Goodman: For Indians.

Allan Nairn: Yeswere collaborating with the guerrilla, therefore it was necessary

to kill Indians. "And people would say," Bianchi continued, "'Oh, you're massacringall these innocent Indians""innocent Indios," in his words. But Bianchi then said,

"But, no, they are not innocent, because they had sold out to subversion." So this is

thethis is the doctrine of killing civilians, and particularly Mayans, because the

army saw them collectively as a group. They didnt view them as individuals, but they

saw them collectively as a group as sold out to subversion. And this was a doctrine

that the U.S. supported.

Amy Goodman: Journalist Allan Nairn. The interview we did was recorded last week

just before he left for Guatemala to testify in the trial against the Guatemalan dictator

Efran Ros Montt. But at the last minute, his testimony was canceled late yesterday.The trial was canceled. Well continue with the interview in a minute.

Amy Goodman: The War and Peace Report, as we continue our coverage of the

historic trial of former U.S.-backed Guatemalan dictator Efran Ros Montt on charges

of genocide and crimes against humanity. Allan Nairn joined us in our studio last

week before he flew to Guatemala. His testimony was canceled. The trial was

canceled last night. But I asked Allan to talk about how he managed to interview the

Guatemalan dictator, Ros Montt, two months after he seized power in the 1980s.

Allan Nairn: Well, he washe was giving press interviews. This was an interview inthe palace. I was there with a couple of other reporters. Ros Montt was very


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outspoken. He would go on TV and say, "Today we are going to begin a merciless

struggle. We are going to kill, but we are going to kill legally." That was his style, to

speak directly. And its in great contrast to what hes doing today. I mean, its very

interesting from point of view of people whove survived these kind of generals who

live on the blood of the people, not just in Guatemala but in Salvador, in East Timor,in Indonesia, in countless countries where the U.S. has backed this kind of terror. You

have the spectacle now of this general, who once made poor people tremble at the

sight of him, at the mention of him, now hes hiding. In the trial, he refuses to talk. He

will not defend himself. Hes like a common thug taken off the streets who invokes

his Fifth Amendmentinvokes his Fifth Amendment rights. But back then, when he

had the power, when no one could challenge him, he would speak fairly openly. In

fact, the second time I spoke to him, a number of years after, I asked Ros Montt

whether he thought that he should be executed, whether he should be tried and

executed because of his own responsibility for the highland massacres, and he

responded by jumping to his feet and shouting, "Yes! Put me on trial. Put me against

the wall. But if youre going to put me on trial, you have to try the Americans first,

including Ronald Reagan."

Amy Goodman: Allan Nairn, at the time in Guatemala, you not only were

interviewing, well, now the current president, Prez Molina, who was in the highlands

at the time standing over dead bodies, but you were also talking to U.S. officials, and I

want to go to this issue of U.S. involvement in what happened in Guatemala. Tell us

about U.S. Deputy Assistant Secretary for Inter-American Affairs Stephen Bosworth,

a man you got to interview at the time during the Ros Montt years.

Allan Nairn: Well, Bosworth was, at the time, an important player in U.S. Central

American policy. And he, along with Elliott Abrams, for example, attacked Amnesty

International when Amnesty was trying to report on the assassinations of labor leaders

and priests and peasant organizers and activists in the Mayan highlands. And he also

was denying that the U.S. was giving military assistance to the Guatemalan army that

was carrying out those crimes.

Amy Goodman: Lets turn to the interview you did with then U.S. Deputy Assistant

Secretary for Inter-American Affairs Stephen Bosworth.

Stephen Bosworth: Well, I think the important factor is that there has been, over the

last six months, evidence of significant improvement in the human rights situation in

Guatemala. Since the coming into power of the Ros Montt government, the level of

violence in the country, politically inspired violence, particularly in the urban areas,

has declined rather dramatically. That being said, however, I think its important also

to note that the level of violence in the countryside continues at a level which is of

concern to all. And while it is difficult, if not impossible, to attribute responsibility for

that violence in each instance, it is clear that in the countryside the government does

indeed need to make further progress in terms of improving its control overgovernment troops.


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Amy Goodman: You also, Allan Nairn, asked the then-U.S. Deputy Assistant

Secretary for Inter-American Affairs Stephen Bosworth precisely what was the U.S.

military presence and role in Guatemala. This is how Bosworth responded.

Stephen Bosworth: We have no military presence or role. We have, as a part of our

diplomatic establishment, a defense attach office and a military representative. But

that is the same sort of representation that we have in virtually all other countries in

the world. We do not have American trainers working with the Guatemalan army. We

do not have American military personnel active in Guatemala in thatin that sort of

area.

Amy Goodman: There are no American trainers there?

Stephen Bosworth:No.

Allan Nairn: None performing the types of functions that go on in El Salvador, forinstance?

Stephen Bosworth:No, there are not.

Amy Goodman: That was then-U.S. Deputy Assistant Secretary for Inter-American

Affairs Stephen Bosworth. Respond to what he said, and tell us who he later became,

who he is today in the U.S. government.

Allan Nairn: Well, first, just about everything that Bosworth said there was a lie. He

said that the killings were down. In fact, they increased dramatically under Ros

Montt. He said, quite interestingly, that it was impossible to know and attribute

responsibility for what was happening. Well, the Conference of Catholic Bishops had

no difficulty knowing and attributing responsibility. They said that the killings have

reached the extreme of genocide. They were saying this at the moment that the

massacres were happening and at the moment that Bosworth was denying it. And they

and the survivors and the human rights groups were all clearly blaming it on the army.

And then, finally, he said that the army has to be careful to maintain control over its

troops. Well, there was a very strict control. In fact, the officers in the field in the Ixil

zone that I interviewed at the time said they were on a very short leash and that there

were only three layers of command between themselves in the field and Ros Montt.

And, in fact, a few weeks earlier, there had been only two layers of command between

themselves and Ros Montt.

Then, Bosworth went on to say that the U.S. was not giving any military assistance to

Guatemala, but I guess it was a couple weeks after that interview when we went down

to Guatemala, I met a U.S. Green Beret, Captain Jesse Garcia, who was training the

Guatemalan military in combat techniques, including what he called howin his

words, "how to destroy towns." This was apart from the weapons and U.S. munitions

that I mentioned before, apart from the CIA trainers who were working in the CIA-


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built headquarters of the G-2, the military intelligence service that was doing the

assassinations and disappearances.

Amy Goodman: The G-2 being the Guatemalan G-2. Now, today Stephen Bosworth

is the dean of the Fletcher School at Tufts University. But before that, in 2009, well,

he played a key role in the Obama administration.

Allan Nairn: Yes, rather than beingyou know, in what you might consider to be a

normally functioning political system, if a high government official lied like that

about matters of such grave, life-and-death importance and was involved in the supply

of arms to terrorists, in this case the Guatemalan military, you would expect him at

the minimum to be fired and disgraced, or maybe brought up on charges. But

Bosworth was actually promoted. And under the Obama administration, Hillary

Clinton chose him as the special envoy to North Korea. Hes been in the news a great

deal in recent times because of his very prominent role there.

Amy Goodman: In 1995, Allan Nairn was interviewed on Charlie Rose about his

piece in The Nation called "CIA Death Squad," in which he described how Americans

were directly involved in killings by the Guatemalan army. He was interviewed

alongside Elliott Abrams, who challenged what he was saying. Abrams had served as

assistant secretary of state for human rights and humanitarian affairs under President

Reagan from 1981 to 1985. This clip begins with Elliott Abrams.

Elliott Abrams: Wait a minute. Were not here to refight the Cold War. Were here

to talk about, I thought, a specific case in which an allegation is being made thatof

the husband of an American and, another case, an American citizen were killed, and

there was a CIA connection withallegedly with the person allegedly involved in it.

Now, Im happy to talk about that kind of thing. If Mr. Nairn thinks we should have

been on the other side in Guatemalathat is, we should have been in favor of a

guerrilla victoryI disagree with him.

Allan Nairn: So youre then admitting that you were on the side of the Guatemalan

military.

Elliott Abrams: I am admitting that it was the policy of the United States, under

Democrats and Republicans, approved by Congress repeatedly, to oppose a

communist guerrilla victory anywhere in Central America, including in Guatemala.

Charlie Rose: Alright, well, I

Allan Nairn: A communist guerrilla victory.

Charlie Rose: Yeah, I

Allan Nairn: Ninety-five percent of these victims are civilianspeasant organizers,

human rights leaders

Charlie Rose: I am happy to invite both of you


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Allan Nairn: priestsassassinated by the U.S.-backed Guatemalan army. Lets

look at reality here. In reality, were not talking about two murders, one colonel.

Were talking about more than 100,000 murders, an entire army, many of its top

officers employees of the U.S. government. Were talking about crimes, and were

also talking about criminals, not just people like the Guatemalan colonels, but also theU.S. agents who have been working with them and the higher-level U.S. officials. I

mean, I think you have to beyou have to apply uniform standards. President Bush

once talked about putting Saddam Hussein on trial for crimes against humanity,

Nuremberg-style tribunal. I think thats a good idea. But if youre serious, you have to

be even-handed. If we look at a case like this, I think we have to talkstart talking

about putting Guatemalan and U.S. officials on trial. I think someone like Mr. Abrams

would be a fita subject for such a Nuremberg-style inquiry. But I agree with Mr.

Abrams that Democrats would have to be in the dock with him. The Congress has

been in on this. The Congress approved the sale of 16,000 M-16s to Guatemala. In 87

and 88

Charlie Rose: Alright, but hold on one second. I justbeforebecause the

Allan Nairn: They voted more military aid than the Republicans asked for.

Charlie Rose: Again, I invite you and Elliott Abrams back to discuss what he did.

But right now, you

Elliott Abrams:No, thanks, Charlie, but I wont accept

Charlie Rose: Hold on one second. Go ahead. You want to repeat the question, ofyou want to be in the dock?

Elliott Abrams: It is ludicrous. It is ludicrous to respond to that kind of stupidity.

This guy thinks we were on the wrong side in the Cold War. Maybe he personally was

on the wrong side. I am one of the many millions of Americans who thinks we were

happy to win.

Charlie Rose: Alright, I dont

Allan Nairn: Mr. Abrams, you were on the wrong side in supporting the massacre of

peasants and organizers, anyone who dared to speak, absolutely.

Charlie Rose: What I want to do is I want to ask the following question.

Allan Nairn: And thats a crime. Thats a crime, Mr. Abrams, for which people

should be tried. U.S. laws

Elliott Abrams: Why dont youyes, right, well put all the American officials who

won the Cold War in the dock.

Amy Goodman: That was Elliott Abramshe served as assistant secretary of statefor human rights and humanitarian affairs under President Reagan from 81 to 85


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debating investigative journalist Allan Nairn on the Charlie Rose show. Actually,

Congress member Robert Torricelli, then from New Jersey, before he became senator,

was also in that discussion at another point. Allan, the significance of what Mr.

Abrams was saying? He went on, Abrams, to deal with the Middle East.

Allan Nairn: Yes. Well, hewhen I said that he should be tried by a Nuremberg-

style tribunal, he basically reacted by saying I was crazy, that this was a crazy idea

that you could try U.S. officials for supplying weapons to armies that kill civilians.

But people also thought that it was crazy that Ros Montt could face justice in

Guatemala. But after decades of work by the survivors of his Mayan highland

massacres, today, as we speak, Ros Montt is sitting in the dock.

Amy Goodman: Award-winning journalist Allan Nairn, speaking last week before he

flew to Guatemala. On Thursday, a landmark genocide trial against former

Guatemalan dictator Ros Montt was suspended after the trial threatened to implicate

the current president of Guatemala in the mass killings of civilians. Allan reports

Guatemalan army associates had threatened the lives of case judges and prosecutors

and that the case had been annulled after intervention by Guatemalas president,

General Otto Prez Molina. Some of the video footage used in the show comes from a

1983 documentary directed by Mikael Wahlforss. Well link to it at

democracynow.org and to Allan Nairns website, allannairn.org.

http://www.democracynow.org/

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A Crossing in the Cuchumatanes

Allan Nairn

Monday, April 22, 2013

Whatever happens in Guatemala, one of history's rivers has been forded.

In this case it was by people wearing huipiles and being pursued by US aircraft,

slogging on as their loved ones fell and reaching the opposite shore by daybreak.

By mounting a domestic criminal trial for genocide against a former state ruler they

crossed the threshold into what is arguably a next phase of the human journey up from

slaughter -- one marked by actual good-faith efforts to enforce society's murder laws.

Those who have accomplished this are descendants of a long, rich popular tradition, a

tradition whose leaders in Guatemala were almost all -- to a man and woman --

assassinated.

But as any smart repressor can tell you, you can kill most but you can't kill all.


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General Perez Molina is Tito

Allan Nairn


General Otto Perez Molina, the President of Guatemala, surprised many yesterday by

finally admitting verbally that he is in fact Major Tito, who I met and interviewed on

film in 1982.

It was an application of the politician's tactic of getting out in front of a damaging

story to frame it in their own way, in this case trying to move focus from the fact that

he was field commander during the Rios Montt massacres to the minor, innocuous

fact that while doing so he used a pseudonym to, he said, protect his family.

Protecting one's family is admirable but it was unfortunately not an option for the

many thousands of defenseless civilians massacred by Rios Montt's -- and Perez

Molina's -- army.
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On the Margins of the Law -- But Inside the Palace

Allan Nairn


Is it possible for the Rios Montt trial to be revived?

"Here it is possible for a burro to fly." It all depends on the pressure/ politics.

That is the view of a senior official who prefers to speak off the record given what he

describes as the delicacy of the situation.

If the almost-concluded genocide trial is not permitted to reach a verdict "It willdemonstrate that the army and the powerful don't have to account to anyone" and that

there exists "a group that lives on the margins of the law but is still able to take the big

decisions for the country."

On the margins of the law -- but inside the palace.

Killing-off the case, he says, would recall the adage attributed to the Mexican dictator

Porfirio Diaz: "'To my friends, what they desire. To my enemies, the law.'"

He adds that such a move by the rulers would say to Guatemala's majority "that no

institution will listen to them, that they are not citizens, that the constitution is not for

them, that the law will never serve them."

It would indeed be such for Guatemala.

But that is also what is being said daily in every country around the world where local

and foreign officials complict in mass killing have yet to be arrested and tried.


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Guatemala: The decisive moment has arrived

Allan Nairn

Thursday, May 9, 2013

The next 12 to 36 hours will be crucial for the Rios Montt genocide trial.

The trial was suspended on April 18after intervention by Guatemala's President and

death threats by army associates against judges and prosecutors.But the backlash against the suspension was intense and the army appears to have

retreated.

At this moment, the trial is again going forward. Closing statements have begun.

Unless the trial is stopped by violence or politics it could reach verdict soon, even

today.

But the hours between now and verdict-time will be long. Many bad things could

happen.

If anyone wants to weigh in against murder, the time to do so is now.
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The Guatemala Genocide Case: Testimony Notes Regarding Rios

Montt

Allan Nairn

Thursday, May 9, 2013

The case against General Rios Montt has included vast amounts of evidence.

My notes for my own scheduled testimony (for what happened seepost of April 18)

included the following observations:

When Rios Montt seized power on March 23, 1982, he immediately seized control of

and transformed army operations.

He cut back on the urban assassinations, which had become counterproductive, and

increased the massacres of the rural Mayans, the army's main "internal enemy."

He took a sweep tactic that had been pioneered by General Benedicto Lucas Garcia

and made it a systematic strategy, applied across the Northwest Highlands.

A CIA report observed of Benedicto's -- later Rios Montt's -- method: "In mid-

February 1982 the Guatemalan army reinforced its existing force in the central El

Quiche department and launched a sweep operation into the Ixil triangle. The

commanding officers of the units involved have been instructed to destroy all towns

and villages which are cooperating with the Guerrilla Army of the Poor (EGP) and

eliminate all sources of resistance. Civilians in the area who agree to collaborate with

the army and who seek army protection are to be well treated and cared for in refugee

camps for the duratiion of the operation."

In practice, the civilians in the camps were often survivors of army massacres who

were subject to vast coercion including execution, torture, rape, forced labor, and

forced service in the "civil patrols."
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Colonel George Maynes, the US military attache in Guatemala, told me that he and

Benedicto Lucas had developed this sweep tactic and that Rios Montt had expanded

it.

A US Green Beret, Captain Jesse Garcia showed me how, under Rios Montt, he was

training Guatemalan troops in the techniques of how to "destroy towns." (Allan Nairn,

"Despite Ban, U.S. Captain Trains Guatemalan Military," Washington Post, October

21, 1982, page 1).

The Guatemalan Catholic Bishops Conference reported in a May 27, 1982 pastoral

letter: "Numerous families have perished, vilely murdered. Not even the lives of the

elderly, pregnant women or innocent children have been respected ... Never in ourhistory has it come to such grave extremes. These assassinations fall into the category

of genocide."

In an interview in the palace that May I asked Rios Montt about killing civilians. He

said: "Look, the problem of the war is not just a question of who is shooting. For

each one who is shooting there are ten who are working behind him."

Rios Montt's senior aide and spokesman, Francisco Bianchi, who was sitting next to

him, amplified: "The guerrillas won over many Indian collaborators. Therefore, the

Indians were subversives, right? And how do you fight subversion? Clearly you had

to kill Indians because they were collaborating with subversion. And then they would

say, 'You're massacring innocent people.' But they weren't innocent. They had sold

out to subversion." (Allan Nairn, "Guatemala Can't Take 2 Roads," The New York

Times, op ed, July 20, 1982).

I visited the Ixil zone in September, 1982, arriving first in Nebaj. The towns and

much of the Ixil area were under army occupation.

A foreign health worker said 80% of the people were malnourished. Many were

dying of hunger, measles, and tuberculosis.

Rios Montt's senior commander on scene was a man who called himself Major Tito

Arias, but who was actually Otto Perez Molina, the current president of Guatemala.


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Subordinates of Rios Montt and Perez Molina described how they tortured and killed

civilians. The soldiers and officers described a strategy that centered on emptying and

massacring entire villages.

They said they would kill a quarter to a third of the people, place a quarter to a third

of them in camps, and the rest would flee to the mountains where, if the army found

them, they would shoot them on sight.

The soldiers said they were still in the midst of intensive sweep operations.

They also said they were under a strict chain of command that placed only three

layers of responsibility between themselves and Rios Montt. In the words ofLieutenant Romeo Sierra at La Perla they were "on a very short leash."

A number of soldiers named specific towns and villages in which they had committed

massacres.

One, a corporal named Felipe, in Nebaj, listed Salquil, Sumal Chiquito, Sumal Grande

and Acul.

His account was consistent with that of a man from Acul who spoke in secret and

described an April massacre in which he said the army shot 24 civilians. He said the

soldiers shot them in the head after sorting villagers into two groups, one of which the

soldiers said they would "send to Glory" and the other "to Hell." He said: "They said

that they were executing the law of Rios Montt."

The descriptions of the massacre strategy from soldiers and civilian survivors were

consistent. They also meshed with accounts that I heard elsewhere in the Mayan

zones.

(Much of the following text is drawn from Allan Nairn, "The Guns of Guatemala: The

merciless mission of Rios Montt's army," The New Republic, April 11, 1983, and

from my work in the 1983 documentary film "Skoop!" also known as "Deadline

Guatemala" and "Titular de Hoy," done with Jean-Marie Simon and directed

by Mikael Wahlforss, EPIDEM Scandinavian TV):
http://primavera-tirania.com/Deadline_Guatemala.phphttp://primavera-tirania.com/Deadline_Guatemala.phphttp://primavera-tirania.com/Deadline_Guatemala.phphttp://primavera-tirania.com/Deadline_Guatemala.phphttp://primavera-tirania.com/Deadline_Guatemala.php


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Just outside Nebaj, more than 2,500 campesinos had been resettled on an army

airstrip. "They didn't want to leave voluntarily," explained Corporal Felipe, who

manned a .50 caliber machine gun in the Nebaj church belfry. "The government put

out a call that they would have one month to turn themselves in," he said, referring to

a nationwide order from Rios Montt. "So now the army is in charge of going to get

all the people from all these villages."

Sergeant Miguel Raimundo, who was guarding a group of 161 suspected guerrilla

collaborators (which included 79 children and 42 women), said, "The problem is that

almost all the village people are guerrillas." According to camp records, they had been

rounded up in sweeps through the villages of Vijolom, Salquil Grande, Tjolom,

Parramos Chiquito, Paob, Vixaj, Quejchip, and Xepium.

Sergeant Jose Angel, who commanded a La Perla platoon explained:"Before we get to

the village, we talk with the soldiers about what they should do and what they

shouldn't do. They all discuss it so they have it in their minds. We coordinate it first

we ask, what is our mission?"

Lieutenant Sierra had noted that the sweep commanders had hourly radio contact with

headquarters. He said the superior officer "knows everything. Everything is

controlled." All field actions had to be reported in the commanders' daily "diary of

operations" which was reviewed and criticized in monthly face-to-face evaluations.

Sergeant Jose Angel explained the village-entry procedure: "One patrol enters the

village from one point, on another side another patrols enters. We go in before dawn,

because everyone is sleeping. If we come in broad daylight they get scared, they see

it's the army, and they run because they know the army is coming to get them,"

Rios Montt's army had a clear policy about the meaning and consequences of such

behavior. "The people who are doing things outside the law run away," sergeant Jose

Angel said. "But the people who aren't doing anything, they stay." He said he had

seen cases where "lots of them ran, most of a village. They ran because they knew the

army was coming."

Sergeant Miguel Raimundo cited three cases where villages fled en masse. "All the

villages around here, like Salquil, Palob, or here in Sumal, they have a horn and


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there's a villager who watches the road. If the soldiers come, he blows the horn. It's a

signal. They all go running."

The soldiers explained that they routinely killed these fleeing, unarmed civilians.

I asked Corporal Felipe how the villagers react when the troops arrive.

"They flee from their homes. They run for the mountain."

"And what do you do?"

"Some we capture alive and others we can't capture alive. When they run and go intothe mountains that obligates one to kill them."

"Why?"

"Because they might be guerrillas. If they don't run, the army is not going to kill them.

It will protect them."

"Among those you have to kill, what kind of people are they? Are they men or

women?"

"At times men, at times women."

"In which villages has this happened?"

"Oh, it's happened in lots of them. In Acul, Salquil, Sumal Chiquito, Sumal Grande."

"In those villages, about how many people did you kill?"

"Not many, a few."

"More than ten? More than twenty? More than a hundred?"

"Oh no, about twenty."


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"In each village?"

"Yes, of course. It's not many. More than that were captured alive."

Sergeant Jose Angel recalled a similar experience in the village of Chumansan in the

province of Quezaltenango. "When we went in, the people scattered," he said. "We

had no choice but to shoot at them. We killed some. . . . Oh, about ten, no more. Most

of them got away."

After tracking and shooting the unarmed civilians who fled in fear, the army dealt

with the unarmed civilians who remained in the village.

First, Sergeant Jose Angel explained, "We go into a village and take the people out of

their houses and search the houses."

Among the items the soldiers looked for were suspiciously large stocks of grain or

beans. The army took what it could use and burned the rest.

Next, he said, "You ask informers who are the ones that are doing things, things

outside the law. And that's when you round up the collaborators. And the

collaboratorsyou question them, interrogate them, get them to speak the truth. Who

have they been talking to? Who are the ones who have been coming to the village to

speak with them?"

The soldiers often went in with target lists of "collaborators." The lists were provided

by G-2, the military intelligence service headed at that time by General Rios Montt's

co-defendant, General Mauricio Rodriguez Sanchez.

The interrogations were generally conducted in the village square with the population

looking on.

I asked Jose Angel how he questioned people. He replied, "Beat them to make them

tell the truth, hurt them."

"With what methods?"


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"This one, like this," he said as he wrapped his hands around his neck and made a

choking sound. "More or less hanging them."

"With what?"

"With a lasso. Each soldier has his lasso."

The day before, in Nebaj, an infantryman who was standing over the bodies of four

captured guerrillas demonstrated the interrogation technique he had learned in

"Cobra," an army counterinsurgency course for field troops. [Another soldier said the

guerrillas, who had set off a grenade, had been "presented" to Perez Molina for

interrogation, "But they still didn't say anything, for better or for worse."]

"Tie them like this," he said, "tie the hands behind, run the cord here [around the

neck] and press with a boot [on the chest]. Knot it, and make a tourniquet with a stick,

and when they're dying you give it another twist and you ask them again, and if they

still don't want to answer you do it again until they talk."

The sergeants and infantrymen of Nebaj and La Perla said the tourniquet was the most

common interrogation technique. They said that live burial and mutilation by

machete were also used.

The soldiers said they expected those they questioned to provide specific information,

such as the names of villagers who had talked with or given food to guerrillas. Failure

to do so implied guilt, and brought immediate judgment and action.

"Almost everyone in the villages is a collaborator," said Sergeant Miguel Raimundo.

"They don't say anything. They would rather die than talk"

When I asked Miguel Raimundo about the interrogation method, he replied: "We say,

if you tell us where the guerrillas are, the army won't kill you. . . . If they collaborate

with the army, we don't do anything."

"And if they don't say anything?"


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"Well, then they say, 'if you kill me, kill mebecause I don't know anything,' and we

know they're guerrillas. They prefer to die rather than say where the companeros

are."

According to Sergeant Jose Angel, it was common for suspected collaborators to be

pointed out, questioned, and executed all on the same day.

Explaining how he extracted information so quickly, he said, "Well, they don't talk

like that voluntarily. You just have to subdue them a little to make them speak the

truth."

After the interrogations had been completed, the patrol leader would make a speech tothe survivors gathered in the village square.

"We tell the people to change the road they are on, because the road they are on is

bad," said Jose Angel. "If they don't change, there is nothing else to do but kill them."

"So you kill them on the spot?"

"Yes, sure. If they don't want the good, there's nothing more to do but bomb their

houses."

Jose Angel said that in Solola and Quezaltenengo he had participated in operations of

this kind in which more than 500 people were killed

He and other soldiers said that smaller villages were destroyed with Spanish, Israeli,

and U.S.-made grenades. Boxes of these grenades could be seen stacked in the Nebaj

ammunition dump.

The soldiers said they also used a 3.5-inch U.S.- made shoulder-held recoilless rocket

that was designed as an antitank weapon but is effective against people and straw

huts. At the La Perla headquarters, one such launcher was sitting next to boxes of

"explosive projectile" rockets from the Iowa Army Ammunition Plant.

F'or larger operations, Jose Angel said, patrols called in army planes and helicopters

to bomb the villages. The helicopters were U.S.-manufactured Hueys and Jet


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Rangers. The bombs included U.S.-made 50-kilogram Ml/61As, twelve of which

were stacked in the base munitions dump in Nebaj.

Lieutenant Cesar Bonilla, the officer in charge of the Nebaj airstrip resettlement camp

said the helicopters were especially useful for catching villagers by surprise.

"When you go in on foot they see the patrol three kilometers away and know you're

coming. But with air transport, you land different units in the area, all the units close

in rapidly, and the people can't go running away."

Bonilla said that this type of operation could only be executed by several helicopters

at once. "With just one helicopter you scare them away and there's no control."

The United States Congress' temporary refusal to sell spare parts had grounded much

of the fleet, so Lieutenant Bonilla was encouraged by reports that the Reagan

Administration was considering changing the policy.

"That would be wonderful," he said. "With six helicopters, for example, the airborne

troops would land all at once before they could make a move. The nicest, the ideal,

the dream, would be a surprise: suddenly, pow! Helicopters with troops!" As he

spoke, he made machine-gun noises and waved his Israeli Galil rifle toward the

refugee shacks. "Ta, ta, ta, ta, ta! All at once from the air! Pow! No escape routes.

That would be ideal."

The day before this conversation, a family in Bonilla's camp -- interviewed in their

shack outside the view of soldiers -- described such an assault on their village. "Two

times they came there in helicopters," said one of the men. "They would come in and

land and the people would retire and they would always kill a few. They flew over,

machine-gunning people from the helicopter." The family said that five were killed in

the strafing.

After the torture, the executions, and the burning, strafing and bombing, the next stage

of the sweep was to chase the fleeing people through the hills.

"Up here there aren't any villages anymore," said Sergeant Jose Angel, speaking of

the patrol areas around La Perla. "There used to be, but then the soldiers came. We


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knew that such and such a village was involved, so we went to get them. We captured

some and the rest of the people from the village ran away. They're hiding in the

mountains. Now we're going to the mountains to look for them."

Major Tito -- Otto Perez Molina -- the commander of the Nebaj base, said in mid-

September that 2,000 people from the area of Sumal Grande had fled to the mountains

and would be pursued by foot patrols and helicopters.

Sergeant Jose Angel said his platoon went on such operations frequently. I asked Jose

Angel what his troops did when they found refugees.

"At times we don't find them. We see them but they get away."

"But when you do find them, what do you do?"

"Oh, we kill them."

"Are they a few people or entire villages?"

"No, entire villages. When we entered the villages we killed some and the rest ran

away,"

Under the policy of Rios Montt's army, a civilian found outside the army-controlled

towns could be in mortal danger.

"We know the poor people from close up and far away," said Sergeant Miguel

Raimundo. "If we see someone walking in the mountains, that means he is a

subversive. So we try to grab him and ask where he's going; we arrest him. And then

we see if he is a guerrilla or not. But those who always walk in the mountains, we

know they are guerrillas. Maybe some of them will be children, but we know that they

are subversive delinquents. I've been walking in the mountains for a year now, and

just in the mountains, one by one, we've captured more than 500 people."

Sergeant Miguel Raimundo also explained that under the army's assumptions a

civilian could also be in danger if they never went anywhere: "A woman told me

yesterday that the soldiers kill people, that the soldiers killed her husband. But I told


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her that if the soldiers killed her husband it was because he was a guerrilla. The

soldier knows whom to kill. He doesn't kill the innocent, just the guilty. And she said,

'No, my husband wasn't doing anything.' So I said, 'And how do you know it was

nothing? How do you know what he was doing outside?' 'No,' she said, 'because he

never went anywhere,' 'Yes,' I said, 'That's because he was a collaborator,' "

It was clear from discussions with these soldiers inside the Ixil zone that, under their

orders from Rios Montt and their commanders, including Perez Molina, all civilians

were potential targets. Indeed, they were the principal targets.

Lieutenant Romeo Sierra, who directed the sweeps through his patrol area of 20

square kilometers and 10,000 people, told me that thousands of civilians weredisplaced but that "in the time I've been here [two-and-a-half months] no subversives

have fallen. Lots of unarmed people, women refugees, but we haven't had actual

combat with guerrillas."

Lieutenant Sierra also said that "human rights" was an "enemy concept." In his army

training he had been taught that it had been developed "by international

Communism."

Years after he had been ousted from power, I interviewed Rios Montt again. I asked

Rios Montt -- a firm believer in the death penalty -- if he thought that he should be

tried and executed for his role in the Mayan massacres.

The general leapt to his feet and shouted: "Yes! Try me! Put me against the wall!,"

but he said he should be tried only if Americans were put on trial too. (See Allan

Nairn, "C.I.A. Death Squad: Americans have been directly involved in Guatemalan

Army killings," The Nation, April 17, 1995.)

Specifically, Rios Montt cited President Reagan, who, in the midst of the killings, had

said that Rios Montt was getting "a bum rap" on human rights.

Rios Montt, for his part, had said: "It's not that we have a policy of scorched earth,

just a policy of scorched communists."


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A Formal Legal Mandate for a Criminal Investigation of

Guatemala's Current President, Perez Molina

Allan Nairn

Saturday 11 May 2013

General Efrain Rios Montt has been found guilty of genocide and crimes against

humanity. He has already begun his "irrevocable" sentence of 80 years in prison.

The court that convicted Rios Montt has also ordered the attorney general to launch an

immediate investigation of "all others" connected to the crimes.

This important and unexpected aspect of the verdict means that there now exists a

formal legal mandate for a criminal investigation of the President of Guatemala,

General Otto Perez Molina.

As President, Perez Molina enjoys temporary legal immunity, but that immunity does

not block the prosecutors from starting their investi

Allan Nairn

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Transcript of Allan Nairn