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“Is there that much difference between Starbucks and the Guggenheim?”

MAneL oLLÉ

AN INT ERvIEW WITH QUIM MONZÓ

Caribe River (Venezuela), Toni Catany (2006)

Do you keep track of the country’s literary novelties?

Notmuch,totellthetruth.IfIhadtokeeptrackofeverythingthatcomesouteachyear,Iwouldn’thaveenoughtime,evenifyearshadathousanddays.

Do you buy more books in bookshops or by the Internet?

IbuyalotinBritishandAmericanvirtualbookshops.

What genres do you read most?

Basicallyfiction,especiallyshortstories.Ireallylikeshortstories.Ialsoreadthepressalot.Toomuch,maybe,butIcan’tkickthehabit.

You’ve always been interested in literature from the United States. What does it bring you and what do you see in it?

Ihaveareactivewayofbeing.Ican’tstandtheherd.Formanyyears,overallthedecadeswhenbeingprogressivewastheorderoftheday,peoplehadanirrationalhatredforanythingcomingoutoftheUnitedStates.Thissortofinanityisnotunusualamongalotofpeoplewho,inprinciple,wouldseemtobeperfectlynormalandinformed.AlltheseclichésgoingroundaboutwhethertheAmericansareverybasic,orinnocent,andthattheydon’thaveanyhistory…Youcanbemoreorlessacceptingofthegovernmentofaparticularcountry,butbelievingthatallthepeopleinthecountryareimbecilesisabarefaceddemonstrationofxenophobia.Nobodywoulddaretosaythisabouttheinhabitantsofanycountryoftheworld,exceptAmericans.

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WiththeAmericans,noholdsarebarredandyoucanholdforthwithasmuchtwaddleasyouwant.IwenttoNewYorkin1982withascholarshiptostudycontemporaryAmericanliterature.Ichosetostudythatliteraturebecause,atthetime,theAmericansweresobad,sodepraved(thosewerethedayswheneveryonewasstillaTrotskyiteoraMaoist)thatpeoplewereclaimingwithtotalimpunitythattheycouldn’tproducegoodliterature.Afewthingswerebeingtranslated,butthepassionwithwhichpeoplewerereadingLatinAmericanliterature,forexample,waslacking.Thesewerethegoodguys:poor,exploitedthird-worldcountries.TheAmericans,however,couldn’tpossiblyproducegoodliteratureiftheywerebadpeople.Butyouonlyhavetoreaditwithoutprejudicetoseethat,naturally,therewassomereallygoodstuffthere.Thisisthekindofcommentthatyoustillfind,eventoday,notonlyatthebarofapub(orthesofainachill-out)butalsoinblogsandopinionpieces.AnythingtheAmericansdocanbeshatuponeventhough,notmanyyearslater,they’redoingthesamethinghere.Nobodyremembersanymorethatthepeoplewhotakeacertainpositionmockedthesamepositionafewyearsearlier,sayingthatsuchathingwouldneverhappenhere.Lookwhat’shappenedwithsmoking.Rememberwhentheyusedtolookonhereandsay,“TheseAmericans!They’vegotrestaurantswheretheywon’tletyousmoke”.

Benzina (Benzine) is, among other things, a European novel about the United States.

NewYorkistheequivalentofwhatParismusthavebeenatthebeginningofthe20thcentury.InNewYork,inthe80s,therewereheapsofartistsfromhalftheplanetandsuchaneffervescenceofartgalleriesthatIthoughtitwouldmaketheidealsettingformynovel.

To what extent does your reading end up influencing your work?

Everywritermakeshisorhergenealogy.Youdoitfromthemomentyoufindwritersthatyoulovereading.TheonesIwasreadingwhenIwasfourteenorfifteenwereJulioCortázarandGarcíaMárquez…GarcíaMárquez’sacaseinpoint.Nowit’sveryfashionabletobadmouthhim,andpeoplewho’veneverreadhimorwho’veonlyreadthecoverblurbsaredoingit.Yet,thirtyyearsago,itwastrendytosinghispraises,eveniftheyhadn’treadhimorifthey’donlyreadthecoverblurbs.ShortlyafterhegottheNobelPrize,moreorless,itdidn’tlookcooltobereadinghim.That’showitgoes…Anyway,asanadolescent,Iwasreadingtheseauthors,andAdolfoBioyCasares,andJuanJoséArreola,andAugustoMonterroso…I’dreadKafkawhenIwasfourteen,inGabrielFerrater’stranslationofThe Trial,andtheversionofThe Metamorphosis thatAlianzaEditorialpublished.IdiscoveredRobertCooverintheearly1980s.Ifellinlovewithhimbecausethekindofstorieshewroteopenedupnewformsofnarration.The Magic Pokerisakeybookofthe20thcentury.IwasalsobowledoverbyDonaldBarthelme,notsomuchtheearlybooksasthelaterones.Amateurs,forexample,Ithinkissplendid.ItranslatedsomeofhisstoriesforEls marges.Itwasalsointhe1980s,butinthelatteryears,thatIdiscoveredGiorgioManganelliinabookthatAnagramapublished,Centuria: 100 Ouroboric Novels.Theyareahundrednovelsofonlyonepage.It’saliterarymiracle.Icangiveyoumoreofmyfavourites:DinoBuzzati,ItaloCalvino,ManuelPuig,SamuelBeckett,RaymondQueneau,BorisVian…Notoneofthesewritersiswithoutanaltar.

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Which of Italo Calvino’s Six Memos for the Next Millennium would you choose?

IfIhadtochooseany,I’dsayquickness,lightnessandexactitude.Aboveallexactitude:toomuchfancyfootworkdoesn’tgetyouanywhere.Fancyfootworkkillsyou.Gettingcaughtupinthefancyfootworkonlyletsyoutalkaboutfancyfootwork,attheverybest.Alotofconvolutionisonlygoodfortalkingaboutconvolutionandthepretensionitmasks,andthat’sall.It’sawayofannouncingthatwhat’sbeingwritteninthatstorymustbedeemed“veryimportant”,anditis“veryimportant”becauseit’sbeenwritteninsuchaconvolutedway.Bringonthetrumpets.

visibility would also seem to be a characteristic of your books. Even though there’s always a lot of play in the narrator’s voice. Do you think your books lend themselves to film adaptations?

Whenyou’regoingtomakeafilmoutofabook,you’vegottoransackitanddragthefilmoutofitinordertoturnitintoimages.Itwon’tworkifyouonlyreproducewhatitliterallysays.IthinkthatDavant el Rei de Suècia (BeforetheKingofSweden)couldwellbemadeintoafilmbut,ifyouwantedtogetitontothescreen,you’dhavetothinkhardabouthowtodoitbecauseitallhappensintheheadofthemaincharacter.Thechallengeisalwaystryingtomakesurethatthefilmisnotjustaslavishadaptationofthenovel,whichiswhatoftenhappens.

Some people have written that both you and some of the writers you admire produce meta-fiction, stories that, even while they’re talking about the world, are also rubbing up against other fictions and projections of the contemporary collective imaginary…

Iwouldn’tknow.Allthistheoryisbeyondme.WhatItrytodoiswritestoriesandthat’sall“Ijustpaintandthat’sit”,isn’tthatwhatsomeoneoncesaid?

Do you theorise about what you do as a writer? Do you know where you’re going to end up when you start writing something?

IfItheorisedIcouldn’twritefiction.IfIknewthemechanismsI’dlosethebeat.Idon’twanttotheorise.Idon’thavethemeansordesireto.IfIwenttoapsychologistandendedupknowingtoomuchaboutmyself,it’dbeterrible.Itrytoknowjustenoughaboutmyselftokeepgoingwithoutheartattacks(atleastforthetimebeing).I’mnotdrivenbyanyneedtoexplainmyselftomyself,ortounderstandmymentalmechanisms.IfIdid,whatwouldItalkabouttheninmystories,inmyarticlesandinmynovels?Iwritetoexplainmyselftomyselfwithoutgettingtoocaughtupinit.

Do you subscribe to the assertion that literature is a merciless way of saying and knowing things that can only be formulated through literature?

Totally.Theambiguityofliterature—whichisonlyaword—there’sNOTHINGtoequalit.

i write to explain myself to myself without getting too caught up in it

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Some people say that there’s not much of that in your literature, that it’s well-crafted and diverting but there’s no real moral or intellectual substance. Others read you as an ingenious, amusing writer, but essentially banal.

Therearesomereaders(orrecipients)whocangetwhat’sevidentandthat’sall:justthefirstlayer.Ithappenswithliterature,journalism,thecinema,televisionandsoon.Ifthisfirstlayerisverysimple,theydecidethewholethingissimple.Buttheycan’tseebeyondthat;theycan’tseelayers,two,three,four,andsoon.Soit’stheirproblem,notthebook’s,orthearticle’s,orthefilm’s…Thesearetypicalbest-sellerreaders.Theyneedthefirstlayer—theobvious,evidentone—tobeloadedwithpretension,withacertainkindofhistoricalresourcefulness,andprêt-à-porter highculture.Thesereadersorreviewerswhogettolayeroneandgonofurthergetabigthrillwhentheyfindallthispackaging(whichreallyisutterlybanal)andtheythinkwhatthey’vegotishaute literature.

If this is the case, wouldn’t it turn out in the end that this cultural conceit of wanting to stuff literature with ideas, data and intellectual weightiness is very close to the basic mechanisms of the best-seller that you’re describing?

Ofcourse!Wecantalkaboutakindofbest-sellerthat’sabitmorepretentious,maybe,andmoreadroit.It’sthekindofbookthatseemstobetellingyoulotsofthings,forexampleaboutChristianityinthe14thcentury.It’srealspoon-fedpapbecausethereaderfindseverythingthereatfacevalueanddoesn’thavetostartasingleneuronebouncingaroundthehead.Therewasatime(inthe60sand70s)whenitwasobligatorytoproduceliteraturethattalkedaboutclassstruggle,thenationalquestion,women’sstruggle,andthelike.Ifthenovelfulfilledalltheserequirements,itwasthoughttobeagreatbook,evenifitwasutterlymediocre.That’sallgonenow—themandarinsarenolongertheMarxistsbutconservativesormythomaniacs—butnewrequisiteshaveappeared.It’salwaysamatterofturningoutnovelsaccordingtoarecipe.

Do you see yourself writing a historical novel?

No,Idon’t.Idon’tknowwhatIseemyselfdoing.Well,doingagreatparodyofahistoricalnovelwouldbereallyfun.Actually,IcanseeRobertCooverdoinga“historicalnovel”,comingatitfromthisstandpointofparody…

What is it about writers that interests people?

Itmakesmesick,thismystificationoftheliterarylife.SoMiquelBauçàdies,andhediesinthewayhedies,andalotofpeoplewhonevertookthetroubletoreadhimwhenhewasalive,suddenlyglorifyhimandturnhimintothe great writer.MiquelBauçàwasatrulygreatwriterwhenhewasstillalive,beforehediedinthewaythathedied.Howhediedhasnothingtodowiththequalityofhisliterature.Butyouhavetobeprettycretinoustogolookinginliteratureforthenimbusthatcloaksthewriterandlittlemorethanthat.Inotherwords,thetubercularwriter,insomeatticinParis,spittingblood…Oh,whatagreatwriterheis!Andifhekillshimself,somuchthebetter.OratleastlethimgetcaughtupinacivilwarinFuentevaquerosandgetputupagainstawallandshotbyafiringsquad.Thereareveryfewpeoplewhoareinterested

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inliteratureper se,withoutalltheideologicalandmythologisingtrappings.Whatpeoplearemainlyinterestedinisallthatstuff:theaurait’swrappedin.

Where would you situate literary fiction vis-à-vis other kinds of fiction?

There’snodoubtanymorethatliteraturehasbeenshuntedofftothefringesoffiction.Itwasreallycleartwentyyearsagoandnowit’sevenmoreso.Televisionisofferingextraordinarilypowerfulworksoffictiontoday.Therewasoneveryimportantpoint(intheearlynineties?)whenDavidLynchdidTwin Peaks.Thatseries(andwhatthataudacitysignified)brokewitheverythingtelevisionhadbeendoinguntilthen.Andthisledtotheappearanceoffiftythousandground-breaking,well-differentiatedmodels.Television’satahighpoint.ItakemyhatofftosomeoftheAmericanseries,fromHouse toThe SopranostoLost.EverydayIseehowmysonisdownloadingfromtheInternetchaptersthey’veshownacoupleofdaysearlierintheUnitedStates.SinceIdon’thavetimetowatchtelevisioneveryday,whatIdoistobuypacksfromtimetotimeandgetrightintoit:fiveseasonsofThe Sopranos intwoweeks.We’retalkingaboutFictionwithacapitalF.Itmakesyoulaughtoseethebuffsstilltellingyouthatthe19thcenturynovelsaretheexamplestofollow.TheBalzacsandStendhalsoftodayarethepeoplewhoareturningoutthisgreatfictionfortelevision,Americanorotherwise.Inliterature,thoseofuswhowritestories(betheylongorshort)areattheperipheryofallthiscentralitythatisn’teveninthehandsofthecinemaanymore.Nowit’stelevision,andtelevision(asweunderstandittoday)won’tbeatthecentreeitherbeforelongbecauseit’llallbedoneontheInternet.Andwewon’tbeabletoseethatthey’retwodifferentthings,andthatwillopenuphithertounsuspectedpaths.Forthemoment,it’sahugepleasuretokeepwriting,allbymyself,atthefringeofallthishullabaloo,withouthavingtoanswertoanythingoranybody.

Do you use resources from audiovisual language to set up or frame your stories?

BeforeIhadacomputer,Ioftenworkedwithaset-upthatconsistedincuttingtheparagraphsofthefirstdraftI’dwrittendirectlyontothepageandthenrelocatingtheminadifferentorder,asifitwasafilmmontage.It’sevidentthatstorytellingbymeansofthewordhaschangedsincethecinemacamealong.Huxley’swayofassemblinganoveland,later,VargasLlosainsomeofhisbooks,happenedbecauseoftheexistenceofthecinema.Andpeoplewhobegantowritehavinggrownupwithtelevisionworkdifferentlyagain.Adsandvideoclipshavetheirinfluence:it’sspeedversusfivehundredpages.Sometimestherearenovelsofsevenhundredpageswhenfivehundredwouldhavebeenplenty.Cuttingisafirst-rateliteraryexercise.WhenI’dwrittenDavant del Rei de Suècia,Idecidedtocutouteverythingthatwasn’tstrictlyessentialanditwentfromahundredandeightypagesdowntoahundred.Thatwasexciting.

Are you planning to write more novels?

Ineverhaveplans.WhatwouldIknowaboutwhatI’mgoingtodotomorrow?I’vewrittenthreenovels—apartfromL’udol del griso al caire de les clavegueres (TheHowloftheCopontheBrinkoftheSewers),whichI’veneverhadrepublished—andtheseareBenzina,La magnitude de la tragèdia (TheMagnitudeoftheTragedy)andDavant del Rei

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de Suècia.NowIwritealotforthepress.Ilikethisbusinessofputtingatwistonabitofnewsandgivingthestructureofastorytoanarticle.Ortheopposite:writingstorieswithelementsofanarticle.InmycurrentfolderofstoriesI’vewrittentherearelotsofthingsthatcomefromthepress.Writeanovel?Maybe,yes.Idon’tknow.Thepaceoflifehastobedifferent.WhenIwroteBenzinaIdidn’thaveaphoneathomeandIlivedoutoftown.That’swhyIhadthedraftdoneinamatteroftwoweeks.Butthemorethingsthatinterestyouinlife,themorecomplicatedthesituationgets.What’sclearis

that,onceI’vedecidedtopublishthesestories,theotherideaI’mworkingonlooksasifit’sgoingtoendupbeingsomethinglonger,akindofnon-fictionstorywithfiction,ifthatmakesanysense.

The weekly commitment of the article isn’t too compatible with the extreme and prolonged concentration required by a novel…

Ifyouputyourmindtoarticlewritingandyoutrynottoengageinsimpledigressiononpolitics,thetimeyougivetoitistimeyoudon’tdevotetofictionwriting.Butiftheyputagunatmyheadandforcedmetochoosebetweenwritingarticlesandwritingfiction,Iwouldn’tknowwhattodo.Fortunatelynoone’sgotagunatmyheadandIcangobetweenonethingandtheotherwithoutanyhurry.

Is this intense journalistic activity a question of vocation or about earning a living?

IstartedwritingarticlesinTele/eXprés,chroniclesofatriptoVietnamduringthewar.ThenIwrotecolumnsforAjoblanco.I’vealwayswrittenarticlesandfiction.IwasinlovewithJoandeSagarra’sarticlesinTele/eXprés,andthereportsofTomWolfe,andthearticlesofVázquezMontalbán(alsoinTele/eXprés)whentheywouldn’tlethimwriteaboutpoliticsandhehadtowriteabouttheCostaBrava.IlovedthearticlesofJuanMarséinPor favour.EventodaySagarra’sarticlesmakemySunday.Espinàsisalsoagreatcolumnist.AndIlikeXavierMontanyàalot.NowIreadhimonVilaweborintheCultura/s supplementofLa Vanguardia.He’sreallygood.I’vekeptsomearticlesofhisfromthetimewhenhewaswritingforEl Noticiero Universal.AfterreadingJoandeSagarrawhenIwasayounglad,Ithengotinterestedinreadinghisfather…AndIwasastonished.Whatlanguage!Now,there’sonefellowIlikewho’swritinginThe Independent,MilesKingston,andthere’sanotheronewhowritesforThe GuardiancalledGuyBrowning.He’sgotabookofarticlestranslatedintoCatalan.He’sgood,reallygood.Andalongtimeago,itwasagreatdiscoverytofindthattherewasacolumnistcalledManganelliwhowaswritingarticlesinthe1960softerrificqualityandtotallypoliticallyincorrect.AndnowthatI’mtalkingaboutItaly,therearealsoFruttero&Lucentini.Ishouldsay“were”becauseoneofthemdied.WhenUmbertoBossiwassayingthathewantedtoproclaimtheindependenceofPadania,Fruttero&Lucentiniwentofftheretowritedispatchesasifitreallywasawarofindependence.

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There isn’t a single political party that isn’t putting on a show to please people who are supposed to keep voting for them

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Would you like to write your articles in Catalan?

Bilingualismisapunishment.JosepPlasaidso,orsomethingverylikeit.

Do you think the social, institutional and political milieu acts as a brake that makes sure that Catalan literature isn’t visible?

BaltasarPorcelhastalkedaboutthisalotinhisarticles.YougointoabookshopandthepercentageofbooksinCatalanisridiculouslylow.Soyoutellme.

What would make this milieu a little less unwelcoming and a little more habitable for Catalan literature?

Totellyouthetruth,Idon’tseeanysolution.Whenwewereinnocent,intheearly1980s,whenFrancowasn’tlongdead,wethoughtthatwejusthadtoopenoutthebaseandgetawayfromelitism:weneededhumourmagazines,discosongs,gossipmagazinesandpornographyinCatalan…thewholethingofthepyramidofhighcultureandlowculture.Madame se meurt,wroteGabrielFerrater.Inherlatestbook,PatriciaGabanchosaysthatthebottomlayer,popularculture(reallypopularandnotclichéstuff)didn’texistinCatalan.Andthat’sdeath.Thatleadstofossilisation,toturningCatalancultureintosomethingresidual,minority,Occitanised,Irelandised…It’stheultimatedisconnection.

In some of your articles you’ve talked about a hologram of a country, a diorama of symbols, fancy dress and cardboard cut-outs as substitutes for the country in which we live and suffer…

Wearelivingapurefarce.Thereisn’tasinglepoliticalpartythatisn’tputtingonashowtopleasepeoplewhoaresupposedtokeepvotingforthem.TheCatalanlanguageisgivensymbolicsignificance(lessandless,takenote),butthepoliticians(fromallthepartieswithoutexception)disownitwheneveritsuitsthem.It’sanoldflagthattheyhavetohidefromtimetotimebecauseagrowingpartofthepopulationhatesitand,whenvotesareatstake,it’sbettertokeepyourmouthshut.

Do you talk much about these issues in your works of fiction?

YoucouldsaythatDavant del Rei de Suècia isanallegoryofpresent-dayCatalonia,anallegoryofdefeat.Thebuilding’sfilledupwithpeopleyoudon’tknowandit’syouwhohastoadapttotheirstandardsandtheirwayofdoingthings,notthem.

Bernado Atxaga has recently become a member of the Euskaltzaindia, the Royal Academy of the Basque Language. Shouldn’t some of today’s well-known writers be in the Philological Section of the Institute of Catalan Studies, or the Royal Academy of Letters of Barcelona?

IntheBasqueCountryandinSpain,thingsareasyousay.Here,theseinstitutionsaresooutoftouchwithwhat’shappeningonthestreetthatIdon’tknowwhattheyareorhowtheyfunction.It’smorethanadecadesincetheybroughtoutthefirsteditionofthedictionary.Hallelujah!Andnowthey’vejustbroughtoutthesecond.Lovely.

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OnceIwenttotheInstitutewithEmparMolinertodoaradioprogramme.I’dneverbeentherebefore.Wepokedaroundthenooksandcranniesand,amongseveralotherthings,weliftedthecoversoftheInstitute’sswitchboard.Thelabelledinstructionswerealldone—onDymotape,ifIremembercorrectly—inSpanish.Noteveninsidethebubbleisthedreampossible.

Are you tempted by the possibility of going back to work in television?

Iwasonlyworkingintelevisionforayear,inPersones humanes (HumanPeople)withMiquelCalçada.Itwasfifty-twoweeksandthatwasall.Ienjoyeditbecausetheideawasright.Then,foryearsIwascomplainingthattherewasnorealcorrosivehumourbutIcan’tsaythatanymorebecausenowthere’sthiswholegangofToniSolerandcompanywhoaredoingPolònia (Poland)onTV3andMinoria absoluta (AbsoluteMinority)onRac1.Itakemyhatofftothem.Inadomainthatseemstobeasdiceyaspoliticalandsocialparodythey’remakingsplendidprogrammes.Minoria absoluta isaddictive.They’rereallygood.

Some people say you don’t try to reflect the country in your work, and that you don’t give specific settings in a lot of your stories.

That’strue.I’vealwayshadaphobiaforthiskindoftweedecorationoflocaldetails.WhenItranslatedHemingway(thebookthat’scalledThe Sun Also Rises)IwasshockedatalltheoverdonepicturesquetouchesofPamplonathathethrewin,andtheexpressionsinbadSpanishthatheplacedinthemouthsofthepeoplefromPamplona,justtosatisfyhislongingforabestsellerandthatofhisreadersforfauxhighculture.IfeelthesameaboutalotofFrenchwriterswhofilltheirmouths(orwhosemouthswerefilled)withreferencestotheRamblaortheBarriXino1tothrowinatouchofexoticcolour.Idon’tseewhyIshouldsaythattheaction’shappeningincarrerJovellanos,orincarrerRocafortifthere’snoneedtogivethisinformation.ItendtoeliminateanythingIthinkisnon-essential.However,ifIhadtowritearticlesaboutBarcelonaasifIwashereforsevendaysasatouristinmyowncity,thenI’dgiveallthedetails.Butinstories,ifthey’renotneeded,whygivethem?

Do you write stories starting out from a plot or the characters?

Morefromthecharactersthanfromaplotorsituation.

In your literature one always sees a certain degree of autobiographical projection. Have you ever thought about doing something purely along the lines of memoirs?

Ithinkthat,whateverIwrite,itwillalwaysgothroughthesieveoffiction.ThestoriesI’mwritingnowtakeofffromspecificdetailsinmylifebuthasn’titalwaysbeenthus?ThestoriesI’vegotinafolderwaitingformetodecidetopublishthem,havecomeoutoftheselastfifteenyears,whenI’vegonethroughthefinaldeclineofmyparentsand

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■ 1Chinatown:anamegiveninthe1920stotheold-cityneighbourhood(whichhadnoChineseconnections)byalocaljournalistafterseeingafilmaboutviceinSanFrancisco’sChinatown[translator’snote].

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there’snodoubtthatthey’refullofreferencesIcouldn’thavepublishedfifteenyearsago.FifteenyearsagoIwouldn’thavebeenabletotellyoumuchabouttheHospitalClínic,ortheValld’Hebronhospital…NowIcantellyouaboutalotofBarcelonahospitals,withallthedetailsyoucaretohave,becauseI’vespenteightyearsinthem.

Some of your stories have appeared with illustrations by Robert Llimós, Perico Pastor or Ramon Enrich, who are mainly figurative painters. You’ve also talked about art in Benzina and in a number of articles. Are you interested in the world of art nowadays?

Idon’tfollowitwithasmuchdevotionasIusedto.Igotoexhibitionsbutnotwiththeregularityofsomedecadesago.IstudiedattheMassanaSchoolofArt.Andthere’sonedetailofmodernartthatparticularlyinterestsme.AfterImpressionism,whenrealitystartedtobedisfigured(orservedupwithoutthepreviousfidelity),themoreartadvances,themoreitmovesawayfrombeingmererealisticreproductionandthegreaterneedthepainterhastojustifywhatheorsheisdoing.Itamusesmemightily,thisneedtojustify.Iftheydidn’tdoit,alotofpeoplewouldbeleftonlywithwhatweweretalkingaboutbefore,thefaçadeorthefirstlayer.Andwe’vereachedthepointwherealotofpaintershavehadtowritebookstodefendthemselvesandtoexplainwhytheypaintthewaytheypaint,andwhytheirpaintingsaresogood.Thisisanaberration:thepublicwilldecideiftheyaresogood!There’sagreatbookbyTomWolfe—fromthetimewhenhestillwasn’twritingnovels—calledThe Painted Word.Hetalksinthisaboutafutureinwhichwhatwillbehanginginthemuseumswillbethetheoreticaltextsofthecritics.Andnexttothem,inminiature,willbeareproductionoftheworkinquestionsothatweknowwhatthegreatcreatorisreferringto,thegreatcreatorbeingtheonewho’sabletoexplainthesenseofthewholething.Whenthebookwaspublished,peoplethoughtitwasreactionary.Wheredoyouseecriticismofthedogmasofprogressiveart?Butnowwe’veseenthatthewholethingisamoreorlessintelligentbusiness.Artandsausages,ecologyandcultureconsumption.IstherethatmuchdifferencebetweenStarbucksandtheGuggenheim?Bothofthemkeepopeningupfranchisessothatcosmopolitanfolkcanhavecleanghettoswheretheycangoandhaveacoffee(intheformercase)orseeartthatintereststhem(inthelattercase).

Does your training and experience as a graphic designer have any influence in your writing?

Inmyearlybooksthere’salotofobsessionwithdescribinganddetailingcolours.Icouldalmosthavewritten,“ThesunwasrisinginaPantone635Csky”.Somethingelsethatclearlycomesfromthatbackgroundinartismytendencytowriteadvancing

Both Starbucks and the Guggenheim keep opening up franchises so that cosmopolitan folk can have clean ghettos to go to for coffee or art that interests them

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rapidlywithoutpolishinganythingandonlystartingtoworkonthenuancesandpolishingwhenthewholethinghascometogether.Iwriteasitcomes,withoutworryingtoomuchaboutcommasandaccentsuntilthestoryiswelldefined.Iseealotofsimilaritywiththeprocessofdrawing.Firstyou’vegottobringtogetherproperlywhatyou’redrawing,whetherit’sasofaorafacebecause,ifyoustartfinishinglittledetailafterlittledetail,whenyougettotheothersideofthesofaortheface,youmightfindthatit’sgoneoutsidethepicture,orthatyouhaven’tmanagedtoestablishtherightrelationsamongallthepartsand,inshort,it’sallovertheplace.

What part has translating played in your work?

Intheearly1980sIbegantotranslatebecauseIneededmoney.Butpublishersonlypayapittance.Literarytranslationisworsepaidthantechnicaltranslation.Ifliterarytranslatorsaresobadlypaid,somuchtheworsefortranslationbecausethegoodoneswillgoanddosomethingelse.WhenIstartedtohavethekindofincomeIneededfromotherkindsofwork,IdecidedtotranslateonlythewritersIliked,suchasTrumanCapote.RecentlyI’vebeentranslatingtheatre—becausefriendshaveaskedmetodoitmorethananythingelse.Besides,theatreisdialogueandIreallyenjoytranslatingdialoguesandmakingpeoplespeakCatalanthatisneitherimposednorputrid.

Has the model of literary Catalan changed much over the last decades?

Yes,especiallyafterthe1980swhenthemassmediainCatalanappeared:radio,televisionandnewspapers.

Have you ever thought about getting involved with the theatre again, with the kind of things you were doing in the mid-1980s like El Tango de Don Joan (Don Juan’s Tango), which you wrote with Jérôme Savary?

Toworkwithotherpeople,inateam,you’vegottohaveareallytoughcharacter,you’vegottobesomethingofadespotandnotlistentoomuchtoothers.Ifyou’renot,youendupgivinggroundandtakingpartinthingsinwhichyoudon’trecogniseyourself.

Do they still say you’re the father of each new young short-story writer who publishes a book in Catalan?

Inthe1980sand1990stheysaidthatalmostalltheyoungwritersthatappearedweremychildren.ItwasasiftherewerenotathousandwritersintheworldwhowerecapableofinfluencingthehundredthousandwriterstheremustbeinthiscountryII

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Manel ollé is a historian and lecturer in Catalan Literature at the Pompeu Fabra University, Barcelona, and a literary critic. Quim Monzó is a writer, translator and journalist. His works have been translated into several languages.