Maine€¦ · STATE OF MAINE DEPARTMENT OF ENVIRONMENTAL PROTECTION IN THE MATTER OF THOMAS PROUTY...

STATE OF MAINE

DEPARTMENT OF ENVIRONMENTAL PROTECTION

IN THE MATTER OF

THOMAS PROUTY ) REGULATION OF WATER LEVELS

JEFFERSON, ) AND MINIMUM FLOWS

LINCOLN COUNTY )

DYER LONG POND ) HEARING

l-22951-36-A-N )

PRESIDING OFFICER: CHRISTINA HODGEMAN

Reported by Robin J. Dostie, a Notary Public and

court reporter in and for the State of Maine, on July

26, 2018, at the Jefferson Village School, 48

Washington Road, Jefferson, Maine, commencing at 1:00

p.m.

REPRESENTING DEP:

MARK BERGERON, BUREAU OF LAND RESOURCES DIRECTOR

SCOTT BOAK, OFFICE OF THE MAINE ATTORNEY GENERAL

KATHY HOWATT, HYDROPOWER COORDINATOR

RUTHANN BURKE, ADMINISTRATIVE STAFF

D o s t i e R e p o r t i n g7 M o r r i s s e t t e L a n eA u g u s t a , M E 0 4 3 3 0

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PARTIES

Petitioners:Thomas Prouty, SpokespersonDyer Long Pond Petitioners109 Sunrise Park RoadJefferson, ME 04348-4162Phone: (207) [email protected]

Dam Owner:Richard Saltonstall, III1637 Three Sisters WayKodiak, AK 99615Phone: (907) 512-2013 (207) [email protected]

Richard Olson, Esq. (Attorney for Dam Owner)Curtis ThaxterOne Canal PlazaP.O. Box 7320Portland, ME 04112Phone: (207) 253-0724 (207) [email protected]

Rod Grady, Dam Operator159 Old Mill RoadJefferson, ME 04348Phone: (207) [email protected]


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mailto:[email protected]




TRANSCRIPT OF PROCEEDINGS

MS. HODGEMAN: Good afternoon. I now call

to order this adjudicatory hearing of the Maine

Department of Environmental Protection on the Long

Pond Water Level Hearing. In accordance with Title

38, Section 840, Subsection 1 of the Maine Revised

Statutes, Commissioner Paul Mercer, the Commissioner

of the Department of Environmental Protection,

exercised his discretion and has decided to hold this

proceeding in response to a petition filed with the

Department. At this time, I will call Kathy Howatt,

Hydropower Coordinator for the Department, to attest

to the Department's jurisdiction to hold a water

level hearing on this matter.

Can you please state your name for the

record?

MS. HOWATT: My name is Kathy Howatt. I

work for the -- Kathy Howatt. I work for the

Hydropower Coordinator for the Department of

Environmental Protection.

MS. HODGEMAN: Please raise your right hand.

Do you affirm that the testimony you are about to

give is the whole truth and nothing but the truth?

MS. HOWATT: I do.

MS. HODGEMAN: Thank you.


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MS. HOWATT: So a petition to hold a public

hearing to establish water levels and minimum flows

for Dyer Long Pond located in Jefferson, Maine was

received by the Department of Environmental

Protection on March 14, 2006. The petition was

reviewed by Department staff, which determined that

filing requirements were met including certification

by the Town of Jefferson of 35 valid petitioner

signatures, which is at least 25 percent of the

littoral or riparian land owners and the payment of

the require filing fee. The petition was accepted as

complete for processing on March 27, 2006. The Dyer

Long Pond Dam is found to be at least 2 feet in

height and impounds at least 15 acre feet of water

establishing it as a dam within the Department's

jurisdiction in accordance with 38 M.R.S., Section

817, Subsection 3. A review of the Department's

application tracking system do not identify any

permit setting water levels under the state's laws

regulating the construction or operation of the dam.

The dam does not operate with a license or exemption

to generate hydropower. The Dyer Long Pond Dam is

not regulated by any municipal ordinances or

inter-local agreements or by the International Joint

Commission; therefore, the Department finds the


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petition to hold a hearing and to set a water level

and downstream flow for Dyer Long Pond Dam is within

its jurisdiction.

MS. HODGEMAN: There will be an opportunity

to ask Kathy questions later on this matter; however,

if there are any questions about her statement at

this time, please identify yourself and we will take

questions. Okay, seeing none. Thank you, Kathy.

The purpose of this hearing is to establish

a water level regime and, if applicable, minimum flow

requirements for Dyer Long Pond in the Town of

Jefferson. Testimony is generally limited to the

statutory criteria set forth in 38 M.R.S., Section

841 A through F.

My name is Tina Hodgeman. I'm the Policy

Director for the Department of Environmental

Protection. Commissioner Mercer designated me

presiding officer for this matter on September 5,

2017. As stated in the Commissioner's designation,

his delegation is limited to, quote, the authority

necessary to administer governing procedural statutes

and regulations in the development of the

administrative record and does not include the

ultimate decision-making authority on the merits of

the record, which, end quote, Commissioner Mercer has


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expressly retained.

Other DEP staff members and state staff

members here today, please raise your hand when I

call your name to identify yourself, Mark Bergeron,

Bureau of Land Resources Director; Rob Mohlar,

Engineer for the Division of Environmental

Assessment; Kathy Howatt, Hydropower Coordinator;

Ruthann Burke, administrative staff; Kevin Martin,

Compliance Specialist. And we are also joined by

Maine Inland Fisheries and Wildlife staff, Keel

Kemper, Diano Circo, Wesley Ashe. And Maine

Department of Marine Resources Mike Brown, Marine

Resource Scientist. And from the Department, Eric

Sroka. Did I miss anyone else? Okay. Thank you.

These agency staff are available to answer questions

on behalf of their respective agencies. Finally,

Scott Boak, Assistant Attorney General, is here today

providing us legal representation and also may ask

questions.

Just a couple administrative items: The

emergency exits are located directly behind you and

outside this door to the left. Restrooms are located

directly outside this door. If you have any

additional building requests or needs, please

approach Ruthann Burke and she will assist you.


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Throughout the hearing, I will be

referencing several procedural orders, Maine statutes

and Department rules and regulations, many of which

we've printed out and are available in the binder by

the door for your reference at any time. With that

being said, pursuant to Maine Administrative

Procedure Act, Title 5, Sections 9051 through 9064,

Establishment of Water Levels, Title 38, Section 840

and Chapter 3 of the Department's Rules Governing the

Conduct of Licensing Hearings, we are conducting this

hearing today.

As many of you recall, on November 16 of

2017, the Department held a pre-hearing conference

where we established the procedures and processes for

this hearing today. I won't go into the same level

of detail that we did at the pre-hearing conference;

however, all of the procedures discussed are also

contained in the Fourth Procedural Order dated

December 18 of 2017.

The notice of today's hearing was published

in the Kennebec Journal on June 25 and July 16 and

the Lincoln County News on June 21 and July 19 of

2018. Notice of today's hearing was also sent to the

parties and others in accordance with the

Department's Chapter 3.


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For those speaking at the hearing today,

please remember to speak into the microphone at the

podium as today's hearing is being transcribed by

Robin Dostie of Dostie Reporting. The final

transcription will be made available to all parties

and interested persons and it will be available on

the Department's website for the public. Based on

the complete record, the Commissioner will make a

final decision to approve, deny or approve with

conditions the water level regime and, if applicable,

minimum flow requirements.

During this hearing, the Department will

receive evidence from the parties starting with the

petitioners, owner and operator of the dam and

potentially Department staff and counsel and other

state agency representatives. The Department

received no notice of intervention from any other

parties in this case. Sworn testimony of the parties

was pre-filed in advance of this public hearing;

however, the dam owner presented in an objection that

some of the testimony was notarized but not sworn. I

did respond to this objective -- I'm sorry, to this

objection in this Sixth Procedural Order and will

discuss it now for a bit more clarity. Currently,

the testimony of Mr. Steven Urkowitz, Mr. Thomas


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Prouty, Ms. Carolyn Wronker and Mr. Robert Cercena is

unsworn. It is, however, currently part of the

record and it will be considered as public comment in

its unsworn state unless the testimony is sworn to

today. If you choose to swear to this testimony, the

testimony will then be considered as sworn pre-filed

testimony in the record and you may be allowed to

testify further today. So at this time, I would like

the four of you to take a look at your pre-filed

testimony. Have you taken the opportunity to do that

at this time? So I will call you up one by one to

swear you to that testimony. So if I could have

Mr. Steve Urkowitz, please come to the podium. Oh,

and you can turn the microphone on for us, sorry

about that.

PARTICIPANT: (Steven Urkowitz.) Hello.

Hello.


State your name for the record.

PARTICIPANT: My name is Steven Urkowitz.

MS. HODGEMAN: Do you affirm that the

testimony reflected in your written pre-filed

submission is the whole truth and nothing but the

truth?

PARTICIPANT: (Steven Urkowitz.) I do.


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MS. HODGEMAN: Thank you. You may have a

seat. Next is Mr. Thomas Prouty. Please state your

name for the record.

PARTICIPANT: My name is Thomas Prouty.

MS. HODGEMAN: Can you please raise your

right hand? Do you affirm that the testimony

reflected in your written pre-filed submission is the

whole truth and nothing but the truth?


MS. HODGEMAN: Thank you. You may have a

seat. Ms. Carolyn Wronker. Please state your name

for the record.

PARTICIPANT: My name is Carolyn Wronker.

MS. HODGEMAN: Raise your right hand. Do

you affirm that the testimony reflected in your

pre-filed submission is the whole truth and nothing

but the truth?

PARTICIPANT: (Carolyn Wronker.) I do.

MS. HODGEMAN: Thank you. And Mr. Robert

Cercena. Please state your name for the record.

PARTICIPANT: Robert Cercena.


you affirm that the testimony reflected in your

pre-filed submission is the whole truth and nothing

but the truth?


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PARTICIPANT: (Robert Cercena.) Yes.


PARTICIPANT: (Robert Cercena.) Can I ask a

question?

MS. HODGEMAN: At this time, we're not

taking questions; however, I will give an opportunity

at the end of my opening statement for questions.

PARTICIPANT: (Robert Cercena.) Thank you.

MS. HODGEMAN: Thank you. We will now go

over how the hearing will be run today. We'll begin

with testimony from the petitioners followed by

cross-examination of the petitioners. Witnesses by

the dam owner then -- I'm sorry, followed by

cross-examination of the petitioner's witnesses by

the dam owner then redirect by the petitioners.

Department staff may ask clarifying questions at any

time; however, we'll generally hold questions until

the completion of cross-examination and redirect.

When we follow the sequence -- we will then follow

the same sequence for the dam owner. The schedule is

on the table and outlined in the Nineth Procedural

Order.

All witnesses at this hearing will be sworn

individually by me when you come up to speak. All

documentary evidence already entered into the record


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is available in the binder by the door for anyone

that wishes to reference it. After the hearing, the

project file will be available for public inspection

during regular business hours at the Department's

office in Augusta. After the hearing, no further

evidence or sworn testimony will be allowed into the

record except for matters specifically identified by

me. The Department will continue to accept written

public comment after the close of today's hearing.

Once I close the record, I may reopen it at any time.

At the conclusion of the public hearing today, I will

identify the final date for submitting closing briefs

as well.

So before we start, I just want to remind

everyone that all participants are expected to

conduct themselves professionally, which I have no

problems, I know everyone will. But if any party is

unable to remain professional, I do reserve the right

to take appropriate action which could mean excluding

an individual from further participation.

So my goal today is to construct a fair and

productive hearing. Please be concise as we do have

a very tight time line and keep your testimony

relevant to the statutory criteria reflected in your

pre-filed submissions. Remember that the Department


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has already read your pre-filed direct and rebuttal

testimony. We're here to listen and consider all of

the evidence placed before us. The purpose of this

public hearing is to collect information as a part of

the process for the Department to be able to based on

the administrative record as a whole make an informed

decision based on the facts and statutory

requirements. Thank you all for your participation

today.

We do plan to finish by 6 p.m. as the

Department is holding a session to hear oral comments

and testimony from the general public beginning at

that timing and we do have a tight time line as I

mentioned previously, so please take breaks as

needed. Are there any questions at this time?

Okay. Seeing none, let's get the proceeding

started by having a summarized testimony and we'll

start with the petitioners, Mr. Thomas Prouty. You

have five minutes.

Mr. Prouty, I will swear you in again.

Previously you swore specifically to the content of

your pre-filed testimony. So at this time, I will

ask that your testimony from here on in for the rest

of the hearing will be sworn. So please raise your

right and state your name for the record.


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MR. PROUTY: Thomas Prouty.


testimony you are about to give is the whole truth

and nothing but the truth?

MR. PROUTY: It is.


MR. PROUTY: And basically I'm just prepared

to read my testimony if that's all right.

MS. HODGEMAN: If you could summarize it for

the Department and the audience that would be

wonderful.

MR. PROUTY: Okay. I didn't think it that

was long, but okay. I'll start and drop out what I

think is not relevant. It's basically my wife,

Debbie, and I purchased property on the pond in May

of 1998. We built our camp in 1999 and 2000. During

this time going forward, we came to realize during

each summer we would spend a significant amount of

time chasing the water level with our dock system

even to the extent of replacing a perfectly good

system with a more adjustable rolling system. And

even then as summer went on, we'd run out of ramp to

the dock and have to put boards in or something so we

could get onto the ramp or do a good jump. So

basically we're losing 3 to 4 feet of height of water


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and where we are we have a very steep incline at the

water level. Others on the pond have no recourse but

put their boots on and walk out to their moored

boats.

After talking to others living on the pond,

it was agreed that we should contact the dam owner to

see if we could find a solution that was satisfactory

to all parties. In August of 2004, I sent a letter

to the dam owner. And I do have an attachment. I

don't have anything of any size. After having

returned to sender -- after having been returned to

sender, the letter was resent return receipt

requested to the dam owner's Camden, Maine address.

Having no response, I penned another correspondence

on March 19, 2005 and sent that return receipt. The

only response that I ever had from the dam owner was

a very unsavory call on my cell phone, which went to

voicemail at the time and where he said, come ahead,

I'm going to sue you if you pursue that.

In March of 2006, we submitted our petition

to the DEP Bureau of Land and Water. And I have an

attachment. On March 27, we received a notice that

the process of the action on our petition had

started. Once again, Attachment 4. After that,

everything slowed down and nothing ever happened.


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Fast forward to last year, 2017 September, contact

with the petitioners and the DEP was re-established.

With the passing of these 11 years, three petitioners

have deceased, seven properties have changed hands

and a couple of the petitioners have expressed no

confidence in the process due to the lack of process

over this time period.

In my profession as a plumber, I have been

called to help several camp owners to add 20 or so

feet to their intake pipes so that they could

continue to pump water from the pond to their camps.

I have seen years where the drop in the water levels

have caused nesting bass to relocate their beds three

times in a season. One summer, I lost a prop on my

outboard due to low water. During the last five or

six years, large masses of green slime, algae, I

assume, have accumulated along the shore. This makes

swimming difficult, not to say that this tells about

the health of Dyer Long Pond.

In conclusion, I think that the last 27

years of non-management of the water levels by the

dam owner by his own admission needs to be addressed.

And thus Attachment 5 alludes to his admission. I

thank you.

MS. HODGEMAN: Thank you, Mr. Prouty. And


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all of the attachments you mentioned are in the

binder and on the record.

MR. PROUTY: Okay.

MS. HODGEMAN: Next, I will call Steven

Urkowitz to summarize your testimony. Please state

your name for the record.

PARTICIPANT: My name is Steven Urkowitz.


you affirm that the testimony you are about to give

is the whole truth and nothing but the truth?


MS. HODGEMAN: Thank you. You have five

minutes.

PARTICIPANT: (Steven Urkowitz.) We have

the southern most house on the west shore of Dyer

Long Pond and we've owned it since 2003. When we

were there -- when we first were there, the lake

level in the spring would be quite high and then

would drop during the spring and summer. The first

few years there were successful loon nestings in

our -- in our part of the lake and but since then,

particularly in the last several years, the drop in

the lake level has been so quick that we've had no

successful loon nestings. I'm not a loon expert, but

from what we can see about the destruction of the --


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of the loon nesting areas it's been -- it's related

to the drop -- to the quick drop in the lake in the

spring.

We've had, as Mr. Prouty mentioned, we've

had a dock that used to be able to extend further out

into the lake, now -- originally when we put the dock

in there was 4 feet of water at the end of the lake

during the height of summer, now there is about 2

feet of water over a very mucky bottom. Swimming, I

don't know if you've had -- if other people have had

experience swimming in muck, it's less than

pleasurable.

The thing that I find problematic is that

without any boards in the lake maintaining the water

level, the water level drops very quickly after the

spring -- the spring heights. What we used to call

the first five years a rock that appears over at the

surface of the water, we used to call it August Rock

and now it appears in the middle of June as a -- as a

mark of how quickly the water level has been dropped.

The alewife hatchery area near -- on our

shoreline is now drying out very quickly compared to

the first four or five years that we were at the

property -- that we owned the property. And that's

the extent of what I have to say.


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MS. HODGEMAN: Thank you very much. Ms.

Wronker. Please state your name for the record.

PARTICIPANT: Carolyn Wronker.




AUDIENCE MEMBER: (Carolyn Wronker.) Yes.


minutes.

PARTICIPANT: (Carolyn Wronker.) So I

submitted a statement and some photos, I assume those

are in the record over there?

MS. HODGEMAN: They are.

PARTICIPANT: (Carolyn Wronker.) The first

point I'm making is that there is a hand carry only

public access to the lake. There is a ramp that I

assume Inland Fisheries and Wildlife put in or DEP.

I was there today and the ramp ends well before the

point at which the water begins, so the utility of

the ramp is diminished by the fact that you can't

launch whatever from the ramp into the water.

As my husband said, Steve Urkowitz, we've

owned the property since 2003. The first couple

of -- the first few years loons nested and there were

chicks, some survived, some didn't, but there were


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chicks and the last four or five years there have

been no chicks. And one year, I found a nest

abandoned. It was quite a ways -- it was on an

island in the lower portion of the lake. The water

had dropped to a level where the nest was basically

landlocked. There were two abandoned eggs and two

water snakes on the nest. I salvaged the eggs,

brought them to AV Payden and tried to incubate them

and that did not work. One went down to Biodiversity

Research Institute for toxicology testing, I could

never find out what the result of that was. I have

also been doing deciduous monitoring at the lake and

only for two years and the levels in 2017 the clarity

levels were reduced from 2016.

And then we -- the other point was the

alewife fishery. I -- they come into the lake in the

spring and we hear them splashing around. We can

hear them from our camp near the shore of the lake.

Last year when I went down towards the end of the

summer the water level was below the level of the

fish ladder and the dam so there was no water going

out of the lake at all, so that means that the

alewives can't get out. And that's what I had to

say.

MS. Hodgeman: Thank you. Mr. Cercena.


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Please state your name for the record.

PARTICIPANT: Robert Cercena.






PARTICIPANT: (Robert Cercena.) I have a

short letter here that I wrote Kathy Howatt way back

in the beginning. I thanked her for her help and I

was pleased that the -- this is just a synopsis -- I

was pleased that somebody was taking the bull by the

horns. And I can tell you because we -- we built our

house in 1970 and there was nobody basically here and

we built it as close to the lake as we could because

it was -- it's held by 15 piers and the deck -- the

lake side of the deck is 15 feet off the ground.

The water level at that time, and I've

actually dug some old pictures out that I found,

which I had to go through all kinds of stuff to find.

There are pictures that we built a slide from our

deck into the lake and I think you have a picture of

my mother going down the slide. I have an even

better picture of that that shows the dock right

against the water at that -- right against the tree


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line at that time. Since then, one occasion I saw

Mr. Saltonstall in his skull, I didn't know who he

was at that time, but I saw him going up the lake and

I heard that he was the only one that uses a skull,

so I got on my boat and I went out and I waited for

him to turn around and came back and I said to him,

look, you know, you haven't put the boards back in

the dam that were there for all these years, if

they're bad or something, we'll go buy them and put

them in for you. And he said, no, you won't. And I

asked him why and he said because he owned the lake

and because he had -- because he had power over the

dam he owned the lake and we could go to hell

basically, but he used a lot stronger terms than

that. I did go ahead and build those boards, those

planks and they're under my house right now, but we

never put them in because they said that they would

cut them out whoever was the caretaker at the time.

And for anybody to tell you that the boards were in

and out, put in in the spring -- put in in the spring

and taken out in the fall are absolute unequivocal

liars.

The question that I wanted to ask you

before, there is another gentleman here who sent Ms.

Howatt a letter, an extended letter, and his name is


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not on that list. His name is Ben Benedetti and he's

sitting right there and he knows probably -- because

he lives right there -- I didn't want to interrupt

you. Because he lives right there, he knows that

lake just about as well as anybody and he's a

fisherman and he can tell you that -- the story and

he should be sitting at that desk right now because

he did send Ms. Howatt a letter and we have a copy of

that letter.

Two things that are really important to me.

The lake -- three things actually. The lake has gone

down considerably. We've had some serious injuries

there. I have pictures of the -- of some of the

injuries. And actually three weeks ago or four weeks

ago maybe now, I slipped on the lake and broke three

ribs on my left side, which are broken now, and one

on the right side because the rocks that lead into

the lake are slipperier than heck. That's number

one. Number two, the loons have just about

disappeared and that's really sad. And the third

thing that really bothers the heck out of me, we used

to be able to sit in the summertime in the -- and,

again, you have to understand, we built this thing in

the '70s. I could shoot across the lake at a boulder

across the lake because that's what I did in the


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police department and just sit there and practice.

There was nobody there. But in the evening you could

sit on my deck and what sounded like shotgun blasts

and turned out, and I didn't know what they were at

the time, it turned out to be thousands and thousands

and thousands of alewives. They're all gone.

They're all gone. The fish ladder most of the time

when we get -- when Ben and I would go down there

fishing we'd be pulling stuff out of the fish -- out

of the ladder, but it didn't matter because the water

level was at the base of the dam and then somebody

put a pipe underneath it so it would take even more

water out. So those are the three things that

brother me; the injuries, which I have pictures of, I

don't know if Ms. Howatt has them all, but I have

them. I have some of them. And the alewives that

are gone and people being injured on, you know, on

the rocks is really a bad thing. And it's -- it

doesn't seem to be fun anymore because the lake is

not as cool as it used to be. The fish aren't as big

as they used to be by any means. There are basically

just a few alewives left. And we actually saw a

couple of weeks ago or a month ago the -- there was a

school of alewives looking to get out, just -- there

were only maybe 25 or 30, and Mr. Benedetti can tell


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you, and like I said, he should be sitting at this

desk because he did -- he did send a letter to Ms.

Howatt. And it's just sad that one guy can control a

lake like this and just ruin everything for everybody

else. Thank you.

MS. HODGEMAN: Thank you. So I did want to

just address your concern, Mr. Cercena, and the

letter that you mentioned is on the record. We

didn't receive any pre-filed testimony from that

person, which is why --

PARTICIPANT: (Robert Cercena.) Can I ask

you a question?

MS. HODGEMAN: -- the -- the letter is on

the record.

PARTICIPANT: (Robert Cercena.) But

you've -- you've changed the rules how many times,

you know, and some of us, not me in particular, but

Mr. Benedetti goes south in the wintertime so he

missed some of that stuff. He didn't see some of

that stuff, but he -- the original letter I know for

a fact went to Ms. Howatt --

MS. HODGEMAN: And it is on the record.

PARTICIPANT: (Robert Cercena.) -- and he

should be sitting at this desk because he knows more

than anybody in this room about the fishing in the


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lake, the -- the alewives in the lake, the loons in

the lake, the water level in the lake, how warm the

water is and how the algae is growing all the way

around the whole lake and it never was there before.

In 1970 when I got there, it wasn't there.

MS. HODGEMAN: Okay. Thank you,

Mr. Cercena, his --

PARTICIPANT: (Robert Cercena.) And you

should hear him.

MS. HODGEMAN: It is on the record. The

letter is on the record.

PARTICIPANT: (Robert Cercena.) But you

should hear him with his own words and he is sitting

right there.

MS. HODGEMAN: He does have an opportunity

this evening to present his letter and his concerns

at the public hearing as well.

MR. BOAK: I guess I would just note that

Mr. Prouty was designated as the spokesperson for the

petitioners and submitted the pre-filed testimony for

the petitioners, which it's my understanding the

Department received letters that were before a notary

and not fully sworn from the four of you but not from

the other individual. I think that's my

understanding of what has happened.


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PARTICIPANT: (Robert Cercena.) But having

said that --

MS. HODGEMAN: We do have a public comment

period this evening at 6 p.m. that we hope to hear

from him at that time, so due to our tight time line

I would like to move on. At this time, we will have

cross-examination, so I understand that you would

like to have 10 minutes with each. If I could, Eric,

I think the easiest way we'll just have the

microphone brought over to that table and then if you

wish...

MR. OLSON: Could I just address that? My

name is Richard Olson. I'm the attorney for the dam

owner and we had requested cross-examination time,

but having read the testimony and heard the

individuals we'll waive our cross-examination at this

point and I do want to thank them for coming and I

appreciate your time. And there is one more thing

I've got to do, which this is driving me crazy.

MS. HODGEMAN: Oh, thank you. I don't care,

but if you do, okay. Thank you. So I understand

that you're waiving the right to cross-examine the

witnesses?

MR. OLSON: That's correct.

MS. HODGEMAN: Okay. Thank you. So there


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will be no redirect as there was no

cross-examination. So at this point, I think since

we are ahead of schedule I would like to take a 15

minute break. Oh, but before that we will have

questions from any Department or state staff. So Ms.

Howatt.

MS. HOWATT: I just have a couple of

questions. The first -- the first one is in response

to the testimony from Carolyn Wronker. You were

talking about the operation of the fish ladder and

what I understood you to say that there was no water

at the location of the fish ladder and I'm wondering

at what time of year? At the end of summer?

PARTICIPANT: (Carolyn Wronker.) That was

the end of the summer. The water level was below the

bottom level of the fish ladder --

MS. HOWATT: Can you come up and --

PARTICIPANT: (Carolyn Wronker.) I don't

have an exact date, but it was late in the summer and

the water was below the bottom level of the fish

ladder and below the bottom level of the dam, so

basically no water was getting out of the lake.

MS. HOWATT: And when you say the end of

summer, do you mean like the end of August or like

September?


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PARTICIPANT: (Carolyn Wronker.) I'd say

late August or early September.

MS. HOWATT: Okay. Thank you.

PARTICIPANT: (Carolyn Wronker.) I can

probably check through the photos and get an exact

date if you want it.

MS. HOWATT: No, I think that that answers

the question for me about the time frame.

PARTICIPANT: (Carolyn Wronker.) Okay.

MS. HOWATT: The following questions I have

of the petitioner. I'm hoping that you, Mr. Prouty,

can come and answer those. Could you step up to the

mic? There are just a couple.

MS. HOWATT: So I understand that the

petition was filed with the Department in 2006 and

included letters from 2004 to the owner of the dam,

Mr. Saltonstall. You requested meetings about the

water level at that time. Was that Mr. Saltonstall

the current owner of the dam or Mr. Saltonstall --

MR. PROUTY: That is correct.

MS. HOWATT: -- his father? The current

owner. Was 2004 the first indication of a change in

the water level and the management of the dam or had

it been going on for some time before? We've heard a

lot of testimony about different time frames, but I'm


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trying to get at an idea of -- a good, strong idea of

when the water levels were appropriate and acceptable

and when that change in water level management

occurred.

MR. PROUTY: Well, I have only been there

since '98 and others around the pond -- Mr. and

Mrs. Brann, who are both deceased now, used to tell

me, as Mr. Cercena alluded to, a lot more noise from

the alewives and a lot more water and when I asked

them they said it was not a new thing.

MS. HOWATT: So what was the time frame?

The approximate year for the time frame.

MR. PROUTY: Well, I would say probably

mid-'80s from what I recollect. I do remember, and I

alluded to it, that the dam owner said in a

correspondence to Mr. Dana Merch that they had put no

stop logs in since 1990. I did have an email from a

Mr. Davis, who has a camp on the pond, he's quite

elderly now, that had a very nice time line of

different things. I found it well after, you know, I

could submit testimony and I don't have it with me

today. I do have a letter from Dana Merch to

Mr. Saltonstall and I wondered if that was in the

record -- in your records on file from, you know,

when you guys picked up the process or if that's


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deeply buried in the archives. I have it here today

if it could be submitted.

MS. HOWATT: We can take a look at that, but

I do believe all of the correspondence with Mr. Merch

in the -- is in our file.

MR. PROUTY: Okay. That's what I assumed.

MS. HOWATT: It's in our history.

MR. PROUTY: It was worth questioning.

MS. HOWATT: Yeah. Yeah. So I understand

you to say that the operation of the dam changed to

your knowledge in the mid-'80s, everything was okay,

but by the early '90s that things had changed, the

stop logs were no longer put into the dam.

MR. PROUTY: That's what I was hearing, you

know, and -- and, you know, we didn't just jump right

on it in 2004. We discussed it. We had a few summer

outings at one person's cottage where we all brought

food and talked and, you know, as it got worse and

worse we decided it was time to move. I would say in

2002 or 3 we actually went out on some of the grassy

knolls with a picnic table -- a round metal picnic

table and a parasol and sat out there on chairs. We

had a couple of growlers of beer to discuss it with

about five or six of us. And we brought out a 14

foot boat to trail everything in and we thought we


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were going to have to scramble between the knolls and

there because that's how we had gone out and realized

we were in water just about up to a little over my

navel and we walked back in towing the boat. And

joked about it, but, you know, what else could we do

at the time? We hadn't started the proceedings. I

mean, there is a good long history of seeing the

place dry up every year.

MS. HOWATT: Thank you. Thank you. I have

no more questions.

MS. HODGEMAN: Scott?

MR. BOAK: Mr. Prouty, before you sit down,

I have a couple of questions.

MR. PROUTY: You want me to stand back up?

MR. BOAK: Please. I just want to get a

sense of what the stop logs historically looked like

and where they were. By that, I mean were they in

just the fish ladder or were they across the dam as

well?

MR. PROUTY: I have never seen a stop log in

that dam. Last fall I took pictures of what the

beavers were trying to do. There was a bunch of

brush in there and it stayed there a couple of days.

I went back down with the boat to fish and to take a

look and they had been removed, but that's the only


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time. Now, there was one other time in the

springtime where I saw what appeared to be like

pieces of plywood in the slots of the fish ladder.

MR. BOAK: Okay. And --

MR. PROUTY: That's the only time I've ever

seen anything there.

MR. BOAK: Have you ever seen anything in

the slots by the dam?

MR. PROUTY: No, I've never seen a stop log

in there. No. I may not have been there at the

right times, I guess, but I have never seen it. And

when Ms. Wronker was talking about -- she sent me

email pictures with her concern and at that time I

believe she said it was 10 inches below the spillway

and the fish ladder and that was in the fall. And my

understanding of alewives fishery is they come in in

the spring or around Memorial Day, they hatch their

young, I believe the adults go out sooner, but these

juveniles, I think, go at the end of that season.

They return two years later imprinted on our pond.

Well, if they don't get out -- if those juveniles

don't get out, they don't come back in two years and

it's as simple as that. Thank you.

MR. BOAK: I guess I would ask -- this I

don't know, I don't want to call each individual up,


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but if each of you have seen these stop logs, I have

questions about that so I guess I would ask have any

of you seen those before and would be able to speak

about it?

PARTICIPANT: (Robert Cercena.) Could you

speak up a little bit, please?

MR. BOAK: Yes. Rather than call each of

you up and ask, I'm just wondering if any one of the

other three of you have seen his historically these

stop logs in so I could ask you about it.

PARTICIPANT: (Carolyn Wronker.) Yes.

MR. BOAK: Ms. Wronker, could you approach?

PARTICIPANT: (Carolyn Wronker.) Yes, I --

very erratically. And there appears to be a board in

the dam now maybe 6 or 8 inches. And several years

ago, I can't tell you exactly when, there was a

fairly tall flake board, something or other, sort of

stiffened with 2x4s and that was in for a while. And

then flake board not being a particularly sturdy

thing to stop water with it failed and ended up

somewhere down the river and then nothing was put in

to replace it. That's, you know, there had been

erratic appearances and disappearances of things in

the dam in the slots that go in the slots on either

side of the dam, but it doesn't seem to be any


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particular rhyme or reason or continuity to the

process.

MR. BOAK: And did I hear you say there is

something in the slot for the dam right now?

PARTICIPANT: (Carolyn Wronker.) Yes, as

near as I can tell. We were there earlier just

before we came to the meeting and there seems to be a

2x8 maybe.

MR. BOAK: Is that a smaller board than

you've historically seen there or larger, the same?

PARTICIPANT: (Carolyn Wronker.) I can't

say. There is -- the history is too on again, off

again.

MR. BOAK: Okay. Thank you.

PARTICIPANT: (Carolyn Wronker.) I do have

a picture of that that I took today if you want to

see what I'm talking about.

MR. BOAK: No, we're all set. Thanks. I'm

just looking at my notes. I don't have any other

questions.

MS. HODGEMAN: Mr. Cercena.

PARTICIPANT: (Robert Cercena.) I can clear

this up a lot better for Mr. Boak if you'd let me.

MS. HODGEMAN: Yes, absolutely. Yes? No?

You're good. I think his concerns have been


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addressed, but if you do have anything additional to

add about the boards themselves.


MS. HODGEMAN: Okay.

PARTICIPANT: (Robert Cercena.) As I told

you before, we built our house in '70, give or take,

'70, the end of '70. My children at that point were

10 years old. In '73, give or take, we built a slide

because the water level was up and the boards were in

the dam in the '70s. At the end of the -- and I have

pictures of the kids going down the slides and you

have a picture of my mother going down the slide.

There was no problem at that point. Somewhere around

1980, '81 or '82 things changed and the boards

disappeared from the slides -- from the thing. So we

had been told that local children had used the slide

after we had left and gone back, so we took the slide

down in 1983. In 1983, there were no boards in the

slide. If there is a board in the slide now it's

because of this hearing. It's not because of their

love for the lake. It's because of this hearing.

There have been no boards in the -- in the thing

since then. There have been zero boards. And the

fish ladder, half of the time Mr. Benedetti and I

would have to go, you know, the trees breaking off


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and stuff were in the fish ladder and we'd go and

clean the fish ladder out. So those are the dates

that maybe you might think about. If there is a

board, in fact, I have the original boards that I

made for that -- for that dam. They're still under

my house. I mean, if you want me to, I'll go get my

truck and bring them here. They're as long as --

probably as long as that table but the width of the

dam. They were -- they were -- the original boards

were 1 foot and they were this thick and we made them

fit the slots in the dam and there were three of them

and we made them conservatively 10 inches, 10 inches

and 10 inches, so that would be 30 inches. That's

how -- basically how far the lake is down. And so if

anybody is telling you they put those things in every

year, they're liars.

MS. HODGEMAN: Thank you, Mr. Cercena. So

at this time -- no other questions? So at this time,

we will take a 10 minute break. I will start

promptly at 2 o'clock with summarized testimony from

the dam owners.

(Break.)

MS. HODGEMAN: If everyone would be seated,

please. Next on the agenda is we will have a summary

of direct testimony by Richard Olson and the counsel


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for the dam owner.

MR. OLSON: Thank you. I wasn't clear from

the agenda whether I was going to summarize

everything myself or whether we would give them each

a chance to summarize or not.

MS. HODGEMAN: It's completely up to you,

but if you could please state your name for the

record.

MR. OLSON: My name is Richard Olson. I'm

the attorney for the dam owner.


Do you affirm that the testimony are you about to


MR. OLSON: I do.


MR. OLSON: I want to talk about -- I'll go

very briefly and reserve some time for both Mr. Grady

and Mr. Madden to testify. To summarize their

testimony, first I'll start with Mr. Grady.

Mr. Grady grew up literally right next to the dam.

He's 41 years old and he spent his -- virtually his

entire life living in or near here with a few breaks

he may talk about. His father was there when the dam

was constructed. His father -- he observed his

father managing the dam, operating it. He observed


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his father going through some of the things that we

heard about from some of the other witnesses in terms

of trying to raise and lower and trying to actively

manage the water level. He'll talk about -- his

testimony talks about the reasons they have gone away

from an active management approach to a natural flow

approach to management. He will talk about

specifically his years as being directly responsible

for the management of the dam and that management, as

he will testify to, has evolved or some may say

devolved to an operation where the dam relies upon

what is what we call natural flow, which is he will

testify that if there has been during his tenure a

single 2x8 stop log at the base of the dam and that

it doesn't change from year to year, season to

season. He'll talk about the reasons why it's left

that way. He will also -- he'll address some of the

issues that were raised by some of the other people

here today about water flow and what they've seen in

the dam from time to time. He also spends -- studies

management, the primary type of management that he

does with the water is really managing the spillway

for the alewives and he'll talk in some -- his

testimony talks in detail as to how he does that, how

he tries to balance the need for a certain amount of


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water to flow over the top without putting too much

water over the top. He'll talk about how while it

might look to a casual observer that there are a

bunch of alewives at the top of the dam who are

either waiting to go down or waiting to go up, that's

not really what happens and the idea isn't just say,

all right, we'll let you guys go out to the ocean

now. There is a time and place for that to happen

and over time and experience what they've learned is

you've got to be very careful about letting the

alewives go because if you let them go and there is

not enough flow of water downstream and it's not the

right time of year then you can end up with a lot of

stranded alewives. His submitted testimony breaks

down into the categories that the statute addresses.

He'll talk -- he talks about the access and use of

the pond, safety, erosion. He talks about how he

manages to accommodate precipitation and run-off. He

talks about his personal knowledge about the habitat,

downstream impacts, water quality and the fishway

management.

The second person that we've offered as a

witness is Mr. Steve Madden and Mr. Madden is not

affiliated in any way with Mr. Saltonstall.

Mr. Madden is, again, another lifelong person who has


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been up at the pond and he will talk directly about

the impacts of higher and lower water levels on his

property and his views on how the water should be

managed. And he's also broken his submitted

testimony down into categories that I believe you're

going to be considering, which are necessary water

levels for access, safety, for habitat, for erosion,

to accommodate precipitation to make sure that we

maintain the right water levels for water supplies

and also to ensure fish propagation.

So unless there are any specific questions

for me, I'll let the two of them have their time

and...

MS. HODGEMAN: So at this time, are you

satisfied with the summarization of both of their

testimony or?

MR. OLSON: I think they'd each like a

chance just to fill in. They also hold some specific

information --

MS. HODGEMAN: Okay.

MR. OLSON: -- and I -- I particularly am --

hearing what we've heard today there are issues that

have been raised that are addressed in --

particularly in Mr. Grady's written submission that I

think he should flush out and make sure it's


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punctuated at least in this public forum for everyone

to hear and I understand can bring some clarity to

this process. And then I hope that -- I know you

have questions about how water levels -- I hope you

ask them and give him a chance to respond to what

we've heard earlier.

MS. HODGEMAN: Thank you. At this time, I

will call Mr. Grady. Please state your name for the

record.

PARTICIPANT: Rodney Grady.




PARTICIPANT: (Rod Grady.) Yes, I do.


minutes.

PARTICIPANT: (Rod Grady.) As I just

stated, I stand behind the testimony that I've

written previously. A few points that I would like

to address that there may be some disagreement on

would be the level of the lake regarding the stop

logs. I think when the original -- in 2004, I

believe, when they originally brought this or started

this process and then in 2006 when the DEP got

involved. At that point, we made a concession, I


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suppose, and at that point we put in what would be a

2 inch, which is really 1 1/2 by 5 1/2 inches. In my

tenure there there has only been one instance when

that's been moved and that was last spring. There

was a log lodged in the dam early spring. Water is

always very high in the spring. It's a very small

spillway. Water melt -- snow melt rather, rain

water, water becomes high quickly. I attempted to

pull it out with my tractor, long story short, it

ended up breaking what was the stop log. At that

point, there was no way to slip another one in.

There is so much water pressure. There was no way

you could slip it all the way down. So at some point

during the summer, I can't give you a date, I put

another stop log in to hold back some water.

Last summer was, as everyone can remember,

dryer than this summer. We had almost no rain all

summer, so water levels did drop very low. I ended

up pulling that stop log to release water downstream

to give flow to the stream itself and even that was,

you know, over time still no water. Then beavers

started to get involved in my dam management as well

because the water was getting low so they started

plugging up the dam and at one point I just kind of

let it go because there was no water spilling down


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over, so I allowed them to kind of hold back what

would amount to probably 1 inch to 2 inches of water

and left it at that. Returning home from work one

afternoon, I noticed somebody had cleaned it out and

I was down there with my son, we were fishing, and we

could see all these little ripples below what would

be the dam, which is the river, and so we went to

investigate and there were literally thousands of say

1 1/2 inch alewives stranded in every little pool.

No place to go. No flow. Because that small amount

of water that does go isn't enough to push them

downstream. So we were able to -- what we did was we

did what we could to get them out, cleaned out the

dam a little bit because the beavers are steadfast,

every night they're on it, clean it out, flushed them

down and let it go, so that way they were able to get

into the meadow, which is just below this first maybe

250 yards of maybe a 20 foot drop. So that at least

they got into a place where they could survive until

fall rains, you reduced -- or increase run-off rather

and they could survive it for the winter or at least

the fall until they get flushed in the fall.

Another aspect of that would be the alewife

population in the lake especially -- well, any year,

but this year, I witnessed and as people probably see


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if they go down there, I have made a pool below the

dam to increase the height of the water so that they

have a better access to go up the fishway. So what

that does is so the water down in the pool stays the

same so they can still go up the fishway. I saw more

fish this year and I'm sure that any department --

any state department that has authority over that

could probably speak with the person of the fish

rights to the river and he would say the same thing

that there are more than enough alewives in this

river and he has no problem with the way it's managed

as far as getting them up.

One other thing that I would like to address

would be the time line of potential stop logs. I

don't really have any knowledge of, you know, when I

was 10 in the '80s when this first started. I can't

really speak to that at all, what was there or what

wasn't there. What I do know is the dam as it is now

was constructed in 1976, so before that the water

would have been approximately 10 inches lower because

the ledge that is there below the dam lip acted as

the spillway. So any time before then the water in

the summer would have been lower than what it would

now without flowing over. Like I said, I can't talk

to how it was managed in the '80s or when the stop


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log was removed. I don't, you know, 25 years ago

this wasn't really an important issue to me because

it wasn't. It's hard to anticipate something like

this obviously, but anyone that has moved in

apparently prior to or post say 1990 in which

everyone is agreeing that it's approximately when the

stop logs were removed wouldn't have experienced

anything different than what we're experiencing now

any year. The only thing different was in 2006 we

started to put that 2x8 in and never removed it.

We've removed it one time and that was only because

it was such a dry year last year. This year I don't

plan on doing it. We'll hold the water back so a

little bit spills down into the fishway, very little,

but I think at least we're holding back what is 7 1/2

inches more water than we had last year, which was

also a very dry year. The rain storms, if we get any

large rain storms it will certainly increase it. But

that's the other aspect of it is if we attempt --

we've tried to hold water back before, I know my

grandfather had, and he has pictures of it where

water comes up very quickly, you can't physically

remove stop logs because of the pressure coming down

through the spillway and it has gone over the top of

the dam and just under the bridge, so it's a danger


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to the bridge itself, which is a town owned bridge

and the driveway of course gets eroded a bit. That

has never happened to me, but it has certainly come

up over the top of the dam itself, just the fishway

portion of the dam. So there is -- there are some

aspects that a casual observer doesn't really

understand why we just can't hold back as much as

they would like. To hold back 18 inches all summer,

I think that was the recommendation from them. In

June it would be very easy, but you still have to

have some replenishment throughout the summer. We

can't just say we're going to put 18 inches of stop

logs in and it will hold 18 inches all summer. It

certainly is going to have evaporation, you're going

to have run-off, you don't have a lot of rain or in

some instances you have plenty of rain, but you can't

anticipate the forecast to know how much to hold back

to end up with 18 inches of water on say August 30

and still have water to provide to the river. So

there is certainly probably a level there in which we

could do, but I don't know that doing it any way

differently than what I am doing now is holding the 8

inches or 7 1/2 inches technically. Is it going to

really give it any more water this time of year than

it would August 30 without rain? Some years we get


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torrential rains and the water can come up very

quickly, but so far this year not so much.

That's really the points of my testimony

that I would like to address and then any questions.

MS. HODGEMAN: Okay. Thank you. I will now

call Mr. Madden. Please state your name for the

record.

PARTICIPANT: Steven Madden.




PARTICIPANT: (Steven Madden.) Yes, I do.

MS. HODGEMAN: Thank you. Five minutes.

PARTICIPANT: (Steven Madden.) All right.

I was born and raised on the lake and basically the

water has always gone up and down wildly and during

the end of August the pond is always low and then the

fall rains replenish it. I provided historical

photos, which I felt showed some history and I have a

floating dock, so therefore it doesn't really affect

me if it goes up or down. I'm actually satisfied

with it with the way it is. We had -- let's see, we

had a lot of alewives this spring. We still do.

Beyond that, I don't know what else to say. I

provided, I think, pretty extensive -- I'd be happy


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to answer questions. I'm not quite sure what you're

looking for.

MS. HODGEMAN: No, we have all of your

information on the record, so if that's all you'd

like it say at this time, that's fine.

PARTICIPANT: (Steven Madden.) But I am

happy with it the way it is.

MS. HODGEMAN: Okay. Thank you. So at this

time, what we're going to do is we're going to bring

the microphone -- we're going to bring Mr. Prouty the

microphone in order to cross-examine first Mr. Grady

and then Mr. Madden. You do have between 15 and 20

minutes per person.

CROSS-EXAMINATION OF ROB GRADY

BY MR. PROUTY:

Q. Hello, Rod or Mr. Grady.

A. How are you?

Q. I have just a couple of questions --

A. Sure.

Q. -- about your testimony. You were talking

about fishing with your son and seeing the

juveniles --

A. Yes.

Q. -- downstream of the dam.

A. Yes.


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Q. What time of year was that?

September'ish?

A. Yeah, mid-September.

Q. Okay. All right. Well --

A. It's my understanding that what happens is

they'll stay in the lake until they get a fall flush.

Q. Right.

A. They know -- they feel that -- they feel

that pull of the water, I mean, just like genetic

pull --

Q. What is your --

A. -- and then they flush.

Q. What is your understanding -- when do the

adults leave?

A. They leave immediately. They spawn, they

hang around the lake and they leave. I actually -- I

am down there -- as opposed to what many may people

think, I clean the fishway. I work every day, so

when I come home I'll stop, possibly on the ride in,

clean the --

Q. You see --

A. -- beaver debris.

Q. You see the beaver --

A. I see it mostly every day. I see fish going

up and I see fish tailing in and going down all at


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the same time. There is a giant school tailing in,

I'll see them tail in and they'll slowly go down over

and then they'll just -- once one starts they all go.

Q. Well, the reason I ask that, Ms. Wronker

sent me pictures last year via email. It was either

mid-September or mid-October when she sent it, I

would have to refer to the email --

A. Yup.

Q. -- and at that time I think she stated it

was either 10 or 16 inches below the spillway and --

A. I would refute that, but --

Q. -- it was dry last year, but the pictures I

saw are those juvenile, which should be the only ones

left in there with these nice blue 6 or 7 inch fish

not little fry.

A. That would be too small for them to be

spawning, so that would have to be fish that live in

that lake. I don't believe they came back for I

think it's two years, possibly three.

Q. But what I'm saying is --

A. So it would have been probably two seasons.

Q. -- then it would have been -- I would assume

they were the juveniles trying to get out.

A. Yes. As stated, I think what they do is

they will stay in bodies of water until they know


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there is enough flow --

Q. Right.

A. -- and then they leave.

Q. So they probably didn't get out until

November or December of --

A. Probably October I would imagine. I think

the water started to come back up in October.

Q. And the fishway -- the fishery on that side

is awarded to Mr. Weeks; isn't it?

A. Definitely.

Q. And he fishes down off Banks Lane, right?

A. No, not anymore. He fishes on the Old

Palmer Road, which is further down.

Q. Further down now, okay.

A. Yup. Yup.

MS. HODGEMAN: Gentlemen, I just want to

interrupt just for a moment. For the purposes of the

transcriptionist it's very important that you speak

one at a time, please. So just make sure that one

person is done and then the other. Thank you.

MR. PROUTY: Okay. Sorry.

MS. HODGEMAN: That's okay.

BY MR. PROUTY:

Q. Well, I just -- I fail to see two things,

the impounding the water for the summer starting in,


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you know, I think one of the suggestions from the,

you know, marine biologist for the DMR said put the

stop logs in in November because it's easier than

trying to do it when the water is up. I understand

that whole process, but impounding the water and

letting less water go would ensure that when it's

time for young alewives to go there is water up over

the spillway because if there is none we can't come

up with it. We can't pump water in it. I know that,

yes, you do have years where no matter how you try to

hold it back it's going to go down very quickly.

A. Which was last year.

Q. Yeah. That's one year out of the last 14

that we've watched.

A. That's your opinion.

Q. I really don't see -- I saw a portion of

your testimony you were worried about erosion and you

alluded to I believe it was NOAA saying that we're

going to have more intense rain storms.

A. I think historically recent history shows

that, yes.

Q. Right. But even with that recent history

we're nowhere near going over the spillway.

A. Were you available in, I believe, January 17

of this past winter?


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Q. Yup, I was on the pond.

A. Were you -- did you witness the rain and the

snow melt we had that week?

Q. Yup. Yup.

A. Did you witness the height of the water

within three days.

Q. Yup.

MS. HODGEMAN: Okay. Gentlemen --

PARTICIPANT: (Rod Grady.) It was within 2

inches of the top of the dam pretty quickly.

MS. HODGEMAN: Gentlemen, I just -- I just

want to remind you that at this point, the

petitioners are asking the questions. Thank you.

PARTICIPANT: (Rod Grady.) Sorry.

BY MR. PROUTY:

Q. Well, basically --

MS. HODGEMAN: Mr. Prouty --

MR. PROUTY: Yes, ma'am.

MS. HODGEMAN: -- we're asking questions.

Thank you.

BY MR. PROUTY:

Q. Well, basically --

MS. HODGEMAN: Mr. Prouty --

MR. PROUTY: Yes, ma'am.

MS. HODGEMAN: We're asking questions.


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We're cross-examining.

MR. PROUTY: Okay.

BY MR. PROUTY:

Q. Well, I have not seen in the last seven or

eight years the water ever approaching in the

springtime up over the normal high water level.

About seven years ago we did have copious amounts of

snow. It may have been six years. I was saying

three years ago we were all screaming uncle because

we were plowing and plowing and plowing. That spring

it actually came up and went over the edge of our

property into two or three low pools and that was the

only time. Not January 17. It never got up that

high. It may have looked pretty high at your end of

going over the dam, understood.

A. That's my point of reference --

Q. Right.

A. -- is the dam.

MS. HODGEMAN: Is there a question,

Mr. Prouty?

MR. PROUTY: No further ones.


MR. PROUTY: If I could ask Mr. Madden one

question.

MS. HODGEMAN: At this time, we are going to


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have the Department ask questions Mr. Grady.

MR. PROUTY: That's fine.

DEP EXAMINATION OF ROD GRADY

BY MS. HOWATT:

Q. Mr. Grady, can you tell me was the present

Dyer Long Pond dam constructed, reconstructed or

repaired by Mr. Saltonstall's father? I know that

you were just a little boy then.

A. It was built as it is now. I don't know

what it looked like before, but it was a ledge that

created the spillway.

Q. So was there a dam previously in that

location?

A. Yes.

Q. And do you know what year that previous dam

was built in that location?

A. I don't.

Q. That's okay. And do you know what year that

previous dam was built?

A. Could be, you know, it's more than 100 years

ago. It was an old -- there was a mill site there

that existed well before my time or probably anyone

else in this room's time quite honestly.

Q. And so you did testify that the current dam

was built in, I'm sorry, 1990? 1976?


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A. Yes, by Richard Saltonstall's father who is

also Richard Saltonstall.

Q. Okay. And is the dam currently in good

repair?

A. Yes.

Q. And could be operated with stop logs in

place and removed, that you have a mechanism to

install them and remove them as-needed for water

management?

A. There is no mechanism to remove as-needed

unless the water is low enough to overcome the

pressure of the lake itself.

Q. When Department staff was out there last

fall we met you on the site --

A. Yes.

Q. -- and did some elevation survey work and

there was a structure over the dam, sort of an

L-shaped --

A. Mmm Hmm.

Q. -- structure. Is that not for hooking up

say a come along or something?

A. It's not functional to my knowledge. It

doesn't -- probably at one point it may have swung

and it doesn't actually swing all the way to the

center point of the opening of the dam as well and


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I've never seen it move from that position nor have I

attempted to move it, but I know that it doesn't

move. Like you can't physically move it. You maybe

could break it free with equipment, I'm not sure on

that, but also it was questionable to me because it

doesn't -- I would assume that if you were to do that

and building it that way you would make it so it

picked directly over the center of what you have in

the fishway and if you measure it from its pivot

point and the length of the arm it won't make it to

the center, so you would have to have something

additional there, I believe, to make that work

properly. But could it be used in a state where you

have to -- you would have to somehow alter it and

also break it free and potentially it could be used

for that, yes.

Q. Okay. All right. Thank you. And the

present dam as constructed by Mr. Saltonstall, II --

A. Yes.

Q. -- how was that operated initially? Was it

operated, for example, to maintain water at a higher

water level than is currently managed?

A. His father bought the property in the

mid-'70s as kind of a back to the land thing and his

dream, I believe, was to use that to generate power,


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possibly rebuild the old mill site and that was the

use of it. I think he died very shortly thereafter.

I think it was three or four years. He didn't really

ever get his dream built. So I think he was really

the only one that was really interested in doing

that, so I think the rest of his family wasn't

interested and he died at a very young age.

Q. So his plans to develop and operate that

site was to restore the dam and to operate that site

as an old or restored mill or something like that

nature?

A. Mmm Hmm.

Q. Where I understand you to say that those

were -- that he had plans but they were not

completely developed out?

A. Really it's the dam itself. The dam and

fishway was built in that location or rebuilt.

Q. Thank you. And the fish ladder, I have a

couple of questions about the fish ladder. So the

fish ladder was constructed by Mr. Saltonstall as

well as the dam?

A. Yes. I believe he contracted someone and I

heard the name before, but I could never recall it in

like this, but, yes, he did, he built that in

conjunction at the same time with, you know, the dam


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and built the fishway. Whether there was a fishway

there before there must have been somewhere for the

fish to pass, I don't have any pictures nor do I have

knowledge of what was there before.

Q. Thank you.

A. You're welcome.

Q. And so what is the water level that's

maintained under normal conditions? And I'm not

talking about a drought condition such as we've seen

a couple of times in the last say five years there

have been a couple of drought years in there, what's

the water level that's maintained on normal

operations in the summer?

A. Typically with the 7 1/2 inch stop log and

usually at least an inch or an inch-and-a-half of

spill even in the lowest point of summer, which would

be pretty much August 1. Maybe, you know, if we

don't get any rain in September, I mean, August

because it's typically very dry you may see it go

down. But almost every year since I've been there

minus a few, which was also I believe 2002-2003 when

they, I think, this kind of started, very dry years,

historically dry years. You look back and those were

also drought years. There is always a little bit

spilling over. Never a lot. There is never too much


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water in the summer, but I think you can say that

about any -- especially shallow and fairly small

basin or a watershed that this is -- there is no real

large water supply for this pond, so it does -- it's

an ebb and flow with the seasons.

Q. And what is the water level that's

maintained under normal operations in the winter?

A. That is the same. I don't...

Q. The same.

A. I don't remove the stop log. Like I said,

last year was the first time I had removed it since

2006 I believe other than replacing it because it has

broken several times and I've replaced it, but normal

conditions are it is in there year-round.

Q. All right. Terrific. And so the operation

of the dam was modified when, I'm sorry, we probably

have gone over that, in 1990?

A. I can't -- I can't attest to that. I mean,

that's what people are saying and I believe that's

what Mr. Saltonstall said to me as well. I think at

that time is when stop logs were being removed after

that initial period, but I can't -- it's not my

knowledge. That's just secondhand knowledge at that

point.

Q. Okay. Thank you. So you did say that when


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you do need to remove stop logs -- stop log boards to

manage the water level you have to do that when the

water level has already dropped, so do you do any

management of the water to accommodate large

precipitation events? Say we have -- say there might

be a hurricane forecasted and they're like the track

is bringing it right up to Maine, do you need to take

out the stop logs in that case?

A. In that situation if I could see there was

like, you know, torrential rain, like 10 or 12 inch

rain storm coming, I most likely would -- if capable

at the time, I would remove them because it does --

it's such a small spillway, I think it's 5 1/2 feet

total, I don't know if the CFS works out to be for

every inch of water, but it builds so fast and it

takes about three days to actually crest after the

event, three days later is when the actual crest of

the water is and then it starts to recede after all

of the water has entered the watershed, exits all of

the small streams, run-off, it takes three days for

it to crest and then it goes back down, so, yeah, I

would in that event. I have not encountered that

quite honestly where I was either able to because the

water was already low enough or that I had to because

I was afraid that the storm would come and it was


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going to blow the dam out.

MS. HOWATT: That's all of the questions

that I have. Do we have any further questions?

MR. BOAK: I do.

MS. HOWATT: All right. Just one second.

PARTICIPANT: (Rod Grady.) Sure.

DEP EXAMINATION OF ROD GRADY

BY MR. BOAK:

Q. Just to follow-up on that point, I think

you're saying that you could conceive of a situation

where you might do that, but you have -- you have

never pulled that 2x8 other than the time it broke

since about 2006?

A. Yes, that is correct.

Q. You were just talking about the pre-1990 and

how you think it makes sense that it may have changed

around then. Do you have any understanding of what

was done pre-1990?

A. Only from what I've heard. I do feel like

they did that first stretch of time. My grandfather

was actually doing it at the time. I do feel like

they held more -- I know they held more water back.

I don't feel like that, I know that. The amount in

inches, I cannot say. I know that, like I said,

there is a picture he has of it happening where too


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many boards, rain storm, water completely over the

dam and just underneath the bridge causing

potential -- I mean, the bridge is really just

pinned. It's a very small bridge. I don't know if

you've been at the site or seen pictures, it's very

small. It's basically placed on either side of its

pillars. It's pins. High water could potentially,

you know, move it downstream and it's just a rock

cribbing that they created probably, you know, late

1800s or 1900s to kind of pen the water in for the

original mill site.

Q. Was it a series of additional 2x8s or do you

not even know what that involved?

A. I can't, you know, I really can't say

without having, you know, anything to look at. I

can't say.

Q. In your experience has this dam ever

operated with any kind of permit?

A. Not that I'm aware of, no.

Q. Do you put logs in or take logs out of the

fish ladder?

A. The only time I adjust the water in the fish

ladder is in early spring it pretty much -- it

flattens the fish water out and it's too much water

going down through, so I do have -- there is a place


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that I have a piece of plywood and I can raise and

lower the plywood to reduce the amount of water

running down the fishway and I will adjust that.

There is usually fish below the dam in the pool and

I'll adjust that until I can see the fish like

successfully starting to make it up on their own and

then I know they're doing it and I'll leave the water

level at that. So this spring actually I can recall

having to do that for the first probably two weeks

they started around the middle of April and I had to

adjust that water level through the fishway only, not

through the spillway, just through the fishway just

so there was a reduced amount of water running down

through there so they could actually utilize those

baffles and get in behind and...

Q. The fishway would still have the logs down

in the fishway, but --

A. Yes, those are always, you know, I never

remove those unless to clean them. I pull those up,

clean the debris out, drop them back down.

Q. And somewhere at the top is where you have

this plywood --

A. Exactly.

Q. -- and you can adjust the water there?

A. Exactly.


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Q. And you did that how many times? Every year

or?

A. It's not every year, but it's years when --

this year we did have a lot of water all at once. I

don't know if it was just snow melt all at once, but

also over the course of, you know, I guess I've lived

there now for 16 years, so over the course of that

time I kind of did get a -- I get a feeling of how

best to move the fish up, so and that's one of the

items that is first in the middle of the pool below

them to get go into the fishway itself and then

reducing the flow down the fishway, it's still plenty

of flow and they can nose into it but then you have

to try to get them up the fishway.

Q. How do you gauge it? Just by eye?

A. Yeah, the best way is when you see fish move

you know it's at a correct level and other than that

I don't know how you would without having more

experience than I do, but I think sometimes the

eyeball test is the best test. It's like if you're

seeing fish not go up through at a certain level and

you reduce it and reduce it and finally you're like,

okay, now they're able to successfully get into the

fish ladder that to me provides some proof that this

is the correct level for right now. It may not be in


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three days, but for right now they're getting up

through and because every day I go down through there

I typically stop and just check it out even it it's

just for a minute on the way home just because I've

been interested in the fishway as well.

Q. Is there a pipe in the dam below the crest

of the dam that lets water out?

A. It's -- what it was is it was initially

installed for the power generation of this dam when

it was initially built. It's plugged. It does not

release water down through, but you can see the inlet

and the outlet. The outlet is just below the

spillway obviously. Inlet being maybe 5 feet from

the foot of the dam in the lake.

Q. So the only way the water is going

downstream is going through the fish ladder if the

plywood is open or over the crest of the dam?

A. Yes.

Q. Have you ever seen in your experience no

water going over the crest of the dam?

A. Yes.

Q. How often?

A. Not very often. Last year was the first

year in several years. It's just been so dry that it

got down to the level of the footings of the dam and


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it sat there for approximately a month, I'd say. It

was really low.

Q. In the height of summer?

A. Yes. It was August, September.

Q. And has that happened before in other years

in your memory?

A. There have been other years. I can recall

only because there is a ledge just across from this

that if you can get on that ledge then you know the

water is really low and I can recall it being that

low and just a pool of water below the dam, no

running water, but this is probably late '90s, you

know, it was before I became very involved in the

actual water management of the dam, but I do recall

that happening. I can't give you a date of that

though.

Q. Have you ever seen dry conditions in the

fish ladder?

A. Yes.

Q. When?

A. Typically late June if it's a dry year,

which was last year and this year, after the fishway

is -- after the fish have grown and come down,

that's -- that's why I do with the water what I do,

but that's -- and then it runs until potentially with


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no rain until mid-September and then the rains come

in the fall and you have a lot less evaporation and

the water level comes back up more easily, the

fishway begins to work again and the fish -- the

juvenile alewives that are there start to spill down

through.

Q. And is that a common occurrence year to year

under your management?

A. Not every year, but the last two years.

Like recent memory, yeah. Like this year, it's

probably going to happen.

Q. When you are managing water by looking at

the flow and the pools downstream --

A. Mmm Hmm.

Q. -- what type of level in the fish ladder do

you try to maintain?

A. I try to maintain it so it's like the last

gate is here and then there is another flat, I try to

maintain at least a gate, the bottom portion of the

gate where the -- where the first I guess obstacle is

with the fish, if I can maintain a level below the

dam so that it provides them the easiest access

because they can start getting behind the baffle

immediately without having that initial run to get

there.


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Q. And if I understood what you said earlier

that you recently and sometime in the last couple of

years dug out the pool at the bottom of the ladder?

A. No, what I've done is I actually blow the

pool. It's a very narrow channel. It was a blow and

I used fire and water to blow the channel up years

and years ago and I have placed rocks there to

artificially raise just the pool below the dam so now

I can raise that level so I don't need as much water

spilling over necessarily to get that same height,

but I can at least acquire that height with a minimum

of water and still have the fishway be usable.

Q. Do you observe the boat launch in your

management of the dam?

A. No, I don't.

MR. BOAK: I don't have any other questions.

Thanks.

PARTICIPANT: (Rod Grady.) All right.

MS. HODGEMAN: Thank you. You may sit.

MR. OLSON: Will I have a chance to redirect

or do you want to wait until we do Mr. Madden first

and then we --

MS. HODGEMAN: No, we -- I have no

questions. Do you want to do questions of Mr.

Madden? So while he's here, we will have redirect at


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this time.

REDIRECT EXAMINATION OF ROD GRADY

BY MR. OLSON:

Q. Mr. Grady, Mr. Prouty was asking you

questions about the water level. Would you

just explain why there is only one stop water log

there at the dam?

A. The one stop log, like I said, it was a

concession at this point in 2006, which I never, you

know, I didn't know the history of it, it seemed okay

to me we did that. And then also provides what I

feel like is it maintains a water level in the lake

as it stands that doesn't affect the

habitat/ecosystem that currently exists in the lake.

I feel like if we artificially raise the water 18

inches, if that's the proposal, I'm not sure what

we're going to be doing to the rest of the lake. I

don't know. That's not my expertise. I don't know

if it's for me to know or for somebody to tell me or

to make that decision, that's fine, it's not my

decision to make. But I do feel like as it stands

now, I don't feel like I can be responsible for

changing the water level and flooding out areas that

have at least for the last 26 years, I guess, is what

everyone is conceding or 28 potentially been that way


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every summer with the rise and the fall of the water

and what happens in those areas. There is lots of

low, swampy areas around this pond, there is a leaf

bog on either end and that's part of the reason I

don't -- I don't want to make the decision to raise

the water without more info to do so.

Q. The second question is, and maybe you

explained this, but I didn't -- not quite caught it.

What's the -- would be -- is there an adverse effect

on the fishway if you were to raise the water level

by putting in another stop log?

A. I wouldn't say there was an adverse affect.

I would just have to limit the amount of water to the

fishway and then so the fish still get up that would

not be a problem. So, no, I'm going to say that, no,

it wouldn't adversely affect it, but then I feel like

the flooding of, you know, I would have to probably

start doing that to maintain the 18 inch level, I

would say probably late April, early May is when I

would have to hold back more than 18 because I know

I'm going to lose so many inches for every day of

every month for, you know, three months that we would

be required to keep the water at a certain height.

MR. OLSON: That's all I have.

MS. HODGEMAN: Okay. Thank you, Mr. Grady.


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Mr. Madden, at this time, Mr. Prouty, do you have

questions for Mr. Madden for cross-examination?

MR. PROUTY: I'll pass on that. It was very

minor.

MS. HODGEMAN: You're more than welcome to

ask the question.

MR. PROUTY: I -- I would like to ask Rod

one more question. I know his time has passed.

MS. HODGEMAN: You can ask Mr. Madden

questions at this time.

MR. PROUTY: No, I have no questions for

Mr. Madden.

MS. HODGEMAN: Okay. Thank you. Any

questions for Mr. Madden from staff? Okay. You're

all set, Mr. Madden. Thank you.

At this time, I am going to have another

break. 10 minutes. So let's meet back here at 5

minutes before 3 o'clock. Thank you.

(Break.)

MS. HODGEMAN: At this time, we will have

agency comments. I will start by calling Rob Mohler

from the Department of Environmental Protection to

the stand, please. To the podium. Please state your

name.

PARTICIPANT: Rob Mohler.


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PARTICIPANT: (Rob Mohler.) Yes.


PARTICIPANT: (Rob Mohler.) So I don't have

anything prepared, but I -- but I do have -- I have

done a lot of modeling and study of the dam

structure. And as Kathy had mentioned earlier, we've

done a survey of that dam and I've taken that

information back to the office and done some

hydraulic modeling to see what's possible at that

site and really what's likely to happen at that site.

So modeling is not an exact science, but with

hydraulics and hydrology, we have a -- it's a pretty

sound science and, like I say, it's not exact, but

it's very approximate and very reasonable

understanding to use in this situation. And so what

I have done is to estimate based on the size of the

watershed for this pond how much water comes through

the lake and through the dam on a seasonal basis, so

a monthly -- every month it has typical average

flows, which is very seasonal. High flows in the

spring, low flows in the summer, medium flows in

other parts of the year, which is basically what


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we've kind of heard as part of this hearing. And if

you run those flows through that dam and that

spillway that spillway can -- as constructed by our

measurements a 7 foot wide spillway and approximately

4 feet high and that structure can only handle so

much water under certain conditions and if you push,

for instance, 90 cubic feet per second through that

spillway you're going to have approximately 2 1/2

feet of water flowing over that dam. And 90 cubic

feet per second is the typical spring average flow.

In the summertime, it drops to roughly 5 to 7 cubic

feet per second and under that condition you're going

to have approximately 2 to 3 inches of water running

over that dam. And based on what I've heard and what

I can tell that this falls in line with a lot of the

testimony we've heard here. Nothing -- nothing

surprises me. It all sounds reasonable. What -- the

area where things can change is intervention, so we

can put more stop logs in -- in the dam potentially

under certain conditions or release a little more

water through that fishway and I've kind of tried to

study those scenarios but there is only so much that

can be managed there. And I'm prepared to answer

questions about all of this, but I -- I guess that's

really all I have.


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MS. HODGEMAN: Okay. Thank you, Rob. We

will call you back up for any additional questions,

but first we would like to hear from the other

agencies as well. Thank you.

PARTICIPANT: (Carolyn Wronker.) Can you

say what exact agency he was from?

MS. HODGEMAN: He was from the Department of

Environmental Protection. So next we will have Mike

Brown from the Department of Marine Resources.

Please state your name for the record.

PARTICIPANT: My name is Michael Brown.

MS. HODGEMAN: If you could raise your right

hand. Do you affirm that the testimony you are about

to give is the truth and nothing but the truth?

PARTICIPANT: (Michael Brown.) I do.


PARTICIPANT: (Michael Brown.) Thank you

for inviting us here today for the opportunity to

comment on what may be a water level management plan

for this lake. I work for the Maine Department of

Marine Resources, specifically river herring for the

last number of years. And our main concern for this

particular lake is that we have enough water in the

spring to operate the fishway that's there. It's one

of the commercial alewife fisheries that we have in


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the state. There are roughly 21 existing commercial

fisheries. We want to make sure that there are

enough fish in our system that can successfully get

into the lake, spawn and the juveniles leave.

Typically, as we've heard, springtime isn't an issue.

There is typically enough water in the springtime to

be able to operate the fishway. We work with dam

owners, we work with commercial fishermen to come up

with a plan that works for everybody on the ground

and we've been fairly successful here on those

improvements I think that we can probably make. What

becomes more problematic for us is the summer and

fall flows. We certainly want to make sure that the

juveniles can get out, that the juveniles leave and

we can't get our successive year classes so they can

come back. We want to make sure those juveniles get

out with low water flow and we may have control over

that and we may not, it depends on what the situation

is for a particular water body. It may be better

that there is no flow until you can assure some type

of flow in the system and we do that through draw

down of the lake, draw down to some locations which

are very successful in providing a window of

opportunity for these fish to get down. Certainly

what we don't want to see is fish become stranded and


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constrained behind beaver dams when you have fairly

limited flows and that may occur because you have a

thunderstorm during a day or two and that may raise

water levels a half inch or so over the dam, which

will attract fish wanting to move downstream, but it

may very well end up abandoning those fish or

stranding those fish in the stream and that's

something we don't want to see. So for us, we want

to make sure that we have enough water in the

springtime to operate the fishway, which typically

isn't a problem for us. We want to see that fishway

operational for upstream passage from April 15 until

June 15, that's when our commercial season ends and

typically when the river herring or alewife fishery

ends in all of our locations and then making sure

that we have enough flow. Not necessarily down

through the fishway but downstream during the fall

and we don't want to see that be any later than say

the end of October. It's -- you get into November,

water temperatures are getting cold and there is

certainly risk of those fish not making it and having

some fatal effects due to water temperatures. So

that's our concern and that's what we would like to

see moving forward. That's pretty much it.

MS. HODGEMAN: Okay. Thank you, Mr. Brown.


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And we do have three folks from the Inland Fisheries

and Wildlife. We will start with Keel Kemper, who

will be discussing the wildlife concerns. Will you

please state your name for the record?

PARTICIPANT: I'm Keel Kemper.




PARTICIPANT: (Keel Kemper.) I do.


PARTICIPANT: (Keel Kemper.) Thank you for

the opportunity to be here. My name is Keel Kemper

and I'm the regional wildlife biologist that covers

this particular area. Because I need to talk quickly

because I have two associates that would also like to

talk, I want to address two important points. Dyer

Long Pond contains four habitats that are provided or

referred to as significant wildlife habitats under

the Natural Resources Protection Act. Those four

habitats are referred to as inland, water fowl and

wading bird habitats. They would be characterized as

wetlands that have very high emergent wetland

components and are generally what we consider to be

some of our higher -- the old saying is the State of

Maine floats because it's so wet, but we try to seek


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out these emergent wetland types, but it's generally

represented by about 3 percent of the total wetlands

in Maine. It is interesting that Dyer Long Pond has

four of them, one at the north end that is 168 acres,

one that is 13 acres on the west shore, one that's

11.7 acres sort of further down on the east shore and

then at the bottom on the south end of the lake 168.5

acres. Water fowl and wading bird habitats, they

generally are considered sort of production areas for

water fowl. These higher value emergent wetlands

generally respond better with water on them. It's

hard for them to function as well in the absence of

water.

I would -- my second point is that the state

fish and wildlife department owns -- literally owns

dozens of dams like this across the State of Maine.

I have at least five under my jurisdiction locally

where we have pretty well-defined management regimes.

We are very familiar with putting in flash boards and

removing flash boards. One thing while we can all

sort of play around with where that exact water level

is, but we all know that wildlife, particularly water

fowl, wading birds, loons respond better to stable

water level. So fluctuating water levels give

wildlife a hard time and so we generally try to


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manage in ways that capture high water in the spring,

hold it for a period of time with the understanding

that stable water levels are probably more important

than just exactly where they are. It's that up and

down fluctuation that causes wildlife a problem.

I am happy to answer questions at the

appropriate time, but for now I'll offer the

microphone to my associates.

MS. HODGEMAN: Thank you, Mr. Kemper. Next

on the list is Wesley Ashe, who will be discussing

the fish issues. Please state your name for the

record.

PARTICIPANT: Wes Ashe.

MS. HODGEMAN: Wes Ashe. Please raise your

right hand. Do you affirm that the testimony you are

about to give is the whole truth and nothing but the

truth?

PARTICIPANT: Yes. So for Dyer Long Pond

it's a -- for our management, if we don't manage the

water for trout -- first of all, it's for trout and

salmon. The water is really not conducive -- it's a

warm water fishery so it's not really conducive to

that kind of management. There are also Atlantic

salmon concerns, so that's another reason why we

don't manage it for inland trout and salmon


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population. So our major concern in Dyer Long is the

bass population. There is a considerable large mouth

bass population. There is a remnant small mouth bass

population and I think individuals in this room would

probably know more about the small mouth bass

population than I do.

So the major concern for us is similar to

wildlife in that bass spawn in the spring and we're

really looking for stable water levels during that --

during that time frame, preferably the May, June time

frame. And really for the most part that's our major

concern is just stable water levels during that

period to enhance bass population. And that's all I

have to say.

MS. HODGEMAN: Thank you. And finally,

Diano Circo. Could please state your name for the

record?

PARTICIPANT: Sure. I'm Diano Circo.


right hand? Do you affirm that the testimony you are


truth?

PARTICIPANT: I do.


PARTICIPANT: (Diano Circo.) Thanks. My


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testimony is fairly brief. I am the chief planner

for the Department. I am responsible for the

Department's water access facilities. We own about

38 acres on the west side of Dyer Long Pond and it

includes a hand carry boat launch. That facility was

built around 1998. We have since that time gone out

and watched the facility over time. It was

originally constructed to be an ADA compliant hand

carry site. It's no longer functioning that way

simply because the water levels have gone down to a

point where the ramp system in place in order to

provide that type of access isn't functioning. So we

have provided you engineering plans of what that

property looked like, which gives you elevations that

we took at the time of construction and our request

is simply that the water level be managed in a

consistent way so that we can provide the ability to

provide public access. That means we obviously need

to reconstruct a portion of that site at this time

because it's been damaged over a period of years. In

order to do that reconstruction, we need to have some

predictability of what those water levels are going

to be so we can do the appropriate thing with the --

with the facility. In the documents that we provided

for you it shows some survey work that was done on


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the facility before we purchased -- sorry, before we

constructed the facility survey work that was done to

determine water level. That work was done in

December of 1995 and showed a water level at 128

feet. It was that level at which we used to design

and build the facility.

MS. HOWATT: What month?

PARTICIPANT: (Diano Circo.) December.

Yup. December 1995. And that's all. Thank you.

MS. HODGEMAN: Thank you. So at this time,

I would ask the petitioners, do have you any

questions for any of the Department staff?

PARTICIPANT: (Carolyn Wronker.) Yes, I do.

MS. HODGEMAN: Mr. Prouty is representing --

PARTICIPANT: (Carolyn Wronker.) Okay.

MR. PROUTY: I have one question.

MS. HODGEMAN: Who would you like to call

first?

MR. PROUTY: Rob.

MS. HODGEMAN: Okay. Rob.

MR. PROUTY: I'm sorry, Mike Brown from the

DMR.

MS. HODGEMAN: Okay. We'll start with Mike

Brown.


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EXAMINATION OF MIKE BROWN

BY MR. PROUTY:

Q. Thank you. Mike, I am sure you've seen the

letter from the marine biologist in your department

asking for parameters in that. How does this -- are

you comfortable with that as a possible regime for

this pond?

A. I think that would be one possible regime,

yes.

Q. But basically the more water, the better,

right, or the steadier the water, I guess?

A. Certainly enough water to provide downstream

passage at least in the fall no later than November

and an upstream passage to water through the fishway

in the springtime for the period April through June

15.

Q. So I read that with quite a bit of interest

that putting the stop logs in in November when it was

easier than trying to do it in flood conditions will

enable us to have water in the spring to bring the

water up over the spillway for the fish to come in.

A. Yes.

Q. And also if you say have some water at the

end of the season when you put the stop logs in, I

think, that was either, what, late July or early


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August you have water for the -- still have enough

water for those juveniles to leave?

A. Yup. Correct.

Q. So you would concur that that's a decent

proposal?

A. Yes, I would.

MR. PROUTY: All right. I thank you.

MS. HODGEMAN: Don't go anywhere yet.

MR. PROUTY: All right. Now -- thank you,

sir. I now have a question for -- did I get the --

the first name, was it Giamo?

MS. HODGEMAN: Mr. Prouty, what we're going

to do next is we're going to have the dam owners ask

questions and the Department and then we'll have the

other staff come up, so you can save your questions

for them.

MR. PROUTY: Thank you.

MS. HODGEMAN: Okay. Thank you.

CROSS-EXAMINATION

BY MR. OLSON:

Q. Mr. Brown, Richard Olson for Mr.

Saltonstall. Have there been any particular

complaints by the fishermen or the users regarding

the alewife population in this pond to your

department?


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A. The only -- the only comment we've had from

the harvester was last year is the fact that they

didn't have enough fish there to fish commercially

for more than three weeks, but that's what happens

sometimes. Sometimes there are fish, sometimes there

aren't.

Q. But you're -- I heard Mr. Prouty ask you is

the biologist report is that an acceptable proposal,

is the current situation acceptable to your

department as well?

A. The current situation seems to work well

with the parties that are involved. That hasn't

always been the case at this particular site, but the

harvester that we have and the way that things have

been operated in the last few years it has worked

well. We work through the town, the state manages

the commercial fishery there with the town. The town

leases that fishery with management oversight through

the Department to a harvester and the harvester and

the folks managing the dam have worked well together

in this particular case.

Q. Okay. But I thought at the beginning of

your testimony you talked about there might be some

things that we could do or change or do you -- can

you be more specific about that or is that something


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we need to figure out going forward?

A. I think that's something we probably need to

figure out going forward. Every situation is a

little bit unique.

Q. But so far you haven't met with Mr. Grady or

Mr. Saltonstall to talk about suggested changes?

A. We have not no.

MR. OLSON: That's all I have.

MS. HODGEMAN: Mr. Brown, at this time,

we're going to have agency comments and questions for

you and then you'll be dismissed after that.

PARTICIPANT: (Michael Brown.) Okay.

DEP EXAMINATION OF MIKE BROWN

BY MR. BOAK:

Q. Hi, Mr. Brown. I want to go back to you --

you were referencing the comments that were submitted

in writing by DMR.

A. Yes.

Q. Is that -- what's reflected in those

comments, is that DMR's recommendation in this

proceeding?

A. That is.

Q. Do you have any other recommendations here

today?

A. I have no other recommendations other than


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systems are often very unique and there is more than

one way to approach water levels and fish passage.

Specifically from my point of view, we try to manage,

you know, fish that are entering the system or

leaving the system, but the written comments you have

are the ones that we are suggesting for this

particular pond at this time.

Q. And when you say that there are other ways,

do you have any thoughts on any other appropriate

ways? I understand your recommendation is what's in

the record in writing, but do you have any thoughts

on any other appropriate ways at this site?

A. At this point, none without talking with

people that manage the dam in other ways to approach

water levels especially during the fall.

MR. BOAK: That's all I have. Thanks.

PARTICIPANT: (Michael Brown.) Thanks.

DEP EXAMINATION OF MIKE BROWN

BY MS. HOWATT:

Q. Mr. Brown, I just have one follow-up to

that, I'm sorry.

A. No problem.

Q. Sorry. I just want to be clear that I

understand there are a range of potential operational

regimes that could be worked out?


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A. Yes.

MS. HOWATT: Thank you.

MS. HODGEMAN: Mr. Brown, you're dismissed.

PARTICIPANT: (Michael Brown.) Thank you.

MS. HODGEMAN: Mr. Prouty, is there anyone

else you would like to call up in terms of the agency

folks?

MR. PROUTY: Probably Inland Fisheries and

Wildlife and I'm sorry if I am wrong, was it Giamo?

MS. HODGEMAN: Diano, okay.

PARTICIPANT: (Diano Circo.) Hi.

CROSS-EXAMINATION OF DIANO CIRCO

BY MR. PROUTY:

Q. One question, was your December water level

128, I believe that's above sea level, right?

A. Correct.

Q. Okay. Yup. We got that. And then the boat

ramp was designed to be handicap accessible; is that

right?

A. It was. Correct.

Q. And so now we'll have to -- if it's rebuilt

it will have to know where the average water level is

going to be held; is that right?

A. That's correct. If you've been out to that

facility and looked it the plank system is actually


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supposed to be in the water and is not in the

water.

Q. Right.

A. In fact, I've been with the Department for

almost two years, but I've been out to the site

multiple times and I don't think I've ever seen the

ramp actually in the water, so we certainly need some

consistency to be able to design that appropriately

so that we can actually facilitate people being able

to have a hardened surface all the way into the

water.

MR. PROUTY: Okay. That's all. Thank you.

PARTICIPANT: (Diano Circo.) Sure.

MS. HODGEMAN: We'll go to the dam owners

now.

CROSS-EXAMINATION OF DIANO CIRCO

BY MR. OLSON:

Q. Thank you. So it was designed for a water

level of 128, did I understand that correctly?

A. That's correct.

Q. And what's the -- do you know what the 100

year flood level is?

A. I do not. I do not.

Q. I understand the 135 feet surprises you as

being the flood level?


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A. I have no reference for that. I can't

really answer that question.

Q. And do you know what the current level is?

A. I do not. It -- I do not know what the

current level is. I can tell you that the ramp has a

significant drop-off at the end of it and there are

several feet from the end of the hardened plank ramp

to the actual beginning of the water and typically we

would have our ramps into the water to about 3 feet

of depth generally to allow the ability to launch.

Q. But as far as you know nobody has gone out

there and surveyed currently what the water level is

and --

A. No.

Q. -- what the ramp level is?

A. No.

Q. For all we know it might have been built

wrong?

A. Potentially. You can -- you can also take a

look and see where the shoreline has been impacted by

water levels and where the ramp sits and gets a

judgement of at one point whether or not the water

was working with the ramp itself.

Q. Have you done that?

A. I've observed that, yes.


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Q. And it looked like it did work at one

point?

A. I couldn't tell you if the water was there

at one point. I can tell you that the way the bank

erosion looks compared to where the ramp sits that at

some point if the water level was equal to where that

zone looks like it was that the ramp would have been

in the water at that point. Can I tell you that the

water was there? I can't tell you that.

MR. OLSON: Thank you.

MS. HODGEMAN: Thank you for your

cooperation with the microphone. At this time, we'll

do agency questions. Kathy.

MS. HOWATT: I have nothing at this point

for IF&W.

DEP EXAMINATION OF DIANO CIRCO

BY MR. BOAK:

Q. My understanding is that you -- your request

is that there be predictability whatever the water

level is?

A. That's correct.

Q. If the water was higher than it presently is

right now that would be acceptable as long as it's

predictable?

A. Absolutely. Yes.


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Q. Are there any limits -- is there any range

in your opinion about what would be appropriate

provided that it's predictable?

A. I think -- I am not sure what the upper

range of that would be. I can tell you that the

lower range is pretty close to what -- to getting not

functional for us just because of the length of the

ramp we would have to design and construct to

actually reach the water. The lower that level gets

the longer that ramp gets the higher the costs

become. And also we try to build these facilities

and we're thinking from an ADA standpoint the

distance that somebody has to travel, we'd like to

keep that to a level that is reasonable for them. We

cannot move that parking lot further towards the

water than it is right now without having some impact

to shoreland, so all we have is the ability to change

the distance of the ramp itself. The lower the water

the longer that ramp has to be and probably the less

functional it becomes for somebody who might have a

mobility issue.

Q. And just so I understand what you said

before, if the water were to stay as it has been

let's say the last couple of years --

A. Mmm Hmm.


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Q. -- would that be an acceptable -- if it was

predictable and acceptable?

A. If it was predictable we could probably

design to make it work. There would need to be

reconstruction of the ramp facility itself to meet

that.

Q. Is it -- if I hear you right, I think it's

at the lower end of what would be okay or is it

okay?

A. Right now, it's not okay because the ramp

doesn't function at all without re-engineering or

reconstruction. I think if the water level were to

drop further than where it is today the length of the

ramp that we'd have to build could become either cost

prohibitive or user prohibitive in terms of the

length of distance that people would have to travel

from the handicap parking place to actually

physically utilize the site.

MR. BOAK: Thanks.

PARTICIPANT: (Diano Circo.) Yup. Thank

you.

MS. HOWATT: I have no questions for you

Mr. Circo, but I do have a question for Mr. Kemper

and one for -- well, I have two questions for

Mr. Kemper.


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MS. HODGEMAN: Petitioners? Mr. Prouty, do

you have any questions for Mr. Kemper?

MR. PROUTY: No, I do not.

MS. HODGEMAN: Mr. Olson?

MR. OLSON: I don't have any questions right

now.

MS. HODGEMAN: No questions, okay.

DEP EXAMINATION OF KEEL KEMPER

BY MS. HODGEMAN:

Q. So in the -- I believe in -- on one of the

shelves in there there is a laser pointer and my

question was you had mentioned some wading bird

habitat, can you point those out to us on the map?

A. Yes. So there are two larger ones up in

this area here and you notice it drains this

particular wetland here.

Q. Mmm Hmm.

A. This is about 165 or so acres. There is

another one sort of right down in here --

Q. Mmm Hmm.

A. -- which I believe is 17 acres. A third

one -- I'll have to get my map. I don't know if it

it's this cove or this cove right down in here. And

then the south end is the remaining larger one that

sort of encompasses this area here. Which if --


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which if you go there, it's the area with all of the

emergent vegetation, that's where all of the bass

fishermen want to be, okay.

Q. Mmm Hmm.

A. So it's right in here. And these are

referred to as inland water fowl and wading bird

habitats and they are afforded significant wildlife

habitat protection under the Natural Resources

Protection Act, so that's kind of why our interest is

here.



BY MS. HOWATT:

Q. And so relative to those wading bird

habitats, you said that they have to have some water

in them and I wonder what water level is optimal and

what range of water level is acceptable in those

habitats to both maintain the habitat and to provide

access to them by the birds and other animals that

might use them.

A. I'm going to interpret that as some sort of

how would I manage it type of question maybe?

Q. Yes. Yes. Thank you.

A. Okay. So these are higher value wetlands.

Wetlands provide a whole host of functions and


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values. One of them is certainly wildlife habitat

and particularly water fowl production areas. And

the fact of the matter is is those functions and

values are better served with water on them. They're

emergent wetlands. They can't function without a

fairly significant amount of water on them. If you

go out in June and you see, you know, the pond lilly

or the pickerel weed and it's falling over because

there is no water there, I mean, that would be an

issue for us. But let's just in a general sense, and

I'll just skip to this, we are very well versed in

managing dams for wildlife.

Now, let's all be clear, there are a lot of

resources here and human interest issues. Many times

our properties are we manage them just for wildlife

issues and so as a general rule this is what we try

to accomplish. We try to capture the high water in

the spring. We generally do that with flash boards.

The reason that you capture the high water in the

spring is that it allows the water to push back into

the alders or the shrub swamp wetlands that are

generally around these areas and that provides more

brood cover. So you increase or enhance the brood

cover for the little baby ducklings so that they can

survive rather than be eaten very quickly. We try to


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capture the water in the spring and we try to hold it

there for the water fowl production season, which we

generally identify as around April 15 to about July

1. At that time, we are less concerned with water

levels. And, in fact, we were out yesterday removing

flash boards from areas that the water fowl nesting

season is over, all of the ducks are done their thing

for the year and so we generally will lower those

water levels throughout -- throughout the summer with

the purpose of being -- arriving and going into

winter with a -- not a low water level but a lower

water level than in the spring, but that's primarily

to protect the integrity of the dam, okay. It's a

lot easier to have a dam that has less ice action

pounding against it and so we generally go into

winter with a lower water level generally to protect

the dam structure itself and maintain its integrity.

We also have some concerns for over

wintering the fur bearers. And fur bearers really --

they like to go into winter with stable water levels

again. So that's kind of our regime. We generally

capture the water in the spring, hold it through to

mid-summer and then slowly release water going into

fall and winter at a lower water level. And we do

this times -- dozens of times all over the state.


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Some areas that maybe you might be familiar with is

the Ruffingham Meadow on Route 3 near Belfast, St.

Albans Wildlife Management area, the Madawaska Bog,

the Range Marsh, the Pond Farm, I mean, literally we

have dozens of dams that we manage like this for

wildlife, but understanding this is a much larger

component than just a wildlife management problem.

Q. Certainly. Thank you. Can you tell us what

fur bearing mammals are present in Dyer Long Pond in

the winter or would there be any?

A. Well, yeah, mink, otter, beaver, muskrat,

those would be the four right off the top.

Q. Okay.

A. Fisher on the outsides. All of our fur

bearers are going to be found at Dyer Long Pond. We

already know that we have a plethora of beaver. The

beaver are only going to complicate the management

issue because they tend to go in and dam when people

don't want them to do. But certainly, mink, otter,

beaver, muskrat, those would be the four -- four

primary ones that we're concerned with. We're not so

concerned with fisher because it's really a critter

of the upland, not of the wetland.

Q. Okay. Okay. And can you -- can you also

describe for us what nesting water birds are present?


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A. What nesting water fowl would be present?

Q. Yes.

A. Well, you've got the whole suite of them, so

we can start with the ground nesting ducks, which are

going to be mallards and ring-necks and green and

blue wing tail. We can -- we can go to cavity

nesters, which are going wood ducks and mergansers.

You're probably a little far south to get common

goldeneyes, but that's a potential there. This -- in

the southern end in the early 90s and some of you may

have been around long enough to remember Jim Dorson,

the wood duck man who was from Gardiner, he handled

the ducks here at the had south end of Dyer Long

Pond, which he maintained for years. When he passed

away, we kind of took him out, it's a little flashy

here, you get wet on Dyer Long Pond if you aren't

careful. But back to your question, wood mergansers,

wood ducks, goldeneyes, all of the ground nesters.

Pretty much all of the ducks that we have and those

are the ones you're going to see.

Q. And do you also manage for the loons? There

are -- we had a lot of comments about loons.

A. That's a very good question. We don't

manage the loons specifically. One of the reasons is

they're quite ubiquitous, but we do recognize that


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loons are very, very susceptible to water level

regimes. Their lay eggs get way back on the bottom

and that's why they build the nest right up near the

shore so they have a real hard time if the water, you

know, they're subject to either being stranded as the

water level recedes and there is some distance from

the shore or alternatively being flooded out. You

see things like loon nesting platforms and things

that are done to ameliorate that. But to be frank,

it's not a species that we really manage for. In

fact, the surveying of loons in Maine is not done by

the Fish and Wildlife Department, it's done by the

Maine Audubon Society and they only count them in the

southern end of the state. So we have so many loons

in the north they don't even count them. That's not

to discount them. You know, everyone loves them and

they're great, but we all recognize their

susceptibility to fluctuating water levels and there

are sometimes management actions you can take to

ameliorate that.

Q. And my last question is about the loons. So

the -- your department had recommended during the

summer a stable water level not fluctuating more than

1 foot, would that be appropriate for loons as well?

A. Yeah, loons can live with that.


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MS. HOWATT: All right. Terrific. Thank

you so much.


BY MR. BOAK:

Q. Have you had the opportunity to read the

recommendation from the Department of Marine

Resources?

A. I have not.

Q. If I give a copy to you can you take a quick

look at that? I want to see if that -- if that

recommendation -- your thoughts on it as opposed to

your recommendation, how it -- your reaction.

A. I'd be happy to look at it. Do you want me

do look at this and come back or just have a look?

Okay.

Q. It's about a little over a page. I think

it's October 2017 is the date. And I guess my

question is after you've looked at that is -- well,

one, I'll get your impressions from the standpoint of

IF&W's recommendation and whether it's consistent

with that.

A. I mean, we appreciate that there is an

effort on April 15, which is in our own line is what

we declare as the beginning of the water fowl nesting

season in Maine, so that's consistent there.


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Measuring a total of 16 inches in height and remain

in place in the dam notch. If I'm just managing for

wildlife, I'd probably want a little more height than

that because then that allows me to get more brood

cover. That's what I'm after, okay. But that's

strictly if I'm just managing for wildlife. June the

15th through Labor Day are placed in the fishway

exit, I don't know how that affects the wildlife

issue. All stop logs are removed to allow the

juvenile fish. There is no -- there is no question

that from our perspective after the water fowl

nesting season is done then there is not a need to

have to hold the water for them and so we are

comfortable with the water, you know, sort of leaving

the system and it's in the best interest of the dam

owners for the integrity of his dam to go through

winter. We have lots of dams and when they break and

fall apart it's a real problem, so we really look at

having a lower water level to keep the ice action on

them to a minimum. This looks reasonable. I have

some concern about putting stop logs in in November

because then -- then you get a big -- you get a big

pile of rain like we've had, now all of a sudden

you've got a lot more water against the face of the

dam and -- and so we would never put -- the idea of


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putting in stop logs as we're going into winter so

they'll kind of be there in the winter, that's not an

activity that we would engage in nor recommend. We

always put our stop logs in in the spring and you

know what, if it's -- yup, at times it's really

flowing fast and we just use smaller stop logs,

multiple ones, you see what I'm saying? Rather than

putting in a 24 inch wide board, it's almost

impossible to move that around once the water

level -- once the water level is against it, but

with, you know, a little short board you can put in

multiple ones. That's kind of how we deal with this

water pressure issue on -- at some of our facilities.

But this looks -- this looks reasonable, but I

just -- I have some concerns about putting stop logs

in in November and December. I'm not convinced

that's going to be very good for your dam long-term.

We all would agree we don't need a dam failure.

Q. Okay. Thank you. And the other thing I

thought I heard you say too is that from the

standpoint of 16 is that just to keep the water fowl

there, you know, if you had your druthers it would be

something like 18?

A. Yeah, 18 or 20. I'd like to get a little

bit more, but that's strictly from a wildlife


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perspective.

MR. BOAK: Okay. Thank you, sir.

PARTICIPANT: (Keel Kemper.) All set?

MS. HODGEMAN: We have no further questions

for Mr. Kemper.

MR. OLSON: Are we allowed to recross and

seek further information?

MR. PROUTY: I'd like to ask a question.

MS. HODGEMAN: I will -- I will allow it at

this time, so we'll start with the petitioners.

PARTICIPANT: (Keel Kemper.) So am I done

or is this for me?

MS. HODGEMAN: This is for you.

RECROSS-EXAMINATION OF KEEL KEMPER

BY MR. PROUTY:

Q. You were pointing your laser at the southern

end of the pond at the wetland. With the history of

it being low so many years, do you find that there is

some in-filling and turning into soil in that area?

A. Well, I mean, I think you find that, you

know, success if you have an area that does not have

water on it those conditions change and your plant

communities come in. Emergent wetlands that don't

have water on them turn into shrub swamp wetlands, so

they -- they move away from being pickerel weed and


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begin to become alder and that's just in a general

context.

Q. Right. And it takes time to do that --

A. Sure.

Q. -- but your whole idea is more water, more

protection from, am I getting that right?

A. Those wetlands function better and provide

for their functions and values with -- with water on

them.

MR. PROUTY: All right. Thank you.

MS. HODGEMAN: Mr. Olson, did you have

questions as well?

RECROSS-EXAMINATION OF KEEL KEMPER

BY MR. OLSON:

Q. Thank you. Do you know whether anyone at

your Department has done any modeling as to what the

impact would be of raising the water level another 12

inches or 18 inches for that matter?

A. We've done no modeling.

Q. Okay. And I understand the general

principle that more water is probably better for the

water fowl management you were talking about, did I

understand that correctly, right, normally?

A. Wetlands perform functions and values, a

host of them, and one of them is wildlife habitat and


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they function better wet.

Q. And I guess there are wetlands now and they

are wet, right?

A. Yeah.

Q. So as we sit here today, do we know if we

raise the water level are they going to function

better or differently or how do we evaluate that?

A. Emergent wetlands require water on them.

Emergent wetlands that don't have water on them over

time change wetland types. These areas are

identified because they are high value emergent

wetlands and that's what we're sort of -- when we

reach out to identify areas that have higher habitat

values that's what we look for, emergent wetlands.

It's just hard to get away from the fact that

emergent wetlands need their feet wet and they need

to be in water, whereas, say alders we all know can

grow in just a moist condition, so alders would not

require that. So we're dealing with emergent

wetlands, very specific wetland types. Only 3

percent of all the wetlands in Maine are emergent

wetlands, so emergent wetlands need good water levels

to have them function at their optimum. Are they

still out there? Sure. Under a lower water level,

it's just not as ideal for emergent wetlands, but I'm


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speaking very specifically to that wetland type.

Q. Okay. But these -- these wetlands are

still -- these have been evolving under the current

regime and are still existing, you know, there is no

immediate threat to this existing wetland system or

is there?

A. I wouldn't call it an immediate threat, but

over time things will change. No, there is it no

immediate threat.

MR. OLSON: Okay. Thank you.

MS. HODGEMAN: Thank you, Mr. Kemper.

PARTICIPANT: (Keith Kemper.) Thank you.

MS. HODGEMAN: At this time, Petitioners, do

you have any questions for Mr. Ashe on the fish

issue?

MR. PROUTY: No, we don't.

MR. OLSON: No.

MS. HODGEMAN: Okay. At this time, do you

have questions for Mr. Mohler from the Department of

in Environmental Protection?

MR. PROUTY: No.

MS. HODGEMAN: Mr. Olson.

MR. OLSON: If I could just have a minute to

check my notes.

MS. HODGEMAN: Mmm Hmm. We do have


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questions for you, Mr. Mohler, so you're not off the

hook yet.

MR. OLSON: Why don't you go ahead.

MS. HODGEMAN: Okay. So at this time, we

will start off our questioning and if you come up

with questioning we will allow questions after that.

DEP EXAMINATION OF ROB MOHLER

BY MS. HOWATT:

Q. Rob, can you -- Rob, we're going to bring up

the elevation survey work that you did last fall with

Dave Waddell and with myself and our hearing officer.

And can you speak to the elevation survey and then to

the flow modeling that you did a little bit? We'll

have some questions directly related to those. So a

question that I have is can you speak a little bit to

the range of water levels that would be allowable

under the Department's Water Level and Flow Rule,

which is Chapter 587?

A. Yes. So I've dealt with numerous similar

issues of this nature and we do have a Chapter 587

intended to cover flows and more directly withdrawals

of water, but generally the regime that we normally

work within is a 1 foot range in the early summer

through July and then allow another foot, so a total

of 2 foot range from the normal high water line


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and -- well, I'll let you continue with the

questioning, but that's -- 2 feet is a pretty typical

range for a lot of different resources.

Q. And that's based on the Department's Water

Level and Flow Rules, which are applicable to dam

controlled ponds; is that correct?

A. That is correct. And that's also the --

yes. I mean, and that's based on what we see in --

I'm trying to come up with the terminology, but even

non-dam controlled water bodies.

Q. So -- sure. That's how we see natural

ponds --

A. Yes.

Q. -- and lakes operate under our precipitation

here, so we want the damned water bodies to also

operate in that same fashion, one foot in the summer

I understand and up to 2 feet in the winter of water

level fluctuation?

A. Up to 2 feet after July 31.

Q. After July 31.

A. Yes, so it's still summertime.

Q. Thank you. And the second question I have

is whether you can discuss with us the range of

downstream flows that would be allowable under the

Department's Water Level and Flow Rule on which you


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did do some modeling on -- earlier in July?

A. Yes. So the modeling is done so we have

numerous rivers, streams in the state that have flow

gauges in them where we've got accurate measurements

of seasonal flows. That's a very small portion of

rivers and streams in the state that actually have

gauges in them, so for the rest of these resources we

have to have some means of estimating expected flows

and to that extent U.S.G.S. has developed some

equations for us to use to estimate those flows on a

seasonal basis based on the size and location of any

particular watershed. So it's a common request of my

unit and, you know, these were in most cases the best

estimate we have to work with, so.

Q. Terrific.

A. Do you want to get into the specifics of --

Q. Sure. Because the flows are -- the flows

out of a lake are based generally on the in-flow, so

looking at the recharge area of a lake, we would look

at -- I mean, the modeling would consider how much

water is coming in generally to predict how much

water is going out, right?

A. Correct.

Q. And so our -- the flow estimates that you

have made have monthly -- so the average or median


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flow in each month --

A. Yup.

Q. -- you have a median flow and you have mean

flow and for the audience, can you describe the

difference between those two values?

A. Well, they have different utility but

they're -- so for anyone who is looking at the

documents, so the median flow is truly the, you know,

you take 50 percent of the flows for that given month

are above that median flow and 50 percent are below

that median flow. The mean flow is the average of

all of the flows for, you know, for the entire period

of the month. So, I mean, it's -- they're very

comparable, but not -- not -- for my modeling on

the -- on Dyer Long Pond I used the mean, monthly

mean flows.

Q. Okay. Terrific. And just for the record,

I'm not sure if we've done this before, I know what

you do in DEA, but we just only had said that you

work in the Department in the Division of

Environmental Assessment, could you explain a little

bit your background and why you're good at the things

that you do relative to figuring out what kind of

water levels should be, what kind of flows should be

in a lake?


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A. So I am an engineer with the Division of

Environmental Assessment and one of my primary

responsibilities is working with rivers and streams.

First and foremost with point source discharges. All

our municipal discharges, industrial discharges and

understanding flows to provide sufficient dilution

for many of these point source discharges and this

water withdrawal and water level aspect has been a

natural carry-through of that work and something I

have practiced for 15 years now, so.

MS. HOWATT: Great, Rob. Thank you.


BY MR. BOAK:

Q. I'm going to ask some more basic questions

about these two documents to make sure I understand

what I'm looking at and I'm going to start with the

one that reads Maine Department of Environmental

Protection-Flow Criteria.

A. Yup.

Q. And starting at the top there is some --

some information that says surface area of 425 acres,

that's the surface area of Dyer Long Pond?

A. Water surface, yup.

Q. Okay. And the date on this would be the

date you submitted this?


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A. Originally conducted the -- I ran the

calculations, yeah.

Q. Okay. Now, there is a chart below that

information underneath the heading Median Monthly

Stream Flows for Ungauged, Unregulated Streams and

Rural Drainage Basins and on the left side you were

talking about that median flow and mean flow?

A. Yes.

Q. Is that -- that's not -- that's not unique

to Dyer Long Pond?

A. That is unique to Dyer Long Pond. That's

based on -- so that's based on -- your copy does not

have the colorized, so this is a model where we have

a number of inputs and those flows are the result of

the inputs.

Q. Okay. So -- so that chart then on the left

side that I was talking about is -- is what gets spit

out for using your modeling for Dyer Long Pond?

A. Based on the parameters that are put in that

are specific to Dyer Long Pond, yup.

Q. Okay. And the parameters that are on that

charge on the right side and that's -- those are

specific for Dyer Long Pond as well?

A. Yes.

Q. Okay. CFS is cubic feet per second?


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A. Correct.

Q. There is a chart underneath the input

parameters that says 7Q10?

A. Yup.

Q. What is that?

A. So that is kind of a critical flow that the

7Q10 stands for 7 days flow for a 10 -- 10 year

recurrence interval. So that's a -- what that says

is every 10 years we can expect flows to come down to

this very -- that's kind of the minimum flow we would

expect to see of -- on a 10 year recurrence interval.

So that's the low of the low and for discharges

that's something we need to design to. For this

particular instance that's not necessarily anything

we need to design or -- or work around.

Q. There is a sentence in the middle of the

page that says something that MDEP has established

the following criteria under Chapter 587. It goes

on, that sentence.

A. Yup.

Q. Is that referring to the -- the information

below that?

A. That is referring to that and that portion

of this sheet is more directed at if someone were

having a withdrawal from this resource, pumping water


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to irrigate crops or to fill trucks or some other

need that would limit them as to how much they could

withdraw.

Q. Are there recommended -- recommendations on

this document that you are making?

A. No. I am just -- I am -- for my modeling --

for my hydraulic modeling of the dam structure, I use

these mean flows that are in...

Q. Right. And that -- that mean flow in the

first column -- large column in the upper left?

A. In the second column.

Q. Yeah.

A. Yes.

Q. Okay. I'm going to switch gears a little

bit and look that survey document of the dam.

A. Mmm Hmm.

Q. Did you prepare that?

A. Yes.

Q. And I just want to understand a little bit

of what I'm looking at. There is a picture that

looks like, of the dam, and that's from above looking

down?

A. Correct.

Q. Okay. There is a chart beneath that and it

seems to correspond with aspects of the drawing with


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letters and I want to just ask you a couple questions

about that chart to make sure I understand how to

read it. The first entry is at the top of the dam

and then it has another column for reading and then

another column of relative elevation and location.

Reading, can you just tell me what that is?

A. That is so when we do a survey we set up our

station in a fixed location that's not going to move

and we get everything level and so that that rod

reading, you know, and then you bring the rod over to

all these various different points and get a reading

from the rod and so that's kind of a reference

elevation.

Q. So at some point it's zero, I imagine?

A. No, not necessarily. Usually you set this

up at about eye level, so usually you're -- no, there

is no need for it to be zero, but it is -- it's

intended to get the reference height of everything

that you need to look at.

Q. So the first two entries are top of the dam

and sill of the dam, they have readings of 5.145 and

then 9.565?

A. Correct. And the difference between those,

so they're 4 -- roughly 4 feet in elevation

difference.


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Q. And at the bottom of this whole chart there

is a line separating what looks like some

measurements for the dam and then some for the boat

launch, do you see that?

A. Yes.

Q. Okay. So using your readings on these, are

we able to then sort of compare the different heights

of this part of the dam to the different aspects of

the boat launch?

A. Yes.

Q. By doing what we just did with -- with some

math?

A. Yes, with the -- exactly. And the

assumption that the water surface on the pond is

perfectly level. So we transposed our elevations

from our first set up to then to the boat launch.

Q. And so looking at under description, it's

the third to the last one, it says, NHWL on rock in

the collection of stuff by the boat launch?

A. Yes.

Q. Are you referring to normal high water line

on rock?

A. Yes.

Q. And that would have been over by the boat

launch there?


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A. Yup.

Q. And so that says 6.8 in the reading, do you

see that?

A. Yes.

Q. And so if I -- if I'm reading this right,

does that mean that the normal high water line that

you're looking at there is about 1.7 feet above the

top of the dam measured on this day?

A. No, that would not be correct.

Q. Okay. So what -- what's going on?

A. So the difference -- so we had to set up our

transit at the dam and we had to set it up again at

the boat launch, so that's why there is -- those --

there is a line between there, so we will have two

set-ups and so then the reference elevations

become -- are different for each site.

Q. Are you able on this document to tie the two

places together so that I could compare, you know, a

difference between a dam reading and let's say a boat

launch reading?

A. Well, so the third column --

Q. Yup.

A. -- is relative elevation and so that's all

based on the measurement of the water level.

Q. So -- so perhaps the better thing to do


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instead of using the reading would be to use that

elevation --

A. Correct. That should all be uniform.

Q. Okay. So using those same ones at normal

high water line on rock of 128?

A. Yup.

Q. And top of dam it says above 130.285, am I

correct then that the top of dam is 2.285 feet higher

than the normal high water mark?

A. Correct. Yes. Yes. Roughly, yes.

Q. Okay.

A. There was very strong correlation between

the high water lines we read at both sites.

Q. And is there a normal high water line mark

at the dam site?

A. No, it was not quite as distinctive, but

we -- if you look at the -- there is a -- we took

number of readings, top of moss, top of black

staining, top of spalling, they're all in that

general range of 128 feet.

Q. Okay. I got it.

A. Yup.

Q. And so the top of black staining, is that

sort of what we see on rocks like the mark on a rock

that would normally be --


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A. Yes.

Q. -- like the water line?

A. Yup.

Q. And when you're -- we're talking about top

of dam, we're not talking about the sill line, we're

talking about the shoulder piece of the dam?

A. Correct.

Q. Yup. Okay. Okay. And then that last

column location we've got some circled letters and

those just correspond to your dam drawing; is that

right?

A. Yes.

Q. Okay. Date on this is 10/26/17, was that

the date that these measurements were taken?

A. 10/19 is what...

Q. Oh, I see up in the right corner -- top

right corner 10/26.

A. I think that's the date that the -- that it

was put on that document, but I think our survey date

was the 19th.

Q. Got it.

MR. BOAK: Okay. All right. Thank you.

PARTICIPANT: (Rob Mohler.) Yup.


BY MR. BERGERON:


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Q. For the record, this is Mark Bergeron. Rob,

just one question along those lines of the survey.

Sometimes we use fixed data elevations that are

reference to some survey mark or some other thing,

along Scott's line of reasoning that was not done,

this was used -- used assumed data elevations,

correct?

A. That's correct. This would not be

considered -- right.

Q. So this isn't tied specifically say to sea

level or some other --

A. That's correct.

Q. -- defined --

A. Those numbers are approximating a sea

level --

Q. Okay.

A. -- but there is no -- not tied into any

specific data. And I'll -- you know, just after

talking this through, the biggest use of this

information is the reference of everything to itself,

so the difference in elevations are very accurate.

Q. And that was the -- my next question was

along Scott's line of questioning was this survey we

can compare the elevations of the dam with the

elevations of the boat ramp and the elevations --


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A. Yes.

Q. -- of the -- the evidence of the normal high

water mark?

A. Yes.

Q. You have water elevations were taken on that

survey date, but that --

A. Yup.

Q. -- just gives you a snapshot in time, but,

again, we can use this information to compare those

two or three items against each other, correct?

A. Correct.

Q. Thank you.

A. And -- and -- yes. And -- exactly. And the

sill of the dam is, for instance, you can draw the

reference from the high water line to the sill of the

dam. I mean, it's quite clear.

Q. Correct.

MR. BERGERON: Great. Thank you.



BY MR. BOAK:

Q. I am just going to follow-up on that so I

fully understand. So while not tied to any

particular data source it is apples to apples at the

two sites within this assumed elevation?


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A. Yes. Yup.

MR. BOAK: Thanks.

MS. HODGEMAN: So at this time, do the

Petitioners have any questions for Mr. Mohler?

CROSS-EXAMINATION OF ROB MOHLER

BY MR. PROUTY:

Q. Just so I understand, so with this study you

could tell me if the water at the dam site was held

to the mean high water mark where it would show on

the end of the boat launch, would it be -- can you

tell, would it be back up to where the concrete

boards end or?

A. Well, so the most direct correlation I can

give you was we took a reading at the bottom plank,

which was out of the water.

Q. And at the bottom of the bottom plank or the

top edge or the center line or do you know?

A. It -- well, so roughly it was -- it was a

foot-and-a-half below that bottom -- the water level

was a foot-and-a-half below the bottom plank on this

date.

Q. Okay.

A. And that was approximately 2 feet below the

normal high water line.

Q. Okay. Which is just about where the dam was


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trickling at that --

A. And the dam was --

Q. And it was just oozing over the spillway?

A. Correct.

Q. Okay.

A. Yup. So the -- yeah, the water level was

roughly at the sill of the dam for this, yup.

Q. Which is just about what it is now.

MR. PROUTY: All right. Thank you.

MS. HODGEMAN: Mr. Olson, do you have

questions for Mr. Mohler?

MR. OLSON: I do.

CROSS-EXAMINATION OF ROB MOHLER

BY MR. OLSON:

Q. I'm a little confused.

A. I get that a lot.

Q. So -- so last fall you went out to try to

see how high the water was, is that a fair way to

characterize it?

A. Yeah. Yes, and beyond that. I -- I -- we

wanted to understand some of the implications

associated with the dam structure.

Q. And -- and I'm not quite clear whether you

came to some conclusions from that exercise.

A. No.


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Q. Okay.

A. We -- it's a fact-finding --

Q. Okay.

A. -- and I -- far from a conclusion.

Q. Okay. Because that's what we're trying to

do. So, I mean, with some of these questions we're

trying to get conclusions from the work you did.

A. I see the value of this as to inform that

process, so.

Q. Right. And I guess to put -- I guess to put

it in some sort of perspective in -- and, again, if I

get it wrong, I apologize, but it sounds like in the

fall we would normally expect the water to be

relatively low?

A. Mmm Hmm.

Q. It was going over the -- over the dam in

some fashion, some water is going over the top of the

stop log in the dam.

A. Um...

Q. Spillway. Sorry. Spillway.

A. When we did the survey there was no stop

log.

Q. Okay.

A. And the water was right at the sill, the

concrete sill of the dam.


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Q. Okay.

A. Yup.

Q. So that's not consistent with what Mr. Grady

said about there being a stop log there in the

fall?

A. It's not, but it is with what he had said.

Q. Okay.

A. He said last year was -- we did not expect

to see --

Q. Okay.

A. -- water over the sill of the dam.

Q. Okay. And at that point, is it fair to say

the water level relative to sea level was close to

128 feet or above that or below it? Can I determine

that or can we determine that from your work?

A. So we have done our best job to put this at

sea level reference.

Q. Yeah.

A. It's within plus or minus probably 6 inches,

which is not --

Q. Okay.

A. -- super accurate, but it was -- no, the

water level was 2 and a -- let me just make sure I

don't -- so just over 2 feet below the normal high

water line, which, again, is --


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Q. Okay.

A. -- not necessarily surprising --

Q. All right.

A. -- for the time of year we did this.

Q. Around 125 1/2, is that ballpark?

A. Yes.

Q. Okay. All right. I just wanted to

understand that.

MR. OLSON: Thank you.


MS. HODGEMAN: Okay. Thank you, Rob. So I

just want to take a moment to thank every party that

was here today for your participation in this

hearing. I appreciate all of you coming out to

present evidence in this water level adjudicatory

hearing. I am going to close the hearing record

meaning I will no longer be accepting sworn testimony

at this time with the following exception: There

will be a public evening session so testimony

received during tonight's evening session of the

public hearing, I will remind the parties -- the

parties that -- witnesses who pre-filed testimony on

behalf of a party in this matter will not be

permitted to testify at tonight's evening session,

but individuals who are affiliated with a party in


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this matter may testify at the evening session only

in their personal capacity and not on behalf of a

party.

Closing briefs and reply briefs: So

pursuant to Chapter 3, Section 23, quote, all parties

have the right to submit briefs and proposed findings

of fact in writing after the close of the hearing and

close of the record within such time as specified by

the presiding officer, end quote. So in this case, I

will provide the parties with an opportunity to

submit reply briefs in reply to two comments made in

the closing briefs. So the reply briefs will be due

one week after submittal of closing briefs.

So and finally, written public comments,

which we will continue to accept as we continue to

process the application. Written comments should be

sent directly to Kathy Howatt. Her card is on the

table by the door with all of her contact

information. You may either send her via mail or

email any information you would like. So we are not

closing the broader administrative record today, but

once the record is closed it may be re-opened at any

time; however, I will only open the record again on

demonstration of good cause for why the record should

be re-opened or at my discretion if I find the need


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to do so.

Finally, just one last reminder that from 6

to 8 p.m. tonight here, we will be conducting the

public comment session to accept additional

information for the administrative record from the

public. So at this time, I will officially close the

hearing.

MR. OLSON: Did you say what the date was

the briefs were due?

MS. HODGEMAN: The briefs -- I apologize.

Briefs will be due August 31. Briefs will be due

August 31 and one week after that reply briefs.

At this time, I will close the record.

Thank you all very much.

(Hearing concluded at 4:09 p.m.)


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PUBLIC COMMENT SESSION

MS. HODGEMAN: Good evening, everyone. I

will now call to order this public comment session of

the Maine Department of Environmental Protection on

the water level regime for Dyer Long Pond in

Jefferson, Maine. This public hearing is being held

in accordance with Maine Administrative Procedures

Act, Title 5, Sections 9051 through 9064,

Establishment of Water Levels Title 38, Section 840

and Chapter 3 of the Department's Rules Governing the

Conduct of Licensing Hearings.

Commissioner Paul Mercer, the Commissioner

of the Department of Environmental Protection

exercised his discretion and has decided to hold this

proceeding in response to a petition filed with the

Department by 35 littoral and riparian owners known

as the Petitioners along with Dyer Long Pond. The 35

petitioners represent more than 25 percent of the

littoral or riparian proprietors of Dyer Long Pond in

accordance with the same section of law thus

mandating this proceeding.

My name is Christina Hodgeman, Policy

Director for the DEP and I am representing -- I am

the presiding officer over this public hearing.

Other DEP staff with me here today are Mark Bergeron,


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Bureau of Land Resources Director; Kathy Howatt,

Hydropower Coordinator; and Ruthann Burke,

administrative staff.

And just a couple administrative items

before we get started: The emergency exits to this

room are behind you there and out this door to the

left. The restrooms are located just outside this

door. And if you have any additional questions about

building issues, please approach Ruthann about those.

Also, for those speaking tonight, an audio

recording of the hearing is being recorded by Robin

Dostie of Dostie Reporting. Please keep that in mind

and speak clearly into the microphone. Prior to

speaking, please state your name and the organization

you are representing, if any, and the town that you

are from.

At this time, I will turn it over to Kathy

to discuss the details of this evening session.

MS. HOWATT: Hi. My name is Kathy Howatt.

I am the project manager for the Dyer Long Pond Water

Level Petition. The Department accepted the petition

to establish a water level and, if necessary,

downstream flows for the Dyer Long Pond on March 23,

2006. The Department's review of the case considers

the following regulatory criteria outlined in Section


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4 of the dam's Registration Abandonment and Water

Level statute.

The regulatory criteria that we will

consider are: A, the water levels necessary to

maintain the public rights of access to and use of

the water for navigation, fishing, fowling, that's

bird hunting for all of you that don't know, let's

see, fishing, fowling, recreation and other lawful

public uses; B, the water levels necessary to protect

the safety of the littoral and riparian proprietors

and the public; C, the water levels and minimal flow

requirements necessary for maintenance of fish and

wildlife habitat and water quality; D, the water

levels necessary to prevent the excessive erosion of

shorelines; E, the water levels necessary to

accommodate precipitation and run-off waters; F, the

water levels necessary to maintain public and private

water supplies; G, the water levels necessary for any

ongoing use of the dam to generate or to enhance a

downstream generation of hydroelectric or

hydromechanical power; and H, the water level

necessary to provide flows from the dam at the outlet

of Dyer Long Pond to maintain public access and use,

fish propagation, fish passage facilities, fish and

wildlife habitat and water quality downstream of the


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body of water.

We're going to ask that you limit your

comments to items that fall under these regulatory

review criteria for the water level petition. The

public hearing including the evening session tonight

is meant for the Department to gather information and

comments in order to make the best informed decision.

It's not a session to ask questions, rather it's

meant for us to hear your comments on the water

levels -- on the water level petition.

So thank you for taking the time to come

here to the hearing and to share your thoughts.

There are sign-up sheets on the table over here next

to the door. Any member of the public who would like

to offer testimony should sign-in on these sheets and

they will provide a list of the people who wish to be

called to testify. Please write or sign your name

legibly. If you do not want to testify this evening,

the administrative record in this matter will remain

open to receive your written comments until a water

level order is issued. So written comments should be

sent to the Maine Department of Environmental

Protection, attention Kathy Howatt at 17 State House

Station, Augusta, Maine, zip code 04333-0017. You

may also email comments to me, spell -- to me,


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spelled my name, K-A-T-H-Y dot Howatt, spelled

H-O-W-A-T-T at Maine.gov or you may hand deliver them

to the Department at 28 Tyson Drive, Augusta, Maine.

And there are business cards up here on the table

near the sign-up sheets with my contact information,

so be sure to grab one of those as well.

The Hearing Officer will call those who have

signed-up to testify and when your name is called, if

you could please come up to the podium and clearly

identify yourself by name and place of residence

before beginning your testimony. You'll see that

there is a microphone here and you may want to check

and -- we have already turned it on. Forget that

part. You can just leave it on. We're planning to

provide each person testifying five minutes time to

ensure that we have an opportunity to hear everyone

who has come to speak this evening. So with that,

I'll turn it back over to Tina.

MS. HODGEMAN: Thank you. And so as Kathy

mentioned, we will allow five minutes per person, so

please try to stick to that time frame. If you do

have additional comments you can submit those in

writing to Kathy. Mr. Prouty, I understand that you

are here to represent the petitioners, so if you'd

like to have a seat at the petitioner's table that


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would be outstanding.

If you are testifying this evening we will

allow the opportunity for the petitioners and the dam

owner's representative to ask questions of you. And

please just make sure that you answer those questions

to the best of your ability. If you don't know the

answer to a question, just tell them that you don't

know or maybe you don't feel comfortable answering

that, that is perfectly fine.

So with that, we will get started. Are

there any questions at this time about the process

for this evening? Wonderful. So I have comments in

support of the petition. The first person I see on

here is Janet Smith. Would Janet Smith please come

to the podium? So I'm going to swear you to your

testimony, Janet. Can you please state your full

name for the record?

AUDIENCE MEMBER: Sure. I'm Janet Smith.

I'm at 41 Sunrise Park Road, Jefferson.




truth?

AUDIENCE MEMBER: (Janet Smith.) I do.

MS. HODGEMAN: Thank you. You now have five


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minutes.

AUDIENCE MEMBER: (Janet Smith.) Thank you.

What I -- initially having been here for the

afternoon session, what I initially wanted to share

with you was my tale about the dead fish that have

landed on our shore over the past number of years at

times of low water level and at times when that green

scum, I don't have the proper name for it, but you

know what I'm talking about, lands in front of your

home. I'm not a fisherman. I understand they were

bass fish, so the boys tell me. Those fish were not

harmed in any way. They were simply dead. So I

wanted to tell you a little more about that, but

that's really not what I want to say.

And then I wanted to tell you about how we

cannot adjust our dock system anymore, which we put

in in 1997 when we bought our property. We can't

adjust it anymore because the water level has

decreased so much, but that's really not what I want

to tell you.

What I really want to say is after sitting

here and listening to the comments all afternoon, I

have come to the conclusion that this is not about

what makes us happy. It's not about what we like.

It's not about what I feel is proper, what I feel is


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the solution to this. It's not about the number of

meetings we've had in our yard with up to 80 people

from around the lake coming together to say what can

we do. We've had many of those meetings. It's not

about the too many hot dogs that we ate at those

meetings. It is about solving the problem. And what

I heard this afternoon is it is not about what

happened in the past. It's not about who knew what.

It's not about the history of when certain things

were built or who did what when. It's about going

forward before we lose our body of water, before we

lose the beauty of this incredibly wonderful

atmosphere.

When Rich and I decided to buy property up

here, that is him, we saw the property from the road

and we just about didn't have to get out of the car.

We said, this is it. This is it. This is where we

want to be. And this is where we still are and this

is where we're going to stay. However, we feel -- I

feel that we have an important job to do in keeping

this body of water beautiful and safe and a beautiful

place for the wildlife to grow and the lush

vegetation to thrive. So we can't do this. We have

talked about it, we, our neighborhood, we have talked

about it for years. We do not have the expertise.


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We have the desire, but we don't know. What I heard

today and what I heard today was expertise. I heard

people say there is something we can all do together.

We can come to an understanding about this and there

is a recommendation. I heard incredibly intelligent,

well-prepared comments from all of those experts that

you brought here today that have been working on

this. It is not about what we want as a neighborhood

or as residents around the lake, it's what the

experts can help us solve. And I am appreciative of

the work that has happened to this point. And from

the expertise that those people brought forward today

we learned a lot. We just had a quick supper and we

learned a lot that we didn't know that we thought we

knew and we didn't about what can be done and how

important it is.

So that's what I wanted to share with you,

not about the dead fish on my shore, however, I am

still upset about that. So that's what I want to

say. Thank you.

MS. HODGEMAN: Thank you, Miss Smith.

Mr. Prouty, do you have any questions for Miss Smith?

MR. PROUTY: No, thank you.


MR. OLSON: No. Thank you.


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MS. HODGEMAN: Thank you, Miss Smith. Next

on the sign-up sheet is Bill Hall. Bill Hall? Okay.

I'll come back around. Ben Benedetti. Good evening.

Can you please state your name for the record?

AUDIENCE MEMBER: Yes. My name is Ben

Benedetti. I live at 79 King Cove Road on the east

side of Dyer Long Pond.

MS. HODGEMAN: Thank you. Can you please

raise your right hand? Do you affirm that the

testimony you are about to give is the whole truth

and nothing but the truth?

AUDIENCE MEMBER: (Ben Benedetti.) Yes.


minutes.

AUDIENCE MEMBER: (Ben Benedetti.) Yes.

I -- my wife and I, Jane, we had bought our property

back in 1980 and when we bought the property the

water was up higher and there were four planks in the

dam. I took my canoe to find out a little about the

pond, went down the middle of the pond not knowing

where rocks might be or anything, but when I got to

the dam I noticed that there were four planks in

there and the water was at least 2 to 2 1/2 feet

higher than it is now. And I -- I can't say much

more other than that, that I've been down to that dam


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several times and I've seen branches in the spillway

blocking the fish ladder, which I removed so they --

because it was just about the time the alewives were

coming back up and there hasn't -- since then, there

hasn't been much done with that dam. I've seen

pallets put against it and various assemblies of

things that people tried to block it up a little bit

to build the water up, but they were removed as

usual. And it's good to see that the people that

came today and testified, especially the DEP and the

wardens because they really eloquently said what's

happening to our -- the swampy area around the land,

the wetlands. I can't say much more about that, but

I agree totally with what they've come up with when

they're -- with what they said. So other than that,

I don't have anything else. It's -- we bought the

property because the pond was beautiful. I'd like to

see it restored to beauty like it was. Thank you.

MS. HODGEMAN: Mr. Prouty, do you have any

questions for Mr. Benedetti?

MR. PROUTY: No, I do not.

MS. HODGEMAN: Thank you. Mr. Olson?

MR. OLSON: No, thank you.

MS. HODGEMAN: Thank you, Mr. Benedetti.

Next is Robert Hanna.


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AUDIENCE MEMBER: (Roberta Hanna.) Roberta.

MS. HODGEMAN: Roberta. My apologies.

Roberta.

AUDIENCE MEMBER: (Roberta Hanna.) That's

okay, everybody does it.

MS. HODGEMAN: Can you please state your

appropriate name for the record?

AUDIENCE MEMBER: My name is Roberta Hanna.

I live in Waterville. My brother --

MS. HODGEMAN: Do you mind swearing to your

testimony?

AUDIENCE MEMBER: (Roberta Hanna.) I'm

sorry.

MS. HODGEMAN: So raise your right hand. Do



AUDIENCE MEMBER: (Roberta Hanna.) Yes.


minutes.

AUDIENCE MEMBER: My brother and I own

property on the lower end of Dyer Long Pond on Trask

Lane. I have been enjoying the offerings of Dyer for

almost 70 years now. My parents bought a seasonal

camp lot in 1959 and built over the next few years.

We've enjoyed the lake and its wildlife and fishing


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and swimming and boating for as long as I can

remember.

In the years prior to the Saltonstall

purchase of land at the foot of the lake, I remember

the dam as being simply a pile of rocks and sandbags

that we camp owners maintained ourselves. The dam

was in its most natural state, as Mr. Olson referred

to earlier this afternoon at that point, but it

wasn't working and eventually over the years it

deteriorated. So in the mid-'70s when the

Saltonstalls purchased the property they offered to

build a new dam with a proper fish ladder in exchange

for dam and water level rights. We all agreed

cautiously based on the need for a new structure and

the good faith afforded by the Saltonstall family at

the time. We all seemed to work well together with

water levels and stop log heights consistent to

maintain a reasonable lake level throughout the

season given the lake's usual lowest point in mid to

late August. We were welcome to fish at the dam, to

hike the trails at the end of the pond and enjoyed a

good relationship with the Saltonstall family.

Several years passed and around the late

'80s or mid-'90s I noticed our domestic water pump

was pulling in an excessive amount of sediment into


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our water system. This persisted with water levels

continuing to lower particularly in July and August

to the point where in 2011 we had to install a

filtration system for our pump to prevent clogging

with sediment. Even now our intake pipe is too short

for us to draw relatively clean water to use. And

about that time is when I saw the no trespassing and

private property signs posted all around the dam.

Also, we have a 20 foot long ledge on the

water edge of our property, which is never fully

exposed in the past until mid-August. It is now

exposed in mid to late June. Clearly, the lake level

is not being maintained to provide a consistent,

dependable experience for all of us to enjoy and for

the native flora and fauna to prosper. Lake

fluctuations in the summer in Maine are normal, but

our experience over Dyer over the past 10 to 15 years

has been nothing short of neglect.

My grandchildren are now in the fourth

generation of my family to enjoy the peacefulness of

my favorite place. I certainly hope we can all

resolve this contentious debate and help each other

once again maintain a well-balanced lake system

beneficial to all. Thank you.

MS. HODGEMAN: Thank you, Miss Hanna. Mr.


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Prouty, do you have any questions for Miss Hanna?

MR. PROUTY: Thanks for your comment. Thank

you very much.

MS. HODGEMAN: Mr. Olson.

MR. OLSON: No questions.

MS. HODGEMAN: Thank you. Nate Smith.

AUDIENCE MEMBER: I'm Nate Smith. I live on

Trask Lane.




AUDIENCE MEMBER: (Nate Smith.) Yes.


minutes.

AUDIENCE MEMBER: (Nate Smith.) We bought

our -- we bought our camp in 2004 and shortly

thereafter we had one of the meetings at the other

Smith's up the lake to talk about the water level.

This was before we knew anything about the history of

it. We are among the petitioners and we have been

talking about this now from 2004 or 5 until now and

I'm just very happy to see that we seem to be getting

to a point we're getting not only maybe some activity

in determining the best way to handle the water

levels, but expert opinions that can be used to


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properly manage the water as opposed to doing work on

the dam but not thinking much about what's happening

up the lake.

One of the things that I found most

interesting today were the engineering studies

gathered at both the dam as well as the boat launch

and we've known that the boat launch has been giving

us a problem as far as getting boats. We're not

seeing nearly as many boats carried in and people on

the lake as we did when we first got here. And it

seems to me the data is there that we could now look

at how to manage the dam level and the water level

from the dam and then make the boat launch function

as it was designed to do as -- and I noticed that was

number one on your priority list was accessibility to

the public and that's one of the things that we are

hoping to get accomplished. So I'm very happy to see

and I hope that we can follow-up with action on your

parts to determine the water level based on the good

science that I saw presented today. I a biologist

with an undergraduate degree, so I understand the

wildlife and I appreciated that very much, but there

is more than just wildlife. There are a lot of other

things that need to be taken into consideration.

Thank you.


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MS. HODGEMAN: Thank you. Mr. Prouty, do

you have any questions?

MR. PROUTY: No questions.



MS. HODGEMAN: Thank you. I have Ron and

Linda Swanson. Would you like to speak individually

or together? Mr. and Mrs. Swanson? No? Haversat?

Jim and Sue Haversat. Steve Giza? Giza? Jeanne

Paterak.

AUDIENCE MEMBER: Jeanne Paterak.

MS. HODGEMAN: I'll have you state your name

for the record.

AUDIENCE MEMBER: Hi. I'm Jeanne Paterak

and I live in Portland, Maine as a permanent

residence and I own my camp on Shady Lane with my

siblings.

MS. HODGEMAN: Will you please raise your



truth?

AUDIENCE MEMBER: (Jeanne Paterak.) I do.


AUDIENCE MEMBER: (Jeanne Paterak.) Yup.

MS. HODGEMAN: You have five minutes.


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AUDIENCE MEMBER: (Jeanne Paterak.) I'll

just say that I concur with most of what I've heard

today as far as time line. My parents bought the

property back in 1968 or '69, built the property in

1969-1970. And actually it echoes quite of what

Roberta Hanna said in terms of her observations. So

I am -- so for the most part, I feel like everything

has been said and I might just say that my deepest

concern has to do with some of the more -- the

biological as a Maine -- Maine resident. I'm

concerned mostly with the environment and so also

just watching a place that I know like the back of my

hand like sort of change, you know, it's challenging

and especially in times of climate change we need to

be, you know, diligent with how we manage these

properties.

So one thing I didn't hear mentioned was the

fresh water muscles as an endangered species that's

also part of the habitat, the wildlife in our lake

and so that's another reason why the stability of the

water levels is really important. Shoreland erosion

is another one that a lot of people are on slope

sites and with the big rains we're seeing some more

erosion, which also has to do with water quality.

And that -- and the health of the trees that are on


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the shoreland. With the drought that we have that's

becoming more regular in the aerification of the

water level along the shore is really important.

So -- so the other thing is I just want to

echo what I heard from the Department of Inland

Fisheries and Wildlife and I especially -- I

appreciate that they were here because without the

testimony from what they know about the watershed

area of our property I think this would be really

lacking in process. And so as we all heard that only

3 percent of Maine's wetlands are actually emergent

wetlands, which is the technical term for the kind of

wildlife and biodiversity that happens in these

wetlands. And right now, we do have incredibly

vibrant wildlife and flora and fauna and we have few

invasive species and all of that is because of these

systems that are around the perimeter of the lake. I

have had experience of more or less walking the full

10 miles of the perimeter of the lake and at this

point, I'm like one class away from my certificate of

sustainable ecology from the Coastal Maine Botanical

Gardens, so I'm always looking. And I started

looking as a child just innocence and my awareness of

taking dingys, canoes and other, you know, boats all

around the lake and observing the boards in and out


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of the dam, having the privilege and pleasure of

having walked on the Saltonstall land when it was

open and it was open and it was a wildlife trail and

I appreciate that. I am sad that it's closed.

And so, I mean, essentially, I just think if

you look at your home page on what the importance is

of the wetlands, it's all right there and so

obviously you're having this hearing with open ears

to hear how and what might be done and how and what

is real or perceived and, as we know, we have no

control over climate and drought but we do have

control over a manmade dam at the end of a lake,

which was not always there you could argue, but it

has been in some way or fashion managed by the

landowners in the area that managed the property.

So I guess that mainly what I would like to

say is that I did hear, what was his name, Keel

Kemper say that they manage many of these privately

owned dams and they also seem to have the most and

broadest knowledge base and managing these kind of

areas and so I -- if I had any say I would say that I

would highly recommend that we would allow, you know,

the DEP would work with the Department of Inland Fish

and Wildlife to help them manage it and maybe at some

point once that stability has been restored, which


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is, you know, what all of the property owners want,

but what we mostly want is for our habitat and the

property that abuts and all those -- and in the

conservancies and I would think it would be an

interest to the Saltonstalls themselves because they

have deeded access for the nature conservancy as

well.

So I'll just say that the last thing I want

to quote is E.L. Wilson, who is a naturalist and

biologist and we should -- his quote is that we

should preserve every scrap of biodiversity as

priceless while we learn to use it and come to

understand what it means to humanity because

essentially without biodiversity we have no humanity.

Oh, and one last thing is that the wetlands

are really important as a place of water retention

and we know that Poland Spring has been in Maine

taking water away and I -- I also worry about the

aquifer health and these wetlands are really

important to the underlying structures of water

retention that has to do with us. Sorry about the

shaky voice. That's it. Thank you.

MS. HODGEMAN: Thank you. Mr. Prouty, do

you have any questions?

MR. PROUTY: No questions.


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MS. HODGEMAN: Malcom Burson. Good evening.

AUDIENCE MEMBER: (Malcom Burson.) Good

evening, Ms. Hodgeman and members of the DEP staff.

Nice to see all of you. My name is Malcom Burson. I

am a year-round resident of Portland, Maine and a

summer resident of Clary Lake in Whitefield. I am

also a certified lake monitor from the Lake Stewards

of Maine and a former board member of the Lake

Stewards of Maine. I am -- in the interest of full

disclosure, I am --

MS. HODGEMAN: Malcom, before you go too

far, would you like to swear to your testimony?

AUDIENCE MEMBER: (Malcom Burson.) Sure.


testimony you are about to give is the whole true and

nothing but the truth?

AUDIENCE MEMBER: (Malcom Burson.) I do.


AUDIENCE MEMBER: (Malcom Burson.) In the

interest of full disclosure, I am also a former

employee of the Department and very familiar with its

rules, operations and the way it conducts its

business. I am speaking tonight in my capacity as


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the elected president of the board of the Clary lake

Association, the next lake upstream as it were from

here along the Sheepscot. A lake, which as the

Department well knows, has had its own challenges in

establishing a water level order for the lake over a

period of the last seven or eight years.

I would begin by saying that I am fully

aware of the fact that the private ownership of dams

that control lakes and therefore their surrounding

watersheds and the use and enjoyment of lake property

owners is disputatious almost by definition. It's

not easy for someone who is a private owner to figure

out an appropriate way to manage water levels such

that the use and enjoyment of the lake residents can

be maintained. That being said, it seems to me, and

I am here to reaffirm the Department's interest in

and capacity to establish a water level order that

meets the criteria in the statute. Whether all of

the seven ones you mentioned earlier, I won't go

through them individually, they all seem to me based

on our experience on Clary Lake to be vitally

important. Certainly the maintenance of habitat is

crucial for both use and enjoyment and also for the

natural habitat and the creatures that dwell in it.

Like the people of Dyer Long Pond, the people -- good


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people of the Clary Lake Association continue to be

very concerned about the loss of essentially

essential aquatic services that we have been subject

to for the last seven or eight years with extremely

low water levels.

I don't think I need to remind you of all of

the very important reasons why there should be a lake

level order, but I do want to commend the Department

once again for its willingness to take a stand on

this to find ways to meet the requirements of the

statute and to deal with whatever the consequences

are of dealing with on the one hand unhappy lakeshore

owners and unhappy dam owners on the other. I have

full confidence in your ability to do that and I am

delighted to be able to speak as someone who has had

the experience on Clary Lake.

MS. HODGEMAN: Thank you, Malcom.

Mr. Prouty, do you have any questions?

MR. PROUTY: I have many about Clary Lake,

but that's not what we're here about tonight. I just

want to thank you for voicing your opinion.



MS. HODGEMAN: Thank you, Malcom.

AUDIENCE MEMBER: (Malcom Burson.) Thank


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you.

MS. HODGEMAN: Okay. I'm going to go

through the list one more time. I have Bill Hall?

Swanson? Haversat? Giza? Is there anyone else that

would like to sign-up to speak this evening? Seeing

no others, I will close the -- did you -- did anyone

else want to add anything?

PARTICIPANT: (Rod Grady.) I would like to

address everyone here not pertaining to water levels,

just access to the property.

MS. HODGEMAN: Can we do that off --

PARTICIPANT: (Rod Grady.) I want to take

just a moment --

MS. HODGEMAN: Can we do that

off-the-record?

PARTICIPANT: (Rod Grady.) I want to take

just a moment just so I can clarify --

MS. HODGEMAN: Okay. I'm going to go ahead

and close the record and if you feel so inclined you

may stay for a discussion -- further discussion

off-the-record. Okay. Seeing no other persons that

are looking to speak, I will now close the evening

session. Just as a reminder, you can continue to

submit written comments to Kathy. Her card is on the

table if you have any questions or concerns. I will


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now close the meeting.

(Meeting concluded at 6:35 p.m.)


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C E R T I F I C A T E

I, Robin J. Dostie, a Court Reporter and

Notary Public within and for the State of Maine, do

hereby certify that the foregoing is a true and

accurate transcript of the proceedings as taken by me

by means of stenograph,

and I have signed:

____________________________________

Court Reporter/Notary Public

My Commission Expires: February 6, 2019.

DATED: August 7, 2018


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< Dates >10/26/17 122:132017 september 16:1

April 15 78:12, 99:3, 103:23

August 1 60:17August 30 47:18, 47:25

August 31 131:11, 131:12

August 7, 2018 158:17

August, september 68:4

December 18 7:19

December 1995 84:9

February 6, 2019. 158:15

January 17 53:24, 55:13

July 1 99:3July 16 7:21July 19 7:22July 26, 2018 1:14

July 31 111:19, 111:20

June 15 78:13, 85:15

June 21 7:22June 25 7:21March 14, 2006 4:5

March 19, 2005 15:15

March 23, 2006 133:23

March 27 15:22March 27, 2006 4:12

May, june 82:10November 16 7:12

October 2017 103:17

September 5, 2017 5:18

'69 149:4'70 36:6, 36:7'70. 36:7'73 36:8'81 36:14'82 36:14'98 30:6.O. 2:24

< 0 >04112 2:2504333-0017. 135:24

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10/19 122:1510/26. 122:17100 56:20, 91:21

109 2:611 16:311.7 80:612 62:10, 107:17

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1800s 64:101900s 64:101959 143:241968 149:41969-1970. 149:5

1970 21:14, 26:5

1976 45:19, 56:25

1980 36:14, 141:17

1983 36:181983. 36:181990 46:5, 56:25, 61:17

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2004 15:8, 29:16, 29:22, 42:22, 146:16, 146:21

2004. 31:162006 15:20, 29:15, 42:24, 46:9, 61:12, 63:13, 71:9

2011 145:32016. 20:142017 7:13, 20:13

2017. 7:192018. 7:23207 2:8, 2:17, 2:26, 2:27, 2:34

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abandoning 78:6Abandonment 134:1

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above 90:15, 113:10, 117:21, 120:7, 121:7, 128:14

absence 80:12absolute 22:21Absolutely 35:24, 93:25

abuts 152:3accept 12:8, 130:15, 131:4

acceptable 30:2, 87:8, 87:9, 93:23, 95:1, 95:2, 97:17

accepted 4:11, 133:21

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accessibility 147:15

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accommodate 40:18, 41:8, 62:4, 134:16

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accomplished 147:17

accordance 3:5, 4:16, 7:24, 132:7, 132:20

accumulated 16:17

accurate 112:4, 123:21, 128:22, 158:5

acquire 70:11acre 4:14acres 80:4, 80:5, 80:6, 80:8, 83:4, 96:18, 96:21, 114:21

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addresses 40:15adjudicatory 3:3, 129:15

adjust 64:22, 65:3, 65:5, 65:11, 65:24, 138:16, 138:18

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affirm 3:22, 9:21, 10:6, 10:15, 10:23, 14:2, 17:9, 19:5, 21:4, 38:12, 42:12, 48:10, 74:2, 76:13, 79:7, 81:15, 82:20, 137:21, 141:9, 143:15, 146:10, 148:19, 153:16

afforded 97:7, 144:15

afraid 62:25afternoon 3:2, 44:4, 138:4, 138:22, 139:7, 144:8

age 59:7agencies 6:16, 76:4

agency 6:15, 8:16, 73:21, 76:6, 88:10, 90:6, 93:13

agenda 37:24, 38:3

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142:14agreed 15:6, 144:13

agreeing 46:6agreements 4:24ahead 15:18, 22:15, 28:3, 110:3, 156:18

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algae 16:16, 26:3

allow 92:10, 104:9, 106:9, 110:6, 110:24, 136:20, 137:3, 151:22

allowable 110:16, 111:24

allowed 9:7, 12:6, 44:1, 106:6

allows 98:20, 104:4

alluded 30:8, 30:15, 53:18

alludes 16:23almost 43:17, 60:20, 91:5, 105:8,

143:23, 154:11

already 11:25, 13:1, 62:3, 62:24, 100:16, 136:13

alter 58:14alternatively 102:7

ameliorate 102:9, 102:20

among 146:20amount 14:18, 39:25, 44:2, 44:10, 63:23, 65:2, 65:13, 72:13, 98:6, 144:25

amounts 55:7animals 97:19answer 6:15, 29:12, 49:1, 75:23, 81:6, 92:2, 137:5, 137:7

answering 137:8answers 29:7anticipate 46:3, 47:17

anybody 22:19, 23:5, 25:25, 37:15

apart 104:18apologies 143:2apologize 127:12, 131:10

apparently 46:5appearances 34:23

appeared 33:2appears 18:17, 18:19, 34:14

apples 124:24applicable 5:10, 8:10, 111:5

application 4:18, 130:16

162

appreciate 27:18, 103:22, 129:14, 150:7, 151:4

appreciated 147:22

appreciative 140:10

approach 6:25, 34:12, 39:6, 39:7, 89:2, 89:14, 133:9

approaching 55:5

appropriate 12:19, 30:2, 81:7, 83:23, 89:9, 89:12, 94:2, 102:24, 143:7, 154:13

appropriately 91:8

approve 8:9approximate 30:12, 74:17

approximately 45:20, 46:6, 68:1, 75:4, 75:8, 75:13, 125:23

approximating 123:14

April 65:10, 72:19, 85:15

aquatic 155:3aquifer 152:19archives 31:1area 18:21, 75:18, 79:14, 96:15, 96:25, 97:1, 100:3, 106:19, 106:21, 112:19, 114:21, 114:22, 142:12, 150:9, 151:15

areas 18:1,

71:23, 72:2, 72:3, 80:9, 98:2, 98:22, 99:6, 100:1, 108:10, 108:13, 151:21

argue 151:13arm 58:10Around 20:17, 22:6, 26:4, 30:6, 33:17, 36:13, 50:16, 63:17, 65:10, 72:3, 80:21, 83:6, 98:22, 99:3, 101:11, 105:9, 116:15, 129:5, 139:3, 140:9, 141:3, 142:12, 144:23, 145:8, 150:17, 150:25

arriving 99:10artificially 70:8, 71:15

as-needed 57:8, 57:10

Ashe 6:11, 81:10, 81:13, 81:14, 109:14

aspect 44:23, 46:19, 114:8

aspects 47:6, 117:25, 119:8

assemblies 142:6

Assessment 6:7, 113:21, 114:2

assist 6:25Assistant 6:17associated 126:22

associates 79:15, 81:8

Association 154:2, 155:1

assume 16:17, 19:11, 19:17, 51:22, 58:6

assumed 31:6, 123:6, 124:25

assumption 119:14

assure 77:20ate 139:5Atlantic 81:23atmosphere 139:13

Attachment 15:9, 15:22, 15:24, 16:23

attachments 17:1

attempt 46:19attempted 43:8, 58:2

attention 135:23

attest 3:12, 61:18

Attorney 1:21, 2:21, 6:17, 27:13, 38:10

attract 78:5AUDIENCE 14:10, 19:7, 113:4, 137:18, 137:24, 138:2, 141:5, 141:12, 141:15, 143:1, 143:4, 143:8, 143:12, 143:17, 143:20, 146:7, 146:12, 146:15, 148:11, 148:14, 148:22, 148:24, 149:1, 153:4, 153:15, 153:19,

163

153:21, 155:25

audio 133:10Audubon 102:13August 15:8, 18:18, 28:24, 29:2, 48:17, 60:18, 86:1, 144:20, 145:2

Augusta 12:5, 135:24, 136:3

authority 5:20, 5:24, 45:7

AV 20:8available 6:15, 7:4, 8:5, 8:6, 12:1, 12:3, 53:24

average 74:22, 75:10, 90:22, 112:25, 113:11

awarded 52:9aware 64:19, 154:8

awareness 150:23

away 39:5, 101:15, 106:25, 108:15, 150:20, 152:18

< B >baby 98:24background 113:22

bad 22:9, 24:18baffle 69:23baffles 65:15balance 39:25ballpark 129:5bank 93:4Banks 52:11base 24:11, 39:14, 151:20

Based 8:7, 13:5, 13:7,

74:19, 75:14, 111:4, 111:8, 112:11, 112:18, 115:12, 115:19, 120:24, 144:14, 147:19, 154:20

basic 114:14basically 14:7, 14:14, 14:25, 20:5, 21:14, 22:14, 24:21, 28:22, 37:14, 48:15, 54:16, 54:22, 64:6, 74:25, 85:10

basin 61:3Basins 115:6basis 74:21, 112:11

bass 16:13, 82:2, 82:3, 82:5, 82:8, 82:13, 97:2, 138:11

bearers 99:19, 100:15

bearing 100:9beautiful 139:21, 142:17

beauty 139:12, 142:18

beaver 50:22, 50:23, 78:1, 100:11, 100:16, 100:17, 100:20

beavers 32:22, 43:21, 44:14

became 68:13become 77:25, 94:11, 95:14, 107:1, 120:16

becomes 43:8, 77:12, 94:20

becoming 150:2beds 16:13beer 31:23begin 11:10, 107:1, 154:7

beginning 13:12, 21:10, 87:22, 92:8, 103:24, 136:11

begins 19:19, 69:4

behalf 6:16, 129:23, 130:2

behind 6:21, 42:18, 65:15, 69:23, 78:1, 133:6

Belfast 100:2believe 31:4, 33:14, 33:18, 41:5, 42:23, 51:18, 53:18, 53:24, 58:12, 58:25, 59:22, 60:21, 61:12, 61:19, 90:15, 96:10, 96:21

below 20:20, 28:15, 28:20, 28:21, 33:14, 44:6, 44:17, 45:1, 45:21, 51:10, 65:4, 66:10, 67:6, 67:12, 68:11, 69:21, 70:8, 113:10, 115:3, 116:22, 125:19, 125:20, 125:23, 128:14, 128:24

Ben 23:1, 24:8, 141:3, 141:5, 141:12, 141:15

beneath 117:24

164

Benedetti 23:1, 24:25, 25:18, 36:24, 141:3, 141:6, 142:20, 142:24

Benedetti. 141:12, 141:15

beneficial 145:24

Bergeron 1:20, 6:4, 122:25, 123:1, 124:18, 132:25

best 66:9, 66:16, 66:20, 104:15, 112:13, 128:16, 135:7, 137:6, 146:24

better 21:24, 35:23, 45:3, 77:19, 80:11, 80:23, 85:10, 98:4, 107:7, 107:21, 108:1, 108:7, 120:25

Beyond 48:24, 126:20

big 24:20, 104:22, 149:23

biggest 123:19Bill 141:2, 156:3

binder 7:4, 12:1, 17:2

Biodiversity 20:9, 150:13, 152:11, 152:14

biological 149:10

biologist 53:2, 79:13, 85:4, 87:8, 147:20,

152:10bird 79:21, 80:8, 96:12, 97:6, 97:14, 134:7

birds 80:23, 97:19, 100:25

bit 8:24, 34:6, 44:14, 46:14, 47:2, 60:24, 85:17, 88:4, 105:25, 110:13, 110:15, 113:22, 117:15, 117:19, 142:7

black 121:18, 121:23

blasts 24:3block 142:7blocking 142:2blow 63:1, 70:4, 70:5, 70:6

blue 51:14, 101:6

BOAK 1:21, 6:17, 26:18, 32:12, 32:15, 33:4, 33:7, 33:24, 34:7, 34:12, 35:3, 35:9, 35:14, 35:18, 35:23, 63:4, 63:8, 70:16, 88:14, 89:16, 93:17, 95:19, 103:4, 106:2, 114:13, 122:22, 124:21, 125:2

board 34:14, 34:17, 34:19, 35:9, 36:19, 37:4, 105:8, 105:11, 153:10, 154:1

boards 14:23,

18:14, 22:7, 22:15, 22:19, 36:2, 36:9, 36:14, 36:18, 36:22, 36:23, 37:4, 37:9, 62:1, 64:1, 80:19, 80:20, 98:18, 99:6, 125:12, 150:25

boat 22:5, 31:25, 32:4, 32:24, 70:13, 83:5, 90:17, 119:3, 119:9, 119:16, 119:19, 119:24, 120:13, 120:19, 123:25, 125:10, 147:6, 147:7, 147:13

boating 144:1boats 15:4, 147:8, 147:9, 150:24

bodies 51:25, 111:10, 111:15

body 77:19, 135:1, 139:11, 139:21

Bog 72:4, 100:3boots 15:3born 48:15Botanical 150:21

bothers 23:21bottom 18:9, 28:16, 28:20, 28:21, 69:19, 70:3, 80:7, 102:2, 119:1, 125:14, 125:16, 125:19,

165

125:20bought 58:23, 138:17, 141:16, 141:17, 142:16, 143:23, 146:15, 146:16, 149:3

boulder 23:24Box 2:24boy 56:8boys 138:11branches 142:1Brann 30:7break 28:4, 37:19, 58:4, 58:15, 73:17, 104:17

Break. 37:22, 73:19

breaking 36:25, 43:10

breaks 13:14, 38:22, 40:14

bridge 46:25, 47:1, 64:2, 64:3, 64:4

brief 83:1briefly 38:17Briefs 12:12, 130:4, 130:6, 130:11, 130:12, 130:13, 131:9, 131:10, 131:11, 131:12

bring 37:7, 42:2, 49:9, 49:10, 85:20, 110:9, 118:10

bringing 62:7broader 130:21broadest 151:20broke 23:15, 63:12

broken 23:16, 41:4, 61:13

brood 98:23, 104:4

brother 24:14, 143:9, 143:20

brought 20:8, 27:10, 31:17, 31:24, 42:23, 140:7, 140:12

Brown 6:12, 76:9, 76:11, 78:25, 84:21, 84:24, 85:1, 86:21, 88:9, 88:13, 88:15, 89:18, 89:20, 90:3

Brown. 76:15, 76:17, 88:12, 89:17, 90:4

brush 32:23build 22:15, 84:6, 94:11, 95:14, 102:3, 142:8, 144:12

building 6:24, 58:7, 133:9

builds 62:15built 14:16, 21:13, 21:15, 21:21, 23:23, 36:6, 36:8, 56:9, 56:16, 56:19, 56:25, 59:4, 59:17, 59:24, 60:1, 67:10, 83:6, 92:17, 139:10, 143:24, 149:4

bull 21:12bunch 32:22, 40:4

Bureau 1:20, 6:5, 15:21, 133:1

buried 31:1Burke 1:23, 6:8, 6:25, 133:2

Burson 153:3,

153:6Burson. 153:4, 153:15, 153:19, 153:21, 155:25

business 12:4, 136:4, 153:25

buy 22:9, 139:14

< C >calculations 115:2

call 3:2, 3:11, 6:4, 9:11, 15:17, 17:4, 18:16, 18:18, 33:25, 34:7, 39:12, 42:8, 48:6, 76:2, 84:17, 90:6, 109:7, 132:3, 136:7

called 16:9, 135:17, 136:8

calling 73:21Camden 15:13camp 14:16, 16:9, 20:18, 30:18, 143:24, 144:6, 146:16, 148:16

camps 16:11Canal 2:23canoe 141:19canoes 150:24capable 62:11capacity 130:2, 153:25, 154:17

capture 81:1, 98:17, 98:19, 99:1, 99:22

car 139:16card 130:17, 156:24

166

cards 136:4care 27:20careful 40:10, 101:17

caretaker 22:18Carolyn 9:1, 10:11, 10:13, 10:18, 19:3, 19:7, 19:10, 19:14, 28:9, 28:14, 28:18, 29:1, 29:4, 29:9, 34:11, 34:13, 35:5, 35:11, 35:15, 76:5, 84:13, 84:15

carried 147:9carry 19:15, 83:5, 83:9

carry-through 114:9

case 8:18, 62:8, 87:13, 87:21, 130:9, 133:24

cases 112:13casual 40:3, 47:6

categories 40:15, 41:5

caught 72:8cause 130:24caused 16:13causes 81:5causing 64:2cautiously 144:14

cavity 101:6cell 15:17center 57:25, 58:8, 58:11, 125:17

Cercena 9:1, 10:20, 10:21, 20:25, 21:2, 25:7, 26:7, 30:8, 35:21, 37:17

Cercena. 11:1,

11:3, 11:8, 21:6, 21:8, 25:11, 25:15, 25:23, 26:8, 26:12, 27:1, 34:5, 35:22, 36:3, 36:5

certain 39:25, 66:21, 72:23, 75:6, 75:20, 139:9

Certainly 46:18, 47:3, 47:14, 47:20, 77:13, 77:24, 78:21, 85:12, 91:7, 98:1, 100:8, 100:19, 145:21, 154:22

certificate 150:20

certification 4:7

certified 153:9certify 158:4CFS 62:14, 115:25

chairs 31:22challenges 154:4

challenging 149:13

chance 38:5, 41:18, 42:5, 70:20

change 29:22, 30:3, 39:15, 75:18, 87:24, 94:17, 106:22, 108:10, 109:8, 149:13, 149:14

changed 16:4, 25:16, 31:10, 31:12, 36:14, 63:16

changes 88:6changing 71:23channel 70:5, 70:6

Chapter 7:9, 7:25, 110:18, 110:20, 116:18, 130:5, 132:10

characterize 126:19

characterized 79:21

charge 115:22chart 115:3, 115:16, 116:2, 117:24, 118:2, 119:1

chasing 14:19check 29:5, 67:3, 109:24, 136:12

chicks 19:25, 20:1, 20:2

chief 83:1child 150:23children 36:7, 36:16

choose 9:5Christina 1:11, 132:22

circled 122:9Circo 6:11, 82:16, 82:18, 90:12, 91:16, 93:16, 95:23

Circo. 82:25, 84:8, 90:11, 91:13, 95:20

clarify 156:17clarifying 11:16

clarity 8:24, 20:13, 42:2

Clary 153:8, 154:1, 154:21, 155:1, 155:16,

167

155:19class 150:20classes 77:15clean 37:2, 44:15, 50:18, 50:20, 65:19, 65:20, 145:6

cleaned 44:4, 44:13

clear 35:22, 38:2, 89:23, 98:13, 124:16, 126:23

Clearly 133:13, 136:9, 145:12

climate 149:14, 151:11

clogging 145:4close 12:9, 12:10, 21:15, 94:6, 128:13, 129:16, 130:7, 130:8, 131:6, 131:13, 156:6, 156:19, 156:22, 157:1

closed 130:22, 151:4

Closing 12:12, 130:4, 130:12, 130:13, 130:21

Coastal 150:21code 135:24cold 78:20collect 13:4collection 119:19

colorized 115:13

column 117:10, 117:11, 118:4, 118:5, 120:21, 122:9

comes 46:22, 69:3, 74:20

comfortable 85:6, 104:14, 137:8

coming 27:17, 46:23, 62:11, 112:21, 129:14, 139:3, 142:4

commencing 1:16commend 155:8COMMENT 9:3, 12:9, 27:3, 76:19, 87:1, 131:4, 132:1, 132:3, 146:2

comments 13:11, 73:21, 88:10, 88:16, 88:20, 89:5, 101:22, 130:11, 130:14, 130:16, 135:3, 135:7, 135:9, 135:20, 135:21, 135:25, 136:22, 137:12, 138:22, 140:6, 156:24

commercial 76:25, 77:1, 77:8, 78:13, 87:17

commercially 87:3

Commission 4:25, 158:15

Commissioner 3:7, 5:17, 5:19, 5:25, 8:8, 132:12

common 69:7, 101:8, 112:12

communities 106:23

comparable 113:14

compare 119:7,

120:18, 123:24, 124:9

compared 18:22, 93:5

complaints 86:23

complete 4:12, 8:8

completely 38:6, 59:15, 64:1

completion 11:18

Compliance 6:9compliant 83:8complicate 100:17

component 100:7components 79:23

conceding 71:25conceive 63:10concern 25:7, 33:13, 76:22, 78:23, 82:1, 82:7, 82:12, 104:21, 149:9

concerned 99:4, 100:21, 100:22, 149:11, 155:2

concerns 26:16, 35:25, 79:3, 81:24, 99:18, 105:15, 156:25

concession 42:25, 71:9

concise 12:22concluded 131:16, 157:2

conclusion 12:11, 16:20, 127:4, 138:23

conclusions 126:24, 127:7

concrete 125:11, 127:25

concur 86:4,

168

149:2condition 60:9, 75:12, 108:18

conditions 8:10, 60:8, 61:14, 68:17, 75:6, 75:20, 85:19, 106:22

conducive 81:21, 81:22

Conduct 7:10, 12:16, 132:11

conducted 115:1conducting 7:10, 131:3

conducts 153:24conference 7:13, 7:16

confidence 16:6, 155:14

confused 126:15conjunction 59:25

consequences 155:11

conservancies 152:4

conservancy 152:6

conservatively 37:12

consider 13:2, 79:23, 112:20, 134:4

considerable 82:2

considerably 23:12

consideration 147:24

considered 9:3, 9:6, 80:9, 123:9

considering 41:6

considers 133:24

consistency 91:8

consistent

83:17, 103:20, 103:25, 128:3, 144:17, 145:13

constrained 78:1

construct 12:21, 94:8

constructed 38:24, 45:19, 56:6, 58:18, 59:20, 75:3, 83:8, 84:2

construction 4:20, 83:15

contact 15:6, 16:1, 130:18, 136:5

contained 7:18contains 79:17content 13:21contentious 145:22

context 107:2continue 12:8, 16:11, 111:1, 130:15, 155:1, 156:23

continuing 145:2

continuity 35:1contracted 59:22

control 25:3, 77:17, 151:11, 151:12, 154:9

controlled 111:6, 111:10

convinced 105:16

cool 24:20cooperation 93:12

Coordinator 1:22, 3:12, 3:19, 6:7, 133:2

copious 55:7copy 23:8, 103:9, 115:12

corner 122:16, 122:17

Correct 27:24, 29:20, 63:14, 66:17, 66:25, 86:3, 90:16, 90:20, 90:24, 91:20, 93:21, 111:6, 111:7, 112:23, 116:1, 117:23, 118:23, 120:9, 121:3, 121:8, 121:10, 122:7, 123:7, 123:8, 123:12, 124:10, 124:11, 124:17, 126:4

correctly 91:19, 107:23

correlation 121:12, 125:13

correspond 117:25, 122:10

correspondence 15:14, 30:16, 31:4

cost 95:14costs 94:10cottage 31:17counsel 8:15, 37:25

count 102:13, 102:15

County 1:7, 7:22

couple 6:20, 16:5, 19:23, 24:23, 28:7, 29:13, 31:23, 32:13, 32:23,

169

49:18, 59:19, 60:10, 60:11, 70:2, 94:24, 118:1, 133:4

course 47:2, 66:6, 66:7

Court 1:14, 158:2, 158:13

Cove 96:23, 141:6

cover 98:23, 98:24, 104:5, 110:21

covers 79:13crazy 27:19created 56:11, 64:9

creatures 154:24

crest 62:16, 62:17, 62:21, 67:6, 67:17, 67:20

cribbing 64:9Criteria 5:13, 12:24, 114:18, 116:18, 133:25, 134:3, 135:4, 154:18

critical 116:6critter 100:22crops 117:1CROSS-EXAMINATION 11:12, 11:14, 11:18, 27:7, 27:14, 27:16, 28:2, 49:14, 73:2, 86:19, 90:12, 91:16, 125:5, 126:13

cross-examine 27:22, 49:11

cross-examining 55:1

crucial 154:23cubic 75:7, 75:9, 75:11,

115:25current 29:19, 29:21, 56:24, 87:9, 87:11, 92:3, 92:5, 109:3

Currently 8:24, 9:2, 57:3, 58:22, 71:14, 92:12

Curtis 2:22cut 22:18

< D >damaged 83:20damned 111:15dams 78:1, 80:16, 98:12, 100:5, 104:17, 151:19, 154:8

Dana 30:16, 30:22

danger 46:25data 123:3, 123:6, 123:18, 124:24, 147:11

Date 12:12, 28:19, 29:6, 43:14, 68:15, 103:17, 114:24, 114:25, 122:13, 122:14, 122:18, 122:19, 124:6, 125:21, 131:8

DATED 7:18, 158:17

dates 37:2Dave 110:11Davis 30:18Day 33:17, 50:18, 50:24, 67:2, 72:21,

78:3, 104:7, 120:8

days 32:23, 54:6, 62:16, 62:17, 62:20, 67:1, 116:7

DEA 113:19dead 138:5, 138:12, 140:18

deal 105:12, 155:11

dealing 108:19, 155:12

dealt 110:19debate 145:22Debbie 14:15debris 50:22, 65:20

deceased 16:4, 30:7

December 52:5, 84:4, 84:8, 90:14, 105:16

decent 86:4decided 3:9, 31:19, 132:14, 139:14

deciduous 20:12decision 8:9, 13:7, 71:20, 71:21, 72:5, 135:7

decision-making 5:24

deck 21:16, 21:17, 21:22, 24:3

declare 103:24decreased 138:19

deeded 152:6deepest 149:8deeply 31:1defined 123:13Definitely 52:10

definition 154:11

170

degree 147:21delegation 5:20delighted 155:15

deliver 136:2demonstration 130:24

deny 8:9DEP 1:19, 6:2, 15:21, 16:2, 19:17, 42:24, 56:3, 63:7, 88:13, 89:18, 93:16, 96:8, 97:12, 103:3, 110:7, 114:12, 122:24, 124:20, 132:23, 132:25, 142:10, 151:23, 153:5

dependable 145:14

depends 77:18depth 92:10describe 100:25, 113:4

description 119:17

design 84:5, 91:8, 94:8, 95:4, 116:13, 116:15

designated 5:17, 26:19

designation 5:19

designed 90:18, 91:18, 147:14

desire 140:1desk 23:7, 25:2, 25:24

destruction 17:25

detail 7:16, 39:24

details 133:18deteriorated

144:10determine 84:3, 128:14, 128:15, 147:19

determined 4:6determining 146:24

develop 59:8developed 59:15, 112:9

development 5:22

devolved 39:11Diano 6:11, 82:16, 82:18, 82:25, 84:8, 90:10, 90:11, 90:12, 91:13, 91:16, 93:16, 95:20

died 59:2, 59:7difference 113:5, 118:23, 118:25, 120:11, 120:19, 123:21

different 29:25, 30:20, 46:8, 46:9, 111:3, 113:6, 118:11, 119:7, 119:8, 120:16

differently 47:22, 108:7

difficult 16:18diligent 149:15dilution 114:6diminished 19:20

dingys 150:24direct 13:1, 37:25, 125:13

directed 116:24directly 6:21, 6:23, 39:8, 41:1, 58:8,

110:14, 110:21, 130:17

Director 1:20, 5:16, 6:5, 132:23, 133:1

disagreement 42:20

disappearances 34:23

disappeared 23:20, 36:15

discharges 114:4, 114:5, 114:7, 116:12

disclosure 153:12, 153:22

discount 102:16discretion 3:9, 130:25, 132:14

discuss 8:24, 31:23, 111:23, 133:18

discussed 7:17, 31:16

discussing 79:3, 81:10

discussion 156:20

dismissed 88:11, 90:3

disputatious 154:11

distance 94:13, 94:18, 95:16, 102:6

distinctive 121:16

Division 6:6, 113:20, 114:1

DMR 53:2, 84:22, 88:17, 88:20

dock 14:19, 14:23, 18:5, 18:6, 21:24, 48:20, 138:16

171

document 117:5, 117:15, 120:17, 122:19

documentary 11:25

documents 83:24, 113:8, 114:15

dogs 139:5doing 20:12, 46:13, 47:21, 47:22, 59:5, 63:21, 65:7, 71:17, 72:18, 119:11, 147:1

domestic 144:24done 52:20, 63:18, 70:4, 74:8, 74:10, 74:11, 74:19, 83:25, 84:2, 84:3, 92:24, 99:7, 102:9, 102:11, 102:12, 104:12, 106:11, 107:16, 107:19, 112:2, 113:18, 123:5, 128:16, 140:15, 142:5, 151:9

door 6:22, 6:23, 7:5, 12:1, 130:18, 133:6, 133:8, 135:14

Dorson 101:11Dostie 1:13, 8:4, 133:12, 158:2

dot 136:1downstream 5:2, 40:12, 40:20, 43:19, 44:12, 49:24, 64:8,

67:16, 69:13, 78:5, 78:17, 85:12, 111:24, 133:23, 134:20, 134:25

dozens 80:16, 99:25, 100:5

Drainage 115:6drains 96:15draw 77:21, 77:22, 124:14, 145:6

drawing 117:25, 122:10

dream 58:25, 59:4

Drive 136:3driveway 47:2driving 27:19drop 14:13, 16:12, 17:19, 17:22, 18:2, 43:18, 44:18, 65:20, 95:13

drop-off 92:6dropped 18:20, 20:5, 62:3

drops 18:15, 75:11

drought 60:9, 60:11, 60:24, 150:1, 151:11

druthers 105:22dry 32:8, 46:12, 46:17, 51:12, 60:19, 60:22, 60:23, 67:24, 68:17, 68:21

dryer 43:17drying 18:22duck 101:12ducklings 98:24ducks 99:7, 101:4, 101:7, 101:13, 101:18, 101:19

due 16:6, 16:15, 27:5, 78:22, 130:12, 131:9, 131:11

dug 21:19, 70:3During 8:12, 12:4, 14:16, 14:17, 16:15, 17:19, 18:8, 39:13, 43:14, 48:16, 78:3, 78:17, 82:9, 82:10, 82:12, 89:15, 102:22, 129:20

dwell 154:24

< E >earlier 35:6, 42:6, 70:1, 74:9, 112:1, 144:8, 154:19

early 29:2, 31:12, 43:5, 64:23, 72:19, 85:25, 101:10, 110:23

ears 151:8easier 53:3, 85:19, 99:14

easiest 27:9, 69:22

easily 69:3east 80:6, 141:6

easy 47:10, 154:12

eaten 98:25ebb 61:5echo 150:5echoes 149:5ecology 150:21edge 55:11, 125:17, 145:10

effect 72:9

172

effects 78:22effort 103:23eggs 20:6, 20:7, 102:2

eight 55:5, 154:6, 155:4

either 34:24, 40:5, 51:5, 51:10, 62:23, 64:6, 72:4, 85:25, 95:14, 102:5, 130:19

elderly 30:19elected 154:1elevation 57:16, 110:10, 110:12, 118:5, 118:13, 118:24, 120:23, 121:2, 124:25

elevations 83:14, 119:15, 120:15, 123:3, 123:6, 123:21, 123:24, 123:25, 124:5

eloquently 142:11

email 30:17, 33:13, 51:5, 51:7, 130:20, 135:25

emergency 6:21, 133:5

Emergent 79:22, 80:1, 80:10, 97:2, 98:5, 106:23, 108:8, 108:9, 108:11, 108:14, 108:16, 108:19, 108:21, 108:22,

108:25, 150:11

employee 153:23enable 85:20encompasses 96:25

encountered 62:22

endangered 149:18

ended 34:20, 43:10, 43:18

ends 19:18, 78:13, 78:15

engage 105:3Engineer 6:6, 114:1

engineering 83:13, 147:5

enhance 82:13, 98:23, 134:19

enjoy 145:14, 145:20

enjoyed 143:25, 144:21

enjoying 143:22enjoyment 154:10, 154:14, 154:23

enough 40:12, 44:11, 45:10, 52:1, 57:11, 62:24, 76:23, 77:3, 77:6, 78:9, 78:16, 85:12, 86:1, 87:3, 101:11

ensure 41:10, 53:6, 136:16

entered 11:25, 62:19

entering 89:4entire 38:22, 113:12

entries 118:20entry 118:3environment 149:11

Environmental

1:2, 3:4, 3:8, 3:20, 4:4, 5:16, 6:6, 73:22, 76:8, 109:20, 113:21, 114:2, 114:17, 132:4, 132:13, 135:22

equal 93:6equations 112:10

equipment 58:4Eric 6:13, 27:8eroded 47:2erosion 40:17, 41:7, 53:17, 93:5, 134:14, 149:21, 149:24

erratic 34:23erratically 34:14

especially 44:24, 61:2, 89:15, 142:10, 149:14, 150:6

Esq 2:21essential 155:3essentially 151:5, 152:14, 155:2

establish 4:2, 5:9, 133:22, 154:17

established 7:14, 116:17

establishing 4:15, 154:5

Establishment 7:8, 132:9

estimate 74:19, 112:10, 112:14

estimates 112:24

estimating

173

112:8evaluate 108:7evaporation 47:14, 69:2

evening 24:2, 26:16, 27:4, 129:19, 129:20, 129:24, 130:1, 132:2, 133:18, 135:5, 135:18, 136:17, 137:2, 137:12, 141:3, 153:3, 153:5, 156:5, 156:22

event 62:17, 62:22

events 62:5eventually 144:9

everybody 25:4, 77:9, 143:5

everyone 12:15, 12:17, 37:23, 42:1, 43:16, 46:6, 71:25, 102:16, 132:2, 136:16, 156:9

everything 15:25, 25:4, 31:11, 31:25, 38:4, 118:9, 118:18, 123:20, 149:7

evidence 8:13, 11:25, 12:6, 13:3, 124:2, 129:15

evolved 39:10evolving 109:3exact 28:19, 29:5, 74:14, 74:16, 76:6, 80:21

Exactly 34:16,

65:23, 65:25, 81:4, 119:13, 124:13

EXAMINATION 56:3, 63:7, 71:2, 85:1, 88:13, 89:18, 93:16, 96:8, 97:12, 103:3, 110:7, 114:12, 122:24, 124:20

example 58:21except 12:7exception 129:18

excessive 134:14, 144:25

exchange 144:12excluding 12:19exemption 4:21exercise 126:24exercised 3:9, 132:14

existed 56:22existing 77:1, 109:4, 109:5

exists 71:14exit 104:8exits 6:21, 62:19, 133:5

expect 116:9, 116:11, 127:13, 128:8

expected 12:15, 112:8

experience 18:11, 40:9, 64:17, 66:19, 67:19, 145:14, 145:17, 150:18, 154:21, 155:16

experienced 46:7

experiencing

46:8expert 17:24, 146:25

expertise 71:18, 139:25, 140:2, 140:12

experts 140:6, 140:10

Expires 158:15explain 71:6, 113:21

explained 72:8exposed 145:11, 145:12

expressed 16:5expressly 6:1extend 18:5extended 22:25extensive 48:25extent 14:20, 18:25, 112:9

extremely 155:4eye 66:15, 118:16

eyeball 66:20

< F >F. 5:14face 104:24facilitate 91:9facilities 83:3, 94:11, 105:13, 134:24

facility 83:5, 83:7, 83:24, 84:1, 84:2, 84:6, 90:25, 95:5

fact 19:20, 25:21, 37:4, 87:2, 91:4, 98:3, 99:5, 102:11, 108:15, 130:7, 154:8

fact-finding 127:2

174

facts 13:7fail 52:24failed 34:20failure 105:18fair 12:21, 126:18, 128:12

fairly 34:17, 61:2, 77:10, 78:1, 83:1, 98:6

faith 144:15fall 22:21, 32:21, 33:15, 44:20, 44:22, 48:18, 50:6, 57:14, 69:2, 72:1, 77:13, 78:17, 85:13, 89:15, 99:24, 104:18, 110:10, 126:17, 127:13, 128:5, 135:3

falling 98:8falls 75:15familiar 80:19, 100:1, 153:23

family 59:6, 144:15, 144:22, 145:20

far 37:14, 45:12, 48:2, 88:5, 92:11, 101:8, 127:4, 147:8, 149:3, 153:14

Farm 100:4fashion 111:16, 127:17, 151:14

Fast 16:1, 62:15, 105:6

fatal 78:22father 29:21, 38:23, 38:24, 38:25, 39:1, 56:7, 57:1,

58:23fauna 145:15, 150:15

favorite 145:21fee 4:11feel 50:8, 63:19, 63:21, 63:23, 71:12, 71:15, 71:21, 71:22, 72:16, 137:8, 138:25, 139:19, 139:20, 149:7, 156:19

feeling 66:8felt 48:19few 17:20, 19:24, 24:22, 31:16, 38:22, 42:19, 60:21, 87:15, 143:24, 150:15

figure 88:1, 88:3, 154:12

figuring 113:23file 12:3, 30:24, 31:5

filed 3:10, 29:15, 132:15

filing 4:7, 4:11

fill 41:18, 117:1

filtration 145:4

final 8:4, 8:9, 12:12

Finally 6:16, 66:22, 82:15, 130:14, 131:2

find 15:7, 18:13, 20:11, 21:20, 106:18, 106:20, 130:25, 141:19, 155:10

findings 130:6finds 4:25fine 49:5, 56:2, 71:20, 137:9

finish 13:10fire 70:6Fisher 100:14, 100:22

Fisheries 6:10, 19:17, 76:25, 77:2, 79:1, 90:8, 150:6

fisherman 23:6, 138:10

fishermen 77:8, 86:23, 97:3

fishery 20:16, 33:16, 52:8, 78:14, 81:22, 87:17, 87:18

fishes 52:11, 52:12

fishing 24:9, 25:25, 44:5, 49:21, 134:6, 134:8, 143:25

fit 37:11Five 13:19, 16:15, 17:12, 18:17, 18:23, 19:8, 20:1, 31:24, 42:15, 48:13, 60:10, 80:17, 136:15, 136:20, 137:25, 141:13, 143:18, 146:13, 148:25

fixed 118:8, 123:3

flake 34:17, 34:19

flash 80:19, 80:20, 98:18, 99:6

flashy 101:15

175

flat 69:18flattens 64:24floating 48:20floats 79:25flood 85:19, 91:22, 91:25

flooded 102:7flooding 71:23, 72:17

flora 145:15, 150:15

flowing 45:24, 75:9, 105:6

Flows 1:6, 4:2, 74:23, 74:24, 75:2, 77:13, 78:2, 110:21, 111:24, 112:5, 112:8, 112:10, 112:17, 113:9, 113:12, 113:16, 113:24, 114:6, 115:5, 115:14, 116:9, 117:8, 133:23, 134:22

fluctuating 80:24, 102:18, 102:23

fluctuation 81:5, 111:18

fluctuations 145:16

flush 41:25, 50:6, 50:12

flushed 44:15, 44:22

[email protected] 2:35

folks 79:1, 87:20, 90:7

follow 11:19follow-up 63:9, 89:20, 124:22,

147:18followed 11:11, 11:13

following 29:10, 116:18, 129:18, 133:25

food 31:18foot 31:25, 37:10, 44:18, 67:14, 75:4, 102:24, 110:23, 110:24, 110:25, 111:16, 144:4, 145:9

foot-and-a-half 125:19, 125:20

footings 67:25forecast 47:17forecasted 62:6foregoing 158:4foremost 114:4Forget 136:13former 153:10, 153:22

forth 5:13forum 42:1forward 14:17, 16:1, 78:24, 88:1, 88:3, 139:11, 140:12

found 4:13, 20:2, 21:19, 30:20, 100:15, 147:4

four 9:9, 18:23, 20:1, 23:14, 26:23, 59:3, 79:17, 79:19, 80:4, 100:12, 100:20, 141:18, 141:22

Fourth 7:18,

145:19fowl 79:20, 80:8, 80:10, 80:23, 97:6, 98:2, 99:2, 99:6, 101:1, 103:24, 104:11, 105:21, 107:22

fowling 134:6, 134:8

frame 29:8, 30:11, 30:12, 82:10, 82:11, 136:21

frames 29:25frank 102:9free 58:4, 58:15

fresh 149:18front 138:9fry 51:15full 137:16, 150:18, 153:11, 153:22, 155:14

fully 26:23, 124:23, 145:10, 154:7

fun 24:19function 80:12, 95:11, 98:5, 107:7, 108:1, 108:6, 108:23, 147:13

functional 57:22, 94:7, 94:20

functioning 83:9, 83:12

functions 97:25, 98:3, 107:8, 107:24

fur 99:19, 100:9, 100:14

176


< G >Gardens 150:22Gardiner 101:12gate 69:18, 69:19, 69:20

gather 135:6gathered 147:6gauge 66:15gauges 112:4, 112:7

gears 117:14General 1:21, 6:17, 13:12, 98:10, 98:16, 107:1, 107:20, 121:20

generally 5:12, 11:17, 79:23, 80:1, 80:9, 80:11, 80:25, 92:10, 98:18, 98:22, 99:3, 99:8, 99:15, 99:16, 99:21, 110:22, 112:18, 112:21

generate 4:22, 58:25, 134:19

generation 67:9, 134:20, 145:20

genetic 50:9gentleman 22:24Gentlemen 52:16, 54:8, 54:11

gets 47:2, 92:21, 94:9, 94:10, 115:17

getting 28:22, 43:23, 45:12, 67:1, 69:23, 78:20, 94:6, 107:6, 146:22, 146:23, 147:8

Giamo 86:11, 90:9

giant 51:1given 113:9, 144:19

gives 83:14, 124:8

giving 147:7Giza 148:9, 156:4

goal 12:21goldeneyes 101:9, 101:18

Governing 5:21, 7:9, 132:10

grab 136:6Grady 2:31, 38:17, 38:19, 38:20, 41:24, 42:8, 42:10, 49:11, 49:14, 49:16, 56:1, 56:3, 56:5, 63:7, 71:2, 71:4, 72:25, 88:5, 128:3

Grady. 42:14, 42:17, 54:9, 54:14, 63:6, 70:18, 156:8, 156:12, 156:16

grandchildren 145:19

grandfather 46:21, 63:20

grassy 31:20Great 102:17, 114:11, 124:18

green 16:16, 101:5, 138:7

grew 38:20ground 21:17, 77:9, 101:4, 101:18

grow 108:18, 139:22

growing 26:3growlers 31:23grown 68:23guess 26:18,

33:11, 33:24, 34:2, 66:6, 69:20, 71:24, 75:24, 85:11, 103:17, 108:2, 127:10, 151:16

guy 25:3guys 30:25, 40:7

< H >H-O-W-A-T-T 136:2

habitat 40:19, 41:7, 96:13, 97:8, 97:18, 98:1, 107:25, 108:13, 134:13, 134:25, 149:19, 152:2, 154:22, 154:24

habitat/ecosystem 71:14

habitats 79:17, 79:18, 79:20, 79:21, 80:8, 97:7, 97:15, 97:18

half 36:24, 78:4

Hall 141:2, 156:3

hand 3:21, 6:3, 9:18, 10:6, 10:14, 10:22, 17:8, 19:4, 19:15, 21:3, 38:11, 42:11, 48:9, 74:1, 76:13, 79:6, 81:15, 82:20, 83:5, 83:8, 136:2, 137:21,

177

141:9, 143:14, 146:9, 148:19, 149:13, 155:12

handicap 90:18, 95:17

handle 75:5, 146:24

handled 101:12hands 16:4hang 50:16Hanna 142:25, 143:8, 145:25, 146:1, 149:6

Hanna. 143:1, 143:4, 143:12, 143:17

happen 40:8, 69:11, 74:13

happened 15:25, 26:25, 47:3, 68:5, 139:8, 140:11

happening 63:25, 68:15, 142:12, 147:2

happens 40:6, 50:5, 72:2, 87:4, 150:13

happy 48:25, 49:7, 81:6, 103:13, 138:24, 146:22, 147:17

hard 46:3, 80:12, 80:25, 102:4, 108:15

hardened 91:10, 92:7

harmed 138:12harvester 87:2, 87:14, 87:19

hatch 33:17hatchery 18:21Haversat 148:8,

148:9, 156:4He'll 39:4, 39:16, 39:17, 39:23, 40:2, 40:16

heading 115:4health 16:19, 149:25, 152:19

hear 13:11, 20:17, 20:18, 26:9, 26:13, 27:4, 35:3, 42:2, 76:3, 95:7, 135:9, 136:16, 149:17, 151:9, 151:17

heard 22:4, 27:15, 29:24, 39:2, 41:22, 42:6, 59:23, 63:19, 75:1, 75:14, 75:16, 77:5, 87:7, 105:20, 139:7, 140:1, 140:2, 140:5, 149:2, 150:5, 150:10

Hearings 7:10, 132:11

heck 23:18, 23:21

height 4:14, 14:25, 18:8, 45:2, 54:5, 68:3, 70:10, 70:11, 72:23, 104:1, 104:3, 118:18

heights 18:16, 119:7, 144:17

held 7:13, 21:16, 63:22, 90:23, 125:8, 132:6

hell 22:13Hello 9:16, 9:17, 49:16

help 16:9, 21:10, 140:10, 145:22, 151:24

hereby 158:4herring 76:21, 78:14

High 17:18, 43:6, 43:8, 55:6, 55:14, 64:7, 74:23, 75:5, 79:22, 81:1, 98:17, 98:19, 108:11, 110:25, 119:21, 120:6, 121:5, 121:9, 121:13, 121:14, 124:2, 124:15, 125:9, 125:24, 126:18, 128:24

higher 41:2, 58:21, 79:24, 80:10, 93:22, 94:10, 97:24, 108:13, 121:8, 141:18, 141:24

highly 151:22hike 144:21historical 48:18

historically 32:16, 34:9, 35:10, 53:20, 60:23

history 31:7, 32:7, 35:12, 48:19, 53:20, 53:22, 71:10, 106:17, 139:9, 146:19

178

Hmm 57:19, 59:12, 69:14, 94:25, 96:17, 96:20, 97:4, 109:25, 117:16, 127:15

hold 3:9, 3:13, 4:1, 5:1, 11:17, 41:18, 43:15, 44:1, 46:13, 46:20, 47:7, 47:8, 47:13, 47:17, 53:11, 72:20, 81:2, 99:1, 99:22, 104:13, 132:14

holding 13:11, 46:15, 47:22

home 44:3, 50:19, 67:4, 138:10, 151:6

honestly 56:23, 62:23

hook 110:2hooking 57:20hope 27:4, 42:3, 42:4, 145:21, 147:18

hoping 29:11, 147:17

horns 21:13host 97:25, 107:25

hot 139:5hours 12:4House 17:15, 21:14, 22:16, 36:6, 37:6, 135:23

human 98:14humanity 152:13, 152:14

hunting 134:7hurricane 62:6husband 19:22

hydraulic 74:12, 117:7

hydraulics 74:15

hydroelectric 134:20

hydrology 74:15hydromechanical 134:21

Hydropower 1:22, 3:12, 3:19, 4:22, 6:7, 133:2

< I >ice 99:14, 104:19

idea 30:1, 40:6, 104:25, 107:5

ideal 108:25identified 12:7, 108:11

identify 4:18, 5:7, 6:4, 12:12, 99:3, 108:13, 136:10

IF&W 93:15, 103:20

II 58:18III 2:13imagine 52:6, 118:14

immediate 109:5, 109:7, 109:9

immediately 50:15, 69:24

impact 94:16, 107:17

impacted 92:20impacts 40:20, 41:2

implications 126:21

importance 151:6

important

23:10, 46:2, 52:18, 79:16, 81:3, 139:20, 140:16, 149:21, 150:3, 152:16, 152:20, 154:22, 155:7

impossible 105:9

impounding 52:25, 53:5

impounds 4:14impressions 103:19

imprinted 33:20improvements 77:11

in-filling 106:19

in-flow 112:18in. 41:18, 43:11, 85:21, 106:23

inch 43:2, 44:2, 44:9, 51:14, 60:14, 60:15, 62:10, 62:15, 72:18, 78:4, 105:8

inch-and-a-half 60:15

inches 33:14, 34:15, 37:12, 37:13, 43:2, 44:2, 45:20, 46:16, 47:8, 47:12, 47:13, 47:18, 47:23, 51:10, 54:10, 63:24, 71:16, 72:21, 75:13, 104:1, 107:18, 128:19

incline 15:1inclined 156:19include 5:23included 29:16

179

includes 83:5including 4:7, 135:5

increase 44:20, 45:2, 46:18, 98:23

incredibly 139:12, 140:5, 150:14

incubate 20:8indication 29:22

individual 12:20, 26:24, 33:25

individually 11:24, 148:7, 154:20

individuals 27:16, 82:4, 129:25

industrial 114:5

info 72:6inform 127:8information 13:4, 41:19, 49:4, 74:11, 106:7, 114:21, 115:4, 116:21, 123:20, 124:9, 130:19, 130:20, 131:5, 135:6, 136:5

informed 13:6, 135:7

initial 61:22, 69:24

initially 58:20, 67:8, 67:10, 138:3, 138:4

injured 24:17injuries 23:12, 23:14, 24:14

Inland 6:10,

19:17, 79:1, 79:20, 81:25, 90:8, 97:6, 150:5, 151:23

Inlet 67:11, 67:13

innocence 150:23

input 116:2inputs 115:14, 115:15

inspection 12:3install 57:8, 145:3

installed 67:9instance 43:3, 75:7, 116:14, 124:14

instances 47:16instead 121:1Institute 20:10intake 16:10, 145:5

integrity 99:13, 99:17, 104:16

intelligent 140:5

intended 110:21, 118:18

intense 53:19inter-local 4:24

interest 85:17, 97:9, 98:14, 104:15, 152:5, 153:11, 153:22, 154:16

interested 8:6, 59:5, 59:7, 67:5

interesting 80:3, 147:5

International 4:24

interpret 97:21interrupt 23:3,

52:17interval 116:8, 116:11

intervention 8:17, 75:18

invasive 150:16investigate 44:8

inviting 76:18involved 42:25, 43:22, 64:13, 68:13, 87:12

irrigate 117:1island 20:4issue 46:2, 77:5, 94:21, 98:10, 100:18, 104:9, 105:13, 109:15

issued 135:21issues 39:18, 41:22, 81:11, 98:14, 98:16, 110:20, 133:9

items 6:20, 66:10, 124:10, 133:4, 135:3

itself 43:20, 47:1, 47:4, 57:12, 59:16, 66:11, 92:23, 94:18, 95:5, 99:17, 123:20

< J >J. 1:13, 158:2Jane 141:16Janet 137:14, 137:16, 137:18, 137:24, 138:2

Jeanne 148:9, 148:11, 148:14, 148:22, 148:24, 149:1

180

Jefferson 1:6, 1:15, 1:16, 2:7, 2:33, 4:3, 4:8, 5:12, 132:6, 137:19

Jim 101:11, 148:9

job 128:16, 139:20

joined 6:9Joint 4:24joked 32:5Journal 7:21judgement 92:22July 85:25, 110:24, 112:1, 145:2

jump 14:24, 31:15

June 18:19, 47:10, 68:21, 98:7, 104:6, 145:12

jurisdiction 3:13, 4:16, 5:3, 80:17

juvenile 51:13, 69:5, 104:10

juveniles 33:19, 33:21, 49:22, 51:23, 77:4, 77:14, 77:16, 86:2

< K >K-A-T-H-Y 136:1Kathy 1:22, 3:11, 3:17, 3:18, 5:5, 5:8, 6:7, 21:9, 74:9, 93:13, 130:17, 133:1, 133:17, 133:19, 135:23, 136:19,

136:23, 156:24

Keel 6:10, 79:2, 79:5, 79:9, 79:11, 79:12, 96:8, 97:12, 103:3, 106:3, 106:11, 106:14, 107:13, 151:17

keep 12:23, 72:23, 94:14, 104:19, 105:21, 133:12

keeping 139:20Keith 109:12Kemper 6:11, 79:2, 79:5, 79:12, 81:9, 95:23, 95:25, 96:2, 96:8, 97:12, 103:3, 106:5, 106:14, 107:13, 109:11, 151:18

Kemper. 79:9, 79:11, 106:3, 106:11, 109:12

Kennebec 7:21Kevin 6:8kids 36:11kind 43:24, 44:1, 58:24, 60:22, 64:10, 64:18, 66:8, 75:1, 75:21, 81:23, 97:9, 99:21, 101:15, 105:2, 105:12, 113:23, 113:24, 116:6,

116:10, 118:12, 150:12, 151:20

kinds 21:20King 141:6knolls 31:21, 32:1

knowing 141:20knowledge 31:11, 40:19, 45:15, 57:22, 60:4, 61:23, 151:20

known 132:16, 147:7

knows 23:2, 23:4, 25:24, 154:4

Kodiak 2:15

< L >L-22951-36-A-N 1:9

L-shaped 57:18Labor 104:7lack 16:6lacking 150:10ladder 20:21, 24:7, 24:10, 28:10, 28:12, 28:16, 28:21, 32:18, 33:3, 33:15, 36:24, 37:1, 37:2, 59:18, 59:19, 59:20, 64:21, 64:23, 66:24, 67:16, 68:18, 69:15, 70:3, 142:2, 144:12

lakes 111:14, 154:9

lakeshore 155:12

Land 1:20, 4:10, 6:5, 15:21, 58:24, 133:1,

181

142:12, 144:4, 151:2

landed 138:6landlocked 20:6landowners 151:15

lands 138:9Lane 52:11, 143:22, 146:8, 148:16

large 16:16, 46:18, 61:4, 62:4, 82:2, 117:10

larger 35:10, 96:14, 96:24, 100:6

laser 96:11, 106:16

late 28:19, 29:2, 64:9, 68:12, 68:21, 72:19, 85:25, 144:20, 144:23, 145:12

later 5:5, 33:20, 62:17, 78:18, 85:13

launch 19:21, 70:13, 83:5, 92:10, 119:4, 119:9, 119:16, 119:19, 119:25, 120:13, 120:20, 125:10, 147:6, 147:7, 147:13

law 132:20lawful 134:8laws 4:19lay 102:2lead 23:17leaf 72:3learn 152:12learned 40:9, 140:13,

140:14leases 87:18least 4:9, 4:13, 4:14, 42:1, 44:18, 44:21, 46:15, 60:15, 69:19, 70:11, 71:24, 80:17, 85:13, 141:23

leave 50:14, 50:15, 50:16, 52:3, 65:7, 77:4, 77:14, 86:2, 136:14

leaving 89:5, 104:14

ledge 45:21, 56:10, 68:8, 68:9, 145:9

left 6:22, 23:16, 24:22, 36:17, 39:16, 44:3, 51:14, 115:6, 115:16, 117:10, 133:7

legal 6:18legibly 135:18length 58:10, 94:7, 95:13, 95:16

less 18:11, 53:6, 69:2, 94:19, 99:4, 99:14, 150:18

letter 15:8, 15:12, 21:9, 22:25, 23:8, 23:9, 25:2, 25:8, 25:13, 25:20, 26:11, 26:16, 30:22, 85:4

letters 26:22, 29:16, 118:1, 122:9

letting 40:10, 53:6

liars 22:22,

37:16license 4:21Licensing 7:10, 132:11

life 38:22lifelong 40:25likely 62:11, 74:13

lilly 98:7limit 72:13, 117:2, 135:2

limited 5:12, 5:20, 78:2

limits 94:1Lincoln 1:7, 7:22

Linda 148:7line 12:23, 13:13, 22:1, 27:5, 30:19, 45:14, 75:15, 103:23, 110:25, 119:2, 119:21, 120:6, 120:14, 121:5, 121:14, 122:2, 122:5, 123:5, 123:23, 124:15, 125:17, 125:24, 128:25, 149:3

lines 121:13, 123:2

lip 45:21list 23:1, 81:10, 135:16, 147:15, 156:3

listen 13:2listening 138:22

literally 38:20, 44:8, 80:15, 100:4

little 32:3,

182

34:6, 44:6, 44:9, 44:14, 46:14, 51:15, 56:8, 60:24, 75:20, 88:4, 98:24, 101:8, 101:15, 103:16, 104:3, 105:11, 105:24, 110:13, 110:15, 113:21, 117:14, 117:19, 126:15, 138:13, 141:19, 142:7

littoral 4:10, 132:16, 132:19, 134:10

live 51:17, 102:25, 141:6, 143:9, 146:7, 148:15

lived 66:6lives 23:3, 23:4

living 15:5, 38:22

local 36:16locally 80:17located 4:3, 6:21, 6:22, 133:7

location 28:12, 56:13, 56:16, 59:17, 112:11, 118:5, 118:8, 122:9

locations 77:22, 78:15

lodged 43:5log 32:20, 33:9, 39:14, 43:5, 43:10, 43:15, 43:19,

46:1, 60:14, 61:10, 62:1, 71:6, 71:8, 72:11, 127:18, 127:22, 128:4, 144:17

logs 30:17, 31:13, 32:16, 34:1, 34:10, 42:22, 45:14, 46:7, 46:23, 47:13, 53:3, 57:6, 61:21, 62:1, 62:8, 64:20, 65:16, 75:19, 85:18, 85:24, 104:9, 104:21, 105:1, 105:4, 105:6, 105:15

long-term 105:17

longer 31:13, 83:9, 94:10, 94:19, 129:17

look 9:9, 22:7, 31:3, 32:25, 40:3, 60:23, 64:15, 92:20, 103:10, 103:13, 103:14, 104:18, 108:14, 112:19, 117:15, 118:19, 121:17, 147:11, 151:6

looked 32:16, 55:14, 56:10, 83:14, 90:25, 93:1, 103:18

looking 24:24, 35:19, 49:2, 69:12, 82:9, 112:19, 113:7, 114:16,

117:20, 117:21, 119:17, 120:7, 150:22, 150:23, 156:22

looks 93:5, 93:7, 104:20, 105:14, 117:21, 119:2

loon 17:20, 17:24, 18:1, 102:8

loons 19:24, 23:19, 26:1, 80:23, 101:21, 101:22, 101:24, 102:1, 102:11, 102:14, 102:21, 102:24, 102:25

lose 72:21, 139:11, 139:12

losing 14:25loss 155:2lost 16:14lot 22:14, 29:25, 30:8, 30:9, 35:23, 40:13, 47:15, 48:23, 60:25, 66:4, 69:2, 74:8, 75:15, 94:15, 98:13, 99:14, 101:22, 104:24, 111:3, 126:16, 140:13, 140:14, 143:24, 147:23, 149:22

183

lots 72:2, 104:17

love 36:21loves 102:16low 16:15, 43:18, 43:23, 48:17, 55:12, 57:11, 62:24, 68:2, 68:10, 68:11, 72:3, 74:24, 77:17, 99:11, 106:18, 116:12, 127:14, 138:7, 155:5

lower 20:4, 39:3, 41:2, 45:20, 45:23, 65:2, 94:6, 94:9, 94:18, 95:8, 99:8, 99:11, 99:16, 99:24, 104:19, 108:24, 143:21, 145:2

lowest 60:16, 144:19

lush 139:22

< M >ma'am 54:18, 54:24

Madawaska 100:3Madden 38:18, 40:23, 40:25, 48:6, 48:8, 49:12, 55:23, 70:21, 70:25, 73:1, 73:2, 73:9, 73:12, 73:14, 73:15

Madden. 48:12, 48:14, 49:6

mail 130:19main 76:22Maine.gov 136:2mainly 151:16

maintain 41:9, 58:21, 69:16, 69:17, 69:19, 69:21, 72:18, 97:18, 99:17, 134:5, 134:17, 134:23, 144:18, 145:23

maintained 60:8, 60:12, 61:7, 101:14, 144:6, 145:13, 154:15

maintaining 18:14

maintains 71:12maintenance 134:12, 154:22

major 82:1, 82:7, 82:11

Malcom 153:3, 153:4, 153:6, 153:13, 153:15, 153:19, 153:21, 155:17, 155:24, 155:25

mallards 101:5mammals 100:9man 101:12manage 39:4, 62:2, 81:1, 81:19, 81:25, 89:3, 89:14, 97:22, 98:15, 100:5, 101:21, 101:24, 102:10, 147:1, 147:12, 149:15, 151:18, 151:24,

154:13managed 41:4, 45:11, 45:25, 58:22, 75:23, 83:16, 151:14, 151:15

Management 29:23, 30:3, 39:6, 39:7, 39:9, 39:21, 40:21, 43:22, 57:9, 62:4, 68:14, 69:8, 70:14, 76:19, 80:18, 81:19, 81:23, 87:18, 100:3, 100:7, 100:17, 102:19, 107:22

manager 133:20manages 40:18, 87:16

managing 38:25, 39:22, 69:12, 87:20, 98:12, 104:2, 104:6, 151:20

mandating 132:21

manmade 151:12map 96:13, 96:22

March 15:20Marine 6:12, 53:2, 76:9, 76:21, 85:4, 103:6

Mark 1:20, 6:4, 18:20, 121:9, 121:14, 121:24, 123:1, 123:4, 124:3, 125:9, 132:25

Marsh 100:4Martin 6:8masses 16:16math 119:12

184

MATTER 1:4, 3:14, 5:5, 5:18, 24:10, 53:10, 98:3, 107:18, 129:23, 130:1, 135:19

matters 12:7MDEP 116:17Meadow 44:17, 100:2

mean 12:19, 28:24, 32:7, 32:17, 37:6, 50:9, 60:18, 61:18, 64:3, 98:9, 100:4, 103:22, 106:20, 111:8, 112:20, 113:3, 113:11, 113:13, 113:15, 113:16, 115:7, 117:8, 117:9, 120:6, 124:16, 125:9, 127:6, 151:5

meaning 129:17means 20:22, 24:21, 83:18, 112:8, 152:13, 158:6

meant 135:6, 135:9

measure 58:9measured 120:8measurement 120:24

measurements 75:4, 112:4, 119:3, 122:14

Measuring 104:1mechanism 57:7, 57:10

Median 112:25, 113:3, 113:8,

113:10, 113:11, 115:4, 115:7

medium 74:24meet 73:17, 95:5, 155:10

Meeting 35:7, 157:1, 157:2

meetings 29:17, 139:2, 139:4, 139:6, 146:17

meets 154:18melt 43:7, 54:3, 66:5

MEMBER 19:7, 135:14, 137:18, 137:24, 138:2, 141:5, 141:12, 141:15, 143:1, 143:4, 143:8, 143:12, 143:17, 143:20, 146:7, 146:12, 146:15, 148:11, 148:14, 148:22, 148:24, 149:1, 153:4, 153:10, 153:15, 153:19, 153:21, 155:25

members 6:2, 6:3, 153:5

Memorial 33:17memory 68:6, 69:10

mentioned 13:14, 17:1, 18:4, 25:8, 74:9, 96:12, 136:20, 149:17,

154:19Mercer 3:7, 5:17, 5:25, 132:12

Merch 30:16, 30:22, 31:4

mergansers 101:7, 101:17

merits 5:24met 4:7, 57:14, 88:5

metal 31:21mic 29:13Michael 76:11, 76:15, 76:17, 88:12, 89:17, 90:4

microphone 8:2, 9:14, 27:10, 49:10, 49:11, 81:8, 93:12, 133:13, 136:12

mid 144:19, 145:12

mid-'70s 58:24, 144:10

mid-'80s 30:14, 31:11

mid-'90s 144:24mid-august 145:11

mid-october 51:6

mid-september 50:3, 51:6, 69:1

mid-summer 99:23

middle 18:19, 65:10, 66:10, 116:16, 141:20

MIKE 6:12, 76:8, 84:21, 84:23, 85:1, 85:3, 88:13, 89:18

miles 150:19Mill 2:32,

185

56:21, 59:1, 59:10, 64:11

mind 133:12, 143:10

minimal 134:11MINIMUM 1:6, 4:2, 5:10, 8:11, 70:11, 104:20, 116:10

mink 100:11, 100:19

minor 73:4minus 60:21, 128:19

minute 28:4, 37:19, 67:4, 109:23

minutes 13:19, 17:13, 19:9, 27:8, 42:16, 48:13, 49:13, 73:17, 73:18, 136:15, 136:20, 138:1, 141:14, 143:19, 146:14, 148:25

missed 25:19Mmm 57:19, 59:12, 69:14, 94:25, 96:17, 96:20, 97:4, 109:25, 117:16, 127:15

mobility 94:21model 115:13modeling 74:8, 74:12, 74:14, 107:16, 107:19, 110:13, 112:1, 112:2, 112:20, 113:14, 115:18, 117:6, 117:7

modified 61:16Mohlar 6:5MOHLER 73:21, 73:25, 109:19, 110:1, 110:7, 114:12, 122:24, 124:20, 125:4, 125:5, 126:11, 126:13

Mohler. 74:4, 74:6, 122:23, 124:19, 129:10

moist 108:18moment 52:17, 129:12, 156:13, 156:17

monitor 153:9monitoring 20:12

month 24:23, 68:1, 72:22, 74:22, 84:7, 113:1, 113:9, 113:13

Monthly 74:22, 112:25, 113:15, 115:4

months 72:22moored 15:3moss 121:18mostly 50:24, 149:11, 152:2

mother 21:23, 36:12

mouth 82:2, 82:3, 82:5

move 27:6, 31:19, 58:1, 58:2, 58:3, 64:8, 66:9, 66:16, 78:5, 94:15, 105:9, 106:25, 118:8

moved 43:4, 46:4

moving 78:24MS. HODGEMAN 55:19

muck 18:11mucky 18:9multiple 91:6, 105:7, 105:12

municipal 4:23, 114:5

muscles 149:18muskrat 100:11, 100:20

myself 38:4, 110:11

< N >narrow 70:5Nate 146:6, 146:7, 146:12, 146:15

native 145:15Natural 39:6, 39:12, 79:19, 97:8, 111:11, 114:9, 144:7, 154:24

naturalist 152:9

nature 59:11, 110:20, 152:6

navel 32:4navigation 134:6

near 18:21, 20:18, 35:6, 38:22, 53:23, 100:2, 102:3, 136:5

nearly 147:9necessarily 70:10, 78:16, 116:14, 118:15, 129:2

necessary 5:21, 41:6, 133:22, 134:4, 134:9, 134:12, 134:14,

186

134:15, 134:17, 134:18, 134:22

need 39:25, 62:1, 62:7, 70:9, 79:14, 83:18, 83:21, 88:1, 88:2, 91:7, 95:4, 104:12, 105:18, 108:16, 108:22, 116:13, 116:15, 117:2, 118:17, 118:19, 130:25, 144:14, 147:24, 149:14, 155:6

needed 13:15needs 6:24, 16:22

neglect 145:18neighborhood 139:24, 140:8

nest 20:2, 20:5, 20:7, 102:3

nested 19:24nesters 101:7, 101:18

nesting 16:13, 18:1, 99:6, 100:25, 101:1, 101:4, 102:8, 103:24, 104:12

nestings 17:20, 17:24

new 30:10, 144:12, 144:14

News 7:22Next 10:2, 17:4, 37:24,

38:20, 76:8, 81:9, 86:13, 123:22, 135:13, 141:1, 142:25, 143:24, 154:2

NHWL 119:18Nice 30:19, 51:14, 153:6

night 44:15Nineth 11:21No. 33:10, 64:19, 88:7, 109:17, 109:21, 117:6, 126:25, 140:25

NOAA 53:18nobody 21:14, 24:2, 92:11

noise 30:8non-dam 111:10non-management 16:21

none 5:8, 13:16, 53:8, 89:13

nor 58:1, 60:3, 105:3

normal 55:6, 60:8, 60:12, 61:7, 61:13, 110:25, 119:21, 120:6, 121:4, 121:9, 121:14, 124:2, 125:24, 128:24, 145:16

normally 107:23, 110:22, 121:25, 127:13

north 80:4, 102:15

nose 66:13notarized 8:21Notary 1:13, 26:22, 158:3

notch 104:2note 26:18notes 35:19, 109:24

Nothing 3:23, 9:23, 10:8, 10:16, 10:24, 14:4, 15:25, 17:10, 19:6, 21:5, 34:21, 38:13, 42:13, 48:11, 74:3, 75:16, 76:14, 79:8, 81:16, 82:21, 93:14, 137:22, 141:11, 143:16, 145:18, 146:11, 148:20, 153:18

Notice 7:20, 7:23, 8:17, 15:22, 96:15

noticed 44:4, 141:22, 144:24, 147:14

November 52:5, 53:3, 78:19, 85:13, 85:18, 104:21, 105:16

nowhere 53:23Number 23:18, 23:19, 76:22, 115:14, 121:18, 138:6, 139:1, 147:15

numbers 123:14numerous 110:19, 112:3

187

< O >o'clock 37:20, 73:18

objection 8:20, 8:23

objective 8:22observations 149:6

observe 70:13observed 38:24, 38:25, 92:25

observer 40:3, 47:6

observing 150:25

obstacle 69:20obviously 46:4, 67:13, 83:18, 151:8

occasion 22:1occur 78:2occurred 30:4occurrence 69:7ocean 40:7October 52:6, 52:7, 78:19

off-the-record 156:15, 156:21

offer 81:7, 135:15

offered 40:22, 144:11

offerings 143:22

OFFICE 1:21, 12:5, 74:11

Officer 1:11, 5:18, 110:11, 130:9, 132:24, 136:7

officially 131:6

often 67:22, 67:23, 89:1

Old 2:32, 21:19, 36:8, 38:21, 52:12, 56:21, 59:1, 59:10, 79:24

Once 12:10, 15:24, 51:3, 66:4, 66:5, 105:9, 105:10, 130:22, 145:23, 151:25, 155:9

one. 23:19ones 51:13, 55:21, 89:6, 96:14, 100:21, 101:20, 105:7, 105:12, 121:4, 154:19

ongoing 134:19oozing 126:3open 67:17, 130:23, 135:20, 151:3, 151:8

opening 11:7, 57:25

operate 4:21, 59:8, 59:9, 76:24, 77:7, 78:10, 111:14, 111:16

operated 57:6, 58:20, 58:21, 64:18, 87:15

operating 38:25operation 4:20, 28:10, 31:10, 39:11, 61:15

operational 78:12, 89:24

operations 60:13, 61:7, 153:24

Operator 2:31, 8:14

opinion 53:15, 94:2, 155:21

opinions 146:25opportunity 5:4, 9:10,

11:6, 26:15, 76:18, 77:24, 79:12, 103:5, 130:10, 136:16, 137:3

opposed 50:17, 103:11, 147:1

optimal 97:16optimum 108:23oral 13:11Order 1:8, 3:3, 7:18, 8:23, 11:22, 49:11, 83:11, 83:21, 132:3, 135:7, 135:21, 154:5, 154:17, 155:8

orders 7:2ordinances 4:23organization 133:14

original 25:20, 37:4, 37:9, 42:22, 64:11

Originally 18:6, 42:23, 83:8, 115:1

Others 7:24, 15:2, 15:5, 30:6, 156:6

otter 100:11, 100:19

ourselves 144:6outboard 16:15outings 31:17outlet 67:12, 134:22

outlined 11:21, 133:25

outside 6:22, 6:23, 133:7

outsides 100:14outstanding 137:1

overcome 57:11oversight 87:18own 16:22, 26:13, 65:6, 83:3, 103:23,

188

143:20, 148:16, 154:4

owned 17:16, 18:24, 19:23, 22:11, 22:13, 47:1, 151:19

Owner 2:12, 2:21, 8:14, 8:20, 11:13, 11:15, 11:20, 15:6, 15:9, 15:13, 15:16, 16:22, 27:14, 29:16, 29:19, 29:22, 30:15, 38:1, 38:10, 137:4, 154:12

owners 4:10, 16:9, 37:21, 77:8, 86:13, 91:14, 104:16, 132:16, 144:6, 152:1, 154:11, 155:13

ownership 154:8owns 80:15

< P >p.m. 1:17, 13:10, 27:4, 131:3, 131:16, 157:2

page 103:16, 116:17, 151:6

pallets 142:6Palmer 52:13parameters 85:5, 115:19, 115:21, 116:3

parasol 31:22parents 143:23, 149:3

Park 2:6, 137:19

parking 94:15, 95:17

part 9:2, 13:4,

17:21, 72:4, 75:1, 82:11, 119:8, 136:14, 149:7, 149:19

PARTICIPANT 54:9, 54:14, 70:18

participants 12:15

participation 12:20, 13:8, 129:13

particular 25:17, 35:1, 76:23, 77:19, 79:14, 86:22, 87:13, 87:21, 89:7, 96:16, 112:12, 116:14, 124:24

particularly 17:22, 34:19, 41:21, 41:24, 80:22, 98:2, 145:2

PARTIES 2:1, 7:24, 8:5, 8:13, 8:18, 15:8, 87:12, 129:21, 129:22, 130:5, 130:10

parts 74:25, 147:19

party 12:17, 129:12, 129:23, 129:25, 130:3

pass 60:3, 73:3passage 78:12, 85:13, 85:14, 89:2, 134:24

passed 73:8, 101:14, 144:23

passing 16:3past 53:25, 138:6, 139:8,

145:11, 145:17

Paterak 148:10, 148:11, 148:14

Paterak. 148:22, 148:24, 149:1

Paul 3:7, 132:12

Payden 20:8payment 4:10peacefulness 145:20

pen 64:10penned 15:14people 18:10, 24:17, 39:18, 44:25, 50:17, 61:19, 89:14, 91:9, 95:16, 100:18, 135:16, 139:2, 140:3, 140:12, 142:7, 142:9, 147:9, 149:22, 154:25, 155:1

per 49:13, 75:7, 75:10, 75:12, 115:25, 136:20

perceived 151:10

percent 4:9, 80:2, 108:21, 113:9, 113:10, 132:18, 150:11

perfectly 14:20, 119:15, 137:9

perform 107:24perhaps 120:25perimeter 150:17, 150:19

189

period 16:7, 27:4, 61:22, 81:2, 82:13, 83:20, 85:15, 113:12, 154:6

permanent 148:15

permit 4:19, 64:18

permitted 129:24

persisted 145:1person 25:10, 31:17, 40:22, 40:25, 45:8, 49:13, 52:20, 136:15, 136:20, 137:13

personal 40:19, 130:2

persons 8:6, 156:21

perspective 104:11, 106:1, 127:11

pertaining 156:9

Petition 3:10, 4:1, 4:5, 4:11, 5:1, 15:20, 15:23, 29:15, 132:15, 133:21, 135:4, 135:10, 137:13

petitioner 4:8, 11:14, 29:11, 136:25

Petitioners 2:3, 2:5, 8:14, 11:11, 11:12, 11:15, 13:18, 16:2, 16:3, 16:5, 26:20, 26:21, 54:13, 84:11, 96:1, 106:10,

109:13, 125:4, 132:17, 132:18, 136:24, 137:3, 146:20

Phone 2:8, 2:16, 2:26, 2:34, 15:17

photos 19:11, 29:5, 48:19

physically 46:22, 58:3, 95:18

picked 30:25, 58:8

pickerel 98:8, 106:25

picnic 31:21picture 21:22, 21:24, 35:16, 36:12, 63:25, 117:20

pictures 21:19, 21:21, 23:13, 24:14, 32:21, 33:13, 36:11, 46:21, 51:5, 51:12, 60:3, 64:5

piece 65:1, 122:6

pieces 33:3piers 21:16pile 104:23, 144:5

pillars 64:7pinned 64:4pins 64:7pipe 24:12, 67:6, 145:5

pipes 16:10pivot 58:9place 32:8, 40:8, 44:10, 44:19, 57:7, 64:25, 83:11, 95:17, 104:2, 136:10, 139:22,

145:21, 149:12, 152:16

placed 13:3, 64:6, 70:7, 104:7

places 120:18plan 13:10, 46:13, 76:19, 77:9

plank 90:25, 92:7, 125:14, 125:16, 125:20

planks 22:16, 141:18, 141:22

planner 83:1planning 136:14plans 59:8, 59:14, 83:13

plant 106:22platforms 102:8play 80:21Plaza 2:23pleased 21:11, 21:12

pleasurable 18:12

pleasure 151:1plenty 47:16, 66:12

plethora 100:16plowing 55:10plugged 67:10plugging 43:24plumber 16:8plus 128:19plywood 33:3, 65:1, 65:2, 65:22, 67:17

podium 8:3, 9:13, 73:23, 136:9, 137:15

point. 36:13, 61:24, 93:8, 140:11

pointer 96:11pointing 106:16points 42:19,

190

48:3, 79:16, 118:11

Poland 152:17police 24:1Policy 5:15, 132:22

ponds 111:6, 111:12

pool 44:9, 45:1, 45:4, 65:4, 66:10, 68:11, 70:3, 70:5, 70:8

pools 55:12, 69:13

population 44:24, 82:1, 82:2, 82:3, 82:4, 82:6, 82:13, 86:24

portion 20:4, 47:5, 53:16, 69:19, 83:19, 112:5, 116:23

Portland 2:25, 148:15, 153:7

position 58:1possible 74:12, 85:6, 85:8

possibly 50:19, 51:19, 59:1

post 46:5posted 145:8potential 45:14, 64:3, 89:24, 101:9

Potentially 8:15, 58:15, 64:7, 68:25, 71:25, 75:19, 92:19

pounding 99:15power 22:12, 58:25, 67:9, 134:21

practice 24:1practiced 114:10

pre-1990 63:15, 63:18

pre-filed 8:19, 9:6, 9:9, 9:22, 10:7, 10:16, 10:24, 12:25, 13:1, 13:22, 25:9, 26:20, 129:22

pre-hearing 7:13, 7:16

precipitation 40:18, 41:8, 62:5, 111:14, 134:16

predict 112:21predictability 83:22, 93:19

predictable 93:24, 94:3, 95:2, 95:3

preferably 82:10

prepare 117:17prepared 14:7, 74:7, 75:23

present 26:16, 56:5, 58:18, 100:9, 100:25, 101:1, 129:15

presented 8:20, 147:20

presently 93:22preserve 152:11president 154:1PRESIDING 1:11, 5:18, 130:9, 132:24

pressure 43:12, 46:23, 57:12, 105:13

Pretty 48:25, 54:10, 55:14, 60:17, 64:23, 74:15, 78:24, 80:18, 94:6, 101:19, 111:2

prevent 134:14, 145:4

previous 56:15, 56:19

Previously 13:14, 13:21, 42:19, 56:12

priceless 152:12

primarily 99:12primary 39:21, 100:21, 114:2

principle 107:21

printed 7:4Prior 46:5, 133:13, 144:3

priority 147:15private 134:17, 145:8, 154:8, 154:12

privately 151:18

privilege 151:1problem 36:13, 45:11, 72:15, 78:11, 81:5, 89:22, 100:7, 104:18, 139:6, 147:8

problematic 18:13, 77:12

problems 12:17Procedural 1:8, 5:21, 7:2, 7:18, 8:23, 11:21

Procedure 7:7Procedures 7:14, 7:17, 132:7

proceeding 3:10, 13:16, 88:21, 132:15, 132:21

PROCEEDINGS 3:1, 32:6, 158:5

process 13:5, 15:23, 16:6, 30:25, 35:2, 42:3, 42:24, 53:5, 127:9,

191

130:16, 137:11, 150:10

processes 7:14processing 4:12production 80:9, 98:2, 99:2

productive 12:22

profession 16:8professional 12:18

professionally 12:16

prohibitive 95:15

project 12:3, 133:20

promptly 37:20proof 66:24prop 16:14propagation 41:10, 134:24

proper 138:8, 138:25, 144:12

properly 58:13, 147:1

properties 16:4, 98:15, 149:16

property 14:15, 18:24, 19:23, 41:3, 55:12, 58:23, 83:14, 138:17, 139:14, 139:15, 141:16, 141:17, 142:17, 143:21, 144:11, 145:8, 145:10, 149:4, 150:9, 151:15, 152:1, 152:3, 154:10,

156:10proposal 71:16, 86:5, 87:8

proposed 130:6proprietors 132:19, 134:10

prosper 145:15protect 99:13, 99:16, 134:9

Protection 1:2, 3:4, 3:8, 3:20, 4:5, 5:17, 73:22, 76:8, 79:19, 97:8, 97:9, 107:6, 109:20, 132:4, 132:13, 135:23

Protection-flow 114:18


provide 47:19, 83:12, 83:17, 83:18, 85:12, 97:18, 97:25, 107:7, 114:6, 130:10, 134:22, 135:16, 136:15, 145:13

provided 48:18, 48:25, 79:17, 83:13, 83:24, 94:3

provides 66:24, 69:22, 71:11, 98:22

providing 6:18, 77:23

published 7:20pull 43:9, 50:9, 50:10, 65:19

pulled 63:12pulling 24:9,

43:19, 144:25pump 16:11, 53:9, 144:24, 145:4

pumping 116:25punctuated 42:1purchase 144:4purchased 14:15, 84:1, 144:11

purpose 5:9, 13:3, 99:10

purposes 52:17pursuant 7:6, 130:5

pursue 15:19push 44:11, 75:6, 98:20

put 14:23, 15:3, 18:6, 19:17, 22:7, 22:9, 22:17, 22:20, 24:12, 30:16, 31:13, 34:21, 37:15, 43:1, 43:14, 46:10, 47:12, 53:2, 64:20, 75:19, 85:24, 104:25, 105:4, 105:11, 115:19, 122:19, 127:10, 128:16, 138:16, 142:6

putting 40:1, 72:11, 80:19, 85:18, 104:21, 105:1, 105:8, 105:15

< Q >quality 40:20, 134:13, 134:25, 149:24

192


question 11:4, 22:23, 25:12, 29:8, 55:19, 55:24, 72:7, 73:6, 73:8, 84:16, 86:10, 90:14, 92:2, 95:23, 96:12, 97:22, 101:17, 101:23, 102:21, 103:18, 104:10, 106:8, 110:15, 111:22, 123:2, 123:22, 137:7

questionable 58:5

questioning 31:8, 110:5, 110:6, 111:2, 123:23

quick 17:23, 18:2, 103:9, 140:13

quickly 18:15, 18:20, 18:22, 43:8, 46:22, 48:2, 53:11, 54:10, 79:14, 98:25

quite 17:18, 20:3, 30:18, 49:1, 56:23, 62:23, 72:8, 85:17, 101:25, 121:16, 124:16, 126:23, 149:5

quote 5:20, 5:25, 130:5, 130:9, 152:9, 152:10

< R >

rain 43:7, 43:17, 46:17, 46:18, 47:15, 47:16, 47:25, 53:19, 54:2, 60:18, 62:10, 62:11, 64:1, 69:1, 104:23

rains 44:20, 48:1, 48:18, 69:1, 149:23

raised 39:18, 41:23, 48:15

raising 107:17ramp 14:22, 14:24, 19:16, 19:18, 19:20, 19:21, 83:11, 90:18, 91:7, 92:5, 92:7, 92:15, 92:21, 92:23, 93:5, 93:7, 94:8, 94:10, 94:18, 94:19, 95:5, 95:10, 95:14, 123:25

ramps 92:9ran 115:1Range 89:24, 94:1, 94:5, 94:6, 97:17, 100:4, 110:16, 110:23, 110:25, 111:3, 111:23, 121:20

Rather 34:7, 43:7, 44:20, 98:25, 105:7, 135:8

re-engineering 95:11

re-established 16:2

re-opened 130:22, 130:25

reach 94:9, 108:13

reaction 103:12read 13:1, 14:8, 27:15, 85:17, 103:5, 118:3, 121:13

Reading 118:4, 118:6, 118:10, 118:11, 120:2, 120:5, 120:19, 120:20, 121:1, 125:14

readings 118:21, 119:6, 121:18

reads 114:17reaffirm 154:16real 61:3, 102:4, 104:18, 151:10

realize 14:17realized 32:2reason 35:1, 51:4, 72:4, 81:24, 98:19, 149:20

reasonable 74:17, 75:17, 94:14, 104:20, 105:14, 144:18

reasoning 123:5reasons 39:5, 39:16, 101:24, 155:7

rebuild 59:1rebuilt 59:17, 90:21

rebuttal 13:1recall 7:12, 59:23, 65:8, 68:7, 68:10, 68:14

recede 62:18recedes 102:6

193

receipt 15:12, 15:15

receive 8:13, 25:9, 135:20

received 4:4, 8:17, 15:22, 26:22, 129:20

recent 53:20, 53:22, 69:10

recently 70:2recharge 112:19recognize 101:25, 102:17

recollect 30:14recommend 105:3, 151:22

recommendation 47:9, 88:20, 89:10, 103:6, 103:11, 103:12, 103:20, 140:5

recommendations 88:23, 88:25, 117:4

recommended 102:22, 117:4

reconstruct 83:19

reconstructed 56:6

reconstruction 83:21, 95:5, 95:12

recorded 133:11recording 133:11

records 30:24recourse 15:2recreation 134:8

recross 106:6RECROSS-EXAMINATION 106:14, 107:13

recurrence 116:8, 116:11

REDIRECT 11:15, 11:18, 28:1,

70:20, 70:25, 71:2

reduce 65:2, 66:22

reduced 20:14, 44:20, 65:13

reducing 66:12refer 51:7reference 7:5, 12:2, 55:16, 92:1, 118:12, 118:18, 120:15, 123:4, 123:20, 124:15, 128:17

referencing 7:2, 88:16

referred 79:18, 79:20, 97:6, 144:7

referring 116:21, 116:23, 119:21

reflected 9:22, 10:7, 10:15, 10:23, 12:24, 88:19

refute 51:11regarding 42:21, 86:23

regime 5:10, 8:10, 85:6, 85:8, 99:21, 109:4, 110:22, 132:5

regimes 80:18, 89:25, 102:2

regional 79:13Registration 134:1

regular 12:4, 150:2

regulated 4:23regulating 4:20REGULATION 1:5regulations 5:22, 7:3

regulatory 133:25, 134:3, 135:3

related 18:1, 110:14

relationship 144:22

relative 97:14, 113:23, 118:5, 120:23, 128:13

relatively 127:14, 145:6

release 43:19, 67:11, 75:20, 99:23

relevant 12:24, 14:14

relies 39:11relocate 16:13remain 12:18, 104:1, 135:19

remaining 96:24Remember 8:2, 12:25, 30:14, 43:16, 101:11, 144:2, 144:4

remind 12:14, 54:12, 129:21, 155:6

reminder 131:2, 156:23

remnant 82:3remove 46:23, 57:8, 57:10, 61:10, 62:1, 62:12, 65:19

removed 32:25, 46:1, 46:7, 46:10, 46:11, 57:7, 61:11, 61:21, 104:9, 142:2, 142:8

removing 80:20, 99:5

reopen 12:10repair 57:4repaired 56:7

194

replace 34:22replaced 61:13replacing 14:20, 61:12

replenish 48:18replenishment 47:11

reply 130:4, 130:11, 130:12, 131:12

report 87:8Reported 1:13Reporter 1:14, 158:2

Reporter/notary 158:13

Reporting 8:4, 133:12

represent 132:18, 136:24

representation 6:18

representative 137:4

representatives 8:16

represented 80:2

REPRESENTING 1:19, 84:14, 132:23, 133:15

request 83:15, 93:18, 112:12

requested 15:13, 27:14, 29:17

requests 6:24require 4:11, 108:8, 108:19

required 72:23requirements 4:7, 5:11, 8:11, 13:8, 134:12, 155:10

Research 20:10resent 15:12

reserve 12:18, 38:17

residence 136:10, 148:16

resident 149:10, 153:7, 153:8

residents 140:9, 154:14

resolve 145:22Resource 6:13, 116:25

Resources 1:20, 6:5, 6:12, 76:9, 76:21, 79:19, 97:8, 98:14, 103:7, 111:3, 112:7, 133:1

respective 6:16respond 8:22, 42:5, 80:11, 80:23

response 3:10, 15:14, 15:16, 28:8, 132:15

responsibilities 114:3

responsible 39:8, 71:22, 83:2

rest 13:23, 59:6, 71:17, 112:7

restore 59:9restored 59:10, 142:18, 151:25

Restrooms 6:22, 133:7

result 20:11, 115:14

retained 6:1retention 152:16, 152:21

return 15:12, 15:15, 33:20

returned 15:11

Returning 44:3review 4:17, 133:24, 135:4

reviewed 4:6Revised 3:6rhyme 35:1ribs 23:16Rich 139:14Richard 2:13, 2:21, 27:13, 37:25, 38:9, 57:1, 57:2, 86:21

ride 50:19rights 45:9, 134:5, 144:13

ring-necks 101:5

riparian 4:10, 132:16, 132:19, 134:10

ripples 44:6rise 72:1risk 78:21river 34:21, 44:7, 45:9, 45:11, 47:19, 76:21, 78:14

rivers 112:3, 112:6, 114:3

Road 1:16, 2:6, 2:32, 52:13, 137:19, 139:15, 141:6

Rob 6:5, 49:14, 73:21, 73:25, 74:4, 74:6, 76:1, 84:19, 84:20, 110:7, 110:9, 114:11, 114:12, 122:23, 122:24, 123:1, 124:19, 124:20, 125:5, 126:13,

195

129:10, 129:11

Robert 9:1, 10:19, 10:21, 11:1, 11:3, 11:8, 21:2, 21:6, 21:8, 25:11, 25:15, 25:23, 26:8, 26:12, 27:1, 34:5, 35:22, 36:3, 36:5, 142:25

Roberta 143:1, 143:2, 143:3, 143:4, 143:8, 143:12, 143:17, 149:6

Robin 1:13, 8:4, 133:11, 158:2

Rock 18:17, 18:18, 64:8, 119:18, 119:22, 121:5, 121:24

rocks 23:17, 24:18, 70:7, 121:24, 141:21, 144:5

Rod 2:31, 42:14, 42:17, 49:16, 54:9, 54:14, 56:3, 63:6, 63:7, 70:18, 71:2, 73:7, 118:9, 118:10, 118:12, 156:8, 156:12, 156:16

Rodney 42:10rolling 14:[email protected] 2:28

Ron 148:6room 25:25, 56:23, 82:4,

133:6Roughly 75:11, 77:1, 118:24, 121:10, 125:18, 126:7

round 31:21Route 100:2Ruffingham 100:2

ruin 25:4Rule 98:16, 110:17, 111:25

Rules 7:3, 7:9, 25:16, 111:5, 132:10, 153:24

run 11:10, 14:22, 69:24, 75:2

run-off 40:18, 44:20, 47:15, 62:20, 134:16

running 65:3, 65:13, 68:12, 75:13

runs 68:25Rural 115:6Ruthann 1:23, 6:8, 6:25, 133:2, 133:9

< S >sad 23:20, 25:3, 151:4

safe 139:21safety 40:17, 41:7, 134:10

salmon 81:21, 81:24, 81:25

Saltonstall 2:13, 22:2, 29:17, 29:18, 29:19, 30:23, 40:24, 56:7, 57:1, 57:2, 58:18, 59:20, 61:20, 86:22, 88:6, 144:3,

144:15, 144:22, 151:2


Saltonstalls 144:11, 152:5

salvaged 20:7sandbags 144:5sat 31:22, 68:1satisfactory 15:7

satisfied 41:15, 48:21

save 86:15saw 22:1, 22:3, 24:22, 33:2, 45:5, 51:13, 53:16, 139:15, 145:7, 147:20

saying 51:20, 53:18, 55:8, 61:19, 63:10, 79:24, 105:7, 154:7

says 114:21, 116:3, 116:8, 116:17, 119:18, 120:2, 121:7

scenarios 75:22schedule 11:20, 28:3

School 1:15, 24:24, 51:1

science 74:14, 74:16, 147:20

Scientist 6:13Scott 1:21, 6:17, 32:11, 123:5, 123:23

scramble 32:1scrap 152:11screaming 55:9scum 138:8sea 90:15, 123:10, 123:14, 128:13,

196


128:17season 16:14, 33:19, 39:15, 39:16, 78:13, 85:24, 99:2, 99:7, 103:25, 104:12, 144:19

seasonal 74:21, 74:23, 112:5, 112:11, 143:23

seasons 51:21, 61:5

seat 10:2, 10:11, 136:25

seated 37:23second 40:22, 63:5, 72:7, 75:7, 75:10, 75:12, 80:14, 111:22, 115:25, 117:11

secondhand 61:23

Section 3:6, 4:16, 5:13, 7:8, 130:5, 132:9, 132:20, 133:25

Sections 7:7, 132:8

sediment 144:25, 145:5

Seeing 5:8, 13:16, 32:7, 49:21, 66:21, 147:9, 149:23, 156:5, 156:21

seek 79:25, 106:7

seem 24:19, 34:25, 146:22, 151:19, 154:20

seemed 71:10,

144:16seems 35:7, 87:11, 117:25, 147:11, 154:15

seen 16:12, 32:20, 33:6, 33:7, 33:9, 33:11, 34:1, 34:3, 34:9, 35:10, 39:19, 55:4, 58:1, 60:9, 64:5, 67:19, 68:17, 85:3, 91:6, 142:1, 142:5

send 23:8, 25:2, 130:19

sender 15:11, 15:12

sense 32:16, 63:16, 98:10

sent 7:23, 15:8, 15:15, 22:24, 33:12, 51:5, 51:6, 130:17, 135:22

sentence 116:16, 116:19

separating 119:2

September 28:25, 29:2, 60:18

September'ish 50:2

sequence 11:19, 11:20

series 64:12serious 23:12served 98:4services 155:3SESSION 13:11, 129:19, 129:20, 129:24, 130:1, 131:4,

132:1, 132:3, 133:18, 135:5, 135:8, 138:4, 156:23

set 5:1, 5:13, 35:18, 73:15, 106:3, 118:7, 118:15, 119:16, 120:11, 120:12

set-ups 120:15setting 4:19seven 16:4, 55:4, 55:7, 154:6, 154:19, 155:4

SEVENTH 1:8Several 7:2, 16:9, 17:22, 34:15, 61:13, 67:24, 92:7, 142:1, 144:23

Shady 148:16shaky 152:22shallow 61:2share 135:12, 138:4, 140:17

Sheepscot 154:3sheet 116:24, 141:2

sheets 135:13, 135:15, 136:5

shelves 96:11shoot 23:24shore 16:17, 17:15, 20:18, 80:5, 80:6, 102:4, 102:7, 138:6, 140:18, 150:3

Shoreland 94:17, 149:21, 150:1

shoreline 18:22, 92:20

shorelines 134:15

short 21:9, 43:9, 105:11,

197

145:5, 145:18shortly 59:2, 146:16

shotgun 24:3shoulder 122:6show 125:9showed 48:19, 84:4

shows 21:24, 53:20, 83:25

shrub 98:21, 106:24

siblings 148:17side 21:17, 23:16, 23:17, 34:25, 52:8, 64:6, 83:4, 115:6, 115:17, 115:22, 141:7

sign 135:17sign-in 135:15sign-up 135:13, 136:5, 141:2, 156:5

signatures 4:9signed 158:8signed-up 136:8significant 14:18, 79:18, 92:6, 97:7, 98:6

signs 145:8sill 118:21, 122:5, 124:14, 124:15, 126:7, 127:24, 127:25, 128:11

similar 82:7, 110:19

simple 33:23simply 83:10, 83:16, 138:12, 144:5

single 39:14sir 86:10, 106:2

Sisters 2:14sit 23:22, 24:1, 24:3, 32:12, 70:19, 108:5

site 56:21, 57:14, 59:1, 59:9, 64:5, 64:11, 74:13, 83:9, 83:19, 87:13, 89:12, 91:5, 95:18, 120:16, 121:15, 125:8

sites 121:13, 124:25, 149:23

sits 92:21, 93:5

sitting 23:2, 23:7, 25:1, 25:24, 26:13, 138:21

situation 62:9, 63:10, 74:18, 77:18, 87:9, 87:11, 88:3

six 16:16, 31:24, 55:8

Sixth 8:23size 15:10, 74:19, 112:11

skip 98:11skull 22:2, 22:4

slide 21:21, 21:23, 36:8, 36:12, 36:16, 36:17, 36:19

slides 36:11, 36:15

slime 16:16slip 43:11, 43:13

slipped 23:15slipperier 23:18

slope 149:22slot 35:4slots 33:3,

33:8, 34:24, 37:11

slowed 15:25slowly 51:2, 99:23

small 43:6, 44:10, 51:16, 61:2, 62:13, 62:20, 64:4, 64:6, 82:3, 82:5, 112:5

smaller 35:9, 105:6

Smith 137:14, 137:18, 140:21, 140:22, 141:1, 146:6, 146:7, 146:18

Smith. 137:24, 138:2, 146:12, 146:15

snakes 20:7snapshot 124:8snow 43:7, 54:3, 55:8, 66:5

Society 102:13soil 106:19solution 15:7, 139:1

solve 140:10solving 139:6somebody 21:12, 24:11, 44:4, 71:19, 94:13, 94:20

somehow 58:14someone 59:22, 116:24, 154:12, 155:15

sometime 70:2Sometimes 66:19, 87:5, 102:19, 123:3

Somewhere 34:21, 36:13, 60:2, 65:21

198

son 44:5, 49:21sooner 33:18Sorry 8:22, 9:14, 11:13, 52:21, 54:14, 56:25, 61:16, 84:1, 84:21, 89:21, 89:23, 90:9, 127:20, 143:13, 152:21

sort 34:17, 57:17, 80:6, 80:9, 80:21, 96:19, 96:25, 97:21, 104:14, 108:12, 119:7, 121:24, 127:11, 149:13

sound 74:16sounded 24:3sounds 75:17, 127:12

source 114:4, 114:7, 124:24

south 25:18, 80:7, 96:24, 101:8, 101:13

southern 17:15, 101:10, 102:14, 106:16

spalling 121:19spawn 50:15, 77:4, 82:8

spawning 51:17speaking 8:1, 109:1, 133:10, 133:14, 153:25

Specialist 6:9species 102:10, 149:18, 150:16

specific 41:11, 41:18, 87:25,

108:20, 115:20, 115:23, 123:18

Specifically 12:7, 13:21, 39:8, 76:21, 89:3, 101:24, 109:1, 123:10

specifics 112:16

specified 130:8spell 135:25spelled 136:1spend 14:18spends 39:20spent 38:21spill 60:16, 69:5

spilling 43:25, 60:25, 70:10

spills 46:14Spillway 33:14, 39:22, 43:7, 45:22, 46:24, 51:10, 53:8, 53:23, 56:11, 62:13, 65:12, 67:13, 75:3, 75:4, 75:8, 85:21, 126:3, 127:20, 142:1

spit 115:17splashing 20:17Spokesperson 2:4, 26:19

Spring 17:18, 17:19, 18:3, 18:16, 20:17, 22:20, 33:17, 43:4, 43:5, 43:6, 48:23, 55:10, 64:23, 65:8, 74:24, 75:10, 76:24, 81:1, 82:8, 85:20, 98:18, 98:20, 99:1, 99:12, 99:22, 105:4, 152:17

springtime 33:2, 55:6, 77:5, 77:6, 78:10, 85:15

Sroka 6:14St. 100:2stability 149:20, 151:25

stable 80:23, 81:3, 82:9, 82:12, 99:20, 102:23

STAFF 1:23, 4:6, 6:2, 6:8, 6:10, 6:15, 8:15, 11:16, 28:5, 57:13, 73:14, 84:12, 86:15, 132:25, 133:3, 153:5

staining 121:19, 121:23

stand 32:14, 42:18, 73:23, 155:9

standpoint 94:12, 103:19, 105:21

stands 71:13, 71:21, 116:7

start 12:14, 13:18, 14:13, 37:19, 38:19, 69:5, 69:23, 72:18, 73:21, 79:2, 84:23, 101:4, 106:10, 110:5, 114:16

started 13:17, 15:24, 32:6, 42:23, 43:22, 43:23, 45:16, 46:10, 52:7, 60:22, 65:10, 133:5,

199

137:10, 150:22

starting 8:13, 52:25, 65:6, 114:20

starts 51:3, 62:18

stated 5:19, 42:18, 51:9, 51:24

statement 5:6, 11:7, 19:11

Station 118:8, 135:24

statute 40:15, 134:2, 154:18, 155:11

Statutes 3:7, 5:21, 7:2

statutory 5:13, 12:24, 13:7

stay 50:6, 51:25, 94:23, 139:19, 156:20

stayed 32:23stays 45:4steadfast 44:14steadier 85:11steep 15:1stenograph 158:6

step 29:12Steve 9:13, 19:22, 40:23, 148:9

Steven 8:25, 9:16, 9:20, 9:25, 10:9, 17:4, 17:7, 17:11, 17:14, 48:8, 48:12, 48:14, 49:6

Stewards 153:9, 153:11

stick 136:21stiffened 34:18storm 62:11, 62:25, 64:1

storms 46:17, 46:18, 53:19

story 23:6, 43:9

stranded 40:14, 44:9, 77:25, 102:5

stranding 78:7Stream 43:20, 78:7, 115:5

Streams 62:20, 112:3, 112:6, 114:3, 115:5

stretch 63:20strictly 104:6, 105:25

strong 30:1, 121:12

stronger 22:14structure 57:17, 57:20, 74:9, 75:5, 99:17, 117:7, 126:22, 144:14

structures 152:20

studies 39:20, 147:5

study 74:8, 75:22, 125:7

stuff 21:20, 24:9, 25:19, 25:20, 37:1, 119:19

sturdy 34:19subject 102:5, 155:3

submission 9:23, 10:7, 10:16, 10:24, 41:24

submissions 12:25

submit 30:21, 130:6, 130:11, 136:22, 156:24

submittal

130:13submitted 15:20, 19:11, 26:20, 31:2, 40:14, 41:4, 88:16, 114:25

submitting 12:12

Subsection 3:6, 4:17

success 106:21successful 17:20, 17:24, 77:10, 77:23

successfully 65:6, 66:23, 77:3

successive 77:15

sudden 104:23Sue 15:19, 148:9

sufficient 114:6

suggested 88:6suggesting 89:6suggestions 53:1

suite 101:3summarization 41:15

summarize 14:9, 17:5, 38:3, 38:5, 38:18

summarized 13:17, 37:20

summary 37:24summertime 23:22, 75:11, 111:21

Sunrise 2:6, 137:19

super 128:22supper 140:13supplies 41:9, 134:18

supply 61:4support 137:13suppose 43:1supposed 91:1

200

surface 18:18, 91:10, 114:21, 114:22, 114:23, 119:14

surprises 75:17, 91:24

surprising 129:2

surrounding 154:9

survey 57:16, 74:10, 83:25, 84:2, 110:10, 110:12, 117:15, 118:7, 122:19, 123:2, 123:4, 123:23, 124:6, 127:21

surveyed 92:12surveying 102:11

survive 44:19, 44:21, 98:25

survived 19:25susceptibility 102:18

susceptible 102:1

sustainable 150:21

swamp 98:21, 106:24

swampy 72:3, 142:12

Swanson 148:7, 148:8, 156:4

swear 9:5, 9:12, 13:20, 137:15, 153:14

swearing 143:10Swimming 16:18, 18:9, 18:11, 144:1

swing 57:24switch 117:14

swore 13:21Sworn 8:18, 8:21, 9:4, 9:6, 11:23, 12:6, 13:24, 26:23, 129:17

swung 57:23synopsis 21:11system 4:18, 14:19, 14:21, 77:3, 77:21, 83:11, 89:4, 89:5, 90:25, 104:15, 109:5, 138:16, 145:1, 145:4, 145:23

systems 89:1, 150:17

< T >table 11:21, 27:10, 31:21, 31:22, 37:8, 130:18, 135:13, 136:4, 136:25, 156:25

tail 51:2, 101:6

tailing 50:25, 51:1

tale 138:5talked 31:18, 87:23, 139:24

talks 39:5, 39:24, 40:16, 40:17, 40:19

tall 34:17technical 150:12

technically 47:23

tells 16:18temperatures 78:20, 78:22

tend 100:18

tenure 39:13, 43:3

term 150:12terminology 111:9

terms 22:14, 39:2, 90:6, 95:15, 149:6

Terrific 61:15, 103:1, 112:15, 113:17

test 66:20testified 142:10

testify 9:8, 38:18, 39:10, 39:13, 56:24, 129:24, 130:1, 135:17, 135:18, 136:8

testifying 136:15, 137:2

testing 20:10thanked 21:10Thanks 35:18, 70:17, 82:25, 89:16, 89:17, 95:19, 125:2, 146:2

Thaxter 2:22themselves 12:16, 36:2, 152:5

thereafter 59:2, 146:17

they'll 50:6, 51:2, 51:3, 105:2

they've 39:19, 40:9, 142:14

thick 37:10thinking 94:12, 147:2

third 23:20, 96:21, 119:18, 120:21

Thomas 1:5,

201

2:4, 8:25, 10:2, 10:4, 13:18, 14:1

though 68:16thoughts 89:9, 89:11, 103:11, 135:12

thousands 24:5, 24:6, 44:8

threat 109:5, 109:7, 109:9

Three 2:14, 16:3, 16:13, 23:11, 23:14, 23:15, 24:13, 34:9, 37:11, 54:6, 55:9, 55:12, 59:3, 62:16, 62:17, 62:20, 67:1, 72:22, 79:1, 87:4, 124:10

three. 51:19thrive 139:23Throughout 7:1, 47:11, 99:9, 144:18

thunderstorm 78:3

tie 120:17tied 123:10, 123:17, 124:23

tight 12:23, 13:13, 27:5

timing 13:13Tina 5:15, 136:18

Title 3:5, 7:7, 7:8, 132:8, 132:9

together 87:20, 120:18, 139:3, 140:3, 144:16, 148:8

tonight 129:20, 129:24, 131:3, 133:10,

135:5, 153:25, 155:20

took 32:21, 35:16, 36:17, 83:15, 101:15, 121:17, 125:14, 141:19

top 40:1, 40:2, 40:4, 46:24, 47:4, 54:10, 65:21, 100:12, 114:20, 118:3, 118:20, 120:8, 121:7, 121:8, 121:18, 121:19, 121:23, 122:4, 122:16, 125:17, 127:17

torrential 48:1, 62:10

total 62:14, 80:2, 104:1, 110:24

totally 142:14towards 20:19, 94:15

towing 32:4Town 4:8, 5:11, 47:1, 87:16, 87:17, 133:15

toxicology 20:10

track 62:6tracking 4:18tractor 43:9trail 31:25, 151:3

trails 144:21transcribed 8:3TRANSCRIPT 3:1, 158:5

transcription 8:5

transcriptionist 52:18

transit 120:12transposed 119:15

Trask 143:21, 146:8

travel 94:13, 95:16

tree 21:25trees 36:25, 149:25

trespassing 145:7

trickling 126:1tried 20:8, 46:20, 75:21, 142:7

tries 39:25trout 81:20, 81:25

truck 37:7trucks 117:1true 153:17, 158:4

truly 113:8try 53:10, 66:14, 69:16, 69:17, 69:18, 79:25, 80:25, 89:3, 94:11, 98:16, 98:17, 98:25, 99:1, 126:17, 136:21

trying 30:1, 32:22, 39:3, 51:23, 53:4, 85:19, 111:9, 127:5, 127:7

turn 9:14, 22:6, 106:24, 133:17, 136:18

turned 24:4, 24:5, 136:13

turning 106:19Two 20:6,

202

20:13, 23:10, 23:19, 33:20, 33:22, 41:12, 51:19, 51:21, 52:24, 55:12, 65:9, 69:9, 78:3, 79:15, 79:16, 91:5, 95:24, 96:14, 113:5, 114:15, 118:20, 120:14, 120:17, 124:10, 124:25, 130:11

type 39:21, 69:15, 77:20, 83:12, 97:22, 109:1

types 80:1, 108:10, 108:20

typical 74:22, 75:10, 111:2

Typically 60:14, 60:19, 67:3, 68:21, 77:5, 77:6, 78:10, 78:14, 92:8

Tyson 136:3

< U >ubiquitous 101:25

ultimate 5:24unable 12:18uncle 55:9undergraduate 147:21

underlying 152:20

underneath 24:12, 64:2, 115:4, 116:2

understand 23:23, 27:7,

27:21, 29:14, 31:9, 42:2, 47:7, 53:4, 59:13, 89:10, 89:24, 91:19, 91:24, 94:22, 107:20, 107:23, 111:17, 114:15, 117:19, 118:2, 124:23, 125:7, 126:21, 129:8, 136:23, 138:10, 147:21, 152:13

understanding 26:21, 26:25, 33:16, 50:5, 50:13, 63:17, 74:18, 81:2, 93:18, 100:6, 114:6, 140:4

understood 28:11, 55:15, 70:1

unequivocal 22:21

Ungauged 115:5unhappy 155:12, 155:13

uniform 121:3unique 88:4, 89:1, 115:9, 115:11

unit 112:13unless 9:4, 41:11, 57:11, 65:19

Unregulated 115:5

unsavory 15:17unsworn 9:2, 9:4

until 11:17, 44:19, 44:22,

50:6, 51:25, 52:4, 65:5, 68:25, 69:1, 70:21, 77:20, 78:12, 135:20, 145:11, 146:21

upland 100:23upper 94:4, 117:10

upset 140:19upstream 78:12, 85:14, 154:2

Urkowitz 8:25, 9:13, 9:20, 17:5, 17:7, 19:22

Urkowitz. 9:16, 9:25, 10:9, 17:11, 17:14

usable 70:12user 95:15users 86:23uses 22:4, 134:9

using 115:18, 119:6, 121:1, 121:4

usual 142:9, 144:19

utility 19:19, 113:6

utilize 65:14, 95:18

< V >valid 4:8value 80:10, 97:24, 108:11, 127:8

values 98:1, 98:4, 107:8, 107:24, 108:14, 113:5

various 118:11, 142:6

vegetation 97:2, 139:23

203

versed 98:11via 51:5, 130:19

vibrant 150:15view 89:3views 41:3Village 1:15virtually 38:21vitally 154:21voice 152:22voicemail 15:18voicing 155:21

< W >Waddell 110:11wading 79:21, 80:8, 80:23, 96:12, 97:6, 97:14

wait 70:21waited 22:5waiting 40:5waive 27:16waiving 27:22walk 15:3walked 32:4, 151:2

walking 150:18wanted 22:23, 126:21, 129:7, 138:4, 138:13, 138:15, 140:17

wanting 78:5wardens 142:11warm 26:2, 81:22

Washington 1:16watched 53:14, 83:7

watching 149:12waters 134:16watershed 61:3, 62:19, 74:20, 112:12, 150:8

watersheds 154:10

Waterville

143:9ways 20:3, 81:1, 89:8, 89:10, 89:12, 89:14, 155:10

website 8:7weed 98:8, 106:25

week 54:3, 130:13, 131:12

Weeks 23:14, 24:23, 52:9, 65:9, 87:4

welcome 60:6, 73:5, 144:20

well-balanced 145:23

well-defined 80:18

well-prepared 140:6

Wes 81:13, 81:14

Wesley 6:11, 81:10

west 17:15, 80:5, 83:4

wet 79:25, 101:16, 108:1, 108:3, 108:16

wetland 79:22, 80:1, 96:16, 100:23, 106:17, 108:10, 108:20, 109:1, 109:5

Wetlands 79:22, 80:2, 80:10, 97:24, 97:25, 98:5, 98:21, 106:23, 106:24, 107:7, 107:24, 108:2, 108:8, 108:9, 108:12,

108:14, 108:16, 108:20, 108:21, 108:22, 108:25, 109:2, 142:13, 150:11, 150:12, 150:14, 151:7, 152:15, 152:19

whatever 19:21, 93:19, 155:11

whereas 108:17Whether 38:3, 38:4, 60:1, 92:22, 103:20, 107:15, 111:23, 126:23, 154:18

Whitefield 153:8

whoever 22:18whole 3:23, 9:23, 10:8, 10:16, 10:24, 13:6, 14:3, 17:10, 19:6, 21:5, 26:4, 38:13, 42:13, 48:11, 53:5, 74:3, 79:8, 81:16, 82:21, 97:25, 101:3, 107:5, 119:1, 137:22, 141:10, 143:16, 146:11, 148:20, 153:17

wide 75:4, 105:8

width 37:8wife 14:14,

204

141:16wildly 48:16willingness 155:9

Wilson 152:9window 77:23wing 101:6winter 44:21, 53:25, 61:7, 99:11, 99:16, 99:20, 99:24, 100:10, 104:17, 105:1, 105:2, 111:17

wintering 99:19wintertime 25:18

wish 27:11, 135:16

wishes 12:2withdraw 117:3withdrawal 114:8, 116:25

withdrawals 110:21

within 4:15, 5:2, 54:6, 54:9, 110:23, 124:25, 128:19, 130:8, 158:3

without 18:14, 40:1, 45:24, 47:25, 64:15, 66:18, 69:24, 72:6, 89:13, 94:16, 95:11, 98:5, 150:7, 152:14

witness 40:23, 54:2, 54:5

witnessed 44:25Witnesses 11:12, 11:14, 11:23, 27:23, 39:2, 129:22

wonder 97:16wondered 30:23Wonderful

14:11, 137:12, 139:12

wondering 28:12, 34:8

wood 101:7, 101:12, 101:17, 101:18

words 26:13work 3:18, 20:9, 44:3, 50:18, 57:16, 58:12, 69:4, 76:20, 77:7, 77:8, 83:25, 84:2, 84:3, 87:11, 87:16, 93:1, 95:4, 110:10, 110:23, 112:14, 113:20, 114:9, 116:15, 127:7, 128:15, 140:11, 144:16, 147:1, 151:23

worked 87:15, 87:20, 89:25

working 92:23, 114:3, 140:7, 144:9

works 62:14, 77:9

worried 53:17worry 152:18worse 31:18, 31:19

worth 31:8write 135:17writing 88:17, 89:11, 130:7, 136:23

Written 9:22, 10:7, 12:8, 41:24, 42:19, 89:5, 130:14,

130:16, 135:20, 135:21, 156:24

Wronker 9:1, 10:11, 10:13, 19:2, 19:3, 28:9, 33:12, 34:12, 51:4

Wronker. 10:18, 19:7, 19:10, 19:14, 28:14, 28:18, 29:1, 29:4, 29:9, 34:11, 34:13, 35:5, 35:11, 35:15, 76:5, 84:13, 84:15

wrote 21:9

< Y >yard 139:2yards 44:18year-round 61:14, 153:7

yesterday 99:5young 33:18, 53:7, 59:7

yourself 5:7, 6:4, 136:10

< Z >zero 36:23, 118:14, 118:17

zip 135:24zone 93:7

205

Maine€¦ · STATE OF MAINE DEPARTMENT OF ENVIRONMENTAL PROTECTION IN THE MATTER OF THOMAS PROUTY...

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Transcript of Maine€¦ · STATE OF MAINE DEPARTMENT OF ENVIRONMENTAL PROTECTION IN THE MATTER OF THOMAS PROUTY...