develop in November, December of 1974 the money market

became a l itt le better;' do you know?

A Yes, It did.

Q So that if you had sold the house you would

not have had to sell it for a VA loan as great a number of I

points as earlier in the year?

A That's right.

Q In view of that condition, did you later in

the gear offer the house to the Robinsons?

A Yes, sfr.

Q And did they accept your offer?

A No, sir,

Q Aad you offered it to them on the same basis

as the July 24, 1974 sales agreement?

' A Yes, sir; same as thfs contract,

Q And you offered t o -- at the t i m e of the offer

you had eceornplished the temite repair?

A Yes, sir. That was completed and had a cetti-

flcate.

Q Just two wrap-up points, F i r s t , is it fair

to say that st all times durtng this closing session on I August 9 , 1974 you were ready and willing to close upon the

basts o f the July 24, 1974 contract?

A Yes, s%x.

Q YOU were willing to cmsamate that?

A Y q sir.

(2 And it's also fair to say that all the decision

w f t b respect to whether you sold or did not sell or the

terms and conditions upon which you would sell or: not sell

were made by you as the seller?

A Rgght, s%r.

Q And that the only advice which you had with

respect to this was from Mgke Home; right?

A Rf ght.

Q And that be advised you that it was your duty

to sell and to negotiate for a sale irrespective of the

race of the purchaser?

A Yes, sir. ,?%at didn't matter at all and I t ~ l d

him I; knew it.

MR. 'flUSSELL: That's a11 I have.

THE HEARING OFPXCER: Any members of the

Commission have any questions?

P.W. BLACKSHECAR: Can we see the contract?

MR. LACKEY: Sfr, 1 have some on recross -- redirect, if I may.

FJould you like t o -- B& MR. m-:

Q I h e just one or two questions, Nr. Mashburn,

if you &net mind.

Yau mentioned that g m had made an offer to

203

sell the house to the Robinsons; is that correct?

A Yes.

Q A later offer?

A Yes.

Q Isn't it true that that offer was made after

the lawsuit was filed in this matter -- ehe lawsuit in Feder

Cotart?

A I'm really not sure, when we made--

MR. BUSS-: It was. ~e '11 . st5pulate that it

was.

Q And are you a defendant in the proceeding now

pendfng Ln Federal Court?

A Y e s , sir.

Q Are you represented by counsel on that?

A Yes, sir.

Q Who is your counsel?

A Mr, Russell.

Q Okay. Wow, Mr. Russell brought up a later

offer that I'm interested in discussing. Would you tell us

about this offer? Was it Pooles or Poulis?

Q ~oulis?

Q Mas it your testbony that you were going to

A. PRICEl NEWBERRY & CO., INC.

net more than three thousand dollaxs more undex: that: con-

A Thatas ttze figure -- actually, I 'd Eorgorrea

that propasit2on until he brought it up. But they offered

US anore nnoney.

Q They offered you more money?

Q you're absolutely s w e of that?

A I 'm pretty sure. In that contract -- f think they've gut a copy aE stt there.

MR. RUSSELL: Just a minute. I'll hand it to

you.

HR, LACKEY: Have you -- Hay I see it= for a

nameat? This is the -- I'll tell you what. X have

a ctlpy right here, Mr. Russell, if you'd like to look

at: it.

3Y NR, LACKEY:

Q Now, Mr. Mashburn, looking at that contract, I

just want t o make absolutely sure that we don't have a m i s -

understanding about thfs, that you turned dawn this Foulis

contract which was going to net you three thwsand dollars

more than the Robinsan contract,

A Fine.

Q Cash in hand?

A A good part of it: was in cash.

MR, RUSSELL: Mr. Lackey, you can compute what-

ever you want to compute. I ccnapute i t as cl hundred

less con?xact, that he would have netted thlrty-nPne

thousand, five hundred, I believe; and that under the

Robfnson contract he would have netted three thousand

one hundred and nfnety -- thirty-six e h ~ ~ s - d , one

huadred and ninety-seven dallars.

THE WITNESS: Thirty-nine, five.

one ninety-seven. We'll stipulate that whatever you

say is right,

MR. LACKEX: Now, my conrputatfuns shows thiat %t

wuld have netted approximately thirty-six thousa~d

that hie w w l d have netted, Thirty-six thozttsad,

one hundred and ngnety dollars, which i s considerably

less -- s a n d a t less than he would have netted under

the Robifison contract.

MR. RUSSELL: Maybe we can figure it out when

we have a recess. But under th&s one there were no

pognts to be absorbed and tirereis no c3loslng cost on

the--

MR. LACKEY: Well, let me just ask Mr, PQrashbwn

abetat the cantract. Maybe I cou'id clarify it,

Q Mr. Mashburm, why don't you look at thfs docu-

A. PRICEt NEWBERRY & CO.! INC.

ment. Is rlnae the same document that Mr. Russell handed you

a moment ago?

A I would assume it i s , the best Xcan tell,

Q Okay. Idhat was the original offer an tMs

contract?

A Thirty -- from what I can see f t was thirty-

eight, then we went to forty-- thousand, %nLtialed by me.

(2 1 r i g Now, do you recall when you gat

thfs contract, da you remember receiving -- I mean, Bo you

remember receiving--

A Yeah,

Q All right. %en yotti received it, what: was the

contract mount, principal amount of the contract?

A Looks Uke on here -- it's been crossed

through but it was thfrty-eight thousand -- looks like five

hundred dollars. f didnt t accept that.

Q Well, was that contract signed by Mr. Psulis?

Is that his name, P w l i s ?

A Yeah.

Q So M r . Poulis made you an offer of thirty-eight

thousand, five hundred m d you countered with an ofEer of

forty-two thousand, that% your init lax -- that contract was

never accepted by Mr. Poulis, rfght, the forty-ma tbustmdl

A It was aecsepred by .me, under those terns.

Q a t a t was accepted by you, the thirty-ef&t

thousand, five hundred?

A Yeah, the forty-two thousand was accepted on

the basis of h h paying in cash less the balance o f a loan

shown at slx thousand dollars.

9 The forty-two thausand only bears your Pnftials

doesn't it?

A That's right.

Q He never signed that contract, dfd he, the

raf sa to furry-two thousand? His initials don't appear by

the figures?

9 So there was a counter ofger of forty-two

thousand which y w based your statement, which sti l l sub-

m i t 'Ls S ~ ~ - S ~ Z Z V Z X ~ ~ ~ that you had an offer of three thousand

&alf;a~s ahout the Robinson offer? Bahar you were referring to

was your counter of fex?

A That's right,

9 h d not the aemal. offer that Mr. Poulis made?

A Right.

MR. LACKEY: X' d Ifke make this docmaant: marked

please, State's Exhibit 2,

WICTEESS: W e l l , f realized more money since

there wasn't any points.

Q Wxtld you mind repeatzng that lase statennent2

A. PRICE# NEWBERRY & CO., INC.

A understanding on that contract, I wwld have

made more money because there were not -- I did not have to

pay any points, and closing costs in that contract.

(Document was marked

BSI m* urn:

Q Who l ed y m to that understanding?

A We went over the glgurss when Mrs. Alexander,

I believe, brought the contract over to his office. We went

over it.

Q Did he tell you that you were g ~ h g t=o net

three thousand dollars more an P~ulis' original ftffer of

thirty-eight thousand, Etve hundred?

A No, I donqt believe ft was on that E%,gure

because I wuuldnf t have taken that figure. I went t o forty-

Q Well, on the forty-two he told you--

A Xtd make same money off ft.

Q PuulZs never accepted it -- the forty-two

thousand?

A Nu,

d So in essence you d&d ratst have an oE£er that:

would have netted you more than -- three thousand mere tka the Robinson closing; I s that correct?

A As far as L kmw, you're right, unless it. would

A. PRICE, NEWBERRY & CO.. INC.

work rnzt on the basis of the thirtfl-eight thousand I would

clear on it. Sut Z donet remember exactly when those two

figures were put: together.

PIR, LACKEY: Mr. Hearing Officer, I submit

that my original objection to testimony concemj-ng

t h i s contract: should kwe been sustafned.

TEfE MEARIRG OFFICER: 'Ls that the nature of

the plea or the nature of an observar&an?

MR. LACKEY: Thert was m e r e l y an obsewaticm,

stick with my arigina3. mling, thank you. you've

j u s t demonstrated very well the purpose of cross-

exandnetion, Hz, Lackey.

MR. TERRY: X just have a few questions.

BY PW, TERRY:

Q Isn't it a fact, Hr. HasXxb, that Mr. Poul5.s

was not going t~ pay you in cash even under his thirty-eight,

f3.ve offer was he?

A R%s offer to me was not a'if of i e 2n wash.

Q Was he afferBng to pay you twelve thQusaflGT

dollars in cash?

A f believe it was somewhere in that neig&r-

Q He was offering to pay you twelve thusand

dollars in cash w i t h w h a t other terms?

A. PRICEl NEWBERRY & CO., INC.

A I believe he wanted me to carry $be balance a£

it over a periad of years with him paying ~ i e a considerable

amount each -the I don't know what, f don't: reefill that

figare,

Q Would it have been samething like three

thousand dallars every tw m o n ~ s : -or so?

A Every what?

C WouXd it have been samething l i k e three

tZlcnzsand dollars every two months?

A Pretty good sum, Can 1 ask -- Theg haw iik

contract that's in there. I don't rmembez the f&girre.

9 Okay, So you were only going eu get: twelve

th001send dallars in cash?

A Smeth&ng like that.

.Q &d with the ~ob5nsons' con?xact: you wwld

hawe g0tte.a wasiderably in excess of thfxty-sosne~hinfs

tkousand dollars after the closing; is &a$--

A Right

Q Y w t e s t i f i e d regarding the fact that you fiiad

made certais improvements in the house, central a%r and so

for&, Wa8 that h e over a period of years?

A No, Yeah, I did tn '~ a l l at one time. I didn't

have that much money,

9 A l l right, These were the hproveateznts yaaa made

elwring the course of the time you lived there; i s that--

A. PRICE, NEWBERRY & CO.. INC.

A Oh, yes. Right.

Q And they weren't m a d e ar the the that you

lncwed out of the house?

A PJo. They were done before I. m e d eut.

Q Did you eyer have occasion to look a4: eke

figures that Mr. Horne went over with you? Did he write

down f3tgures and s0 forth?

A Yeah. He wrote them down and f, also worked

them up, just in ballpark figures.

Q Let me show you t=he document: and ask you if

p a recognize that document.

A X couJdntt swear to ft but 5t laaks like

probably where figures were worked up on this house, I

assume.

Q fk, you know what &at is?

A 1Yo. That's what I J u s t said, sir, that it

looks like the ffgwes worked up on this house.

Q Om the Robgnson fuzuse.; righe?

A On my house.

Q W $ t h respect to the Robinson offer, which was

A Yes, sir. l'hat could have been.

Q %at &es -- Whose f2g;ures axe those?

A I really don't know. I assume they 9xe prab-

ably M i k e Harne ' s.

Q Does that look l i k e Wr. Home's handwriting?

A I havan't seen that much o f his handwriting.

Mike Home says that's his.

Q So Mike Horne sat: down with you an the day of

closing; you a l l d id same figwin$, df&* t yo%?

A Right

Q Okay. What: was the amount that Mx. came

up with that you would realize on that: hou~e?

A f can't tell myself on M s .

MR, RUSSELL: I object to this. Be fs not

cmpetenc t o teseify as to somebody else's Efgures.

21#E HEARING OISPYCERf The dtmess has expressed

rehctanee a h t thts and Z think that best l s fr go

Home*

PIR. TERRY: Let: me j u s t ask one more question.

BY MR. TERRY%

Q Does not Mr* ~ome's figures to you on h g u s t

the 9th which yau worked wt: and went wez with him reelect

Ulat you would have realized thirty-seven thousand, aix

hundred and t=hirty-seven dollars and t9fty cents, minus

six trtfndrsd and nfnety-two fjtfty? See %f that regxlashsrs

your recollectf on,

A No. I really don't see that, Mr. T e x q . E

don't see it: here showing anything about thott amount.

Q So is it yaur testimony that you d d ' t h o w

A. PRICE, NEWBERRY & CO., INC.

how much you would have gotten in cash had tbe Bobinson

deal closed on August the 9th? You don't know how wtch cash

you would have gotten Erom that closhg then, do you?

A Other than what I have, my own figures. And I

had those I went wer wlth M i k e . It's been so long ago I've

campletely forgatten.

"TIfE HEARING OFFICER: The witness previ~usly

testified i t would have been a litt3.e less than a

thousand dollars.

IS. TERRY: Yeq Your Honor. And these cyes-

tions go to that: answer and his knowledge o f *at

kind of a deal he was getting,

MIA, RUSSI&L: I call the hnmissian'a attea-

tion to the fact that he testiffad in that regard

in response to Mr. ~ackey's questions. Mr. Terry

has already had a shot at him, on that partkctxlar

sub3 oct and should not have--

TM[E BEIRING OFFICER: I elrink Mr. T e r q bs

f inkshed d t h the examination,

MR, TXRRY: I am, Your Honor, yes,

THE HEARXHG OFFICER: Any members of the

Commission? I

I HR. RIMG: 1% concerned that apparently frcm

1 the testhony y ~ u were notified on Thursday prior to

closfng on Friday that there were sane wney problems.

A PRICE. NEWBERRY & CO.. I NC.

And it appears obvious at this point that yaw broker

knew rn Thmsday what those problems were. How, do

you think it's unusual that he didn't -- is it your

testimony that no attempt was made to explain those

figures to you until yott got to the closbg?

THE WITMESS: That's right. X didn" cpedtfon

Mike. We'd been working back and Eenrth on this

thirig and I didni t question him about f t. Just out

of that reason I f e l t l ike he was -- he thought it

would be worked out -- the money problems at tihe

time.

MR. KING: Okay. Well, certainly f rom the \

reaction that yau a l l had at the closing table no-

body had attempted to prepare the buyers to pay that

money. Did you deduce from that why the clasing -- why everybody met in the f irs t place, and &at was

expected to happen, who was gofng to pay %t4

THE WITNESS: Well, under the terms of the

contract, part aver a hundred dollars -- part wez

the termite thtng, fo r instance, was supposed t o be

paid by the Robinsons.

MR. KING: So it's apparent that; he just left

i t to chance at the closing t b t whoever was going

to give would do it or ie would all go under?

THE WIETNlSS: %at's more or legs, X thi&.

CO.< INC.

He and Mr, Cook and Mike, 1 thi* they felt l ike

maybe the parties would get together.

HR. KIBYG: No other questions,

MR. DAWSOM: Mr. Hashburn, you have made

statements relative to the price going up and I

bel ieve that yaaz stated on one occasion that the prfc

went up at Hr. hnner's office after closing did not

occur, And cm another occasion yon said the price

went up after you had been able to go to the bank

to renew the thirty thousand dollar note, When did

the price sf the house go up?

TEE WITNESS: Went up at the closing, Samebody

asked what did X plan on dubg wLth the B ~ w e and X

sald ell, I'll put: it back rn the market far forty-

E m , nine hundred.

And then -- let's see. f belfeve the rest of

your question was -- I raised it m c e . &tual%y, I

raised ft when I left the closing, Then -- What was

the rest of your question, sir?

MR. DAWSON: I wanted to know when did the

price go up. Because you testified that ft: wont up

at two df ffermt times. X w a n t t~ know at: Wch l ime

did the price actually go up.

TME WITNESS: In my intention it went up when

they asked me what I was going to do with it. And 1

A. PRICE, NEWBERRY & CO.> INC.

said well., I guess I'll just put it back ~n the

snarket: and put it back an like at forty-four, nine

ktzneed.

MR, DAWSON: That was at Ms. bnner's office?

THE WITNESS: Yes. That was at the @losing.

E4R. W'WN: What was the reason that yau

increased the price at that t h e ?

THE WfTEaESS: Well, t~ put it back on a0: the

prSce it was or9ginaPly begore we cut the price to

forw-three, ftve. And the reason P thought I

could get more money was the economy and the Water-

gate thing 1 hoped had been cleared up and so it

cauld get mave money. Muney would be easier, It was

j u s t a business decision. They're not always good.

a s o , I was not that -- I think yors asked &e

second part was -I after the loan I would have

gotten either Eram this b& or someplace else, So--

'PW. DAWSON: At that time at the -- Mar, Dmmer's

off2ce after the closing d i d -0: scar, axa I ccrrect

in assuming that: you did not feel that that trans-

action could be closed out?

WITNESS: . I didn't fee% that

because we had actualZy endfed up meeting twjlce at

that same the. Mr. and Mrs, Robinson, Mrs. Robinson

particular woulrin' t give anything.

A. PRICEl NEWBERRY & CO.! INC.

MR. MWSON: Okay, No further questtons, I

Tl[IE lG&!!&fHG OFFJCFiRr Uby. Mr. Mashburn

excused or da you want Wm to stay around?

don' t mind having him around. As far as X'm caw

cemed we're through with hlm as a witness, anless

sanething u;ntoward ar unexpected occurs. IC" dike

for him tc, stay around and Ilsten, if Mr. Lackey

doesn*e have any objection to him staybg ;ia rtre

room. X undarstand that we may have to r e a l 1 hb.

I bt% antfcipate it.

MR. TERRY: Your Honer, could L ask kk. Mask

burn one store question tn light of the quesstbn that

took place?

quesri~n regarding y w r knowledge and yew camsnIc;aitimt w i t h

Hr, &me. Did Mr. Home or anyane w i t h Jackson Rei~1t37

ever tell you that a veteran could not pay the p i n k s and

cwLd not pay the termite damage?

A That the veteran could?

Q Gmld not.

A No. I don't believe so. Because I was going

en the basit3 of the -- the ccmtmact said X fnad to gay the

I I A. PRICE, NEWBERRY & CO., INC.

f k s e hundred dollars and they paid the rest,

Q Did anyone ever tell you that in order for

this transactdon to close on August the 9th that you mid

have had .to carte up w i t h the six nbaety-two, fif q?

A 3t donl"t belteve &at wasi mentioned at the

closing, They were talking to the Robinsons abut the

afference that they had &I pay.

Q Did Mr. Home ever marion it to you prior to

the closing?

A He sa9d Z'd only M e to pay what was an tbe

coatract, S.o that's what I went: on, that basis.

m* '.tmmP: Thank you.

TEIE: HEARING OFFICER: Okay.

Ma. IXLA-HEAR: Mr. Hashbum, the tima that

you and W, Horne found out that the WbLnsonts were

black, did Mr. Horne discuss w%th ycnz or advise pau

that: he might have any problems whatsoever cc+'~c;~i~ufng

his business if you went through w i t h the eontract,

or d5d he try to get you to not fukfill yaw

obligation--

= WITNESS: No, sir, %era was -- Pn fact, I was there with Mike for same a&ice but I deal

w9th contracts and f didn't M e any questim8 h

mind,

MR. BJLACKSPfW: Do you see in your b 1 6 5 ; d g e

A. PRICE. NEWBERRY & CO.. INC.

anything that Mt. Harne did that persuaded you not

to go through w i t h it? Md ha do everything as far

as you were concerned that a good real estate broker

should do?

'EfQE WITM3SS: Heah. As fax as f know,

I don't -- Well, simple answer is yes, he d i d

everything that 1 thf* any a t h a broker ~ m 1 d do

in my opinion. He didn't -- He wanted actually -- and evidently, when he got me down here -- and ft

was probably just like any other salesman, get the

parties together, maybe sanething cam be worked

at. So I took i t on that basfs,

HR. IEAcaSHEAR: Would you go so Ear as to say

that your thinking is that he really wanted yw to

go tXncoagh wfth the contract?

TEE WITNESS: Y e s , sir. I donf t: think Hike

had anything one way or the other. In fact, it

wouldn't have mattered anyway because it was my

money that was being given away, In fact, I dan' t

think hardly anybody there could convince me at that

t h e that i t wasn't. But I wasn*t going to pay any

m o r e money. And I felt at: that time that if they

d i e take it on the basis o f this contract, I could

get more money for it in a very short while. The

VA appraisal was very l~w,

A. PRICE! NEWBERRY & CO.1 INC.

PBX, Wmm: Did you ask him to try to

renegotiate thfs matter for you?

TEE VXTNESS: No, sir. Y m mean renegotiate

at the clesing?

HI, IIUCKSNEaR: A t the clos9.ngS ar did you

ask kh after the posing t o try and renegetlaee?

THE WITNESS: Mo, sir. f d2dnpt,

FlbR, BLACHSHEAB: No further questions.

3W.3 HEARING OFFTCEX: Okay,

HR. RUSSELL: Just: one puestion.

BY MR. RUSSEU:

Q H&ke Horne had a c ~ s s f o n riding on this

deal, d2dn' t: he?

A Y e s , sir.

Q And he didn't show any disposition t o throw It

may, did he?

A No, sir.

(Z And muldnL t: it be. fair to say as far as you

could tell he wanted the deal to close?

A Yes, sir, I think they a l l wanted the deal

t=o close except: me,

MR. W3SMI'IX: 'Z wocxld P i k e to ask Eaim one

quest%un if I may, you're sayhg at a later date

you made an offer back to the Robinsons.

WITNESS: Yes.

A. PRICE) NEW.%ERRY & CO.< INC.

MR. ESESMITH: To sell them the property at the

prfce that you had agreed to there.

II EIPB, NFSMITH: What grampted that offer? As

X recall, it was several months later. What

prompted that offer -- counter d e e r by y w 2

TklE WXTkES5: At that t b e the pofnts weril!

dropped, interest and everything had ckopped that I:

could have sold it to them and cleared what I had

originalxy fntmded to clear out of thls cont~aat,

MEi, RUSSELL: Mr. N e s m i t h , maybe Ttd better

II answer that. That was done strict'fy an advice of I

counsel .to s t a p any c Z a h of damages wader the law-

suit,

'Ske points were down, he could have, closed it

I/ withaut lashg those paints and ~ a d e more money tban

he could have Pn August,

So 2t: was an my &vice that he made the offer.

And the cblEfer was rejected,

MR. !.Q3SMTTH: Thank you.

THE HEARXMG OFFECER: Okay. Witness is

I1 (Wgtness excused.)

Mr, Lackey, does this c a p l a t e your--

=. U m : &. Castellani, "Id l*e eto make

A. PRICE. NEWBERRY & CO.. INC.

a tender of evic9ence, I have t w a exhfbits. W i b l t

1, which ILs the check o f Advance Mortgage Company

ident i f ied by Mr. Birrgham. And state's &&%bit Nuggbe:

2, which i s a contract which Mr. Mashburn and f j u s t

went wer involving Gus A. Poulf s to J, M. Hashbum

to purchase the same property , f ' d like $0 off sr

t b s e inta evidence,

THE H W N G OFFXCER: Any objection?

MR. RUSSELL: (Shakes head negatLve1y.)

THE EEARXMG QFFXCP;R: 'Eke evidence -- EkkLbf trs

P and 2 are admitted without objection,

(State's Exhibits I, and 2

a&i.tted into evidence without

objection.)

PIR, LACKEY: I rest,

TEE BEARXMG OFFXCER: A l l right, Let's all

rest. In v i e w of the problem we have w t t h er f%ve

minure break, let's take a ten rn-te break this

time.

(Short recess,)

HEBRING OFFICER: M r . Zussell-, w e you

ready? Do you want to call yaur first wieness?

MR, RUSSEL&: If 1 might, X t d like to make

a motion to dismiss two sf them, depending on how

they go, And Is d like to make the first one w i t h

respect to the charges ag&%mt Mr, James E, J86:Sstsm,

whcr i s the broker and oxma of Jack8o.n R e a l t y

Caonpany . THE HEAafNG QFPXCER: If f may, X thimk I

know what you're go- to say. And unless yar hwe

some valfd objection, I 'd PAke to hear what Mrp, Lackc3

has to say because I think yauere go* to &e a

nmtiarn to dismiss as to Mr. Jackson on the basis

that there's been no conne~tim b e m e n Jackson and--

P1IR. RUSSELL: I thhk probably what you say

Ls 0:orrect. And 1 knew that Hr, Lackey wants to

rely upon the Rule 520-1-.21 of the Ccmmirss3Lonrs

rules, And P t is chat a real estate bxuket: shtIf,

be befd respansible far any salesman wRo vioXates

any of t=he regu'iatfons of this Chapter, Pt has been

estitb%ished that: Mr. IIome was the assoclLaee brukrr9:+

and with tbat Z pass the ball ta Hr. Lac- and Be

can ccms back,

MR. LACKEY: P thf& theza*s two xef;rpcmse;s to

t h e , sir, FirsC of a l l , let me point out to yau

that there was testimony an the part of B. Reeves

that he had. a conversation d t h Hr, Jackson Monday

A. PRICE, NEWBERRY & CO.< INC.

following W s -- the date of closing, And un that

&fenday -- a-nd when he talked ta Reeves -- tjlBen he talked to Mr. Jackson they went into this, And Hr.

Jackson acknowledged that he had talked Ebbnne

about it, that he knew about the factual s l ~ t h n ,

And I will simply assert that if Mr. Home is fin fact

found to have been ;Lrr violation of Che reax estate

law, then I think he can certainly prove the

ratification of that conduct of Mr. Jackson gzz hSs

conversation that Mbnday, for a start,

And the other grounds of course 19; that P t says

every broker shall be responsible to -- L j u s t

alleged that 520-1-.21 fn that soctian of the wSe

is broader than what: M, Russell would hasre yow read,

~ ' m not absolutely convixlcad tn my nahd &at wh-

a -- you bow, there are three classes uE licenrtees,

~hexe's what: they call a broker, an associate br~ker

and a salesman. O f carse, the broker here should

be held responsible for these salesmen, it actwlly

means principal broker. And X think that CQ say

that a principal broker is to be l i ab le for the accs

o f kfs salesmen but not for his associate broker,

who are %n essence d o i q the same w u ~ k , ~ f d Be to

constwe that rule a b i t too narrowly, Because if

you t r y to put that sort of cap on Pt, that= m e a n s tha

A. PRICEf NEWBERRY & CO.# INC.

there's nobody wko is responsible £or these associate

brokers. Everybody -- not everybody, but obv~ously

under the law if you look a t it under 84-140% 2n

following, you'll see that it's clear that an

associate broker iand a salesman are in essence the

same thing. They are persons who are Ilcensed to -- Well., perhaps I ' d better get the section. f t: would

be easier to find it -- to do that.

It says ( reading) associat;e broker shall. mean

a person who acts on behalf of a real estate broker

in performing any act authorized by this Qapter to

be performed by the broker.

B e salesman or"5alespersaa shal l mean any per-

son, other than an associate broker, .who acts an be-

ha13 of a real estate broker in perfomfng any act

authorfzed by this Chapter to be pcrforoned by the

broker.

Now, that's the dfstinction under the law.

Now, the regulations don' t contain to my knowledge--

and I'm sure that y~u'll correct me if it's d i f fer -

ent--a shplier distinction. And I think that sface

both, even under the definftions here, both the

assistant broker and the saleman are perfuming the

same fintztions which I just ourtlined, t h a ~ f l: would

not be improper to construe the language of that

A. PRICEl NEYVBERRY & CO.# INC.

rule to include associate brokers.

So I &Pnk that under efther of those two

theories, efther that W. Jacksan's knowledge--

demonstrated knowledge of ehe events which occurred

on the follow2ng Plonday and his r a t i f i c a t h of

thsn if Mr. Reeve's testhemy -- I bal.leve luIr,

~eeve's testimony can be construed that way -- or a broader reading of that rufe would auf fice ro keep

Hr. Jackson in.

PW. RUSSELL: XJ'lX respond briefly, if Z

might, You have Borne cpestiens, Mr. CastelPani?

THE EUR3CNG OFFICER: X had a question. My

qtiesthn is that I guess *at: you're saflng, Mr.

Laokey,f s that whenever they use the tenn sale-

in the mlea and regplrrtisns, ~rou contend that they

axso mean associate broker, or they also use the

term broker in here, h ' t they, quite a bi t? You

mem to say that never includes associate broker?

Associate broker &bait means saleman?

MR, LA-: I will not stand here and say

that in the mfeo and regulations of this CamZssZon

tkat their term associaee broker %s ~t used,

because X don't know that: for: sure. But obviously

the rule makes a separate distfncdon between b'i:okers,

assoeZate brokers and salemea. f mean the Zztts

makes that, rather,

L e t me just give you an example. I Z m jus9:

pteking 520-I-.20, Meighborhood Disruptions,

(Reading) No real estate broker, real, estate sales-

man or employee or agent of any real estate kproker

or salesman shall uti l ize loud speakers, sound tracks

ur other voice amplifying equ&pment.

Now, if you use M r . RussellCs coast~"uc.tf.on

of the term salesman Ln that rule, that means that

an associate broker could go out and use a sound

track 3.n his neighburhood. And f think that's a

xeassnable construction. You have to consE:ma the

associate broker as to either being a bxoke~ or a

salesman in the context of these rules because a e y

don't refer to associate brokers. Bnd the clefhi-

tion of an associate broker ere m o r e identical or I more close al igned to a salesman than they are ta a

broker, A broker is respanslble for the &ctiv&t=es

of his salesmen and assacfate brokers, Z think

that's tbe only proper cmstrtxction that can be given

to that rule. And since associate broker isn't

defined in that regulation I th5,nk it's a perfectly

permissible constwction,

THE H M X N G OFFICER: I see your Paragraph 23

of the Notice of Hearing directed towards Mr. Jackson

A. PRICEI NEWBGRRY & CO.l INC.

which y ~ u allege as to the practice of the Respon-

dents mt to aelP property omed by whPte persons to

black persons and vice versa. Do you sti l l make

that contention or do you contend that that allega-

tion is recovered by same of your proof?

HR, UCXCEY: 1 say again that I tbfnk that ff

Mr. Home is found to have committed a violaeioa,

ghat that wiX1 be hputed to Hr. Jackson, and that

is their practice -- what Mr. Home was doing is

the practice sf ehe real estate firm,

Now, of course, as f. understand Plr. Russell,

3.E hfs motfans aren't granted be intends to ca l l -- wesl1 have a chance t o further develop that m

CXOS8 e +

But f: just think that under that -- what I've j u s t said -- is a bit premature to be letting W.

Jackson out.

MR. RUSSELL: Mr. CaseeXlani, you've raised

a second pofnt which I intend to raise. And that

is that in my vf ex* there has been ns evidence

presented in support of the allegations a£ Paragraph

23. And 1 certainly do not * t e n d to call witnesses

to open that subject up.

The Paragraph says that it is alleged that it

is the practice of the Respondents not to selX

property owned by white persons to black persons and

vice vezsa and that by refusing to do so, the agent

02 the Respundents was acting within the scope of

his aulhor%ty.

Row, you've csxrectly designed that there has

been no evidence of the practice of the 'Respondents

with respect to selling blacks or to whites, cn: vice

versa. And testhonj thus far has cme ernttrely

from persans who are not associated w i t h Jackson

Realty Cmpany and could m t w e n have repreed to

have had any kncywladge of the practices or policies

of the Respandents. So I'm mt gofag into that.

I ' d j us t hurl fayself bf f. did.

And 3t have a motion pending to dismiss with

respect to Paragraph 23.

%XI?, HlWtZEIG OFFICER: Hav& yau Efled same

sort of an answer or--

MR. RUSSEIL: Yes. We ELled an answer, was

denied of Paragraph 23.

THE HE:ARING OFFICER: Okay. I'm i n favor of a

copy of that answer. E don't guess it's necessary

to have one right now, But Z'd like to W e one

samethe before--

MR. RUSSEL;L: I have capies O£ the arigiftal.

1'11 bzntmg them down. 1% gohg to make a note of it

A. PRICE. NEWBERRY & CO.( INC.

right now.

Now, Bet me go to M s other point which f

think is very important. And first, Nr . Lackey

argues rtzat solrte testimony of Mr. Reeves l%&ed

Mr. Jackson in some way to the activft&es h a e

invo3lved, Z made very good notes em that. Hr.

Reeves safd that he talked with Mr. Jaeksan on tke

Mortday mornjlng after the Friday. He said he fele

because of the racial issue, it was best that f call

Mr, Jackson. He said that Hr. Jackam was negative

and iwrbted, And when I asked him a b t it, he

safd that he knew about the transaction and quote,

to some degree, close quote. Ho further e&aboka-

t.ltcun bn *at as to what to some degree is.

Now, he further said thatb dtscussed it ~ 5 t h

Plr. Jackson, said it was racLal, and HF, Jackson

said, quota, it may be racial to you, but not to

us, period, close quote,

NOW, that's all there is, Now, you can't. hang

a man on samething l ike that X subi t .

Now, secondly -- and also 1 think Wt; insofar

as the prosacutfon relies upon that slim reed, why

&e mation should be granted,

Now, the other part relates to whether ctr not

under Rule 21 you wlll hold a broker respowible

A. PRICE# NEWBERRY & CO.< INC.

231

in a situation such as this where the rules says

a broker, real estate broker, shall be responsible

foe any salesman who violates any of the reguIat5ons

of thPs Chapter.

Now, of cauxse salesmen, 9t says salesman,

and you people who wrote thfs rule know better than

anybody else that the essential difference is in

training and experfence and resgonsfbi3,itiea between

a saleman and a broker.

When yarr -- I just cton't believe that when y m

say solemnen y m mean to ltrtcluife brokers, wen if

they are assodate brokers,

Now, it £urther says (reading): Every broker

s h L E be responsible to instruct his salesmen or

employees a£ the provfsions set forth 32.n thfs

Chapter. That second part of that rule -- Chapter deals with the; broker's responsibflity to make sure

that hLs people know what the law fs and that: they

use i r properly.

And then the final sentence says (reading)::

The broker shall notify the Georgia ReaX Estate Cam-

mission of any vfolatfm sf this Chapter. bSow, that's

what the rules says. And certainly it seems to me

it m l d not be held fbr the puscpase of Intperflfng

a mar& Ifcexlse, that he is respmstble for the action

A. PRICEI NEYYB-ERRY & CO., INC.

232

o f wmeone else unless he knew about it, unless

he was directly or indirectly Lnvolved, unless he

expressly or Impl2edly or otherwise directed,

Now, the record doesn't: shooJ &at Mr. Ja&soa

authorfzed or condoned anything wMch i s alleged t o

have happened, Now, certainly we don't have in this

country a system where we take away the Zfcssnse af

a broker because of actions o f an associate which

w e r e unknown by that braker, which were net

authorized, which were not s h m on this record tro

be condcnad or encouraged in any way.

Mr. Castellani, you're familiar o f course with

the crimfnel rules, and this is not particularly

unlike that. Our courts have consistently held that

a pr%nc&pal is not to be held responafble Eot the

crb%naZ acts of 8.: agent, because the necassa~y

ccbinal intent cannot be fmputed to the principal.

And furthermore, that no principal gives an agent

authority to canmit a crfni.nal act or to disobey

the law. And there's been m, such authority granted

here 2n aniy action, if P t were in vfolation of the

rules, wrauld have been beyond the scope oP the

eutho+ity of the here associate broker-agent.

Now, ene further thing on this. And *at is,

that our license Law under wfrfch we operate, Section

A. PRICE, NEWBERRY & CO., INC.

21 says that a broker can have his license revoked

or suspended when the broker &self has been fmnd

guilty of unfa1.1 trade practices, inc'luding k t not

P M t e d to the one in isenre here, which i s the

Sub (1) refusJtng because of race eo show, sell

real eatate to a prospectgve purchaser,

Now, theye's nath2ng in the law which, sets

forth the takItng away of B brokerSs license s4.rapPy

because oE samething one of the safeman may b e

dme.

Thiak of the exposure, You have a S B & B ~ ~

puts an earnest mmey check %n his pocket, ym'd

be up hem to lase your license up here tom~rrtsw.

That wou ld be nonsensical unless you knew about it,

unless y.ou condoned it, ursless y w authorized i t j

and that" the e s i ~ s z t i o ~ w e have here,

Now, thfs law, Judge Castellan%, X do not:

belleve can be expanded to cover the situatian where

a broker's salewan takes some aetfon wh%ch is

alleged t o be against the rules. The law is quite

explicit in Subsection -- 5,n Section 1421 i n saying

that when the licensee--at's the broker k e - - b s

been found guilty of any unfair trade practices then

you can suspend or revoke.

But the law does not say when the licensee's I

I1 A. PRICE. NEWBERRY & CO., INC.

agent: ox saleman or samething Etas been found p Z 1 t y

of dokg these th1ngs -- and when you have ta law

the legislettur's delegation af paver should nst be

expanded to take away peoples' licenses, and that:

they shbtxZd ba done cnnfy &a accordance with the

explicit terms of the statute.

Tha~k you.

MR. TERRY: Pour Hanor, may I?

'XBE I3.EARING OlFFICER: Y e s , certatnly.

MR. TERRY: X'd just l%b to say a few words

?tn rcesponse to Mr, uss sell's presentation.

'bt seems to me that d t h respect t=o 520-h21,

fr ts important to xecognPze that Mr. & m e and the 1 facts %n this ease really perform two Eunct%ons, Be

certafnly was a salesman w i t h respect: to hPs 1 dealings d t h Hz. Mashhm. He performed the

operat3.vely of engaging 2n representing Mr. Hashbum

d U t respect ta the sale of his Wse, And 'Z think

w2thin that context he certainly was a salesmen,

through Mr, Borne, did bve a policy with zespect

wltta3.n the meaning tpf that section,

In terms of Mr. ~usselzs 'ssssrtfon re&enrdZq

Paragraph 23, there fs very clear and convincing

evidence %n this case tket a s campany, act%%

A. PRICE. NEWBERRY & CO.. INC.

.

t;o black garsons, whrch 9s reflected in the admissimi

net anly made by Mr. Home but also those by Mr.

Bmngtf acting in concert v d t h hh,

mle other self-serving statements of t=he

defendants are ~ 8 s t i ~ s of fact £or the Cmmi~~ion

to decide wRe*er or not there was such a polic~,

&b the fact &at they denied that there was f s no

surpr2se in any race discrimhation case. In fa&,

that% a typical situation.

As the courts have said, qwte, &f@dan.tta kri

civfl rights cases seldom admit &a nature of the

viblations su that the courts have to look m, and

adbm-f,nistrat=ive bodies frava tu look at the e~aduct

af the defendants, rmt what they assert was 3.n tha

inside of thdr mind, but: rather what their c m h e

was . In teams of the facf that Mr. Horne had greater

t 2 : d t h b g and respokisibiliegr, t:hatts vexy true, And

it seems to me far that reason he had a Zllgkr duty

sf c a m than persons who mrght have been operating

under him. It seems to me %tts unsgeakabb to think

that a salesman -- that Mr. Jackson could be

responsible for the conhct of a salesman but not

Mr. Home, who is Prls real -- is in fact his a'feer

ego, Mr, Home has no legal existence in &ems of

A. PRICEl NEWBGRRY & CO.' INC.

the weal estate -- his r e d estate operation;s inde-

penbent of Mr. Jackson. And under clear prfnc%ples

of agency emd principals * .relationship, Mr. Jackson has to be responsible for the ccmbcr: a£ U s

agent . 3311s fsntt a erhinal case, the assertims of

&, Russell nomfthsrand~ng. There are r#, crhhal

acts here, This is a question of civil IiabUity,

and admfrdstratfve procedure, not a criminal pro-

cedare. So that it's m e , that had &is been a

crhfnal act, Mr. Jackeso~ couXd be held respoaafbXe

for it, '4kst that's the appXe and orange mufine, f t

seems to me.

So in essence T think that, as 3F, mid, t b

evidence is here. Lt's clear and convincing. &d

f th2nk that Mr, uss sell's motion shuuld be &mi,ed,

TEE HEARING OFFZCW: YOU keep using the term

clear and convincing, Du you believe -- uzidmsrawd

or cantend that thaxe is a separate standard af

proos £ram the preponderance o f the evidence test

thar we should follcm in this case? Xs there mother

test, a third test that should be used?

ER. TERRY: I would use clear and camtacing

as being even more proof than preprrxldersmce o2 t:he

evedencrt, Xfi other words, it's not just a guesttun

237

of the proof here as fifty-me percent, f Wi%k

t b w i k e here is uvemheb- with respect Ca

the issues fn this case.

THE IiEAKING OFFJCEZ: What; buzdtm do yott

thfnfc the plabntiff has in t M s ease?

I S , TERRX: LL: seems to me that the b ~ ~ b e f t

is a s prqandermce of evidence standard 3.n

any other civil preceedlng. When this case goes tu

trial Federal Ccwtrt it's going t=o be p r m d e -

ance of he evidence and I &nFt thi* the ~tmdrw.d

should eertahly not he higher here than Bdfta-t: %$

would be Zn a federal ectwt,

MR. RUSSELL: I think -- Zat me t3ay it s b l d

be higher here. There's only one thing involved

there and that's prtssib%Xf ty of dmages which are:

not much, Here the license m d a metn's rqmtati.on -- and those are mare precious things a n simply

money.

THE H-ING OFFXCER! I understand ysur

positiozk, &. RusseI.1.

Mr. Lackey, do yjou-

MR. ZACK3EP: L e t me get back Snto the 333%db2a

of it;, I only have one statement.

Unless you put: up ehe barden of pruuE - '1: wa1d po5,nt out te the C ~ a a m i i s s f o n that the Court of

A. PRICE, NEWBERRY Z CO.# INC.

Appeals in Chis state has most emphatically held

the actions of the R e a l Eseate Cc#amissi~n are cfvil

in na-e and not crimina1. And it's found in

Biekws versus Georgia Real Estate Commission, whfch

is found 3.n 89 Georgia Appeals, page number escapes

me, And I th%& that that statement: in that case

pzecsludes the q~re8tiort of what the burden of evbdence

is.

P fhwk ZtFs a civil case, It's the same

burdn of proof that would &st in any c$vi2, a s s ,

and that's simply a prepcladermce of the evidence.

Vssre not -- P m bow, we're not: pensllfz%mg

under these cases, We're not penalfzing the

Respondents, shcm~d they be Eomd guilty for these

vial;ttSlons. We're simply protecting the pubiatc,

NX, RUSSET&: Just to clear up the record,

May f have rme word of conclusion?

The Bickers case was reported 89 Gessgfa

Appeals, 815, lt954 case, And it bl& sfmpJty that

upon appeal from he Cammisarian that: the appellant

sftall comply with rules relating to civfl appeals.

Now, there fs no holding in that: case wfth

respect to the standard of pracrf required %n a

proceeding in which a man's license is at state.

There are other cases %TI our juxisprvdencs

A. PRIC-EI NEWBGRRY & CO., INC-

called -- such as State Board of Medical &casainers

versus Lewis in 149 Georgia; Jews VBESW Se:ett;ie B a d

American Opltametdc ~ssociation in 379 Fed Sub 175;

a11 of tnrhfch hold and s-te that a lfcense revwe-

rim proceeding I s criminal %n .name.

Haw, X thhk that: the best a% we could conclude Zs that the authorities are inconclwkve

on the? suBQsct.

But our problem f a mt here with some s tad la rd

of proof, O a r problem here is wieh two t M ~ g s .

Une af them 5s the allegathn of a practice in thks

allegation 23, Bow, one robin doesn'tmake a sprhg

and m e %mident, even if proved, doesn' t: make a

practke,

Row, there's no proof of practice aden. a2lega-

t b n 23, Z don't feel anybody can -- Well, 1fr.

Terry makes a masterful argument abut clear and

cmwtmc%ng on pxactice. But when you -- at: the =st:

youPve go% t:nly one, You caa'e have a pscactiee.

Now, you're about to say samething.

THF. EiZAUNG OFFICER: Uhat I was going to

say was that alth~ugh thezags sane pr~blem with

Paragraph 23 and proaf that has been offered, It=

not sure thae that, even ff Paagyaph 23 was not in

A. PRICEl NE\SC/%ERRY & CO., INC.

the case, 3 think that if they sirawr thgs one!

incident, if the matter is as shown and as alleged

in the crucial ccnnplrrint against Mr. &me, there's

a very strong posslibility under this regulation -- the regtdatiom should be interpreted the way it:

reads or hatever other address that you want to put

on ie -- &n this regulaeon, if ycru can show that

Mr. & m e is in fact fs a saleman, the regulation

clearly says that a br~kar shall b e b l d resps&bla

for any safeman ksho violates any xe@tians of

this Chapter.

MR. RUSSELL: That's right.

2lB B U N G OPFICER: And thatt& whae cmaerns

me at thls point. h d I assume that youfre going

to bring up thar. Wut L -- I would have brought ft

up &n your place, And that's smetMng that buthers

m e , is to how b-road this Xiability extends and

where it extends.

F i r s t of a l l , is an associate bmk~x and

salesman invalved; and secondly, does a bx~kez hawe

to h v e any knowledge or doas it have to Be &thin

the usual course of h9s businoas and subjecl: to the

same Ldmjitations as an agency principal, or is it

just sn absolute blanket?

MR. RUSSELL: Let me ask you to read the last

CO.. INC.

two sentences. Tt: says that %he b~oker is reaponsf-

ble for his salesman d t h respect to the regulatgons

under th&s Chapter. And then ft goes on and says

the broker fs supposed go educate the salesmen. And

then Itt: goes on and says i f the salesman v%sTates

a remlation then the bmk- f s supposed to tell the

Geerg%a Real Estate CommLsston abut tt.

Bow, all that is very sensible. The brokm

i s rmponsible for makkng his people shape up and

ktzw what's g o i q on. But ft doas not mean, and

was nevejr gntsnded to mean, I'm sure, that when a

salcspersm dues surnethhg wrong, that youtre go*g

to jerk a broker's license when the broker duean' t

know abut it, doesn't c o n h e %t and has not

encowaged it or snrtbrfzed it. I .mean ia: Just

ccm£dratt be athemdse.

f knOw that: a l l o f yuu weren't cm the

Ckamfssbn when that was adopted, A31d s m e o f you

know amre about it than I da, k t It don't: bexieve

any of you thought that you wme going te be takhg

axmy er. Bmker's license bbacauc~e some salesman

slfpped away w2* a hundred dollars earnest money.

EWUtING OPFICW: Let me say there's s

praeeical matter, Nr RusselX, IRaXess the €hmti.fision

felt strongly it didnf t wane to grant ~ ~ % O E X tai

A. PRICE, NEWBERRY & CO.< INC.

d i . d s s , that I wouXd sttspectt we just fiold the

r n t i o ; ~ ~ ~ in abeyance when we serve a mlhg cm it.

I@%, RUSS-: As a practical matter X thf.nlk

it makes o dtffereaee whether we have one xame or

one less witness.

THE liEAIUNG OFfrIGER: Yes, sir. That's what

I maan. I think ghat X could let you cmtfnue w2tb

your argument, we couXd adjourn the Camnn5asion

see if we get' a consensus the ~arolafssioll.

t b usual practice f s fut me tu make an U t f a l

xec~3mmmdation t o close the evf dace, And ~'m

afraid that if Z were to rule m e way or ttre othe ,

you mEght have to came baek and have pmceedangs S f

the Cmmisslon decided to overrule me, since they.

certainly have that rfght, .&A--

BEI RUSSEU: - & the end a f ghe day you can

rnaet wLth the iss sf an and j u s t held these mtieaa

in abeyance that relate to the stblega~&~n@ under

Paragraph 23 and that reXate to the mettsz: of whether

you*re going t o hold Mr. Jackson responsible ~ d e r

this Rule 21.

TIE NEARING OFFICER: Yes, I unders~.ood t:b

sense of what your motion was sayP~g. And I;--

MR. RUSSH;t: If you'd J i b to, we'll just:

A. PRICEt NEWBERRY & CO- INC.

TEIE EEAKENG OFFICER: X think L t would be best

f f we just: proeread unless any of you other gentlemen

have anyexlling you w a n t to say about the motims,

Bur I thfnk as a practical matter it would

prabab5y best to hold them in abeyance,

MfP. RflSSE=Wt: CouZEa you talk about them tonight

and tell me fn tha rax-.ft;S;ng, or just hold up on Mr.

Jackson; etntfl in the mornfng?

TIXI2 HEARXPJG O m C E R : Well, I rathar suspect

ehe Cammi,ss%on would probably rather hear the entlre

evidence in the case and then make a decision as ts

the mat%onh;,

Xf X w e r e ta decide right now, I.think I w d d

wemule ysux motions, Bur: I think you understand

that I am concem~d about sane of the things that

I've brought up. And if they're ncir going to be

treated Iln the evidence, I ' d Z2ke for them to be

treated in some sort sf argument or brief after -the

case is wes w i t h because I'm concerned otxntt

whether or not the Cammiss5on intended to hold a

broker just absolutely l iable fur any acts a£

sa3esperscfns. And ff that 1s what the C~l~mi.ssSon

intended, then I' d llka to Imow ahu.t thae. T'= just

try%- to f h d the scope af thetsc responstblflty.

MR. RUSSEZL: Well--

THF, NEARXNG OFFZCER: Well, X twnk maybe! the

~ ~ s s i o ~ ' ~ council woald be the best way te handxe

that.

Let's proceed now an the evfdence an &fs

paint: and try and see 2f we can get: as much done as

we can in the next hour, haw and a half ar so,

HR, RUSSEZIZI: I'd Xike ta call Mr. Gsrry

Domar,

LACKEY: Mr, Hearfng OEffcer, one

additional matter has c m e up and we never ad&fsssed

it, Xf there's any possSb%l%ty that Hr, Mash-

may be recalled, l c d like to have b h sequestered.

THE BEARfNG OFFICER: Well, Mr. Lwksy, be's

under yo= subpoena, i s he not? Were yew the ane:

that subpoenaed hb?

MR. LACKEY: Y e s . Z belaeve he i s .

3 I E HEARING OFFICER: Well, sir, ff you thidc

that there's a possibility you're going to use hirn

a g e or ;myone 5s going to use XI%= again, he's

your w&tness. I'm just telling you that if Pre

contimes to stay he's -- dur%ng the evidence -- Now, each of the camsel. am wa3.ve the Segaesmatien

Rule, as you understand that,

ER, U m: Z understand that,

THXfi REARING OFFICER: f f ycm tki* that be may

A. PRICE. NEWBERRY & CO.. INC.

245

called again and you don't vanr to waive that rule,

I would suggest that; you arsk fttae he be aegueotered.

f 'TI leave it ap to you to dec2de tbt.

MR. LACKEY: Well, I've sXraady invoked the

R u l e . What I'm saying 1s #hat i f Mr. RxssselX,

anticipates callgngg h i m agah, then I want knPrn ts

leave the rum,

TXE HEARING OFFXCISR: Well, do JT~U antft&pat@

caPXing h k ?

MR. LACKEY: Z do rwt antjtczpiate c&X%bg h i m .

THE REARING OFFXCER: Well, Xr, RusadslZ under-

stands t b t tf he stays 5n this room e&t he c-t:

be calXed by anybody unless all. three of gou webe

the r~cyuirerizrents sf the Rule of Sequests.aeiaa, So

that4s a problem for camsel. As bag 88 a l l three

of ycru mderstand what the Rule means and fP he

stays here during evidence then he is -- Z hate te use the word tainted himself, but he puts himself

subject to not being able t o be used again ns a

wjltness, unless y m all agree,

MR. LACKEY: I'll not waltve the W e , mes that

clarslfy it?

THE I?luEaNG OPFTCER: You w3.11 or w3.21 sat?

MR. SAXEX : Will not,

TWE: BEARING OFFWZR: 1 guess thatv% utp to &&.

A. PRICE. NEWBERRY & C0.J INC.

Russell.

M R . R G S S a : ~ ' m mi: g03fag to ask Hr. ~ s h b m

m y m m a

havfag been a lread~ sworn, was exagifned

and testZfied as fallows:

Q Would you state yyour name firstly?

Q Asrd what I s your occupation?

A Z'm a lawyer.

0 And where do you pmract2ca?

A 1835 Savoy Drive, Atlanta, Geoxgta,

Q Bnd w b are ysur partners?

Q Excuse me, H a v e you been sworn?

A Yes. !&is morning,

Lawrence Brown and Jerry RosenbZut=h,

Q And $tIr%ng the summer of 1974, west? yc~u

regular3.y conductdng closd.n&;s fcm Mr. 'Fred 3, Reeves and

A We cbse for them occasional l;y, yes,

f2 You say oecasianally, 'Lsn*t it true that you

and your parmer, Larry Brawn, handle many transact2cms far

A. PRICEl NEWBERRY & CO INC.

- _ _ - 9 On a regular basis?

A Yes,

q Aold are you acquainted w f t b a tYansacCirrn

which inv0'1.ved a sale of a house by Mr. Jim Mash- as the

seller and Mr. and Ears. Leon M, Robrjtnsm a$ the purckw;lrsem?

A Yes. I am.

Q And W. Ralph Cook t=egitified this morn&ng

w&th respect to that trmsactfoa, X cal led Si%ry Demsr to

cet'llfng y m ?

A , .

I d n e t understand. He called me %n regard

Q IEe t=afled y m to cXose this trmsoot=%en? 3

A Be never called me cm the phone. He sent us

the clos%ng.

Q Mr. Cook sent ycru the cfosfng?

A The mortgage company that we get the closiag,

arr& that's haw we get the cjlcrsing,

(2 f--id a s b d you. ta act as C ~ U S P B ~ ~ attorney?

A ghat's correct.

Q Mow, do yow xecaZX at approxbate2y wtza.~: e.fsae

af day the d o s i n g was scheduledt

a ont?? O'CIQC~, on@ p.m.

A. PRICE, NEWBERRY & CO., INC.

Q And d%d that bald E%m? Was there a sl1.ppaga

tn that, do you know?

A D3.d that hold £imP

A Well, for approximately -- X believe £0: an

hous, wne21 two o'c'lock.

Q And do you recall the flrst people d t h pihcrn

yon talked in c o ~ e c t i o n with Phis trsasactim?

A Zn c~nrasction w i t h this particdax t=ranstzctim?

Q Y e s ,

A The Egrst person I spoke to about tb&s t3as

Q Aad w2rae did he say to you a h t it?

MR. LACKEY: f abject tu thal, That's hear-

say,

MI. RUSSELL: X'm surprised where that vb3ec-

Q Did you xeceive any tnstmc-tions fim atyyone,

from W. Brcsm partieulerly, with respect to this closing?

A Y e s , I did,

Q ~dhzt: were those instructf.-ans?

A Well, let me clarify. He didn't instmet me,

f-fe j u s t apprised me of the sf mation.

A. PRICEl NEWBERRY & CO.< INC.

Q And what aid he tel.1 you w i t h respect-- ..

. : Tkte: same ahjeet3.m a t i l l applges

to hearsay.

f;N MR. RUSSEU:

Q New, at the time of c2asing a d beeore ping

t-o zhe c3los3.ng table, did you speak e:o any other part:&es

d t h respect: to the tramoct%on?

a RO.

Q ~ t d you confer w ~ t h any of them? z an- naw

thf s is af termwn of closfng. ~aw've not yet gms t o

closirng tab'le. Did you talk abut the braRsastton w i t h zay

of the persons im03ved?

A Before we went into the, c1ssf.ng mmm?

Q \ Yes,

A I spoke to everyme eoncerned,

Q 'li9~uld you te21 ane w h a t was the subject of

your discussion d t h thm?

A Each different par* 2'

Q Yes .

A Okay. The first dfscuasion was with &. Horrrc3

and Hk, Mashbum. They were sitting in my offfce and X

walked fn to get stlfne figures E m the next clostng, wMch we

were having diff iculty getting paid off on. And we were

d&scussfng -- Itan nut sure of the figure, but there was a

difference in the termite le~fsrer and a d.lscoug% poin~.

A. PRICE, NEWGERRY & CO-, INC.

A Yea, azld we discussed *ether or zzoe PbXr.

Mashbum would M e to pay that zimmt, whether ax fi%

had to pay s&x hundred and ninefqr-two, f i f ty .

Q And w h a t was the advfca g%van t=o h b at that

t h e ?

A There was no advlce, What 1 had said was that

the contract didn't call fur i t and * t * s some*iag h t

will have to be discussed batween everybody. And he had

-- T believe I was asked E m a copy of the c'bosing statement:

ta see, yaubw, what the net was and how f had broken

everylh-lng down. And o f course W, Borne was t ~ y h g tu

explarn w h a t he felt %he net w u l d be, what the flgwes were

or should have been and what Cime clctsing cssts were, and

j u s t what a l l the figures i ~ l ~ u n t e d to.

Q Wh-11~ you were %here dfd Hr. Clay czaoae to the

clos&ng while yau were in your office w&th M r . I-lome and

Mr. MashMrn?

A Y e s , Ne did,

Q Xneidentally, before 1 foxget .to a& you,

have yozr stnee this trernsactien. closed, done cZos3ing for

the Reeves ccw~partfes and the Reeves people?

A 2 believe posltive9y. so. Not me psrso~zelzly

but m$ -- the sme Eim, yes.

Q POUX Ell- has contfinuecri to do ctosiqgsl

A. PRICE, NEVBERRY & CO.< INC.

A Yes. 1 don't know if it's been he same

volume but we have closed at Least one I'm gositrive of. f

have na know~edge of -- my -- Lawrence Brawn generally

clasas for this particular real eseette company. I do not.

Pou h o w , I dun' % discuss his clos%ngs and he Itoasfl't discuss

mine. St 's more of an independent s%tuat : f~~f~ T b o w

that: we have because I have persomLXy seen at leaot m a

EPgna thetr ctmpmy. And L know we have one for tUs Ridq

for t3xeIt.r cmpany. And I knaw we've had at least sne OP:

tw others fur their company,

Q But &. Brown is your parefper?

A Rtght . Q Axid you Pwkr upan Hr. Reeves and his carapany

as one: of fhe clients of your uffice, of your partnersh9pP

A More or less one of Ch.e people we regularly

close for, yes,

Q How, Mr. Clay is of coarse Luther Clay, lgho is

s bmkr w%th one sf Mr. ~eeve% conqpaafes; i s that correct?

A Yes.

Q And he came: go the c1osZng and is it= true that:

when he arrived, ",hat. you were in ~ C T U T offfce t a l k f ~ g w%gh

Mr. &rne and M r . Mashbarn?

A Yes,

Q And is ir: ewe tiat at that time, f f you

remember whether he came out 9x1 the hall and yuu.qZased the

A. PRICEl NEWBERRY & CO., INC.

door and you talked with him?

A Pfo. The d~or, I be12 eve, was open, The

secretary, I beffeve, rang us on ehe phone and said, you

h o w , Hr, Clay 4.s here, you know, he'd like ta ta lk to you.

I said fine, send h h back, Ths hallway isn' t thae: lang

frm the front to my office. H gut tap, It walked to the

door, walked just otats2.de to meet him. And f. m e t h b three

or four steps away from the doorway. And as f safd, the

door was open,

And Luther said Gary, what's going on? '1:

said Luther, there's a problem. &d before 1 safd anything

else, Luther said, goddamn Ralph Cook. I: knew it, Arnd T

safd well, you know, let's go insldo, because X csulslntt:

stand fn the hal1wkty and gossip or discuss the situation.

Fjxst of all, the door was open, Z was only two steps away

fram the door. And I felt rather than make anyone fed.

uncomfortable, create any other problems, Iwmted everybody

-- J: wanted h%m --- ke wanted t o c m e in and talk to &&.

Home and W. Plashbu~n. I: f igured he'd come right in.

Q And did a& that t b e ever say to &fro

Clay that this transaction wf ll never close, the selPelr was

never told the parchasers were black?

A No, Never did.

Q NOW, y m went on into the rclom w i t h Mr, Mash-

burn atnd %. 8orne. And what happened then?

A. PRICEl NEWBERRY & CO., INC.

A Well, Luther walked 3n. f fntroduced him to

Mr. H m e md &. Hashburn, pllr. Home was standing on ehe

tsarside closer to tho dasr. He said, you know, ha%Za, I'm

Luther Clay Erm, you know, F,J, Reeves and Ztd like tu

apologf ze to you £or this sim~tt%ort, f know -- we were

mt told the p w ~ h a s e r ~ were black, we don't: do business

t h f s way, Bnd E k e brae was very quick to say well, WB

w e r e not told but, $crx;t b a w , tbat f s not the probleta,

Q k%.at dtd Mike say the. problem was?

A Well, he said that there was a diEferremze in

money over the t e d t e letter and over the discount,

And I told him, you knaw, thaf: that's wh& wp:

were galng over,

9 I uaderstood prru t o say that C l a y mld Wrne

and Mas- Plhat he was Clay Era F.J. Reeves Compwis that

correct? The reason I ask yotl Zs that &a record shows that

Nr, Clay was net associated with F.3, Reeves, He's

associated d t h Judsm Realty Ccrmpany, bur had been asked

tb ga to the elosing on behalf of M r . R e e v e s ,

A I believe he: sag8 'ioe was w i t h F.3. Reeves

because tBatts who the closlng was with,

Q All I'm trying to get at, he di&' t go out e

of his way--

A Nb, he never said,

Q --to infum the people there that: they were

A. PRICE. NEWBERRY & CO.. INC.

not dealfng ~3.6 a brrfa~x from F.J. Reeves and C~mpany but:

m ~ l l y they were dealing wftk a broker frcm mother

camprn~?

A No, Be did mt. Be represented that he was

sepresmthg the company that was c1asfxq.g.

9 Now, how long dld you tall< back fa your office

before you went to Che cllos%ng?

A Ten minutes, five minutes,

Q %&at: did Mr. Clay say other than what yott've

already told us?

A ~ t * s h d to reamber that long aga bur it:

was a general discussion abut -- X believe he said that:

he d l l d n t t w ~ t %a cme to the closing, that he wished tihat

Mr. Reeves would be there, and that he was sent, you know,

as representhg the company and that; they didn't: &rr Bushess

that way, and hefs sorry that they didn't know, he was sdrrry

fbs bri.mg%ag a problean, And f belgeve he said that: if this

Paan does no$ close, it: caruzot be any reasaas fur race.

And Mr. Home was vary quick ta poiar: out, he

sald, everyme f a aware and, pou h w , of the Eact you tern-

not di scrhinate, And nubody is discrimin;af3fng, h d &hat

is nor a probltm. He said ha would have appreciated being

te ld that &e pu~chasers were 'bfack, bat that is not: a

pr:ablem.

Q Be said the fact; the purchasers were black was

A. PRICE, NEWBERRY & CO.# INC.

askad if he usa tb% pkm-@. And I soid Lf par'd lfba

yat can use Lmm-Fa ofEi.ee, they're adjd&ag* W I

And said, you kiov, go on ia and use Lawrence's office and

call. And cat that: t h e he spoke to Hm.

Q Was your latpressfan that Mr. Clay djtd at ehac

t h e csX1 W, Reeves?

Q Sow, did p a ee that time also talk tu

Reeves?

A A t that t-, after he tun@ltl.ded Ma coznrerss*

tgbn and advise& Mr, Reeves of the Eact that there was a

problem, 8nd once egafn he told Mr. Beeves that W&I@ &bet

tell axybody, You b o w , he ehought: everpane knew that

A. PRICE, NEW%€ RRY & CO.# I NC.

purchaser was black.

Q Cculd you speak up a lit&Ie bit?

A tie went through the fact that no cna had

fnformed aapotpe that the purchaser wes black, and that, ~ r o a

know, Ralph had created a problem aod it was just a general

ccmtersation end L t wasn't very langthp. And then et tha

end of the phone he said, Fred would like eo tsUl to you.

And I got on the phone and he said Gary, do you h o w we're

under a federal order and, you k o w , we carmot--discrhdaata

and please try end close th i s loan. And I hadn't said any-

thin up unti l then. I said there i s a problen with the loan

but X will. t r y and cbse it in accordance with tho contract.

Q I gut over here maybe to inspire you to talk

a If t t l a Zorzder.

A Q k q

Q Now, then let me ask you somathfxkg. When ymr

talked w i t h . Wt. R e e v e s , did ycu visualize yourself talklag

tu him in a lawyer-client relationship? I mean his f i rm

has refersedtbls closing to you. Were yau advising hist as

a lawyer?

A Was X advising him as a laver?

Q Y ~ S ,

A No

Q DLd you - visual$ae eh&t he was a clfenr atn8 ;yrru

were a lawyer in cunnectlon with thLs transactfoal

A As Sax as -- Yes, as fax aa ehsiag €he %oaa,

of course, B e e ~ e , you knm, X sa%d Ekaa &eze vsae e

problem and ~ ' d try and lose it according to the c~~fmwt.

X swltdn't -- You know, it was .Lmpass&ble to do anything

other than what tha pdtrties wanted to bo regardless of his

feelings or your feelings or my feelings. You knw, if they

will close, I can close it. If t b y von't close -- you knov, the puchaser m: seller woost close, I can't do my-

thing d t h it,

m. T-: Your %nor, if I dghe again, Z I tM.mk Bk. Rmael'L is l eadhg th i s wktrreas, Bnb a s

allowed @o suggest artswars ta &a d t ~ a a s ,

llURXE& OFHTCERt Z bdfevs rhat t b

ajeetion merde by counsel is weXl-Eomded,

Russell.

m, afJSSEtlL: P -Id lib to answer thatf

nesses, And there's nt3eh9q -- S had to ca&5 aZllPa

beawe the State crawfished an ft amd didat$ cdtll

him, And he certaPnLy 2s as b s t i X s r to me sthi I&+

Harshburn was to W . Lackey . But I * ll try 4a shape up end not lead.

THE EEkkRING OFFZCER: Thank you,

Hit, RWS-: I b a ' t agree tkort: X wex have

A. PRICE. NEWBERRY & CO.. INC.

led b t I w & l l -- if I did, I w ~ n * t do i t

Q At= fie canclusion of this telepbne e?wers%-

t ion, you ware in Blr* ~rowa's effice d t h &. Clay?

Q aftid &at djtd you do ckon?

A I fhUrpg up ehe phone and walked out sad w~lllscab I ineo the other ram, 1 saPd, you hw, I 'd fib? werp~bdy

tcr *as& c m a inm the cl-osinf: mom* M d we had tBm gu

Put@ the cI~sf=ng room. At'id I W n k L had already had my

secretsry see the puschasers and ME. Wla in Zhe oXes.Lag

roam. So we a3tX went: Sneu &e clos9sg rwrnn at the poffft.

9 How, what was safd wben you a l l got into t&e

re bf f feremcft. eE ~ f n Z o z l , It w m aW%ws rtna-e: &we was m3.w tr, be 8 pmIsXm, Sb Z sat dawn and Z sag8 that we hknrc a

pm3bI,emr The p b E a ~ 5s ehat tlke laan did nae L M ~

me: f519a pzodwt te pay t M a 4lxpE3atsaa I asked pam,tba~ears

11 A. PRICE. NEWBERRY & CO.. INC.

Q D%d the puzchaseszl $tats tskaecher ar Zheay

-Id efose on ats basts ef &he Jury 24 sales a ~ e ~ ~ y s . ~ ?

A They stated r b e hey muld nut: gay 5% at

first, mag said that chep f~ou5.dn' X pay %t, that Eke7

watrZda't &R the contracts pay tt: and *eyere not: ?a

WP %tr wM& b

Q #hat I'm asking you 2.8: Bfd tihey %ait2,atft

*ather er m;0t Lie the purch&sers came up with t b ~ ! s i x

kanCIrced and n&nety-two BalBars that t h y wme ready ts clase

under the ssXas--

A War; a L r ; Hz, Hashbarn ready eu c3ase *- &Ed

Ex,, 24asfitbtxm say he was ready?

Q Pas,

A Of ccwrse. Pie ~Eb$d &ad -- E said thae ebre

was a pfubff?i~g sad I asked if they w a X d pay f ~ , whfcr9-r

wuuldn't h w ~ asked.

AJse, Bfr. Eome ~dterated ehe Ifact that there

was a &EEmeaee aftd that %b they ml$n8t: pay &IZ -- 9t% s8301181r t:fi%ng cuufd be worked at, that: they wm2d clase, Am%&&,

Hashlxzm agreed.

Q E ~ F * , in response to &a bfPer sf Ek, Wshburzln

l o close upan the payment of the sfx hvndred zmd nbetp-twa

doXXars, wIhar: cmxnter pr~paslalrsr did HE, Rusbiason or Em,

A. PRICE# NEWBERRY & CO.) INC.

Li T'bze ufu:e xm CQIU~~S pmqpw&b, X%ey miM

Wt &hey did not hava the mamy, they did nat cesr .e t fir

it, and they &ids8 r heve tke atoney aad they rreraa'r -- sf

firat st was B g~&s&o;rt thDe taey &an5% mmeot fer i t

and bhep wems*E g&sg ea pap. ZG Aft== t.hat ckrrry m%d elat

%hey dfdnot btse 4 b sazney, '&w tkey alse sa%d mt they

had baaed eke tio saarmne Zn E9ssily and gb~lcp

e d i k k f t set i t back, at least nat w f m B fw weeks.

Bk, Cook mked tiaxe s few t&mw if tbey

wadald eungkkr psflng ft; IvIr, GZay a@M them a gew t3sm

i P they wcmld wy it. &d wxe m@wt:Zc a- it.

They said that they &'t and that +hey earlmt't.

9 Was any off- by Hr, or IbJX, CXay fm

cooperate iri the money in any way, by odJustlware of mmmb-

s2en or %nyf%&ag ILke that2

A Xa: was so quefitien ra%eed ax rn afgsr- by

mxyaae to me any c d s % o n & ar &s & iafz.y&&hg+

Q Scr you rzad a case sf &in ioEZex an& w e:amt;er

&fez ae: alX, Ebw long d;Ld t M o @ en?

A E afse asked 19 thesf wmld eogsxmxise, wmI8

-7 pey any part o f ft cind the e m aras no. bad thfs

weat am a4 &E f e a s t an bwc , a .aa9xxbwa sf an hryacr.

Q %w, w a d ml~r c=~cs~n~~k$ S ~ S S X ~

A *en they said that f : b y Y = ~ * E -1 pky

d rhey ceuldn'c pay, PIr. Mashbu+w-X tkx%sk--sa&d -% be

A. PRICE, NEWBERRY & CO.# INC.

the a r , wmtc back in, @a talked Ecm a little -re,

PP; was MQ o ~ e x , comte offer er myth%?3g

else, && Er, W w left.

Q %#hen be XePt did be say any- a k m ~ grolrted-

hgs base back on be m'z:k:ee?

6 8e said if he dPdnge c b s e today W t hi; wag

gphg w put %t back on the a-arkee.

Q D M he say mythfag &boat at wbe psics he

would put i S : back oa the aazket-2

A X believe the; aTJ,gbal pr%ee, k t I% rtrt m e .

Q &d d%d you jEntxaprat that as bfsng the

A. PRICE, NEWBERRY & CO./ INC. I

A Mesr ever$one !:a& lafk.

g &t;a weryma h ~ d lo&. And d i d you 3ce-

m* c:a3kfs eterxx.4

A I d&$late have ZQ, X BeXAwe he ems we,

I atlghf: have, H% nat sure if 3 apepke m lrlm or nag,

kt3 be asked me the best: wey to cxmei was,

Q Dtb anyme m e w i t h h3.w when they

A 3C&s gwzcbsera, eBe R~bbnssrns,

Q Tim bbhsaao, Dkd yau mat wftb &a gObhmam

as-4 Hz', Cmk at= that the?

Q Did W, Qmk also see% wieh pus p- pa3t-"% (

A E drmt r XB- thei meatkng. f r@w psi5.f t ; f i ~

in &e claaing roan. I was at che haad of the tabla. me).

were att t ing at the left. So I don't rmmbex,

g OId tlrey dkscuss d t h mu a desSPe rn w&e a am

sffer on 't:b l2owm?

A Yes . They sa&d thaz they %mre w L 3 . m a s pa3

Q Thay were willing u, pay the money that *y

A --prwiowsJly rlekssd t=s gay.

c! Bid yew ass ist theol &n working op a aasr offle?

A Hoe

Q 'Bee w s teszlsitmy here that= the ramwad o22er

was brouglrt to yo~r. offieaarrdtha special stip~tla~im 15

was wxft=ta fPzt1~ i t err, yiauv adv2ca, i7bu1d you 1mk-

A E dmct rmmba, Caraz X see Lt?

Q Why &a%' e p u read f s, i f you wcm'ltd, P k a d it

mxg Xoud.

A Ramber 15 says fzedin,&: Tfxe p u r c ~ ~ z agzees

to pay up to sir hundred and nhetptwo dellat-il and ftfm

A. PRICEJ NEWBERRY & CO., INC.

.& &. %k2 nts~Z3"~ I gef4fe f t to US SOP*

f-2 Patrd -- 'f~ctdenmPfp, Lt: was tasehcmy W.

Heme, 1: gpess, wes B selT$.ag ageae *en you p r

b s e . Ur ~ a e t ~ ~ . he Listing ageat? Eb ~ Q U remember?

a He was the agent,

Q wabs f=he only

is X b J L w e he was orr'l;y one that I m e t ,

Q m h n g la&s was

A W e e a d a half ga-s age, I &elfeve,

Q h d kn tkwt $he& a d a BrnHf y e a htmmtf,

b d ~l'rw h e aw k s b s s far Mr. Hmne 03: tzrs P-2

S ESone ~~hatsoe3er. ?e have never bad a c3.aashg

mbdEwLs&arrm m his l am -* ae hmse ~r aayphee eXses.

Q YOU jU3e hEEp~~32 BBQ k h &ETS3.tad?

A The uriJy tbrt ~ ' v c seen him m%$L be w2kLzqg

MS m*aBrs~* ZE he WBL; W ~ W I X ~ ~ EKZC3861 MS 1- ofit

mrL5,ng a c m d the haus@.

Q Em y m ever visit h5511 saae erocfial'ly?

A. PRICE. NEWBERRY & CO.. INC.

'EBE ~ s : S ~ B U -e nw to tell ysu she*

mg ratnW%z&fp ~ L t h Hz. &sme is, I lpas as Ertm~I%y I

zay bwe. It was e good aqmeiance. You knou. I I

Mr.. have d t t r respect to uraspiring to keep ths

llad the pueotfm txa me was ludifrous because -- Eor .the

sinrple reason that we rqgxlsrly clcae for F.J. Rtwves snd

gebg amspire or Q any=% to jeopardize my b u r i i m s

A. PRICE. NEWBERRY & CO-. INC.

*%tga;'l

A &&ably -- mybe &me CQ f1ZVe htmiked, kt:

9a .&w, no m e has e v a accused YOU of z%&m3&q

te C ~ Q S I ~ ; betzause O£ s~h&ttbts race, b e they?

d Ear: at a1'2,

Q

cxlss5an did 7 ma% Ere -8b.b- mad P&-. %lama have ~ & a respect to aa a ~ ~ a f : OE rht3 tkee DE pwu zu keep &a

Robllsscws E P ~ wcmpl%sMag ehe p?.mcbs@ aE *is IP

A Vet d%&* t havie any &&assScm ur a q ~ ~ t = ,

Q &aybdy ever: askc p u ko cmperate Sa bephg

IIxisl fzm a-oql i%.W- kae pwcWse?

k I b S L MnEE m y b @ -4 -8 ~B@%s&

Q h d certaialy t;hey never &LC% do P t l

A Ng*

6 pau delivered the second offar t;c Hr.

Ebred~ s w , &d Erwva any i3zra.p~~ r e 2 a t ~ a f i Q a -8

f;rmsa.cdm?

Q Yes, hiti* H P ~ W k ,

A . He mu2d be zb Lase urn X wag4 w e

A. PRICE) NEWBERRY & CO.1 INC-

i* w%a%.

P a d n E t gar - HE. jmt mstifiad *a-

th is liloFnfng-thst tta hsd a eonversotien rrith m &fir

Axqpmt 9tb 8nn -- when yoa a d he ware, qtxepte, tbr oalp

peaplo in ttle &See. Asd he say. you said to hiPq E.l*,

don't get Brad in tsoYble by bzfaging backs into #msa

site araas,

ra a a l p h d d b e the Lsstam3 Ehat I3dm&d

m k zxoz m get myaxm 9n WwbXe,

Q f$Sd yl~tr w e -

s BSo, m x e was n@ @-82:sprea* &&€% gl;$ a

rsatter of fact, I pra wmex Pn ery office elone, Zbxe i s

elways sdaebody there. I either waUr m e sdth Zaaxmm or

aaze aX she st3-axes.&1rf@s. Bbbc,dg &s &VBZ t l x i~e~~ a# a mbp.

b mr affiea, &d wwZd wt: cam eu the sSffm, Xiaa

never been at my ofB.ce, W e r e we saved uz saw, = U s am bf; -- de-t a cPr;ns3.q, [6 Wer had & tzemv--

tton h a a d X wmIa$3i't= h e else H a d sf wm~emiwt&m

g Zt W%fb &]ts@ ~ % d C%14%t d'M%t% mz4B t3a

A. PRICE, NEWBERRY & CO., INC.

€&ak, Oarp D ~ ~ Z P safd that thep mfdi W e Eo hova

is the lxmk ctr +=ash e-o amex m y C ~ X L air9

t t ~ t : ~ a 2 p t ~ ~ a o n ~

A X: m a r a d * Y m knew-

Q a m s t PC ams etaae aa. smmy 0-5.- A?kw 3%&

~eeves' caw+pm$ee plu hsd tagen e check and he%& Lt: fm (I

day ar twa &YE f$ t~ C ~ W X ?

A Qg c%wrss, Z% wez've aw%g

wace bad.

A a; asked se ~ C E B S X W tsPIe21 was ae oEEer,

mere was rtQ 3m3Z2@yq P@ %waFm gat *-m: fw*

Q M d y a - m e ef fWXmm to E ~ D O O ~ 10lfe II

@losing fee wh%& w~xp3,d hase aiwnted to e t b ~ m d ,

swm &llms asni fifty cents?

9 3Es &at w=?g?

A I last & ~ L o a i n g fee ef w himdred and eighty.

f iv i~ dOZPmsr

Q W p 8 rhtt POUT c l o s ~ Pee on this l d Oh.

I'm sorry, @a cX~sd,zq3 mats vare i%d.teii ed to tpsD and b X . f

p&%?Gmt.

a W ~ r e wo aad a half petceat. Ta ~ @ B X ~ d s ,

I had to EIIr the fee to get the elesing. m d thea rhis pws

Q &W f7t-l qu~~t2on. =a+ part did y w hsve fn

mpiracg , if there waa aay such coasphmy, m k.cap

tb%s %mmsacQfw ;Em eX~s5sg"f

A. PRICK, NEWBERRY & CO.< INC

P w dear ewe s-t:?

A B&gb;t:. EOIVM~Z~ p q is -e

9 ~8eryitktqg I say is taxm4 Y m daag a1 #&as@

s@%wawmts dlnd yet as I hrnra m'&d ycru and Elr. gnsss%l

tald par, 4g these %8d%d€bX8 &@sti l led m e

p u i&%Se*

three ex h p e ~ 9 4 3 ~ wmx"Ld a12 -st @e say ym

whea ycm're ~ h i w l y c l a h b g Wt: you diQlgt aciy it, Bo

yoa bsve enaap @ZtpWt%car far ft'l

A Bel l* I 43d.rik em$ $hi;t !#id3ia1.& ** @if

t3a3dIrgmaa

Oki%y, f was wit& the f$Q;Mee ef

Oppax-CJ &F mm ywra as a;a3s&sta# ?b%ga a&&-* %

W S ;Ct91 &$t:%%l%~?y &%B% thesre' ;rpp Z bb &s~Zhd~k&t5m prejudice

4m lRW& $EPU G)T: @I86 &%fa€*

h d X M W e * s - - a - X &

m ~ ~ i ~ g w 8ggp&mdy m make a &a

A. PRICE. NEWBERRY & CO.. INC.

as %R&ammfir* s%wtrcra*

Bopi* f f I emebaradPd yma. as I did,

%hat ehsrago m pxsjudiee 8ad ISmg this didns E eZoPo bOUIUie

of earac.nic reasons, l%dng$ rm imparUal persen -- the bp&tiel perma -- if thare was w aXKegaeion rm CD mg

so -- Zn am@.* tlta oory GxmspZfi:acy as far Hs x'moare-B -

Q Peu assert chat &XX, -rtf &em persaw am Zyfm

a w are ~m

ma make ;a p b gall, X C Q W X ~ m e w e h P e d tiwig X %slb

to Pllt. Rewraa. I could h w e dadad tbet X saet Nr, C l a y its

a hormg, xtm f k rnXxfP3& the em*. x * * a : tl&egd myu

f q g -a: P spoke w khaa amd X dmT* w i d %%a& 1E. =P

I1 A. PRICE, NEWBERRY & CO.$ INC- I

dol%ars, pu'd ray Mat that's a -*tory case of

M t : e iad&v%&~lf 6.

or my Xacm~a o% gee %awoEv.eB &a m y t . W ~ t:

; s f c W y mawrerZ,

A Yes, f e#s 4dini-y h+a c X i 4 s t .

Q pou all have o -- share of43se rpaf. mr- I A Bt& my parPner* B;e Ss lm equal par-,

ship w e m e , Rhen I want b 5 = 0 pszmtire, f rrnt i~ La*

Immnce an4 we bad a w1zba3 agpet-k, sdX5 r

ve?fbal t, P s k g w R i s n t b W d w - e b -

~iram&Si to teduee it to Mi*. I~'S stZlf B O ~ re $43

w ~ i w , x t t @ sax vmbr,

Ehe efnsiqgs amd lase *eh they did and ~'m auxykqg +hs

ccffka, f E sais qgeeamkf: Uaak ope &b%de

f%EQ?-Etfqy* Z T @ & ~ ~ L W % of * 3w&es what ax %&w# mes3t&enm

or whose -- because WE felt tbt x t t b x ax- amz s m q

we Eirst bad co %am a livbg* A d Ehatss thz? wf@ it's

I1 A. PRICE, NEWBERRY & CO., INC. I

.f' 3 4 -8e me. We WE,

A ff i ~ x s a ~ l l y ? I

G! P&*wa%Xy*

A Zfva h e Lwr, ibd m%gr 8- X T.%&

ctoae fes Sf Lawwe Bwn %s aep: 5.a &e s;Efke+. ZSce &&ky

b E h : cl~sirrg tw @it mine. Or if hs oisl't tr. a+ tha clos*

bee-e lua bad m be saowfBK:a elm. I -'t t&h% ~ ' v a

cZdsad i x ~ e t e t c ~ ~ s fur Ms, mid &f-arj2t&fr mt; m e

th* size

Q W e then F.J. Btitewe. 628#*t rtonw'litlp w s

A PRICE. NEWBERRY & CO.8 INC.

%adiHbXs, I rrtsmstte,

A tiroe the 0 1 : ~ h* tha ms$dey

af thta t&m& ft sapa Bemez md &am, or Boasat, Ennn and

RrsaeabX;BI Asd the cwlp reasam Wi: -* &a&% ol

A. PRICE.; NEWBERRY & CO.. INC.

maw W ' P

a *

Q ~o you know wkether they-.-af porn mm

bwe anp t c j p X ~ closistg at-@

A 3%wy use Bk. Wiekareo~, Char1i.e W S - w ,

Q A& t h e of %Be cbs&q+ F,J, -- E& &a time $be clasbg w z t ij%qpsaiS ts have ~ E & ,

F.J. Reeves &Irem& M d ip regular cXosio$ at-J ssd pru

dld ckt busiaess d t P , Jacksea; is that right4 Y a p ~ ~ Z 3 g O

4% M, EC'S rng -- V@ d8d the e%as%tg&c P&k&% X

just saf d before. X gut half that mumy. ebaE uas a E k m

client. &re i a ao division between Uwr-e aad ~ p s e l f ,

Re &bs.e;s thas a@ itit ~ e e e r uf pramhe, Tiwe ammr weat

into my pocket also.

kc% i f yawc qmsej t~a 6s was L tsydnii4; tm

develop their busiwss.'you can't davelcp theit ~~a by

l~skng ZimaCh~ c l & a e *

Whea y.ou gee X rrrsmbft;r ef cbebgs s memi&

Q W e gou h o t 2.3, Rema as a cZJ;&fzcf

A %+8'3X3 &f= i fibl- f ~ r IsMim -s

1 mw. ~ e * v e closed arms after fhie. xed say zm.

1 y- office. uaa i t y- test- ~t pm -e -- uhp. pa 11 A. PRICE, NEWBERRY & CO., INC.

%qj? -- WheP the c&w h, h~ b d

asked Ear ~paawplpxc~?: where %%my cwkd &ksma these - &Ms st-drn private%* f=H& E&wr~?a *p w e e g£Pfng ma* .j:

k ~ ~ t d *b% &I@ fX3 g f ~ ~ ChtB?%% ikE P%*$ a1f: %&?%is P~%v&~;I*-

1 I did wt waed srg aPfice. I was fs016Mng on the c f ~ ~

*em m e was ao&qpSeted. &di X s&%d they wme ~ 3 ~ ~ 3 ~ 1

ta use my nrg.efSce. M d so were? mp office.

A 2BaZe;.

Q PsJ5 rQItkee;, %&em did ysrr gp sin and fo-, e

~ A W k S f w4dkcizd 333 ZC? &&I% ~ . ~ A ~ Y I P : 25-e~ TmZ"&

cm my desk-* & a ~ : $IF~P~%'~:B f L @ z e -4 hsmamca %a: the

e Z ~ s i ~ * t - X w l b d b, and f3wgf s X-

A. PRICEl NEWBERRY & CO.< I NC.

Q Da you recall har loag ie wits betwixm tb@ tLne

&by M W l p want in snd you w a n t beck ial I

A &* f dun"*

Q !&US% g6U w a t b&k %a, ~ S W Z o q were yau

tlw3te betweea the -the yaa went in aad Clay skm~4 up?

A F%ve ta tm m;izmte;e at: =st, E'd my, V&WB

m h a t e s .

Q Okay. Do you reeall Pk. Cook b k

leawkhg on door and st%ck;&-sg his head io che dco+ b c

ween the time you went back and Mc. Glay shnred ilp?

A lib, base Z &%%we, the 4-r t5)3d

Q Sc yuu drm't rammember Wr. Ckmk bPck

&wet L e t sna rqkme it. You didn't say anything to Mr.

@gOfC: &%tbem El#% % h e p a w m z .tx, yaax o%Eice and Pk, 4X.53y

b P k , JI699kad jEma ofl%cs dmd saw yau and saw Mr. i ? & f s m

A m*

9 ib &hat's a~&&es M a g that HP, W%k 328 zmt

telling tire m* about, or that you d421)t re~aXX7

A - t t b 3 s O E M ~ ~ R ~ b k &Kh& bppW3&d,

Xf y w want: I:O sap he% nnt tall%- the m t h *. A. PRICE, NEWBERRY & CO., INC.

0 Bow after Bizlr. Clay &x=r%.ved was i t bsfeae

yar left yarr office tc ge to ehe clashg?

A Hive te ten d'IW$w at amst.

A. PRICE, NEYVBERRY & CO./ INC.

'4 11 wss gaw UD see tf we coo~d *m get m apgsm+

1

2

11 A. PRICE, NEWBERRY & CO.< INC.

A -0

Q A% ~*@'&!-dk - l&~#Bl %$%t QS

b'&,mk@ 8aJ pru w@td 4x4 gaP oel3mi - that -43

*a@ t:% C& lMt@kf

A Bad tx~ ba ~~~ five.

Q mo: yela &mCe z-bar spe?c%ficbtf%~?

a ~$3, I &?~'t, ~r-bxg. S~USQI I~IUB sbx, x t -Id kws be: beeawe 3f: W d at c&m&qg %a between gPIgtt

% %%@ -8 *k C % Q I ~ 8-a- W&S

I! A. PRICEl NEWBERRY & CO., INC.

Q you w e sayiDg -* Wa w s e dbawisl@g

* & b x W. Osok hod am% with port mil had ehis corntexm~iom

sither chet day or -- p a never had a private cmsezsarion,

&&a' z: &at,

A iekh w, Cssk?

Q 'Yes.

a z ~ m t : kt,

had a prfvate emexsation w i t h Mr. Coak. Nr. Coak isn't

cIPant, &d Z m1S you f:ha t.3.zat: 3. ecmfddt; ~ V Q a

pxfvate mzwese*Im wdgh .i.

P3R, L A C K ~ ; f dfm't bwe any mo~e ~;ft~essf:W,

3s si, 3YEwt

q Hz. Wrxg@xt ~l?gf z.wm@ b T@my a d f,

~JI'WSMWE ~ ~ L I W ~ ~ O E B %EX. 19ti~te~~ B&, & B&s~ &&*+

Pm.mar, f r d lib 4x3 show yea dl&.%

A. PRICEl NGWBERRY & CO., INC.

crfa!s%sg2

A 5we.

q okay. Do you recalI - %&at 2s the amuu.~% of

1 tmm diaparsed at end o f the c~ostng?

a Fortpt3xree dollars and f%fty ~esfits go pay the

$nmsf&~. tax. RYWC &kllm% ~ ~ 1 2 S~IQ Ear E k e re&xm%b@

ameeXfation. 'E~Qcc) e$azsimd, iour huaeed and a i z q &l%lus

tlmclilswd, fortpffve doZlers and ofsetg ceats -14 ge ta

A. PRICE* NfWBERRY & CO./ INC.

A ~~~ a ~ d & = b e

Q me: Waxi that 1EwT

A Pay off on hfs mztqgage, oe the sarl%s~'s

Zwregqga *

Q CmLd X rpse & dmmwmt pugre

h, please? tmee i s %he &emsamt Wt you're

A m e ' s a 423.~&* r~1eW.5-t*

XR. 333RKY: I'd Uke USEX W s w glm --

A. PRICEl N-EWBERRY & CO./ INC.

A 1&mty percent; n 3 a s ~ f i u e .

g Pcro tes t i f i ed resd.lizqg yorrr bow3te+ of

Hz* Em338 and so forth. B i d I uadststand that ppu i&ve ia

s m S U M ~ ~ S ~ E W O

a mt8~ ~ ? m ~ ~ e t t *

q And lans far do yaa lioe fbxm ona 4me4S--&wT

Q f gkhk you taseifled thgt Plr. &%%k@ d Mk*

~&shEmm were suxpdsed &at Rebh80#0 =era blsdr, and

Hr. 5 2 3 x 4 3 n& 3.fidicstSm t2me E h

~ U g d &=a bema to Xet ch;= atma% it hd CPE e m ; i a

fsE€t--*

A f 3wseg ssltZ8 $hap:*

Q %Bx3E dI,d Fats srszp?

A E was sm3.g" asked %haze

g m r did Hr, sw rajgardiq fawt -0

he dfdtsl't-:--

A At; *t t : h @ O Any e*?

r% A$ my the*

A Ba rmevtw sag& a@=. I& mly z~w&&

to Lathar atatmeag w b s Mkbf: wa3ked tho s@e&..

A. PRICE, NEWBERRY & CO.< INC. .

Q Ba& what= was U s X@I-I&@?

A Bfa r a e m a was thf he d d hrwe X i g o d a

I W W ~ awn 3S&m8dr bllt *$ fher fs s ~ t ~JM p~o$Xm.

f-? p heve ca judgment as to phethez or -E

he hehuu2d hwe beea mid thst Wry ware bzack WQP~ LhoeT

a b Z?

fl Yes,

d st redly. ft's ef a y b-s* f

wrtee ck€? ~108%343 &3m*

q P w xzxmtfmad f : b E p a -- ym'vs cham& X

$kbk swex8X hu#&ed at; 3.434423~; bJack tm wMze t3.aashz

A. PRICE, NEWBERRY & CO., INC.

~ O S s ~ w

$b%?3z was tiRl WdthiP the last rarrattr. BmP2

wwa 2s the. mtbsfdaT I c d d n 6 t tell you. Smaf.

SwwaZ*

f4 WmZd you have cfaaed as m a n y as 2 % ~ houses

b3mk'f

A 3: w a d say 2t d d W e im be at f w e ~SBP?.,

I*%% tell yotl the true. 6men I go% pr a closing. Z cbn't

A. PRICEI NGVBERRY & CO./ INC.

A xn 4% year?

r% *

A Let's sag ei&t hmmdhed to eleven i~saihdl.

V Ohay. Aad of *&we, 3&mt percea* of thrs - ~sm2d be RU, VA gwax&xs,teed loanal

A %Q$.g&o;; n~w? %!ell., the %%i-&wt cherrgas* R%&t

sew thst" ssll p ' r e cXos2ng b-sa there's m,

23mnq. 'fbs s-s rmd loa~s are cl~sing all the comi~m-

&aXa. Bight nov I'd say that h e t y percent of %&&si are.,

Lest ysar at &is risre I'd sap thet thitv pemenr QE tbm W e a r

9 m y m hawe had rt &&%nt1,82 &aAqg

&?he m e of p~ priveCe pxmztiae of FBb and Vd me&

rams?

II A PRICE# NEWBERRY & CO.. INC.

of &a ~ ~ L & C ~ ~ f = e r h &Ww m r

Q P$ qq43stim-m r@€€tIy %Ri%a@ to, I ~~ grru

amwezed it properly, to the sections char: era 1

11 A. PRICE, NEWBERRY & CO./ INC.

cWfeg i s gm=a12y 0 -J,ity; wf;? A Wt BE~B.

p &x# of ten does a closing usually

ML BUSSELt: It's ohdous Mr. T q dsesn't

biva m y o;eam~=-e. garmers,

A (By Mr. Ilm%aet) Boat fDog does a clos-

d & y

0 Y e s , sr&E;E2-f 2y

4% Okay. ThFs varies w%eh the real asrate

sapd ir var%sa fh. age~g. I ccul&'t evea @?vs ycll o

geg&#3z.sef ensarez. lx2+2akar%t5 it v a e s with raal iMEtote

i t varies tba sgent, &d Z cea ~ M M Ff pat

Q Obrg. But generally spsatdag* ikms a efosfPg

teka w e thaa a half an hear? I'm fsXkQqg abut psogr oE

Ft c;'i;rs;s%-*

A e; of &%$

Q Ye&.

a okay. xt depa* on tge -- I% pot hadag

%~r?mim hare, if you want to ~ X a i n it, I wfL1,

St d~pmds oxl the r-1 e;sre;ae~ -, T t

w on t3w q~np:. I can't @va you an hoaesc .nsvpnr.

(2 So you reell$ cans% give sa ammar:t

A Pact waO= t-43 m a &baat *fa p m b d a

iwiqpsy2 T&kes m e an heas. %f -- T i k b d @ae

I&@ h h fax ma txm and .st &&P fi-8, 2'8 E~xgpeem

A. PRICEt N€W%ERRY & CO./ INC.

. Soroebody had mentioned ie , Mr. Cook -- two and half

kourap.

Q My question was: Generally speaking, how long

ft took*

A depends an the agent and t h campa~y.

Q And ysrx ~ e a l l y cane% give a specf f f e awwew?

A Lf you're t a l k h g abate -- I can gene~aff ze

aty cmganies,

ff yrnaPre talking abwk Southside Realty,

youere; eaUrLn8 abut twelve to fiEteen mfnutes,

If groutre talk%.ng about most of the aarlbild-e

reill tks, ym%e eibPkiag a W t twelve to fifteen 911,m#xs,

If you're talklag a b u t F.J. Reeves or Judksm,

en the merage, an hour and a half, two W s .

9. W t most aL yaws me the twelve ta f i f f z ~ n

msmtss--

A UnaOubtedly. But 'I: df dn't: say they were FHA,

VA ar emveritional, I didn't say what: kind of closings they

are, whether sr nat thsptra tAe s a a kind, y w know,

Q But you can't name any other than the lncidertt

A Other than this m e r%&t now?

Q yes.

A f can't name. thm by names. But X CEU~ ~ a m e yuu

A. PRICE, NEWBERRY & CO.< INC.

solpe real estate ca~panfes w h e r e $hare are Fliba* VAs that hrnr t s a t ~ I o f i e d ~ I hn't za~.e~a'bar tkteix aames bur X c m give you I

Q Whak real estate ecapanktks"3

A Tke reason being i s that: Z never xessez~bes case I

A lot sf tbacs people come in---thatf s why they scb-

closiags at: &s end af the marnth batead of begi,mdng,

Pt Xessens a e f r grep&fds. .And a Xoe a£ times uae wS%l get

they have to pay prepaids that mmmt ta between a hundred I and three hrmdred dellars, Arxd people can't: gay % b e lfoo they I don't cicsa and &hen they reschedule. So soetetimes they

don't close %n the beginning and they close at the end,

Sase of them nwer close, This is a canstant thing. There I are a lot c?f ehem. Case names X cadt give you,

Q Whm did yau learn the Babim~ns wwe B3ia&?

A libeta the ~ Q U S ~ was sold,

Q Wen the kotxss wias sold?

A. PRICEf NEWBERRY & CO.> INC.

day of c les iq?

A SO. mefi the h ~ ~ 2 4 W ~ S ~ 0 1 d ~ right s h ~ ~ t r y

aereafte~ &e=n we learned we were gettfng el~sfag.

Q Are. you talking about tho amtrack?

A X lieamset they wars black when the misa was

m&b, And if you want to haow how -- Xs that the next gFxes $tan?

Q M e you taXUog, about &e date of the eoatxaet?

A Approximately when the trouse was sold--thar's

correct--wEhisnever .it was, 3d.y 24&*

Q And haw dfd ymt b o w that they were black;?

b Because Ralph ealXe6 dm afffca, laughing about

h m he was gskng lw fategrate ehe L;aV%sta Road area, El@

d2dntt know Zf he should caEne early far the closirig ox lsree

far the cfasll#g, sbtl8 he j u s t go in rhe clasing roonu,

showXd hew& t a t s i d e , how t o handle the wble lfmiag,

T t gee: go be! -re er lass a s&t=wittion where warJrBody was

laughfng about it Beeawe Ralph was BQ B8~1fish abut 22.

%at's when X learned a b t it,

Q Did you aatictpate that that might be a

problem d t h zespect t o the closing?

A None whatseever. Thrsrc? was no reason,

f2 D;td you. talk to anybdy prbr ta your testi-

here tertay? f mean hglva you been fntewsbiewed by btsy

of the attameye; or--

A. PRICEl NEWBERRY & CO., INC.

A ZSva nut beem f.ntervf med. Z haws talked to

HZ, Russel3 because f have been get+$ng ecrpfss of t b h a i t

which you f i l e d , and I asked tbt I be n o t t f i a d of any other

pLeadknge5 or mqrthtng else that: were £%led baause Ltws~a

& h a ~ k t tkt 'I was going ta be . jahed as a defandaElt, a d f

asked i f Icmld be netiE$es&,

c! f see. 50 Hr. ; W a t S ~ ~ l l sent you eopfes af the

Q B i b yw b e any cmwersiat%m~s .s+bth hW about

what your a : e s W y would be?

A ZSure, Also Hr, He&ieh 2n the State &prt-

sumt af Gesrgf s.

Q Axrd dbd Mr. Russell 2ntemf you?

A Intewiew .am@? fkcr, %a dhscusrsed tka copli-a:mts

-- we d9sewsad the situation and he asked me nry apWons a d

my reaetim tu the sfltuat%oa, El@* he dfdntt -- I dk&nSt

d&sc:ws &dtt E was going to say to I r b , either.

Q Pm dtd mLk t o W . Russe13. a b t yaw test&-

=liy here t&yT

A I to ld him what bppened and what: X t b q g g h t

sbuuz ft, w* I did net, -

Q UBB tMs w e tba telephone or %n ymx offfca

UF %I3 WS sf$%f,Ze Gr BfHt?

A En mp ofLi~e inPt3.alEy, and I weat tu pf ek up

A. PRICE, NEWBERRY & CO.# INC.

1~btaterAaZ his offfce also.

Q Did you agree t o give Mr. Russell any Lind OE

sta tmat?

A &. I ditdn't apee eo give anyone 01se a

bStStSRePrtr

Q And you did nor give aoy ksnd ,of stetme~~r9

k @a. Z didn't: gfve mg~aa,s alas a stat;mmt,

I a m s t asked for a stamant,

Q PJraw, #auld it haPa been poss%bls te have cbsed

this contuaef on &gust Zbs 9%h wit&aul= Xr, H p t ~ k h m x agzwe-

gag to pay the six hundred and ainety-two dollars and f i f ty

e a t s b s 4 J i f ?

A surs,

Q W o w so?

A Real. estate cmpany ao'~1ld have cut theltr

cdnan2ssfon, the seller could have paald st or nmcrxtgagewany

crouZd b e a t the discotl~t arid %ken we: could have mds

pwvfs&ans for the balance; arammt: if you're cutting t;he

~ f s o E o r r or samething.

f2 Did Mr. & m e ever;: mggssr any uf these

alternattves?

a B6 *

Q &Ed y ~ u ever suggest say a5 those altema~%varrs?

A S suggested comprmf shqg zmmmt: of rw~ey,

X suggested -- Fgrsf: I stxrted of course asking l f *eg

A. PRICEl NEWBERRY & CO., INC.

3Qo

wes1d pay the dmf9 a*. YOU he t s=t= a t at 8 amqrcp"

laiae wbea t&ere is a possibiliep of @ m e w m y palr che

a l e ghieg. Then I suggested ccmpdsiag it, I did oot

mggr?~t wf:t3ag the cowrndssfon. ~ f P o d g sends pou bruinclls.

yar don't hUp 4&3%3uad tO them and say. b y , hO* GWeZJDp

ytnx c~smfsa5an.

Eve- + h e I've Md a atZoaiqg d t h $ 3 ~

sfon be- at, t b agar, d t h s i~esr nae. &he eIos%ag BX

we^ 3ave3.vd d d %dl, mybe we can work sa~ettxbg mit ex

har a m , yea haw. mtybs we cerr we& ea~athLog orrt, sxt

the canmi~rrioa -- If thay *Lng it up, then I vtll. I bol\' t

fsel it's ~i , r place ask -body to cut their l ~ c o l a ox do

aayt=hhzg l3.b wt*

Q Bt;= hcwse W , Rubinram was kt ve tam md

was a mterm gwwanteed baa, a veteran wDYrd wt

A Suit's &orxset.

q SQ ZC: umld h@ve ta have be- s w i [ ~ ' Z r ; ~ a t % v ~

m e t if bc sm g p h g g close that aft=ammm,

a ml=% fiax~~ec.

Q Is W. Clay fr%end of yours?

A fs &, C l a y a figand @f =be?

Q We'll, haw would y m &f&ne g~w: re%a~cy~ls'ka.Ep

~%ii:h &, Clay, gust stxfcl;ly ta trus%aess relsati.msh%p, &

gersoa that= yT?uC-.

A -st: desEj_~ftaly, X'W never been tro Ma bvset,

Z1ve rra3.y be~a ta f;he offtee? ea few thes, I bon'C kjsoat

a q nwcre thae 1C h o w anyme: else, Ltv% seen h h %n &e

affica a few times sad ~ * v e elkosed a few laans,

Q h d wou'id Cba sarw be tme a% Ralph W'P

Rtfve you b d prafessfum1 dteal5.~ga ~ 9 t h Mm?

A defh%teTy , I would say I'm a 12trIe

~ e n d l i e x wttk Luther Clay r b n Hr, Cook.

Q And W r . Weeme?

A ~ r , ~eeves X &net knaw really at aff, kkss

v ~ r y wiet and never see hfm, y m know, ~ s ~ s just mt

a tcffker.

Q O w thiag X don't: underarartd, Mr. Dwnnw, is

if these people atre sltffl brfrr$%ng wu 'butafrmse, arnd why i t

i s &ey carsld poassibxy have any fdea of my mspiracg

ag~gnfiyt: qnsu,

A One thing I don't understand, if I earnpired,

why wauld Pkey sen& maze. bs fness?

Q Can p explain tihat st all?

A Peculiar, isn't it? I don' t understand why

sameb* waXd want to use my frxcl if E was guilty af sl'f,

A. PRICE# NEWBERRY & CO.l INC.

.msbodp t-tablo, sanebody * c o d d @lao% the loans &;ere

sither they heve a lot of c%usizqp where e buyer i s bbads

and a saP'1ar 1s WMte that is eke ~rqxmdt3t:ance OP 2:tZakf

business, Et d want f;O fEnd one t k t &hey cauPd rely aa,

P ~lrtotzldnr't: a;tsa 9as if 3t wets this %;aye Yew lax1 me,

8 Were you. mare that: &e jtldgza fn the pz;a:wdjta&

&mrolvfng ebe Ibbfasoms verme Ja&sofi Re&l.ty Company, Xm,

and t=b ind%vidmls w%m awe Res-dmts 3s this case aka well

as Mr, W s k h , that he has grant& a motLon tu add as;

o party dafertdmr, as a cu-coaapfra~r?

A T kmentt beem serrred, ldm iiwar%*-

9 Y0ufre mare of that%

A Yes, I ' m aZse amre that there's a m4dm

fur recmsiderat&un--

Q B w d%d you be- ware-

a --srilT pend%ng, I asked Hr. %ursseIb &e se3&&

me a icwy of whatever was EglecE,

0 &re y w aware oE the Ezltc* tilzat: &kc, Mas-

WBB gofng tu ream a laan if ~ k l r s eontract failed?

A He mmt1,oaed ft art: &e&os&ng, he hRPB gl

thirty ehausrmd doIler aota, niaety-day note. Aad that's

1 thhk -- t b t ' a one reasm why it was a tm C ~ O S ~ ~

ao be cctuf.B get ~ X O C Q O ~ ~r whatewer, 8e s&%d ff t h y

mm5&@t t't:k stmath%ag out of P:h& ecloslaqps casts, if a r e

-8 m cc3mprwI~e; *at: could be reached, ff nsrbdy wanted

A. PRICE. NEWBERRY & CO.1 I NC.

334

A O f C@U33G YhOt+

Q X f p~ had barn me& m e of the a c t LhPr

if thFs didn't close he was going to have ~o pay PLva b ~ & % d

cad ninoky Qllars in interest in the nata, +$nt

S%@E have l ed y m go give him scma ach-Ica w&th zsspoet to

who?xb,er ~ l t zmt he ta 80 ahead m& close4

A =?Id BJiB haw lBw& it; WafpP

B MghL

A Pssa%bXy, But ItE he haw twts -h he ha3 Eo

pay & x 6QEL't; 3m-rlers---

Q ffa yc#r bxm whstt: ~Sorte the whole &%zag Esmki~

q 3 fn term3 QE*"

I Et hait ;t=o ba a f ~ s b afck&.

Q YQU"~~; fi;aZErSng about C w k easm back,

thtaugh; f a el.!@% ?~S$fnc?

A Wghe, You're t=lplkdng hue tihe fbs% &&ma2

Q Yes, X*m t;aWng a b t : the fgrabt tha*

A X t ha& te b feux 0"1& er 4:w.

Q ZPca 'gau h a p t b e ~ e w r d e t

A @WEE hawe. Ye@ drragr kt?;* &e reco& be*

em-wa yeoa cm3 t bZlP clfmm ZQZ tW QD p a , sf%. a t a ammaea- ox *at: r90 pea tjio arc bs dt, y m p - ~

3-E *'fL 'Y@U %Wk2 Jre3ur o f f %k c~0~%33@ SZ&d - the* &m dude hPX3 that; way*

0 De y m kacw xihy &he af%x a e mda,

A. PRICE, Kt'WBGRRY & CO., INC.

tthe offer thet eemo in after aitr o'clock, was i t w w rejected

Be aawtarcad he was going to Claytan, Georg%a. I. tbidk tt

f s , md he left.

Q I]ut when a e y cgme baok with the s a d offer

*&ch y€%€--

A Z coaPh*t r=lem t b t eke way 3tt was, f

coulbrr* %: doss f e %f ehay wc3:msz t=aLI 2n J,e c3to~isg--

Q xr w m ~ d lawe za be .nteaub&pf~md back?

a m t t s xigkt*

Q %st's 1x3 aaa~sme e h ~ &f all. the parr=les wm3;;ad

taa clese eund resubbe i t back ka VVA, & yea Prnsw sf

readcnrt why Wshbm mu3.d me have awepted that &Em

ghat; fre C S ~ ~ S Hte was pJf%lbqg tx~ at i5atm o'c%o&, 8-9-74?

A 'Eaans w ~ o w e x ,

Q Can y m thf& of aqy reason why Ew muXd

~ e @ c t that= ogEe?~ f f he was MlJ-Jrng to acceps ft aa &gw&

eht3 9*, Z974?

a m y he waafdnpr afseepier i t later on2

A. PRICEl NEWBERRY & CO., INC.

ibr E b ' t W r mybe he hit at the O b ef

a closiq reas - w b m he ww at the o f f a oad ha fair,

you kmro, tb%t thpy should have closed the. You

p@e gee 8ad a& they have -- they otap wid or you

~ Q W , Xt's 8 pzfmz%pl_e w%t% &em PeopS-e w e p le fwlE~%~~ ~ k m e

pzineiples*

Q Bjf~sztf d p u b-ve any c)bJe@t%m eo e%es5,~ cases

me &m when f ar;d #m mn'atTa8, Be was a r-3. weage

a c v * ZB&r sdd, Gary", what dt3 yes want me m 2.eIX pm&

go m%te samtking for e f s felXm? I said, y m kamw, f

em's: -- x*a m3Z: gmZa$ a3 g&24%3?mtt?.e ca*. Xr: w sl4.wm- I

A. PRICE, NEWBERRY & CO.' INC.

pug 3BaEwaga c q q has it, L t 9pi11 teennsd,

9 kt=, it: cUd cMse fLaa3Xy1 DlLd ~Pos& *&

af lcr-7

bS %J elesed that: flee-, mt wa@ m=4p * ba hsd prtid Befima there m no b a s md i t was r e w d ,

Q hS, hila8 the at%mmey j6u f5em &%q& WZ

A I Ererva zw fdssr bat E ebiXL, 'X: am && =it.*

Q f, see, ga y m rec459.1 wbe the ssX3tzt9 air 4&@

lz.qr= tam2

A ~ B J bayex say Be: Z5hamm B%gsby or Ghz~Sew B,

Eawzk5,~.

8 < ~ g m E , X f q > &4.-peby?

&ti I belfeve oo,

fl dirnd wh43egs ather -1

A real wmtre cmqsqy, L kmwdm st w&@ W

X can E%nd am% %c was,

rlght? I man, y ~ u teatfE%ed regerdlng that and ft got to

bo a jab d n a ~ d like effha. Mtd evez teXL Wkka Ebrae

' mt I aanr to do i s close the ~oaa.

k&s m, ~eww* % wm€X&'a= mil h b *d*

Q Me w a t rn ta say, 'I*= uder exm&m% or&r,

please close tba loan. And then hs safd yar said, i f Ft

olmms, y m rrpsdwsTend th&t Jaz&awx% 3WmZty t%mpaqf s e t s

last% mehside f&tm and csn cause yat a a+ of &&dl

bZ3 ' t t . n&d yent #Br Gbip &2%~?

A W, hwtllse X &mde rt:hhk that thy ere 1

1- aor+bside. First of all, I don't bellare UMt they

me a l.argp =or*%& z-P ast~-t:e ei?fb.ce, S d SE &=X, E

m t f d ~ a s i f $ i ~ 84%~ w e , Tfoia:d of &I, Z w X d rta &dak

%f ehey m X z 9 emse h9st Isam s mt*

Q y m ksaw w&i,ag 42lxmt ~ e b m

Ccmpaay that: wxi3.d wdw yru th&& fn3-m~ hey -wmr2& m$ w

damage -4 barn?

A T've &&Ek wb* Jaskm ReaPm OW &

by%n;g z q hawe.

Q Wel'lk, t;ErexEk q t % 3 . a g c]ia tMs l 3 3 m ~ O ~

wW.ctb wuxzld %exid yws ee be%&ieve tM8: they mold wane; &u

aamisa;et 3.n any m y ?

A rn*fffg &Q&s~)v.~z*,

A. PRICEl N€WB€RRY & CO., INC.

Q CU1 tight. Bnd also w a d ss aayisg,

i e rm lose, i t -xd j~psdl:dfi& retat-* r ~ t h

CMt8. Would yau state %&ether rrr not you said -1:s

A m, I di&'c b-tr I dislnet zaxm? - X bnw

they weme on tba dtrg,ple list* I dfrh't *f& at%&*

Q d9d y a eve^ say tiwe a&ex -- %b day

rrPter *t yQ%z

clwa qmte?

A X =ever d54, X ~utd ihfs3a s2w.t: rEawe's a

proble~h. &B told4 me that h% m& the order, hs hrd ts

e%om so ptmsill da &ae X can, Aad X. mfd, yaz bmws P

NEWBERRY & CO.) INC.

Q %&s t11ae ~?erm.pked ~ ~ t b m y i o s x f 3 ~ we3y?

B '&w much was be fee? E30, neg a% aLX*

Q The s E a @ t ehae: yrrzl bmght ymw hmzm thz~u&

Hr. &me has net iaEX%ze~cerl your f=49tbcmy?

A f'va c?lah;e& as zn'ioeh %I'm k% L* as Z b e

£or Jack- WaXty.

Q Now, in yan: aperients with several hm&ed

trma;act%sns fm~Zving whKte sellaxs and B l a gmchexs, I

have p u ever experitz.aced one beEora fn h f e h @%e ssff a

hait ~104 been a$ &a puutclwsor saw Ma&?

L e t me pat f t smother way. t&%XX, attar

m y E m e t=o pat it,

A. PRICE, NEWBERRY & CO.. INC.

1 Q M f n if it's pofnts, terndre Letters; rdght=T

Q &d -- Let me jmr: say one mr.er thbg, X a

f2 Nw, rawt ewexyWy s e w m sgms oa points.

d X*m not swe, T b h ha.@ w e z crt:mxcred kf8re,

Axag as X, §a&&, m close ab-txe eighty a bm&d Xoms a

3Zfm2tEh. &id %*-

A. PRICE* NEWBERRY & CO., INC.

the prerequfglite to ehe clasing was never exeated, pparr it?

A . %& %a#%i'&.

BE, RWm: Thae's all,

Eli, LAEKmr X e B may, thx'ea qa&gt~ms, P q

s-e*

m ~ s - ~ m o s

m* u-t

Q W, Dmne'p:, you ~estified that you wrked w i t h

OEO; $6 that ccxreeI?

A Office af Economic Qppsrttmity.

Q As their f egsl cs~nsel?

A 1 wasn't e'netr Irsgal comsef. A 1 HcGhee

was,

Q mat w e r e you?

A Assistant Legal Advfsor far the Of fics af

Economtic Opparmity, Southeast Region, Lartf clerk,

Q I'm sure that you're probably more fm%hfar

with this than '1: an, but correct me if I 'rn wrong, a0 yasilr

faarbliar wgth a t b e VIP of'the Civf% Rfghts A c t af 1968it X

belteve that's the E a r hsustng sectlort, i s Lt--

A You know, at OR0 we newer d id fahr hwsi,ng,

What I did was -- we Eunded and defumdad progrmii;, ccmmun1.w

action pxi3gr8~~s. W e ehecked the qwl&ffcations, ve red

e e f u pragrma, we dsfundad one in fiabama, we dfd dif%emmt

things, We sever worked w2th faEr hasing,

Q Okay, Can you answer my question? Are you

at least famiZfar wztk the pr~v%sians of that--

A Yes, tme.

Q And 3. sn* t 9t true tbt persans X&Q are in

violation of thad say be sfmilarlp liable for dmmgas4

A %%at's what ft says,

Q AIR r2gh~. isn't kt true that if tb3.s

Ccmmfssfona a d subaseqe~it1-y the Federal Court believes Nx,

Cciok, Mr, Remes and E;[ac, Gleeyt s teatimoay rather h yours,

that ptil may be sub3 eet ts civf l damages in tkf a matter?

d Thats* s absolutely correct,

MR, LACKEY: Thank you. '.%at% a l l 36 i~ava,

HR. TERRY: E j u s t have sna quastfofi,

BY MR. TERRY:

Q P5r, Domer, dgd 3 ur2derscarrd an redkect; E r a

Mr. kssell t h a you remembered &, Reeves mention o f the

fact that he was vnde.5: consent--

A Csment, soma kfnd of order.

Q Yotz remember-hh making tha t staf;e&1clftg?

A (Hods head affZxnativeXy,)

Q Way d1d he mike that: statement?

A bcaese Luther gee: (oln Gke phone 2nitLaLPy aad

A. PRICEl NE\\SC/%€RRY & CO., INC.

f;he selEex. Eke-*

m, DAWSOM: 31 wdex~t;and eke.

* m ~ W X ~ E S S ; &d da I tkb& i t was w, mkts

pos%&Lon to telll the seller? Haybe on IML follod~pg

you.

MR. DAWSON: I th%& you understand, ~ d r e

answer%ng tbe past ion, SSo you feel that Tj f r , C d

wers responsPbZe in any wray in this trransactftsn h r

the prsb'llems that developed relating to the terdte--

1EEIE 'WLY!HE:SS: Pitot any mere -- Of cosrse net, HR. DmWI: This kind erf problem?

TEE WXTHESS: Hot e t all,

HE%. WSB: Prm a legal staadpoht, do poer

f;hi&c that i t makes any d2ffereace ff Hz, Cook did

me neatLon that rha Robhsms w e r e b l a d t

THE %IT&ESS: From a legal atandpolat? No*

'fYaB, PARSON: I& further questions.

'PIXR. UW: Or for any oeker reason?

.k BE BJSmS: Nut at aff, As I said beEexe,

it 3 u s ~ ward have made the -- 91: just muf,d have

goae emfez. &d P al?jxtlrc Ot ~ i g h t have ckossd, you

b, had they M e X 3 , f dknft bw beacdiuse -- bet aot been apprlsed of %he fact that -- ~here weze

Tat of things, the tenmigas, &e klf a p o h t , they

didn't knw the purcbaars were black. P &net chid

A. PRICEI NEWBERRY & CO./ INC-

mid b lph f;nrrlc &dnPt: teZl aayWg, ) ~ o u h e w , it: was a

surprise ad, you imov, all kfsds sf pmblema and all he

talked abut was race wrlttr Mr. Eeifwes . &id tbm ha 8dd+

he @ants ta &alk t;o y ~ 1 , h d I got ora tbet phone aad I s d d ,

hello, ilr, R a w e s . He said, Gary) you ~ K W , wasre &

stme Isi;nd sf federal order, you knw, not eu dirscridaats.

(;Z And that: was all. be mLd?

A And he said, X wufd appreciate k t i f grar;r

would & ert.qeirfng yew can to get f& cZosed, iaEtd f said

that I -Id,

Q &d that's ax1 tbr: W ~ B said?

A %at is a l l that was said ,

DABSON: Mr. Dunner, I have an h p r m s % ~ s

as t o how yolu fear about: Mr. Cmk slnd his &dZ&ty.

Do y6u Eeaf that he -- &, Qek -- was respss&b.Le &a

any way t;a tell Mr. Msshbum abut the t d t : a

problem, the prob'llm 0% the discountl

THE wITNE:SS: Da I this& what? That it: was Bks

respnsf bil itp?

ErZR, DMSBRt Yes.

TflE WTkBSS: b, Sot at al l .

MR, WWE: 'well., W c l a f r it be 28

assuszing that yoxi d~ n ~ t feel that: W, Gwk was

reisponsth%e?

TWlE WXBESS: Mr, krne was the one w b ha&

A. PRICE, NEWBERRY & CO., INC.

ycm bw, the face thak -y wexs b1ar:k bad aay~Mqg

to & with i t . fkzt X ~~ 3.t shaufd hatvz been t e l d

O ~ C R Z ~ termite letter slnd the bl f -p ia t . I

think that it=; could W e saved--

I.IEARTMG O F n G m t Thfs f s a quest3.c~n that:

I ~ p t s ~ ~ t i ~ r r m y : . &W o ~ t m do ~ i ~ d that real

estate people hide somet:Wn& 2fke this fp:m €bdx

ageat, &ma the sellex: or the purchaser a d throw

the parties togeeher and it a x e s out all rgght?

Does rMa happen gaix&y f z q ~ e ~ t l y ?

'SE%E WPDBSS: Y e s , Yea, a lot ef t i m e s are

c m ~ go the closing; table and there are th3tqgs that

they eel1 FBI that they -- t 2 m t s s what E mmat MOICQ

by lang ft takes re close is transactf0~1., Bere

are real. restrat@ csmpanLos where p-le in* they

kaaw exactly wkaf they're g a t . ?o pay, and they

know a a c e l y what theytxe going f:o get;, A got o£

tdtakes s ~ e b o d y sJhta is exgsctjtng to pay a kun&btd

del2ars ta cXose and &t rrrtds up fbtg: h e a d & 2 b ~ s

to clrase and they don't hawe that: money w i t h

ehm, or they've been told, you e, thae they

would W e an inreksst adjustment and there isn't one

and WI have t~ explafa whar an faterest adjustment fs

And tfnese kiad of problems happen a lot,Errrpp~!n w e

than they shauld. And this happt;ns, ye&, sad a b e

A. PRICE) NEWBERRY & CO., INC.

of times thar's the rea.am k a long closing. Wlr

i t docs bppen e lot. his is e ~olason praDtice,

'XiS iEARZPicG OFFLCiZR: H6-w abPuO a p m b ~ ~ Otiaf

a tmu~ts es six hundred md izEaetp dollars? &e you

usually talktag a b u t a husdred, a ba$x:ed f i f ty

doZXar profZfem, or 2s o h Emadred &ad -ty doL%azti-

u s d ?

Z3.E WXTEJESS: X wmld say -- A 1st: of f5mea

it's w%tb%a a net check annd it's at few thmsand

d o l X a s , as much as fore;y-five timusand dorXaiax short

wit& a purchaser. I j us t have -- ge;neuaXXy W e them

-- L have ~ e i a 4s atuch as tkss tm faux: bed

dallars oft=.

M4, KXNG: Based orp w b w you said 1301&~* f£

there% -- Jackson Realty--

ZW2 WXmSS: If they did that, i t ' s PC% my

!+R, K X m What I t m minterest4 in* anb surprisa

a t you would say, t b t i$. made a differe51~e a m @

nr, knew he race 02 these people atit. &ae t&ae

4- TII& WITNESS: It didn't make any dkf farsnce

ar the cXasing, Okay. Zt wade a dbf f seace , Ie

I1 A. PRICE# NEWBERRY & CO.I INC.

X X satti re Lut:her, y w knm, we? horve a pmb%em, Z

d$.ihst have t;a say, knew, w b f : a s preb3em wm.

alre.ktdy caw C;s the? cloafnl~;, ha didnit wmE te

and he w b b d that W. Reeves -28 hawe be- a r e ,

And gk~? anfy tMng he caw, you kmm, ta st -- wars

bwwe MP, Cook deda'.~: say-in Mrs mind--that

p m h e r s r weire black,

Sa when T. bad io gssble.rs, he 4mu1hP~ awes

help me even negotiate i t either: by sa- mybe we

eaa work sscmeth5ing out w2.a tbe cam%ssAae or: axiythh

else, The 0fz3-y thosaght: 4.n U s miad w a s , gsd-

Ralph. W k , Be didn't tell me that W p were Bid.

And Z didn't: hawe -- Pike E said, I dida'g hare a

cXran~s r43 say, yea ~~) t:hatf s rrol the p22&ibm*

it's all wer mney.

The w b Z e atmosphere at the c3ssaiag ps&m e;Q

thm cm]r.ag -- just 2fke Fir, Crrokwanted W,

should I caoe early . That's not what closfng is

alk abut. I wont to get 19 there, coll&ce. ttw

mamy, CLQSQ the 1oa'~f and go.

racial problems, &at that was a l l that fhoJ saw fro.

e h ~ eisae $ saLd there was a problem w thes tiwa

&aLd Beeves tkt there was a pzablem, && &st's dl

t b f ; was pipoke abut. a e y xpevez serfd, sdwzf: _ Z ~ J tSw

A. PRICE, NEWBERRY & CO.< INC.

&Xm1 ?%ifkt question w m Bwer asLed me, &ima$y

d,d, Plhat %S i s f h t p p*X* & I could hwc soid.

a$x hwx$rred and nbety.Lbm dok'faxs, And f m L d @(s

A. PRICE, NEWBERRY & CO.. INC.

WSB trlldng ebrmt md I@= i n r ~ ~ u ~ 2 d

mRITNESS: I'm not sme i f I Bida'r wosk

cPm~stly*

3 t 4 ~ , K!XK: IOU we= rd=%sg ef~ez-H m-;~*

eu w k or samasi~nrt a ~ ; Rema R e a l t y , as ff

they h-ad t33xmxa89d ttk% ampbht .

3BB %XT#.!lESSz a&atgs t b feelb.g W aE b d

B e x a m e when the elaahqg b n b up, we hi dZsmat~6ed

the Stm-my, we? hiad sUts.ewsa-d G % B q p e s e , we $a;$

d i ~ s s t w ; 3 everyth;fa%,. &if Z sjas ta1d smbdy

het any masy, nuehiag meld be

mey ca2Xed back s a d Z had #&a taessqe &mi sty

seeraw* c ~ l d oss w&t, yy3u how, they w e mstixta4;

ov?E4r.

&ere was rra -- The WbWcyns ae m@ %&m dtwSq

&a cX@si,ng d%d &ey wex say chiskc filmy % X t ekey w a

bdng dfsmMn8ted agagnsr, cUd zhey em- say chat

u p , yew h e w -- a=y aetgsn &at: E = h q f ~ a e ebr

ehere was sny *- rpho only aae who smnt3-d s ~ L M ~

was Hz, @s&, &d h i s s$st=memts e091.e eff @m

Wbbsms were ef 4 zac5a2 nature a d of a

tme, C k t yea kmw, -IT, fL they don't: ebse, p%%

k-, t:he:r=e! cmld 'fie a ~ l a % a t m&.

me xs ~ M S &I f i ~ . f : ~ f ; -Q j ~ ~ e

A. PRICE# NEWBERRY & CO./ INC.

392

rbe oloaing tab3-e at two o'clock?

W3imSS: I&, i s the seam4 f;Waa

m, K1:BG: 83.3 oicZac&4

TEE VIErnSS; Er, Wk'tpurn didn't caw 't.ihasek- rn

clase*

Ve &It W t , yooz ktwF evexytUng was r;aoLaf ly

xnaoe%vwteFt$, '1Im lwm, I had sf faxed ru ~5.ese i f t : tf

we wu2d m k scmeWng we, i f they k ~ ~ ~ l . 4 aigmee te

pay. I offered to close it. WZIIIt X vuuld have done

i s 3E. m e e d t:s cbse bD %n w c s ~ , Anb X had mew

t.f.6fx.ed it e;a evergr%a@ey. I said, X i d f5ke %o EZOW ft

en ISCZ~W sawI 3tt xes&mLitt:ed $6 VA, gust

have them apprmrz Et, Beeausa X believe P f ca pux-

chaser -- &exass nn preblm if the setzlex" pays

rtrt;r~wtW.ntg;. But ff the pwwbrrses #sacZS te p p

clwhg w s t s erar anyeMng, S: r=k&nk it trEPee:e:s %Es

l;Zqp%dXty md &ei%wiaciaZ, p2ckrre upan wh3.d %bay

need ee h d a loan. A d they h.me r;o b ~ e , X e W ,

a proof oS h w rnuch they have I;rz tihe Bask mad

diffiezen~ other %;hZ~gs, 3% naf a mrqqe mm, I

don't: b, &~t 3 knew Wt: ionce the p u ~ c h e t s ~ ~

rm&tt&es ~blfigeitkun, Zt b@ ta ba s e c d k a f ~ d by

the VA, And X have cksesf it 3.n erscw, wtdch

I wm&&d tm &a, and jusr: res-t it atsd elm house

d d %eve bem sold*

A. PRICEf NE\SG/%ERRY & CO., INC.

&at: as Z sa%d, zmbdy WE& sny c z E E b r t , &Wmdy

said e h r t k ~ y ~ ~ 1 d ~ ~ ~ ~ F w E L s @ .

Pat* KXNG: All fighe* fk;r yxm 2Wwca anaiqr a-

rea- te befime, any other tpeeX2f.c nt~sa~f m

belime that &eves Rej~Zw Ralph eok e e &e

reason for th3.st

Rm5a: reason f ~ f hshat?

KING 2 f lawd2bXe. )

BR, W S S m : I heard weryeLrig but: f i e f a r

word.

bB, KIWt Well, b;he q b A n 2 : here, ax

l ~ d t , ax m y sther probZma, the faPXxare sf Wss

tung m go *-. 5 : Yes,

w i t h my partner, who was the one elosisg, and he hod,

I gttess, spoLen to one of their agents and tlrey hul

mslrtZoned thar Mr. Cootc hsd ~ ~ & t 4 ; & the sitruMaa,

and also Wt ~ X C -a e t h e r statemeat PP& trg

s a & o e else that the sf s M l d haw

advised rrLrtr one of their agents, that ~ r a s GX~lsp.

A. PRICE, NEWBERRY & CO., INC.

up+ bat &at %s geteitag $.am efraaser heaxsay* X M*t

es m a d to h b s x s c l ~ we've be- m m

&yr

2%

m, m y . , SQIX p e .

M&, KIWGt I)o yes kwe my o&ax spmf Liers"t

Mx, F q &s* 2.2; was, mad I -- it %?as pt epzesa elme Pam asked; foST crslKz of *e 43xm&iss*

*

Hi€, %3z'a'xPt 5 l!a%Fi$* B&QcP~~:*

W- m ~ e fg ~ W l e r

Mite K3NG: y ~ w *

&a, RtJSSm: fttt 3 ~ 2 : 3.ake ta m k &* m m e 3.f hg: &, Bemm ei f%fa i3 %xmpl&*t d*

t b -%I!MZS* of ~%I!S&E%?

SfEi$lEl3BESSr He,

WL Btws-2 *4 w* fl.ewe0 .a.ed a easp&iaSrt. l£@BP

ZBE kF.€=a9Sr XBo,

m* l%z?Ssm: r n k t s ; an,

BIZ. TERRY: The C a m asked

quest-, I urn't .hrrp but: follar .cIp the puastlna

re&prdh%g eg: csnv=s;rath W e Reeves, ~BC- M&h

ai~bp, =a Ycptf test- *t y a -14 a- k b t

a BXO~%-, the ~a31ler %S mt w w t~ W e j 2rs

A PRICE. NEWBERRY & CO.. INC.

zmyMs,g else beoewe, you knwr, as u Inthor

safd we have a problepr, thot raas it. Bul thrtss w$rE

k said. Bo just sf~ppsd ilai he said it, pou lirurpr,

PS i f %XI 1 h # T it. Bad froa whof he S d d , -t

W= pe,

m,333mY: dndyartdidntefmov*ito-S-

pr2or ta &gas$ the 9th? You'd miwez seen fttrst

TBE ~~: 8uLBo, not at all.

m* l%ERP: lhsntrm.

TIIg 2%lhwmG OFFICBR: I thinlr the orrag%Ic Eiteur

i s qma as. And I beUwe we'll e d j n w until-8130

h tBe a#,=bg.

A. PRICE. NEWBERRY & CO.. INC.

I1 A. PRICE# NEVBERRY & CO.> INC.