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Title:

E. Bennie TaylorEleana Turner

An interview with E. Bennie Taylor, April 9, 1973/interviewed by Eleana Turner

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TAYLORIE. Bennie

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MISSISSIPPIDEPARTMENTOF ARCHNES AND HISTORY

Division of Archives and LibraryPatti Carr Black, Director

This transcription has been edited by the interviewer. Title to the

material on the audio tape and in the typewritten transcription and all literary

property rights belong to the Mississippi Department of Archives and History.

Permission to cite, quote or reproduce this interview, in whole or in part, must

be obtained in writing from the Mississippi Department of Archives and History.

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E. Bennie TaylorEleana TurnerApril 9, 1973Mr. Taylor's home in the Basin Connnunity, George County, MississippiMerrill, Mississippi, the old river town.

Miss Turner: This is Eleana Turner with the Department of Archives and Historytalking to Mr. E. B. Taylor at Basin, ~lississippi,in George County.Mr. Taylor, would you tell me a little bit about yourself, like whereyou were born, how old you are...that type stuff?

Mr. Taylor: Well, I was born in Hazlehurst, Mississippi, January 20, 1893...cometo Merrill in 1906.

Turner: 1906?Taylor: 1906•..no, 1901, on the sixth day of March.Turner: So, you've been here just about the whole century in George County.

Well, what was Merrill like when you moved there?Taylor: Well, Merrill was a pretty lively little place ...several sawmills...

there was the Cochran Lumber Company, and Dixon and Mallette LumberCompany. L. C. Hellums was running the shingle mill at that time.We moved there and started a sawmill.

Turner: And what was the name of your sawmill?Taylor: J. G. Taylor's sawmill.Turner: And what did you do? How old were you?Taylor: I was eight years old.Turner: And you worked then?Taylor: No, I went to work down at the mill when I was ten years old.Turner: And what did you do around the mill?Taylor: I cleaned up trinnningsfrom around the saws at the planing mill, and

I fired a boiler at the shingle mill. My daddy had a shingle mill, too,and I fired the boiler for that.

Turner: Did you ever go to school?Taylor: Went to school in Merrill about four years.Turner: What type school did they have? Was it grades one through twelve, or

was it grades one through six?Taylor: One through six.

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And did the people go on to school after that?Yes, ma'am, they kept school there until 1911, I believe.And then they did away with the school at Merrill?Yes, mal am.And they've not had one there since?No, ma'am •••hadn't had a school there since. They moved it to Bexley.That's where the people went to high school?Yes, ma'am.I understand that you did a lot of the weather readings. Could you tellme something about that?Yes, ma'am, my wife, she had that ...from 1917, I believe. It was justa year or two that I had it, and then I went to the shipyard and thenshe took it back over.But didn't you, did you help her?I helped her.Could you tell me something about the floods? I understand that Merrillfloods just about every year.It's not every year •••it usually gets up pretty high every year •••ithadn't been doing that in the last, oh, I'd say, ten years.Hadn't been flooding in the past ....Not as much. 1961 is next to the highest water they ever had here.What was the highest they ever had?The highest was in 1900.Right before you came?Yes, ma'am.You remember other years of big floods?Yes, ma'am, in 1916 was next to the highest water we ever had there.Tell me about that flood.Well, it come a hard stormy rain, and •.•I think it was on the fourth ofJuly, no, the fifth of July, and we had twelve inches and thirty-fivehundredths rainfall there one night.

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Twelve inches?Twelve inches. (Laughter)My goodness!And that flooded everything there ...no current in the river downthere when it started falling.What did the people do when this happened?Well, they just .•.some of them moved out •.•there's some two-storyhouses there and they all moved up •••most of them moved up into them.Someone told me they had ropes where they would .••and big screws upin the top of the ceiling where they would just pull their furnitureup when it flooded. Did you ever know of that?No, no, ma'am, they didn't do that. They got lumber from the mill andmade scaffolds to put their stuff up there on it.Oh. I understand that there were two depots there at one time. Doyou remember that?No, ma'am. It was only one.And where was it located? Is it still there?No'm, it's not there now. There's nothing there to show for it at all.The first depot was on the ••.on the west side of Main Street. In 1908,they moved it and built over on the east side and they done away withthe one on the left.How many railroads went through there? How many lines went through there?Only one..Andwhat was that?It's been ••.MJ&Ke, and then they changed to New Orleans, Mobile andChicago; and Gulf, ~bile and Northern; and then •••GM&O ..•.And it still goes through there?Yes, ma'am. Now it's GM& - let's see - it's the Ie and Gulf or somethinglike that. I forget just what it is now. Let's see, I'll get somethingand .••Great Northern .•.•It's been that since last August, the merger between the GM&O and theIe took place.

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Yes, ma'am. And ICG.So now it's the ICG?Yes, ma'am, Illinois Central and Gulf.So Merrill was a big railroad town at one time.A small railroad town •••big sawmill town.Tell me more about the sawmills. Those seem to be diminishing now.Well, the first sawmill there in Merrill was Dixon and Mallette.Were these big sawmills?Yessum, pretty good sized sawmills. It was right where the railroadcrosses the river.Were they all on the railroad tracks?No, ma'am. And then, I think it was in 1903 or '04, F. B. Merrill andLige Rose moved in there and built a mill.Now was that who Merrill was named for?Er •••F. B. Merrill, yes, ma'am.They called him Colonel Merrill?Yes, and they run a mill there awhile. And then.Rose got out of itand he went into the mill business •••I think they bought old BrowningCooper mill property below that, and - Browning Cooper left - theyhad a little old tram road they pulled the cars in there •••the lumberup there by mules on a little car. And the Rose Lumber Company - theydissolved - and then it was the F. B. Merrill Lumber Company and hebuilt a dummy line down the road there, and they hauled the lumber outwith cars •..trains •..and on below, that was the A. F. Cochran LumberCompany. That was about five or six miles south of Merrill.On what road?That was on that dummy line. They went in there and got •••put the carsin there on the dummy line •..the log road ..•and then they finally builta railroad themselves, come out - I think it was in 1908 - in 1909they went broke. They taken up the railroad.What's located there now, anything?Not anything now.Just woods there now?

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Yes, ma'am. There's a few people living there.Why did they name the site after Colonel Merrill? Was he the richestperson there or •••?No'm. He was in Mobile. He was just president of the GM& .••MGA&KCRailroad Company.Oh!He was president of the railroad. And then he come there and startedthat railroad. It was named Merrill, I think •••well, back to startwith, the post office was named Cochran.And then they changed it to Merrill?Yes.When?That must have been in 1898 when the railroad got there.I understand you ran the post office.I was postmaster up there for several years.How many •••when did you start running the post office?I first started in 1922.And how many people did you have using it then? .Oh, there was, I recon, nearly a hundred and fifty.And when you quit, how many.Well, there was about a hundred.So it didn't go down that many.No'm, they got the rural route in there and they wanted that.And now they've done away with the post office.Yes, ma'am, done away with the post office.When you moved to Merrill, was it larger than Lucedale?Yes, ma'am.When did the change take place? And why, do you think?

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Well, ah, that water was the cause of it. You see, when the countywas made, George County was made, they tried to put the county seatup there at Merrill but they wanted to move it out about a mile. Theold citizens wouldn't do it. So Lucedale was made the county seat,and Lucedale went to building up. But Merrill was bigger than Lucedaleat that time ••And then people started moving into Lucedale.Yes, ma'am.I understand there were three doctors out at Merrill at one time.Let's see ••••Two doctor Elys, and a Dr. Dorsett.It was •••no there wasn't two doctor Elys at one time, and Dr. Carl Elywas running the drugstore there ••.and, ah, when he went off and finishedhis schooling to doctor he went to Bexley and Will Ely stayed there,and when Will Ely left, Dr. Knight come in there .••and he stayed therethen. And there's a Dr. Thornton ..•he'd been at Bexley, and he comeup there and done a lot of practicing in Merrill.Was Bexley a big place too?It was a sawmill town •••Greene County Lumber Company run in there.You know the old church that's sitting there at Merrill with all themoss hanging down? Could you tell me about that church?Well, it's that church was built there in •.•I think they started itthe first of 1908. All the denominations went in together to build it •.•Presbyterians, Methodist, Baptist, and the Episcopals and they built achurch •••got to be a Baptist. They used Union literature there inSunday School.All the denominations worshipped there together?Yes, ma' am, had a right to use it. It was supposed to have been aBaptist.And then in more recent times it's been a Methodist church, hasn't it?Yesstnn, Methodists kept it up. Baptists wouldn't do it ••.they quit it.What do you think will happen to it now?It's gonna catch fire and burn up.I sure would like to see it saved. It's •..•

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I'd love to ....Real pretty.I'd love to. But then •••that grass and stuff is going to get up thereand somebody is gonna get a match in it somewhere and it's gonna burn up.So it was built in 1908?Yes, ma'am.Tell us a little bit about the rivers •.•what rivers form the Pascagoula?Ah ••.Leaf River and Chickasawhay River form the Pascagoula River.And do they come together at Merrill?Just above Merrill.Is that named a place, too, where they come together?No, just call it the Pascagoula River.And how deep is the river?Well, it used to be mighty deep but it's kinda filled up till it'spretty shallow now with sand.I understand that at one time it was navigable:Yes, ma'am. Steamboats ran up it at one time.When was this?Oh, that was back in •••must of been 1904, '05.What did they •••what was the purpose of the steamboats coming upto Merrill?Well, they hauled freight and passengers, went as far as Averyup on the Chickasawhay.Oh, really?Yes, ma'am. Never did go up the Leaf I don't think. They went upas far as Avery and one was sunk at what they call Big Creek.That's right in just about even with Vernal.Yes.And one sunk at Old Avery, just below the bridge.

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The steam .•••Steamboat .•..Yes .•••.••And another one sunk at Cedar Creek .••hit a snag and sunk.Were people killed?No, I don't think, I didn't hear it if they were.Everyone got out all right.Yes sum. Hit a snag and it .•.sunk.I understand, also, that Merrill was one of the first places to havetelephone service. Can you remember when you got your first telephone?Yessum, we had telephone service in there pretty early. I don'tremember just when .••and it was from Leakesville. Mr. Jim Beard,he come out to operate the central at Merrill and tended telephones •..kept it up.What type of transportation did you have when you moved to Merrill?Horse and buggy.Did most everyone have a horse and buggy?Had a livery stable there. There were two livery stables there.Are they both tom down now?Yes, ma'am, they've been gone for years.Are any of the old buildings still standing?There's two of the old buildings still standing.What are they and where are they?Well, now one of them's up on Hog Island, the other's at the footof Hog Island they call it.Tell me about Hog Island. What is Hog Island?Well, that's the place where all the old hogs went when the river got up.It's just a high place at Merrill?Yes sum , just a high place. It never has been covered.

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And what are the buildings ••.are they people's homes?Yes, malam.When do you think they were built?I recon one of them was •..must of been built in•..let me get the deedto that.Okay. (Pause) These are all old papers, aren't they?Yes, ma'am....That something about the lumber company?No'm. E. Kennedy ..••Is that who owned the house?He owned it at one time.Is this the house where you lived?Yes, ma'am. (Pause)And Merrill was in Greene County at this time?Yes, ma'am. (Pause) What date is that?April 17th?Eighteen .•••...Eighteen-ninety?Yes, mal am. That aint't the deed I was looking for though. Yeah, Ibelieve it is..•Merrill Land Improvement Company.What was it? A kind of real estate people that come in?Yes, ma'am. You see, now, he bought that and then the house wasbuilt after that.Right after that.Yes.Helen Smith.That's right.Now, who was Helen Smith?

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I don't know. She was a notary public.Oh. Oh. Well, now, who was this L. L. Davis?Well, he was the one who built that house there. I never did know him.Now, who's living in the house now?Uh, I don't know what the girl's name is•••Willie Jane Cochran's girl isliving in the house. I don't know what her name is.

-And there's another house out there?Yes, ma'am. One down below that belongs to •••oh-h-h ••.girl outhere, woman out here at Lucedale. I don't know. Last I knew ofher she was a Harris, I think, Lily Belle. She owns it, her ..•.Is she renting it out?No, ma'am, it's just up there vacant.It was built about the same time?Yes, ma' am, about the same time.Are they large houses?No'm, the one we was living in was pretty large, the other was not.The other was •••three rooms.Yes ••••.••And a kitchen.What are they built of? Pine?Pine lumber.Native lumber, I guess.Yes, ma'am.Cut right around here. Was it made at the sawmills, then?Yes, ma'am. Ah •••Dixon and Mallette cut the lumber. I don't knowwhen that mill was built there. It was an old mill when I wentto Merrill.It was an old mill when you went there?Yes, ma'am.

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There •••there's still part of an old mill there. What mill is that?I don't •••.Where the pilings - concrete pilings are?You mean .•••Is that part of the old mill?No, that's where ••.the Rose Lumber Company was built over there ••.that 's brick •.•.yes ••••..•Pounda tion.Yes.That was when the Rose Lumber Company built there •••and they, ah ••••When was that?That was in .••I think they started it in 1902. They moved it there andbuilt, and that was the F. B. Merrill Lumber Company mill. And thenFerguson come there and he rtm a mill .••using the same old mill •.•sitefor a mill. Then he went broke.Were there a lot of rich people in Merrill?No, ma 'am. There were no rich people in Merrill. Some of them gotpretty well fixed up in there. Richmond McKay in Premium Mercantile,they rtm the store there. Billy Thomas was in there with them .•.Billy Thomas and Mr. McKay •••Jett Dorsett, he moved in there.What did he do?He run a store. He moved in there, I think in 1903, the best I canremember. Run a store •••and then he built a two-story building 'rotmdthere for his store.Has it been torn down?Yes, ma'am, they tore it down.Well, where were all the stores located?They were there on Main Street.That's the street that rtms parallel to the river?

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North and South •..no'm, that's Mill Street - runs north, and to theriver.Well, I don't know which street ..•ah .•.did Main Street run alongthe railroad track?No'm, crossed the railroad, running north and south.Oh, but there's nothing left over there.No, there's no stores left over there.Just fishing camps now.Yessum,Now, were there stores on Mill Street too?Yes, ma'am.And that's where your store was?No'm, mine was on Main Street.Oh-h-h-h.Called the Old Joiner House, at least on that lot.But your store was in a new building?I built that building there in 1925.Yes.Had a store there for thirty-five years.Well, didn't you get some national recognition for running theweather bureau?That's right.Will you tell me about that?Well, I'll let you come in here and look at it.Okay. (Pause) She won two awards? Are those two different awards?Yeah.Can you tell me about them? Why she won them, or how she won them?I think that states in there •..on them what ..••

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She won it for length of service and outstanding service? "TheThomas Jefferson Award for Unusual and Outstanding Accomplishment inthe Field of Meteorological Observations in the Tradition of ThomasJefferson, Pioneer Weather Observer and Third President of the UnitedStates." When were these made?Well, the date's there ••••In 1968, and one in 1960.(Pause) You want me to move that so you can get closer to it?

Turner: Did that thread cabinet come out of your store?Taylor: Yessum .••that's an old one, too.Mr. Turner: You still got the old •••haven't you still got the old weather thing

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Oh! Can I see it?Yes, ma' am. 'IWelve inches and thirty-five hundredths rain fell onemorning.In this gauge right here?Yes, ma'am.Tell me, did you .••measure every day, every morning and every night?Every morning at seven o'clock.And only once a day?Yessum, well, if they had a whole lot of rain, called for a specialmeasure.And how did this work?This here shows how high it goes, and it stays there. And this onehere, it runs up you know high as it goes, but when it goes down thishere black thing stays •••that shows how low it goes •••and if you wantto set that you got to turn it like that •..you see that run down?Yes.This other, you got to whirl it to get it down.That's the rain gauge?

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No, that's the temperature.Oh! Where's the rain gauge? Oh, I see. (Clatter of metal)Now, this just ho Ids two inches of rainfall there, and when it getsover that, why, you pour this out into that small gauge, and if it'sless than an inch, you see, it shows here.Yes.That's in hundreds.Did you leave - take - the top off of it?You leave the top on it all the time ••.I .•..Oh, it fell down like that.Yessum. It may be all right to leave the top off of it, but thishere may be hard to measure.Now, how do you measure the river?Well, we had a gauge up there •••just went to the river and read thegauge.You did that every morning?Yes, every morning.And then did •••would you turn it in to the national weather bureau?Turn it in to the U. S. Weather Bureau •••yessum.How do you do that? Do you call them or telegram?For a long time they used a telegram and then they started telephoning.Who did you call? Where did you call?I called Meridian to start with •••and then they moved from there toJackson. Now they've moved it to Mobile.And when did you quit doing this?I think it was in '71, I believe.And you started it when?We started in 1914. The family did ••••1914-1971 •••and now there's another man out there doing it.Yes, ma'am. r'l I, I. I.

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And what are you doing now?Nothing.Nothing••.just farming.•.gardening?Gardening.Do you have any animals? Just that cat ...?No, ma'am. That eat's all ...it's a nuisance!

Turner: What are you growing in your garden this year?Taylor: Well, I've got potatoes, and corn, radishes, onions and collards....Mr. Turner: He'll have some of all of it.••peas •..all of it!Taylor:Turner:Taylor:Turner:

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Oh, I'm going to plant some more. It's just a little bit early.Do you still come out here and measure your rainfall?Yes, ma 'am. We had ten and thirty-hundredths in March.So, if anybody needs to know about the weather, they can still callyou, can't they.They call me and ask me about the river - I keep up with it - atMerrill they call them and they say call me biggest part of the time...tell me what it is and then I tell these folks around here what it is.That's what I figured!a picture of you now.

You'll always be our weather man!(Pause)

Let me get

Taylor: ..•Out on the hill, and can't go ahead and plant too early.Turner: Is it colder here than it is at Merrill?Taylor: No'm. It's about the same, because as it is, Merrill's down in

this river flat.Mr. Turner: Was there some frost here about a week ago?Taylor: Yeah, a little bit.Turner: Is it going to frost tonight?Taylor: Well, I hope not.Turner: I heard it's going to get pretty cold.

(End of Tape)(Transcribed by Eleana Turner)

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AU 145 OR 197.13 TR 144 Interviewee: E. Bennie Taylor ......AU 145 OR 197.13 TR 144 Interviewee:...

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