archive_[2008-03-29]_Juggler-(Wayne-Elise)_005.pdf

The Jaw-Dropping Juggler Archive v2.0from Fast Seduction 101®

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This is the Juggler (Wayne Elise) archive. There are many archives like this on Fast Seduction 101. For example, wehave archives for: Style (Neil Strauss), Mystery, Juggler (Wayne Elise), TylerDurden, BradP, Ross Jeffries, jlaix (Jeffy),TwentySix (aka Extramask), Zan, David Shade, MrSex4uNYC, TokyoPUA, Badboy, Formhandle, ijjjji, GoneSavage,Razorjack, Svengali, toecutter, Jimbo, PlayboyLA, Jetman (aka John C. Ryan, Jr.), zarathustra_fi (Franco), Vin DiCarlo(aka Woodhaven), Herbal, Maniac High, JohnnyC69, money_matteo, Hitori, epitome, IN10SE, Lifeguard, Geoff,Huddersfield Mark, madbad, chessclub, Vince, Neo-Rio (aka Rio), Player Supreme, BlueMystery, NashvillePlayboy,Nathan Szilard, ALPHAHOT1, A2daMIR, Alessandro, Harmless, ox, Trystan, Nightblue, Commander Zap, Nightlight9,dc_guy, Coolwater, Whoisthis19, Dan Scorpio, finalD, Bishop, Laife, Lovedrop, Casey, Breakbeat, Jestor, HyperFocus(aka Identity_X), Trystan, Tunnces, vampire2727, Shark (Ranko Magami), Scoob, Papa, Roadking. All of them areavailable for download. And, you don’t have to worry, we’ve been around for a long time and the site is not goinganywhere, so you can download them at any time.

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The Jaw-Dropping Juggler Archive v2.0 from Fast Seduction 101®Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com

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BackgroundWho is Wayne Elise aka "Juggler"?

Or, more specifically, what are these post archives about and what do they have to do with his involvement with the"Seduction Community"?

Wayne Elise, aka Juggler, was one of the main characters in the best-selling book The Game: Penetrating the SecretSociety of Pickup Artists, released in 2005. He also wrote a chapter in that book, but was a member of the seductioncommunity long before that, going back as far as 2001 when he was first written about in the New York Times. Jugglerturned his interpersonal skills that he developed as a professional comedian and street busker into teaching men to bemore successful with women, and he was one of the first people aside from Mystery to teach in-field workshopsthrough his company Charisma Arts (previously known as Charisma Sciences or Charisma Sciences Institute).What a lot of people dont know is theres a huge amount of wisdom from Juggler chronicled in his posts on the mASF Forum on FastSeduction.com . In fact, the mASF Forum was literally the only place Juggler was posting for the first2 years when he was making a name for himself and was a large part of the reason he became well known in theseduction community. Juggler was also one of the only major seduction gurus to speak for free at the 2004 AustinSeduction Summit, which was a free community event organized by the Austin Lair and FastSeduction.com , one ofmany official free Summits promoted through FastSeduction.com .Juggler has also appeared as host of a channel four UK program called Seduction School and has traveled the worldteaching men the art of seduction.To find other archives of posts from people such as Style, Mystery, and TylerDurden, all major personalities from The Game, all of whom gained their initial broad notoriety from the community on FastSeduction.com , check our other archives . You can also find new and influential members of the community using our searchable post archivecontaining well over half a million posts, or join our very active forum.

Articles in this archive are generated through automated means on a regular basis. Due to the automated nature ofhow this PDF is generated, on occasion there may be articles found within this archive which may not actually beattributed to the author intended to be represented, although best efforts have been made to ensure the automatedgeneration process is as accurate as possible. In either case, proper attribution is given. Please make note of thespecific citing above each article for verification. Questions about this archive should be directed to theFastSeduction.com webmaster at [email protected]. To find more articles like this, visit the The Archiveat Fast Seduction 101 web site at FastSeduction.com. Don’t forget to bookmark the site when you visit! The site isfully free to access an contains the largest knowledgebase and features on the subject of meeting women, pickup and seduction.

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San Fran workshop cancelled / Post 241

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Subject: San Fran workshop cancelled // view thread onlinePost Date: March 6th, 2002 07:00:00 AM (EST)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.generalArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

Unfortunately, because of schedule conflicts I have had to cancel the SanFrancisco workshop. There simply was not going to be the time available whichit deserves.

Hopefully we can reschedule a workshop soon.

But I am still getting together later that evening with a few familiar facesfrom this group for some SF sarging. Not sure where we are going to be, but ifyou are in SF that night you may see us out. I’ll be the guy with theeye-patch.

-Juggler

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San Fran workshop cancelled / Post 241Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com


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Entertaining a group / Post 242




Subject: Entertaining a group // view thread onlinePost Date: March 8th, 2002 07:00:00 AM (EST)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.generalArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

Check out the group before approaching.See how tight the girl is with the guys. You do not have to always open withthe guys. If she doesn’t seem tight with the guys then open with her or thegroup in general.

Myself, I do not spend much time befriending guys in groups. A big waste oftime really. Just a friendly word or two is all you need.

Further, the gender make up of the group is not really that important. It ismore the number of people which is important. A three-person group is great.You chat with your target and the two others, in this case guys, can chat witheach other. On the other hand a two set is the most challenging to work forguys like me who sarge primarily alone. In that case I sarge both girlssimultaneously. There is a whole separate science to that but I’ll leave thatto another post.

Back to your group question. Don’t worry about entertaining. All you need is anopener. Once you are in with your group then concentrate on being interesting,not entertaining. Do not be tempted to rely on props or gimmicks. These willhelp you short term but harm your abilities long term. Learn to rely 100% onyourself.

Work on your tone and express a range of emotions. Show the group where you arecoming from with your feelings and values. People will listen to that and theywill all like you for it. Do not get people excited about the things you aretalking about. Instead get them excited about you.

Hold the group for a brief minute and then when you have them at a high pointlet everyone know you want to talk with the girl one on one.

-Juggler


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Entertaining a group / Post 242Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com





















keeping it going(i know i’m gonna get flamed) / Post 243




Subject: keeping it going(i know i’m gonna get flamed) // view thread onlinePost Date: March 8th, 2002 07:08:00 AM (EST)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.generalArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

First off, get your success rate lower. You should really keep it at 10-25%. Ifyou are at 50% then you are not challenging yourself enough. Try harder pick-upsituations. You goal in pick-up should not be to get with girls. Your goalshould be to increase your abilities.

As far as keeping girls around, work on being more sensual and yes put yourselfout there emotionaly. Let them know you are willing to have a longer termrelationship if she shows how good she can be to you.

-Juggler


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keeping it going(i know i’m gonna get flamed) / Post 243Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com















Psyching myself out...How do I stop? / Post 244




Subject: Psyching myself out...How do I stop? // view thread onlinePost Date: March 8th, 2002 07:29:00 AM (EST)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.generalArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

Why is being with you the best possible choice any woman can make?

Why are you the prize?

Give me some justifications for these attitudes. The fact is that many of thepeople on these boards adopt these beliefs but they are NOT the best possiblechoice and are not the prize and deep down they know it.

So argue it out with me. Back these statements up. I can promise you that ifyou can convince me that you are really the prize then you will never have anydoubts in your head again.

-Juggler


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Psyching myself out...How do I stop? / Post 244Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com














Great kino, but still went home empty handed? / Post 245




Subject: Great kino, but still went home empty handed? // view thread onlinePost Date: March 9th, 2002 10:52:00 PM (EST)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.generalArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

br>

It is good that you made a point of applying kino. But your mistake was notescalating kino.

She wanted to get sexual with you on some level. But she, like most girls arefrustrated when they can’t get a guy to lead. After she saw that you were notgoing to lead her where she wanted to go she was ready to call it a night.

When you go out again kino in more adventurous areas, kiss the girl and takethings as far as you can go. Don’t wait for the opportunity of ’tingly legs.’Kino the areas you want and make out for god’s sake. Good luck.

-Juggler


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Great kino, but still went home empty handed? / Post 245Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com






















Intriguing Transition to Palm-Read / Post 246




Subject: Intriguing Transition to Palm-Read // view thread onlinePost Date: March 9th, 2002 11:03:00 PM (EST)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.tactics-techniquesArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

Palm reading is a gimmick. Only use gimmicks if you are a beginner who needs toget experience approaching. Otherwise know that the goal is to learn to rely100% on yourself and your personality.

-Juggler


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Intriguing Transition to Palm-Read / Post 246Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com



















Humanely getting rid of UG CB? / Post 247




Subject: Humanely getting rid of UG CB? // view thread onlinePost Date: March 10th, 2002 01:27:00 PM (EST)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.generalArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

>Being able to>say No to a woman is an essential part>of the PUA personality.

Great point Next Level.

Going a little further.

The place where a PUA wants to be is having the attitude where you are alwayson. There is no need for a 3 second rule. You are constantly communicating withyour pick-up environment.

To get to that level of outgoingness also demands having the ability to talkwith anyone. That means doormen, other guys, even UGs. Heck, I chat withpanhandlers outside of clubs. But the moment the interaction is no longerhelpful you need to have the ability to cut them off and walk away.

As has already been sugested, if you are not intererested in a girl just say,"I’m not interested." or "I’m not interested in you in that way but I wouldlike you to introduce me to your blonde girlfriend over there." Be straight upabout where you are coming from and you would be surprised at how well it willwork for you. Keep in mind Next Level’s response to this girl wanting anothercar ride: "No." That’s great. He didn’t have to dress it up or anything.Beautiful.

Also do not be tempted to avoid conversation with UGs. Because then you will bepulling into your shell a little. Never be afraid to talk with anyone. Developthe ability to lead. You lead them in and you lead them out.

-Juggler


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Humanely getting rid of UG CB? / Post 247Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com




























>If this is true for you, how do you>approach and entertain groups? Because>that’s my purpose for learning some>"gimmicks" just to disarm the group.

Do a search for ’juggler group’.


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Re: Mystery’s PUA web page / Post 249




Subject: Re: Mystery’s PUA web page // view thread onlinePost Date: March 10th, 2002 08:19:00 PM (EST)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.generalArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

On 3/10/02 4:53:02 PM, HoVa wrote:(snip)>anytime juggler is coming to>LA?>

I plan to get out there soon.

-Juggler


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Re: Mystery’s PUA web page / Post 249Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com





















I can tell you’ve read the FAQ and all that stuff and are into NLP but what youdon’t get is that times have changed. The state of the pick-up arts haveevolved since all the materials you have boned up on have been written.

Palm reading, tarrot cards, magic tricks, cameras are all things whichencourage you to rely on something outside of yourself. Do not go down thatroad. You will waste alot of time and energy.

Sure, there is no harm in throwing in a little palm reading in your pick-up, ifyou enjoy it, but it should not be a means to seduce. >No that’s not correct. The main reason>(but not the only one) is to see if she>is suggestible. If she fights you tooth>and nail on it, she is probably not>going to be a good NLP subject.

As far as NLP, there are some techniques which are helpful. But there are manytechniques which are make believe. They will make you feel better aboutyourself but their uses in pick-up are imaginary. If a girl is hot andinteresting you do not want to exclude her because she is not a good ’NLP’subject. What a waste.>helps accessing a women on a>deeper. Admittedly, there are other>ways as well.

Like just directly talking about deeper stuff, for one.>It is also a way to>challenge her. "Palm reading was>originally developed by the greek>philosopher>Aristotle to see if a person is as>beautiful on the inside as on the>outside.">Or "So you can find out things about>yourself that even your best friends>don’t know"

That is all beginner stuff. Once you get enough experience you will get tiredof it always being about her and you will begin to seek to have PU aboutgetting girls obsessed with you and your values and deeper feelings.>It also allows you to be somewhat of an>authority where she will accept

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>everything you say from then on as truth>or with more magnitude...She will think>of you in higher terms from then on,>What you say will have more power>because she is filtering your words>through the way you established yourself>from a solid cold reading

Gimmick! Instead become a person who embodies authority through your tone andpersonality.

Only use gimmicks if you are a new to pick-up. They will help you get in withgirls for sure. But after you get some experience get away from it and begin touse yourself. Your goal is to get girls to become quickly obsessed with you andnot to have them obssessed with knowing more about themselves.

-Juggler


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Stop and Describe. / Post 251




Subject: Stop and Describe. // view thread onlinePost Date: March 10th, 2002 09:52:00 PM (EST)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.generalArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

Great post Alessandro.This is very close to the Juggler Method.>I have been avoiding to post>this for a while, for I have>no explanation for it.

Glad you did. part of why you may have been apprehensive about posting is thatit is 180 degrees from what many of the guys on these boards advocate. You areon your way to the advanced stages my friend where few tread.>Here is a routine I think>works best:>1) approach the chick.>2) have a creative "excuse">handy.

Another great way to approach within your framework is to have an emotion.People are interested in emotion. Sometimes, if something bad happened to methat day then I will approach a girl with a sad face. She has to know why I amso sad. I tell her and let her cheer me up. Or if I am happy about something,whatever. You can be sooo yourself. See most guys tighten up and want to hidetheir true feelings. That is a mistake. You want to do the opposite, loosen upand express.>3) Share your philosphy about>something, with her (describe>something>passionately.)

Very good. A few of the things I talk about is my love for my neices, goodpizza and passionate love making.>4) make her imagine that>thing.

Excellent. Here you can lead her imagination into your world.>5) throw out a romantic/sexual>statement, as an anology to>the former>"point" you have stated.

Because she is very interested in you at this point you can show her how shecan fit into your life. This is also a way to lead her.>6) with the sexual statement>still in her mind, go fully

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Stop and Describe. / Post 251Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com














>and describe>a part of your "point" in>great detail.>7) watch her shine!

A girl can become very enthralled and want to be the best she can for you withthis method.>So, don’t be afraid to lay>your beliefs and principles on>thick.

Yes! Yes! Yes! >I once believed in waiting>until you can elicit her>values, or atleast>find out about the order of>her rep-systems.>But NLP is too slow in real>life, and most chicks will>dismis you by>the next sentence if you don’t>bring something meaningful to>the table

You are showing your worth here by talking about your values. Much more directand confident than EV and feeding back.>I am not sure if this is a>valid concolussion or not, I>am still>learning.

It is!>All I know is: 1) Women are>turned on by your passion for>your>principles/values/beliefs/phil>osophy, to the extent that>they will>accept them as valid, and you>will NOT need to tailor your>lifestyle>to her tastes (as suggested by>EVing.)

Yes, talk about YOUR values passionately and she will want to adjust herself toyou.

Great post Alessandro. I hope you can be a part of one of my workshops one daybecause you are on target.

-Juggler

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Subject: Intriguing Transition to Palm-Read // view thread onlinePost Date: March 11th, 2002 08:58:00 AM (EST)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.tactics-techniquesArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

>>-Juggler>If this is true for you, how do you>approach and entertain groups? Because>that’s my purpose for learning some>"gimmicks" just to disarm the group.

It is great that you want to master the group approach. But seeking to beentertaining is not the path you want to go down. Yes, you will get positiveresults from being entertaining but these results have diminishing returns.

Instead work at being personally interesting. This is harder but in the end youwill blow away the gimmick guys. And there is no cap, or diminishing returns onbeing personally interesting.

-Juggler


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The answer to sarging with too many GUYS / Post 253




Subject: The answer to sarging with too many GUYS // view thread onlinePost Date: March 11th, 2002 08:55:00 PM (EST)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.tactics-techniquesArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

This could be great fun CP. We will have to try this Saturday night.

-Juggler


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The answer to sarging with too many GUYS / Post 253Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com














quick poll / Post 254




Subject: quick poll // view thread onlinePost Date: March 11th, 2002 10:02:00 PM (EST)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.generalArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

I usually sarge alone but being shadowed by an ugly, seven foot bodyguard.

-Juggler


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quick poll / Post 254Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com















Anyone use a motorcycle? / Post 255




Subject: Anyone use a motorcycle? // view thread onlinePost Date: March 12th, 2002 09:41:00 AM (EST)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.generalArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

A motorcycle would be fun as hell to take girls on. But I don’t like usingprops to help pick-up. All my props are for hindering pick-up. In that vein, Itell girls I am a trash collector who drives an 86 Impala.

-Juggler


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Anyone use a motorcycle? / Post 255Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com














I’m a player / Post 256




Subject: I’m a player // view thread onlinePost Date: March 12th, 2002 09:52:00 AM (EST)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.generalArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

I tell girls that I am a great Pick Up artist who almost did a workshop in SanFrancisco this week. But plans to do a bunch in SF and elsewhere soon. I tellthem I am good at very few things in life, but picking up girls is one of them.

I tell them how one of my girlfriend’s is only 18 and how I have a couple ofoutstanding marriage proposals on the table. I expect to be married within theyear to whichever girl manages to put a ring on my finger (It’s got to be nice,with a diamond)

So basically, wacky as my life sounds, I tell her the truth.

Then I let her know that if she wins my heart she could be the one I settledown with.

-Juggler


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I’m a player / Post 256Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com

















Unemotional Congruency / Post 257




Subject: Unemotional Congruency // view thread onlinePost Date: March 18th, 2002 10:17:00 AM (EST)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.tactics-techniquesArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

Sure, being unemotional will let a girl know that you are not an AFC guy allslobbering over her, but it will not allow you to demonstrate much value.

Instead show a range of emotion towards your material. That includes happy,sad, sexy etc..

Focus on what you are talking about, not her. If you do this convincinglyenough, I promise you that once she hears your first few sentences no girl willever be able to blow you out.

-Juggler


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Unemotional Congruency / Post 257Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com















DC Workshop April 4th / Post 258




Subject: DC Workshop April 4th // view thread onlinePost Date: March 19th, 2002 10:20:00 AM (EST)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.generalArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

Hey Guys,

I will be conducting a one day workshop in the DC area on Thursday, April 4th.

Room for at most four people.

Same subject matter as the cancelled San Fran workshop but without thecancelled part.

We will meet for dinner and chat about individual sticking points and solutionsand then out to the lounge/clubs.

Also there may be a NY workshop April 8/9.

To reserve a spot email me at jug***r@ti***.com [ safemail ]

-Juggler


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DC Workshop April 4th / Post 258Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com

















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The workshop is for people who would like to improve their game. It is abouthelping fellow seducers. If you do not feel like you can improve Allesandro oram not interested in the Juggler method, then I understand. Do not attend.

But for anyone else I will be giving personal advice. I want to wing closelywith people so I can help diagnose sticking points and improve their game. Inorder to provide this personal attention we have to limit the number of peopletaking part. >Besides, april 4th is a>thursday. Good luck sarging in>DC>on thursday (there are chicks>ofcourse, but unless you are>a local resident, it would be>hard to find many of them.

I agree that Friday or Saturday would be a better night, but unfortunately I amonly in town for this one night. But we will find sarging ground. Even if ithas to be coffee shops or street pick-ups.

So I repeat, anyone who wants to take part let me know and you will improve. Ifyou are a beginner I will carry you through approaches and instill the properattitude. For those with more experience I will help you refine your game.

Some of the topics we will cover:

1. How to be interesting vs. entertaining

2. Non-verbals

3. Demonstrating value through a range of emotions

4. Getting a girl to EV you.

5. Forcing IOIs

6. Opening science

7. Closing science

See you in DC.

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-Juggler


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Thanks for the tip five683.Very helpful. We will be hitting ladies night.

-Juggler

On 3/20/02 9:19:00 AM, five683 wrote:>Thursdays = Ladies Night>And DC’s no>exception..............>>And just keep in mind while>you’re here Juggler that>Georgetown’s not the only game>in town...>>LOT’S ’O PLACES in the heart>of the city.....>>Maybe this link will help:>>http://www.digitalcity.com/was>hington/bars/search.adp?vtid=3>&stid=126&type=venue


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Should we REALLY count kiss closes? / Post 261




Subject: Should we REALLY count kiss closes? // view thread onlinePost Date: March 20th, 2002 07:45:00 AM (EST)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.generalArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

Yeah, some kisses are not worth the lip stick they’re written on. Kiss closescan be like grinding on the dance floor. Girls do not take it seriously.

Unless you already have a significant level of commitment to you then don’t usetricky stuff to get the kiss.

Instead set the kiss up with more significance.

Change, "Do you want to kiss me?" to "We will have so much fun when we gettogether Sunday. Don’t you think? Until then I’ll give you a kiss to rememberme by." or whatever... just set the kiss up to mean more. And yeah, you shouldhave gotten contact info already.

-Juggler


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Should we REALLY count kiss closes? / Post 261Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com






















pick apart my email / Post 262




Subject: pick apart my email // view thread onlinePost Date: March 20th, 2002 08:05:00 AM (EST)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.tactics-techniquesArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

Talk to girls in person or use the telephone.

If you really must email, keep it short. Two or three lines max.

Writing all that you have shows her you are way to interested.

Good luck,Juggler


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pick apart my email / Post 262Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com















Confusing Situation, Semi-Long / Post 263




Subject: Confusing Situation, Semi-Long // view thread onlinePost Date: March 20th, 2002 08:36:00 PM (EST)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.generalArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

>Should I say forget the>club and get ahold of HB9 and>go to coffee with her?

Yes.

You can do the club by yourself another time.

-Juggler


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Confusing Situation, Semi-Long / Post 263Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com

















Keeping her turned on...all night. / Post 264




Subject: Keeping her turned on...all night. // view thread onlinePost Date: March 20th, 2002 08:44:00 PM (EST)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.tactics-techniquesArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

>I wanted her to dream about me.

I don’t know about the rest of your post. But this is an idea that you shouldaspire to achieve with all your women from this day forth. As she falls asleepwhisper a beautiful picture of the two of you into her ear.

-Juggler


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Keeping her turned on...all night. / Post 264Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com














Avoiding Pressure From Others / Post 265




Subject: Avoiding Pressure From Others // view thread onlinePost Date: March 23rd, 2002 10:38:00 PM (EST)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.generalArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

Sarge alone or use the PAIR service on this site to hook up with an experiencedwing.

-Juggler


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Avoiding Pressure From Others / Post 265Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com


















Advice needed.... / Post 266




Subject: Advice needed.... // view thread onlinePost Date: March 23rd, 2002 10:42:00 PM (EST)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.generalArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

Don’t fight those feelings man. Fall in love. Just make sure it is with allfour of your girlfriends.

-Juggler


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Advice needed.... / Post 266Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com














The ’Tom Selleck’ Opener / Post 267




Subject: The ’Tom Selleck’ Opener // view thread onlinePost Date: March 23rd, 2002 11:08:00 PM (EST)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.tactics-techniquesArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

For a good routine, you need a beginning, middle and end. Your beginning is notbad, but your middle seems muddled and you have no end or conclusion. Alwaystry to make some sort of point with your routines. Hopefully one which puts herin a mood.

I’ve re-written it off the top of my head for you. Not perfect but you can getthe gist:

"Some people have started to spread a rumor that Tom Selleck, the actor, doesnot like women. It is amazing to me that anyone would think that. Here is a guywho has seduced many beautiful women. (Self point, if you are into that kind ofthing) He was Magnum PI for god’s sake. Tall dark and charming. And really, Ihave always thought, even though it’s a tv character, our lives were similarbecause I enjoy making girls feel good and having adventures. But for the sakeof discussion, let’s pretend that he decided to become gay. So here is aquestion, if you were in the mind to do it, what kind of adventure would youtake him on to seduce him back to enjoying women?"

As a follow up, be prepared to talk about how you would seduce a lesbian intobeing with you.

-Juggler


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The ’Tom Selleck’ Opener / Post 267Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com

















This guy messing up my PU’s / Post 268




Subject: This guy messing up my PU’s // view thread onlinePost Date: March 24th, 2002 08:11:00 AM (EST)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.generalArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

Be Alpha here.

You may not realize this right now but the alpha thing to do in most situationslike this is not to fight. It is to talk in a strong and commanding voice.Believe it or not, that is more powerful than fists.

Make your intentions clear, "We are not going to fight about this. I presumeyou like women so instead we are going to find a way to make the ladies veryhappy. My name is Goldenj_9. (hold out hand with absolutely no fear)"

Avoid fighting. Losing teeth could wreak havoc with your game.

At all times lead people through your strength of voice and character.

-Juggler


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This guy messing up my PU’s / Post 268Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com


















The ’Tom Selleck’ Opener / Post 269




Subject: The ’Tom Selleck’ Opener // view thread onlinePost Date: March 25th, 2002 08:55:00 AM (EST)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.tactics-techniquesArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

>By the way, am I right if I>say that, when you started,>you didnt know the SS/NLP>basic concepts />emotional-talking and figured>them out empirically by>experience?>And how??????

Yes, that is basically true. I still don’t think of myself as an NLP guy. Alotof my experience has come from testing material in front of an audience. Butmany of the conclusions I reached happen to be very similar to SS.

-Juggler


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The ’Tom Selleck’ Opener / Post 269Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com




















suicide callback / Post 270




Subject: suicide callback // view thread onlinePost Date: March 25th, 2002 12:45:00 PM (EST)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.generalArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

Great input from Lovedrop on what you should have done.

For what you can do now. Call her up asap and tell her that your sister’sfriend is in town and your sister wants you to take her out. So you can’t gettogether with the HB. If you can, talk about exciting stuff you can do withyour sister’s friend and ellicit the HB opinion on fun places to go. Then tryto set another meet up with the HB for another day. And make sure it is a firmcommitment.

Let us know what happens,Juggler


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suicide callback / Post 270Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com

















Forix is in BIG trouble!!!! :-( / Post 272




Subject: Forix is in BIG trouble!!!! :-( // view thread onlinePost Date: March 26th, 2002 06:50:00 AM (EST)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.generalArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

Hey Forix,

If you still love this girl then continue to work on her. But as you areprobably aware of, living in the same house is not helping you get over your’oneitis’.

Having said that, I think that you have a good plan: Working on her while stilltrying to get with other women.

But try not to EV too much. This could put you into a mind frame where you areoverly concerned with what she thinks and further sink you into oneitis.

Also, you may want to try talking more about sex. The path to this girls heartlies through her horniness. Try setting the feelings aside and play on the sexangle.

Good luck and please let me know what happens. Your situation reminds me verymuch of the situation between one of my girlfriends and her husband. They aretrying to work things out now. Bad for me, but good for them if they canre-establish a passionate love.

-Juggler


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Forix is in BIG trouble!!!! :-( / Post 272Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com



















weird situation: did i do the right thing / Post 273




Subject: weird situation: did i do the right thing // view thread onlinePost Date: March 26th, 2002 07:14:00 AM (EST)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.generalArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

Let me get this right. You were in her dorm room and you got no action?!

Forget going outside, couldn’t you have kicked people out of the room or founda place to get her alone?

Maybe I’m missing something here or it’s been too long since I’ve been in adorm. Have they changed that much? In most dorms I have known, everybody sleptwith everybody else and closing the door for sex was no problem.

Beyond that, get her over to your place asap. This one is not like wine - yourposition will not improve with time.

-Juggler


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weird situation: did i do the right thing / Post 273Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com















OT: Do I overcompensade non-supplication ? / Post 274




Subject: OT: Do I overcompensade non-supplication ? // view thread onlinePost Date: March 26th, 2002 07:36:00 AM (EST)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.generalArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

>But I am wondering, what is>going up in her head ?>Her reaction was in no way>adequate to the situation.

Dude, if I shared a night of fun getting to know someone closer as a friend andthen they unexpectedly refused to help me with a minor task which wouldprobably just be my excuse to spend more enjoyable time with this person, Iwould probably cry too.

So yeah, you are taking non-supplication too far. Get rid of the idea that you can never help a HB. Instead, always be ready todeal.

When she asked for your help you should have said with good humor, "Sure, Iwould love to help, if you don’t mind me having a glass of that wine you havein your cupboard."

Always show people that you are willing to trade and sell yourself, even insmall ways. You would be amazed at how often, once chicks know this about you,that you will get offered sex for moving furniture, picking up groceries, etc.

-Juggler


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OT: Do I overcompensade non-supplication ? / Post 274Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com


















HB Silicone update - she flashes me! / Post 275




Subject: HB Silicone update - she flashes me! // view thread onlinePost Date: March 26th, 2002 09:29:00 AM (EST)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.generalArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

You probably aren’t looking for any criticism here Maddash, but I am going tomake your post an example of a lost opportunity that many guys let slip fromtheir grasp by being too jokey.

Humor is a good thing, but unless you are using a GM style approach, jokearound about everything else with girls but sex. People joke about sex becausethey are not comfortable discussing it seriously. Speak of it candidly and youwill make many women crazy with lust and you will impart them with theknowledge that you WILL seriously lead them to sex if they wish.

You had an opportunity here.>Then she comes out and yells "Look!" and pulls her shirt>down nearly to her nipples. Sweet.>

There! You could have said with a straight face, "I like breasts like yours.Sometime I can show you a way of touching them called the four squares that Ilearned from an Indian woman which, I am told, feels unbelievable. Hey have youseen my running shoes?"

But instead you...>laugh and say "Hey>now, that’s cruel.". Silicone replies "so what, you lived>with sisters.", "yeah, but you’re not my sister. And I have a LOT oftestosterone."

Too witty/jokey with a touch of needy thrown in. But can’t really blame you.You were probably pretty surprised. Just be ready next time.

-Juggler


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HB Silicone update - she flashes me! / Post 275Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com






















What the hell? Shit test of some sort... I think. / Post 276




Subject: What the hell? Shit test of some sort... I think. // view thread onlinePost Date: March 26th, 2002 09:54:00 AM (EST)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.generalArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

Your reach is greater than your grasp

1. Avoid sending long emails.

2. Use patterns which are appropriate for the level of rapport which you have.Pattern to push her over barriers which she has reached. You are sending herstuff about places the two of you are not anywhere near yet.

3. Back off a little and talk about the excitement of getting to know someonenew. Then move her step by step towards wherever you want this to go. Once youhave more experience you will realize being good at seduction is not aboutskipping steps but is about going through each step faster and more intensely.

4. Use your own words from now on. Figure out how you really feel about thingsand then take some time to get good at expressing your values and manly wantswith eloquence.

Good luck,Juggler


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What the hell? Shit test of some sort... I think. / Post 276Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com



















OK..OK...I Get it... / Post 277




Subject: OK..OK...I Get it... // view thread onlinePost Date: March 26th, 2002 09:34:00 PM (EST)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.generalArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

On 3/27/02 8:40:00 AM, five683 wrote:>So noooooooooooo one’s going>to explain to me the>four squares technique....

It’s not like I’m not going to see you in a weekfive683. I’ll explain it then. :-)

-Juggler


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OK..OK...I Get it... / Post 277Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com














DC Workshop Opening / Post 278




Subject: DC Workshop Opening // view thread onlinePost Date: March 26th, 2002 09:42:00 PM (EST)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.generalArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

Someone had to cancel out of the DC workshop, so a spot has opened up. If youwant to take part and can be in GeorgeTown Thursday night, April 4th, let meknow.

-Juggler

jug***r@ti***.com [ safemail ]


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DC Workshop Opening / Post 278Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com


















DC Workshop Opening / Post 279




Subject: DC Workshop Opening // view thread onlinePost Date: March 27th, 2002 08:10:00 PM (EST)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.generalArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

On 3/27/02 8:04:00 PM, Alessandro wrote:>I don’t know man. I wanna meet>you in person, but I guess>the "workshop" environment>will screw things up a little.

I’ll answer your email and hopefully we’ll work something out. >It sucks that you travel all>the way to DC, then spend your>night in an "academic">workshop.

I enjoy helping other guys improve their game. Humans should all be having alotmore sex. Besides, it is an infield workshop - everybody taking part will havea blast, me included.

-Juggler


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DC Workshop Opening / Post 279Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com




















Being Led Instead of Leading / Post 280




Subject: Being Led Instead of Leading // view thread onlinePost Date: March 28th, 2002 02:38:00 PM (EST)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.generalArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

Be in your own mood. Refuse to join anyone in their sorrow.

Handle people in bad moods antiseptically. That is, you can talk about theirmood without joining in one with them.

Try to find out specifically why your particular girl is in a bad mood.

You: "So what is going on in your life right now to make you so down?"

Her: "I got fired from my job, my boyfriend (or girlfriend) left me and the catis sick."

Once you know the details you can CHOOSE to show sympathy:

You: "Well that certainly is alot to deal with. I hope things work out."

Or if the details do not justify her mood:

Her: "I took a long time to find my car keys this morning and now my drink iswarm."

Here you can CHOOSE to skip any show of sympathy or even bust on her for anunjustifiable mood.

Either way, do not get in a long discussion about what is going wrong in herlife. Go right into positive stuff.

If that doesn’t work then this person may just be one of those people who arenever happy. You may want to consider skipping her.

-Juggler


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Being Led Instead of Leading / Post 280Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com















ASF / NLP Book List / Post 281




Subject: ASF / NLP Book List // view thread onlinePost Date: March 28th, 2002 02:55:00 PM (EST)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.generalArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

Hey Sandstorm,

I’m writing a book. I’ll let you know when it’s ready.

-Juggler


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ASF / NLP Book List / Post 281Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com














Re: ASF / NLP Book List / Post 282




Subject: Re: ASF / NLP Book List // view thread onlinePost Date: March 28th, 2002 09:54:00 PM (EST)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.generalArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

>No kidding? When will it be out?>>... Chris>

A couple months.

-Juggler


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Re: ASF / NLP Book List / Post 282Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com














Escalate into sex talk / Post 284




Subject: Escalate into sex talk // view thread onlinePost Date: March 29th, 2002 01:42:00 PM (EST)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.generalArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

On 3/29/02 11:05:00 AM, DanB wrote:>What’s the best way of making>transition after fluffing,>EVing and got the trance word>into sex talk?

Easy.

Don’t fluff.

Do not EV. Instead lead values by taking a chance and sharing yours. Some ofyour values should be great sex.

Forget her trance words. Let her pick up YOUR trance words.

You are the man. You are suppossed to lead.

Good luck,Juggler


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Escalate into sex talk / Post 284Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com























her core value is committment. what now? / Post 285




Subject: her core value is committment. what now? // view thread onlinePost Date: March 30th, 2002 01:21:00 PM (EST)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.tactics-techniquesArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

On 3/29/02 7:37:00 PM, labrat60 wrote:>Seriously tho, do you think my core>values have something to do with this?>Been reading your past posts and it’s>good stuff so I’d like your opinion.

Since you have read my stuff you probably know that I am not a big fan of EV.

Instead I encourage leading values. That is, you take risk and share YOURvalues FIRST. She sees how open you are and reciprocates.

Discuss a range of values. That is something that you can only do if you areleading. If you try to cover many values by EVing then it will come across as’twenty questions’. EV only ’works’ if you follow one line of questioning.

When you discuss broad range of values by leading, point out how different youare on somethings then point out how similar you are on others. Let her latchon to those and run with it.

-Juggler


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her core value is committment. what now? / Post 285Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com

















workshops? Juggler? / Post 286




Subject: workshops? Juggler? // view thread onlinePost Date: March 30th, 2002 01:25:00 PM (EST)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.generalArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

On 3/29/02 10:08:00 PM, Man-Steak wrote:>Hey, does anyone know of any>workshops around central>Canada? I think Juggler’s>having one in Montreal and I’d>like to be part of it.

Hi Man-Steak,

Tentatively it will be during Jazz fest in July.

I hope to get a website up soon on the whole Juggler method and it will have aworkshop schedule. Also, if you are in Ontario you may want to consider drivingacross the border for the Detroit workshop which will be soon.

-Juggler


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workshops? Juggler? / Post 286Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com






















Tips from a Natural GM / Post 287




Subject: Tips from a Natural GM // view thread onlinePost Date: April 1st, 2002 11:58:00 AM (EST)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.generalArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

CP!

You found your edge! Although, you may have to pick up very small women.

But in all seriousness, even though you are naturally a good guy I couldactually see you getting away with this attitude.

I’ll just loan you my goon in case anyone wants to kick your ass.

BTW: You were right CP, a certain someone called me out of the blue thisweekend.

Oh and also I’ve been thinking. When we sarge the old-folks home, does pinchingtheir oxygen tubes count as a neg?

-Juggler


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Tips from a Natural GM / Post 287Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com
















girls talking about getting kids / Post 288




Subject: girls talking about getting kids // view thread onlinePost Date: April 1st, 2002 12:01:00 PM (EST)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.generalArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

Funny, but what our kids would look like is one of the things I like to bringup with girls. I find the subject fascinating.

-Juggler


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girls talking about getting kids / Post 288Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com














What I learned at Juggler’s DC workshop slightly O / Post 289




Subject: What I learned at Juggler’s DC workshop slightly O // view thread onlinePost Date: April 8th, 2002 06:28:00 PM (EDT)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.generalArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

Hey guys,

After traveling for a week it’s nice to get back and read up on what happenedto everybody after the workshop on Thursday.

For details see Alessandro’s post in field reports: ’How NOT to cross the "keybridge’. Pretty funny stuff.

Well here are the things I learned at my workshop:

1. Next workshop has to be three days. There just is not enough time in onenight to begin to analyze everyone’s game.

2. I’m going to have more generic opener stuff prepared for the guys who needit. So much of my own stuff is personal and not applicable to the other guys.So next time we will be more prepared on this account.

3. Alessandro is a really good PUA. I like his style. But he is a terribleparallel parker.:) Sorry about you getting towed man. That sucks.

4. I really like DC. Even though the secret service yelled at me for sargingthe Whitehouse gate. Georgetown is also great. We got to get back there realsoon.

5. The "How’s the water (beer)? My friend drank it and is sick" opener needssome work. ha ha

Thanks for everybody who attended the DC workshop.

Next workshops will be Detroit (in late April or May) and Montreal (June 27-29)Also, there will probably be a San Francisco workshop squeezed in theresomewhere.

I’m hoping to get a website up on this stuff within the next two weeks. I’llkeep the guys who are interested here posted.

Oh, and Alessandro, I may be the laughing stock of seduction but I did notnotice you mirroring me at all. No wonder I was so comfortable with you. I feelso used. :)

-Juggler

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What I learned at Juggler’s DC workshop slightly O / Post 289Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com





























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What I learned at Juggler’s DC workshop slightly O / Post 289Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com





Juggler! / Post 290




Subject: Juggler! // view thread onlinePost Date: April 8th, 2002 06:32:00 PM (EDT)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.generalArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

Hey Man-Steak,

Don’t have a date for the Detroit workshop yet, but it will be within the nextmonth. Montreal will be June 27-29.

Feel free to contact me with any questions: jug***r@ti***.com [ safemail ]

-Juggler

On 4/7/02 2:35:00 PM, Man-Steak wrote:>Hey, sorry for this "standing>on a table and shouting>outyour name" kind of thing,>but you don’t post your email>online. It’d be great if you>could send me an email, I want>to hit your Montreal workshop>and I’d like to see if I can>make the Buffalo (Detroit? I>forget) one, but I need info>really soon. Thanks.


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Juggler! / Post 290Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com























Re: How NOT to cross the / Post 291




Subject: Re: How NOT to cross the // view thread onlinePost Date: April 8th, 2002 06:37:00 PM (EDT)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.fieldreportsArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

I don’t know where it originated. But I got it from CP and/or one of the otherguys in San Fran - not sure which. But now it’s spread to both coasts.

-Juggler

On 4/7/02 3:15:48 PM, CPowles10 wrote:>On Sat, 06 Apr 2002 23:46:00 -0400,>Signore wrote:>>>Ricki Lake Opener:>>>>Have your wingman go up to the>target group and say "My friend needs>some>>advice...he got a call from the>producers of the ricki lake show and>they>>invited him on. The thing is he>thinks this girl is his secret admirer>and>>they are going to have her confess>his feelings for him!" Then the wingman>>chats with them for a little and>soon calls you over. Play along and>voila.>>>>Credit for this opener, to the best of>my knowledge, goes to Hollywood>(or Vinigar), who shared it with myself>and Mys in New York.


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Re: How NOT to cross the / Post 291Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com





















Eliciting values vs. ’I am the prize’ / Post 292




Subject: Eliciting values vs. ’I am the prize’ // view thread onlinePost Date: April 8th, 2002 10:21:00 PM (EDT)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.advancedArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

Yes BL, elliciting values can be very un-alpha. And it tends to put you in aposition of changing yourself to fit her values.

If a guy is really sneaky, he can make it seem as if he is not changing hisvalues to meet hers but I think, wether she knows about it or not, it is a formsupplification and will take a toll on a seducer.

We never need change ourselves for a girl. It is not neccesary and will hurtour game long term. Guys who are very good at EV and feeding it back to her areusually souless creatures. They don’t know where THEY stand on any issues.

Having said all of that, I do think it is a good thing to share values byLEADING them out of her by sharing yours first. That can be scary for us PUA atfirst. Many of us are so used to holding our cards close to our chest. But onceyou can succsesfully share a piece of yourself it will encourage her to do thesame. And if you do this well, you can even change her values. She will beEVing and ’patterning’ you.

-Juggler


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Eliciting values vs. ’I am the prize’ / Post 292Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com



















PUA’s Advice NEEDED! / Post 293




Subject: PUA’s Advice NEEDED! // view thread onlinePost Date: April 9th, 2002 10:27:00 AM (EDT)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.generalArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

Work on your group skills.

If you think a guy is going to be trouble, be-friend him BEFORE he saysanything to you. Then use him to help you.

Many times have I had a guy in a group help me get girls within his own group.

When I has in SF a few weeks back. I was chatting up a guy so that CP couldtalk to a girl at his table. Well we hit it off so well that when I saw him atanother bar later I got him to continuously ping away at these three difficultgirls for me. When he broke through momentarily, he signalled me and I moved inon the blonde. Never really got IN though. :(

Anyway, the point is that if you can find the ways to be-friend these guys youwill be amazed how useful they can be.

-Juggler


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PUA’s Advice NEEDED! / Post 293Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com





















Subject: Eliciting values vs. ’I am the prize’ // view thread onlinePost Date: April 10th, 2002 09:41:00 AM (EDT)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.advancedArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

No matter the method you use to discuss values the crucial difference here iswether you put your values first or hers.

Yes, humans adapt. But let her adapt to you. You are a force of nature. Not theother way around.

If everyone of us PUA took the time to sit at a table and write down what isreally important to us in life and in relationships and in sex, then thought upreally great ways of packaging these values so they SELL then we would all havesomething very powerful in our tool box.

Think about this:Where does she get her values?Probably a combination of her parents, society, religious indoctrination andfriends.

That is alot of people telling her what to think. But that is all it is, peopleforcing or coercing their values onto her. And chances are she has never metanyone like you. Someone who can eloquently and powerfully connect what shereally wants (physical pleasure) to a new value system (yours).

Heck, values are not really that deep a part of a person. In fact values are not that firmly attached. Even core values are just thedefault mechanism that people fall back on when they can’t decide how to getwhat they want.

Don’t spend alot of time talking about values even. You can think that you arein a good area but you can easily spin your wheels here. Move the conversationto more intimate levels (physicality and sex) as soon as possible.

Remember you must come off more powerful then the environment (not loud or bigbut passionate about your beliefs) . A force of nature. Something she wants tojump onto.

-Juggler


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Re: Eliciting values vs. ’I am the prize’ / Post 295




Subject: Re: Eliciting values vs. ’I am the prize’ // view thread onlinePost Date: April 10th, 2002 10:49:00 PM (EDT)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.advancedArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

Comments within:

On 4/10/02 5:58:54 PM, finalD wrote:>Some people seem to be having>a bit of a conundrum on the>issue of (a)>figuring out what she wants>and being that thing while (b)>trying to be>"the prize" in the first place>and therefore not changing.>I think there are several>misconceptions going on.>First, "eliciting>values" does NOT mean, "ask>her twenty questions and>memorize the answers.">Ya don’t just go, "So, where>are you from? Where do you>work? Do you like>your work? What is it about>work that makes you like it?">She’s put on the>spot, which makes her>uncomfortable; and her answers>aren’t, literally,>EXACTLY what she likes about>work, they’re what she THINKS>she likes, and>furthermore what she thinks>she SHOULD like. You have>thousands of layers>of acculturation and>politeness standing between>you and getting, and being>able to hear, a straight>answer.>>"Eliciting values" means,>having a deep perception of>human needs, and>being able to ferret them out

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Re: Eliciting values vs. ’I am the prize’ / Post 295Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com










>in a complicated, careful,>rather>introspective way, that allows>you to find out about people>without exactly>having to ASK them what they>want.

Beautifully put, but mistaken. Ferreting them out in a complicated, carefulintrospective way will lead you into murky teritory and burn alot of time. Ifyou are interested in what a girl’s values are then ask her in the most directway possible. "Are you looking for a relationship or to have fun with someone?"Bam! You are very different. Be direct. Be powerful! >You perform a little in>front of them,>and NOTICE what they respond>positively to. You then>fine-tune your>perceptions. Over a while, you>build a concept of those>things which you>can do well, that bring about>really positive responses from>the people in>front of you. As you do those>things well, you start to>impress them with>the notion that YOU are the>prize. You probably do other>things well, too,>but you don’t necessarily>demonstrate those things to>the people observing,>because you have noted they>don’t necessarily respond>particularly>emotionally to those things.>So, over the course of>fine-tuning your own>performance for the audience>and on the basis of the>audience’s responses,>you slowly but surely undergo>TWO processes, that>recapitulate each other ->- eliciting their values, and>becoming more and more of the>prize.

Not really. at the beggining of the sarge you are a force to be recond with.You do not undergo change. Your goal is to change your audience. >There’s no one way to pick.>You can’t EITHER "elicit>values" OR "be the>prize." The go hand in hand.

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>The SKILL of KNOWING, in the>first place, to>bother to elicit values (pay>attention in a deep way) is,>furthermore,>exactly the sort of thing>she’s looking for. If you’re>enough of a PUA that>you can ALWAYS pay attention>to a chick in a deep way, and>she’s a punk->rock Goth chick who only fucks>other Goths, she’ll go to bed>with you even>if you’re wearing your Gap>khakis (if she’s open-minded),>because you’ve>given her the NOTION that you>CAN pay attention, even if>what you offer>isn’t the standard thing that>she usually accepts as an>offer from a guy.

Sort of agreed here. It’s not a bad thing to appreciate someone’s values. >I think what we need to focus>on, here, is less the issue of>"be the prize">and more the issue of "pay>attention." Also, it’s less>the issue of "elicit>values" and more the issue of>"have confidence in yourself.">The things>that you "are" that make you>the prize, aren’t necessarily>non-transferable>choices like being a Goth or a>preppy. They’re inherent, deep>choices, like>being confident and secure and>decisive.

Yes, And being decisive in YOUR values is very confident.

>Learn to read her body, and>notice when she responds>positively or>negatively. Learn to notice>when her conversation becomes>suddenly animated>and positive, and have NO>preconceptions about where or>when it "should."

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A PUA needs to learn to become so powerful that it blows this frame away. Sheshould be noticing your subtle cues.

-Juggler


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bumped into ex-girlfriend: advice plz / Post 296




Subject: bumped into ex-girlfriend: advice plz // view thread onlinePost Date: April 11th, 2002 08:27:00 AM (EDT)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.generalArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

Tell her you are not looking to get back into a relationship. But that if shewould like, you two can be friends who just happen to sometimes make each otherfeel real good.

-Juggler


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bumped into ex-girlfriend: advice plz / Post 296Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com


















Subject: Eliciting values vs. ’I am the prize’ // view thread onlinePost Date: April 11th, 2002 09:42:00 AM (EDT)Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.advancedArticle Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact [email protected])Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com

Hey Guys,

Great, thoughtful responses by everyone. FinalD you continually amaze me withyour humble eloquence. Of course you are wrong, but you say it masterfully. :)

Okay, FinalD mentions a Goth chick. Let’s take an example from my life. Acouple months ago I met and seduced a young girl who is the lead singer of avery popular lesbian band. She is very different from me. I am a tall, squarelooking, white dude. I’m a right-wing, republican conservative for god’s sake.(except when it comes to sex and PU, of course)

Her values are liberal to the extreme. Now the question is, did I use hervalues to build a shared world? Heck no! When the subject came up I let herknow I am very different from her. And I let her be very different from me.

The point is to get to a place where you are very comfortable being 100%yourselves. To be able to think aloud in front of a girl. The only way to dothis is for you to become very comfortable hearing and expressing disagreeingopinions and values. And this will lead her to the same place.

Now, if you point out the differences in your values then the values which youhappen to be similar on will be all the more powerful and magical.

Trying to include values and build worlds sounds poetic and I’m sure it worksfor many guys, but try my advice here and you may find yourself in a whole newleague of possibilities.

Which brings me to another point. Many HB values are so built on sand. Theydon’t really know what they want or how to go about getting it if they do.Their values get blown around like the wind. If you try to build have yourcastle on her values with these kind of girls, you are chancing a very unstableproposition. Also many young girls are seeking for direction and someone totell them what values to have. If you try to include her rickety valuestructure she will have no respect for you.

And DrunkMagician, if you look carefully at Night’s values question which heposted in the lounge, which you seemed impressed with, wether he realizes it ornot, it is really a statement in the guise of a question. Very leading. I wouldnot take that kind of thing as an example of good EV cause it is not EV at all.And I will go further and say that it would be more powerful re-worded as areal statement.

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Use the values which you do not agree upon as sort of negs. You willdemonstrate alot of value by just mentioning how the two of you are notcompatible on so and so issue.

And remember emotions are much deeper and more powerful than values. Tryshowing a range of emotion through your material and that will give you astronger connection than you can ever get through shared values. Think dynamichere.

And to use the sales comparison. If you are selling Fords then you can ellicitvalues and find what the customer is looking for then find the perfect model tofit their needs. That works. But if you are selling Feraries, you can’t ellicitvalues, "Oh you want blue, huh? Well, how about a head-turning red instead."Your job is to sell your values (speed, excitement, power, social status,etc...) Be the Ferarie!

-Juggler


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On 4/11/02 1:32:22 PM, finalD wrote:>I do see how that could take place,>especially if you’re not very good at>this "eliciting" procedure. And I>definitely don’t question your idea that>you can just "bam" right across their>frame and be SO stunningly different>that you get to straight-out ask. But>it’ll depend on context, whether or>not we agree or disagree, and chances>are that we’ll be doing almost>exactly the same thing.

Come sarge with me sometime and then you will see how different this is to whatyou are used to. I promise you will never go back to what you were doingbefore.>For me, the>whole "murky" stuff is actually a lot>quicker than asking -- I just "get a>read" off the chick, or "figure out>her aura," or something, and after about>three minutes of interaction I’ve>started to weasel my way into her>consciousness.

Yeah, getting a read is cool. But what do you do with this read? >I don’t actually meet people in>situations where it would be too>effective>to just outright ASK, "so, wanna>fuck-buddy or do you want some crappy>Disney LTR" (or any question that will>immediately imply that)

You would be surprised where/when this can be accomplished.>so I don’t>disagree with your description of your>procedure, I just think you’re>misunderstanding the area in which I’m>doing mine.

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You may be correct there. But there are very few places where you can not dothis. What venues do you work? I do clubs and bars. Love street PU. Coffeeshops, pretty much everywhere except gas stations. >It sounds to me like>you’ve read into my whole description,>something about spending lots of>time slowly "wearing down" some kind of>resistance -- no no no. I’m out to>accomplish as much as possible as>effectively (quickly) as possible.

No, I didn’t think you got alot of resistance. A guy like you probably comesacross as very likable. >Her: "Fuuuuuun. Every girl loves fun.">(Thinks: if I say that answer I will>seem to him like a fun person and maybe>he’ll want to have a relationship>with me. I love it when men think I’m>fun and give me flowers for months>and months before we have sex.)

I never have that problem because I make it clear I am a player and not lookingfor a relationship. She knows what I mean when I ask that question.

-Juggler


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On 4/11/02 1:26:06 PM, finalD wrote:>Sounds to me like you DID "elicit>values" -- the value of letting her be>100% "herself."

Sort of. But I put my values first and never tried to mingle the two. Yes, intheory she is allowed to be herself. But in practice she is very influenced byMY values. > Your story agrees with>my post entirely ... check it again,>I said quite clearly that a good PUA in>khakis could seduce a goth chick,>as long as he didn’t start thinking of>EV as some act of fitting a chick’s>preconceived profile ("ooh, wanna fuck>Goth chick, gotta paint my face>white and get six piercings!") and>instead as something that becomes an>umbrella (confidence, 100% yourself,>etc.). It’s beyond me how you missed>that concept from my post and thought>you were espousing the opposite of>what I said.>>But anyway, it’s great to see we agree.

Yep, we agree on this point.

-Juggler


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On 4/11/02 5:00:33 PM, finalD wrote:

First off let me say that FinalD, if I was a girl I would want to marry youtoo. You have alot of things going for you. So yeah, in a funny way it’s toughto be you. Maybe you should give yourself an ugly scar or something.

Anyway, a few comments follow:

>>Is this making any sense? I find this>exchange very productive for ME,>Juggler, although I suspect you aren’t>getting much out of it except>explaining to another clueless wanna-be>just how perverse and limited his>view and experience of the world is. :)

Not at all D. I always get something out of your posts.>I’m realizing just how much I’ve>PARTICIPATED in other people’s>"token"ing of me; and how much my own>"interpersonal" zeal to find a "soul>mate like bond" is hampering my>sarging.

I’m not sure it is D. I like the idea of finding "soul mates". If you canpackage that concept along with the idea that before any girl would beconsidered for that position you would have to know that you two are physicalycompatible then I think you would have a very powerful tool.>I have mentioned that, before, on these>newsgroups. That in all>interactions, I tend to assume a level>of "ideal click" is necessary that>is MUCH MUCH higher a level than most>people are perfectly happen to>function on. Another reminder, this>thread.

If you mean "ideal click" like clicking with someone in a magical way than Iam on the same page as you. This is a wonderful thing man. Instead of fightingit you may want to use it. Let some girls know that that is what you are lokingfor and see if they try to live up to the notion.>Comments? Thoughts? Where am I going

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>wrong? :)

You have got to be the most honest guy posting here I think. You should meetCPowels one of these days. I bet you two are alot alike.

I don’t know if I can tell you in print how to move your game forward or how mymethod would work for you or anybody else in this group. My frustration at thatinability was one of the reasons I began to do the workshops. It is one ofthose things that in an afternoon of hitting coffee shops or a night on thetown it would become clear.

I don’t think I will be getting down to Florida anytime soon but it would becool to chat on the phone sometime about this stuff.

-Juggler


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DISCLAIMERJuggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com





Table of Contents.............. 1The Jaw-Dropping Juggler Archive v2.0 from Fast Seduction 101®

........................ 2Background

................. 3San Fran workshop cancelled / Post 241

................... 4Entertaining a group / Post 242

............. 5keeping it going(i know i’m gonna get flamed) / Post 243

............... 6Psyching myself out...How do I stop? / Post 244

............. 7Great kino, but still went home empty handed? / Post 245

................ 8Intriguing Transition to Palm-Read / Post 246

................ 9Humanely getting rid of UG CB? / Post 247


................. 11Re: Mystery’s PUA web page / Post 249


.................... 14Stop and Describe. / Post 251


............. 18The answer to sarging with too many GUYS / Post 253

...................... 19quick poll / Post 254

.................. 20Anyone use a motorcycle? / Post 255

..................... 21I’m a player / Post 256

.................. 22Unemotional Congruency / Post 257

................... 23DC Workshop April 4th / Post 258



............... 27Should we REALLY count kiss closes? / Post 261

................... 28pick apart my email / Post 262

................ 29Confusing Situation, Semi-Long / Post 263

................ 30Keeping her turned on...all night. / Post 264

................ 31Avoiding Pressure From Others / Post 265

.................... 32Advice needed.... / Post 266

.................. 33The ’Tom Selleck’ Opener / Post 267

................. 34This guy messing up my PU’s / Post 268

.................. 35The ’Tom Selleck’ Opener / Post 269

.................... 36suicide callback / Post 270

.................. 37Forix is in BIG trouble!!!! :-( / Post 272

............... 38weird situation: did i do the right thing / Post 273

............. 39OT: Do I overcompensade non-supplication ? / Post 274

............... 40HB Silicone update - she flashes me! / Post 275

............. 41What the hell? Shit test of some sort... I think. / Post 276

.................... 42OK..OK...I Get it... / Post 277

................... 43DC Workshop Opening / Post 278

................... 44DC Workshop Opening / Post 279

................. 45Being Led Instead of Leading / Post 280

................... 46ASF / NLP Book List / Post 281

.................. 47Re: ASF / NLP Book List / Post 282

................... 48Escalate into sex talk / Post 284

.............. 49her core value is committment. what now? / Post 285

................... 50workshops? Juggler? / Post 286

.................. 51Tips from a Natural GM / Post 287

................. 52girls talking about getting kids / Post 288

............ 53What I learned at Juggler’s DC workshop slightly O / Post 289

...................... 55Juggler! / Post 290

.................. 56Re: How NOT to cross the / Post 291

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Table of Contents

................. 57Eliciting values vs. ’I am the prize’ / Post 292

................... 58PUA’s Advice NEEDED! / Post 293


................ 60Re: Eliciting values vs. ’I am the prize’ / Post 295

................. 64bumped into ex-girlfriend: advice plz / Post 296





......................... 72DISCLAIMER

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Table of Contents

archive_[2008-03-29]_Juggler-(Wayne-Elise)_005.pdf

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