- 7249 -

proceedings of and of speeches at meetings or conferences, and am of the opinion that the methods used and circumstances re-lating to the method of recording of the proceedings of and speeches made at the meeting which was held by an organisation known as Natal Midlands Region of the Congress of the People at Regent Theatre Pietermaritzburg on 5th December, 1954, and also the methods used as well as the facts and circumstances relating to the nsbhods of technical recordings at any other meeting or conference of any organisation are facts, matters and things within the meaning of Section 233 of Act 56 of 1955. I object to the disclosure of the above facts, methods or things which on grounds of public policy and with regard to public int-erest ought not to be disclosed, as I deem such disclosure to be against public policy and detrimental to public interests, I accordingly claim privilege for the above facts, matters or things from disclosure." (Handed in G.1056.) BY THE COURT: I am not quite clear as to what facts the Minister claims to be privileged from disclosure. BY THE P.P. s The method of I will read it again: "I am of opinion that the method used and circumstances relating to

the method of technical recording of speeches and proceedings at conferences. BY THE COURT; That is the method employed in making the record-ings. BY THE P.P.; As well as facts, circumstances, relating to the method. BY MR. BERRANGE: I take it then that it debars the defence from testing the genuineness of the recording. BY THE COURT: I don't know. I haven't considered the position. One would have to study the provisions of this section. BY THE P.P.: There is a further affidavit: "I Charles Robert Swarts hereby make oath and say: I am the Minister of Justice and head of the Department of Justice. I have duly considered

- 7250 -

ail -fclte facts relative tft thg- technical fao&rding made W ^ ^ ' •

South African Police of the proceedings and speeches at meetings or conferences, and am of the opinion that the places where such meetings or conferences were held, except the following places, namely Queenstown, Regent Theatre Pietermaritzburg, 4a Kort Street, Johannesburg, 37 West Street, Johannesburg, the Parade Cape Town, are facts matters and things within the meaning of Section 233 of Act 56 of 1955. I object to the disclosure of the above facts, matters or things which on grounds of public policy and from regard to the public interest ought not to be disclosed. I deem such disclosure to be against public policy and detrimental to public interest. I accordingly claim privi-lege for the above facts, matters or things from disclosure." (Affidavit handed in G.1057.) MR. COARER: I may not have followed correctly that affidavit, Sir, but I think I understood it to be that the Minister of Jus-tice claims as a privileged fact, matter or thing, the places at which meetings were held. / BY THE P .P.; That is so, the places where meetings were held, BY THE COURT; Yes, I think that is what the affidavit says. (Magistrate reads affidavit.) I don't know what the effect of this is, why the place at which a meeting was held should not be disclosed. BY THE P.P.; Yes, Your Worship, I am not prepared to discuss the effect of that, that may destroy the whole value of the affidavit. BY THE COURT; Have you considered this aspect; is this in com-pliance with the reasons of Section 233. BY THE P.P.; Yes, in compliance with that section, or as a re-sult of that particular section, within the provisions of that, BY THE COURT; I mean the affidavit, does that comply with the requirements of that section. BY THE P.P.: That is my submission.

- 7251 -

BY MR. BERRANG-E; Of course, that may be the submission of the Crown. Your Worship will readily appreciate that we are not prepared to argue with you at the present moment. After con-sideration the Defence may raise this matter and may have some-thing to say and may have certain submissions to make to the Court in regard thereto. The position as I understand it at the present moment is that there are two affidavits. One affidavit prohibits any investigation or cross-examination which can test the authenticity of the tape recordings. The other affidavit prohibits any cross-examination whereby one can test the authen-ticity of the tape recording in the sense that the place at which the tape recording was made is withheld, from the Defence. In other words, if I understand the position correctly, this witness or some witness can come here and say at some place, unmentioned and unmentionable, in the Union of South Africa, a tape recording was made of certain speeches and this is what the tape recording reveals, and the Defence is then barred from testing the genuineness and the authenticity of that evidence. However, in due course we will deal with this ..... BY THE COURT;! don't know whether the Minister is the final ar-biter in this BY MR. BERRANGE: That is why I said in due course I would ask to reconsider the position. We would make certain submissions to Your Worship later on, if we think it worthwhile doing so. But at the present moment it seems to me that this is nothing else but an endeavour to stifle cross-examination. We shall deal with that in due course. BY THE P.P.; I agree that is more or less the effect, and the Minister is, in my submission, definitely the final arbiter in this. Once he has lodged, BY THE COURT; One can understand this in regard to the methods adopted by the police in their investigation, that under cer-tain circumstances it would warrant the non-disclosure of such

- 7252 -

methods in public interest, "but I don't quite appreciate the fact of this. BY THE P.P.: If Your Worship would like me to address you on that point I can. BY THE COURT; Well, the Defence is not making the point. I am merely putting it to the Crown. BY THE P.P.; Then there is another matter I would like to raise now, and that is the question of transcripts. I am aware of decisions of the Supreme Court where it was held that where tape recordings are audible and can be heard "by the Court, magistrates, prosecutors, defence counsel, as well as the Ac-cused and others, there the correct procedure is to play the tape recording here in Court. This tape recording which has now been handed in can be heard.... BY THE COURT; You mean heard by more than one person at the same time. BY THE P.P.: We haven't tested it, but I think it will be aud-ible in this Court. There are of course, certain words or sen-tences which are indistinct, and which can only be heard with difficulty. For that purpose there are transcripts available, but I am satisfied, and my submission is that transcripts in respect of this particular recording are not admissable, but my request here is that the Crown be allowed to make use of the transcripts and hand them in in order to facilitate the proceed-ings, but if there is any objection, or even if my learned friends remain silent, I will ask Your Worship to proceed by playing the recording.

BY THE COURT; Unless you have the consent of the Defence then you can't proceed in this matter. BY THE P.P.; Yes. I don't think there will be any difficulty in recording...... BY THE COURT; How long does it take to listen to one of these recordings

- 7253 -

BY THE P.P.: As long as the meetings lasted. BY THE COURT: For how long would that be? BY THE P.P.: That varies in respect of each meeting. BY THE COURT: Several hours? BY THE P.P.: Yes, it will be several hours. I think the re playing of the tape recordings will take quite a number of days, in this Court. It is quite evident to me, in any case, that some of the sentences and words will have to be replayed ill order to get a clear meaning here in Court. BY THE COURT: Will the Defence have an opportunity of checking that? BY THE P.P.: The tape recordings are here, and I intend in any case...... BY THE COURT: Of checking the transcripts, whether they are a true transcript? BY THE P .P.: They can be checked, and may I indicate I intend in any case to ask leave, even if the transcripts are handed in to play one or two of these recordings here in Court. BY MR. EERRANGE: Why? BY THE P.P.: For good reasons. BY MR. EERRANGE: Why? BY THE P.P.; In any case, I make that request,..,. BY THE COURT: I think you ought to take the Defence into your confidence entirely. They want to know why BY THE P.P.: Your Worship, perhaps to show in the first place that they are not fabricated, and they are there, the words are there, and in the seoond instance, my submission, that is, of course, the proper way of doing so BY THE COURT: But you can't have half-measures; it is either the one way or the other. If you want to have the quality of the recording proved in Court,.... BY THE P.P.: A further reason I submit is that the Court will get a very good idea of what is happening at these meetings, if

- 7254 -

one or two of these recordings are played here. Several tests, for instance, were conducted BY THE COURT; That sounds like a good reason; I have often wondered what the atmosphere is at these meetings. BY THE P.P.: Several tests were conducted here, and the Court, in my submission, can listen and hear.... unfortunately not see what took place, and judge for itself what is actually happen-ing at these meetings. BY MR. BERRANGE; I regret, of course, Sir, that the Crown has not seen fit to take us into its confidence at an earlier stage; if it had done so, we might have saved a lot of time. This has just "been sprung upon the Defence without any prior warning what-soever. I don't quite appreciate the necessity for all this secrecy. I don't think anyone would have gone and stolen the transcripts, or even tried to steal the transcripts. That "being so, Sir, and due to the fact that the Defence has only been ac-quainted with this new tactic on the part of the Crown at this particular moment it will be necessary for me and on behalf of my learned friends as well to ask for an adjournment in order to consider the matter. I ask Your Worship therefore to adjourn the Court in order to enable us to consider the whole position* And that is a matter for consideration which relates not only to the suggestion made by my learned friend, (a) that the trans-cript should be handed in, (b) that half or a portion of the recording should be played, and then the transcripts are handed in, and also the question of the consideration of the affidavits, made by the Minister. If I understand my learned friend cor-rectly, I am endeavouring to repeat what he says to see that I am under no misapprehension about this. Insofar as the trans-cripts are concerned, my learned friend, asks the Defence whe-ther it will agree to the transcripts going in, provided it gives the Defence an opportunity of checking the accuracy there-

- 7255 -

of, "because if I understand the position correctly if the tape recording has to "be played, they will take as long as the meet-ings themselves, which may last several hours at least, or even several days. But my learned friend says, if, even if the Def-ence does agree to the transcripts so "being handed in for the purpose of saving time, the Crown still wants to play a portion of the tape recording. One of the reasons given by my learned friend for that is because he says playing the tape recording is the proper method of producing this evidence. Well, if he is correct in that, logically it is half the proper method of producing the evidence. However, these are all matters which I feel might have been discussed with the Defence before today, in which case we would not have been in the position of having to ask the Court to adjourn the Court now to enable us to con-sider the position. BY THE P.P.: I have no objection. (COURT ADJOURNS) COURT RESUMES: BY MR. BERRANGE: During the interval, my learned friends and I have had an opportunity of discussing the matter with counsel for the Crown, and counsel for the Crown has indicated and given an undertaking that he is putting in, he is proposing to lead evidence about eight meetings »vhich have been recorded on a tape machine and my learned friend, in order to assist the Def-ence, has placed the Defence in possession of the transcripts of seven of these meetings. He hasn't done so in regard to the eighth one because some argument may ensure as to its admissa-bility in the sense that the Crown has informed us that the tape recording of the eighth meeting is no longer available and the Crown will endeavour at a later stage, when it comes to deal with this eighth meeting, to argue that the transcript itself will be admissable in evidence, and until such time as that matter has been disposed of and a judgment has been given

- 7256 -

in regard to the admissability or otherwise of that transoript no point will "be served in giving the Defence the transcript of this next meeting. So the position then at present is this: The Crown has indicated that it will lead evidence about eight meetings, the seven meetings are those in respect of which transcripts have been put into the hands of the Defence. The Defence naturally desires before coming to any decision as to what its attitude will be, to have the opportunity of perusing these seven transcripts, and they will require careful perusal. Furthermore, in view of the fact that I am representing other counsel who are not in Court today, and haven't been here for some time, I have in mind, Mr. Maisel, Mr. Rosenberg and their juniors, before I take it upon myself or either of my learned friends take it upon themselves to come to any agreement with the Crown in regard to the adbission of the transcripts, or any other matter which the Crown is desirous of having our agree-ment on, I would like to have the opportunity of placing the facts before those counsel who are not present in Court. In order therefore to peruse these transcripts and consult other counsel, I am now going to ask the Court to adjourn this matter until tomorrow morning. I hope that we will be ready by to-morrow morning to go on with the matter. My learned friend Mr. Slovo has asked me to make it clear that the number of meetings that will be referred to in this manner by giving evidence in regard to tape recordings is that number which I have already indicated, viz. the eight meetings referred to by my learned friend,. BY THE COURT; Does the Crown agree to the adjournment? BY THE P.P.: I agree to the adjournment, but I would like to make some commots on the last remarks of my learned friend, that the Crown will only lead eight tape recordings of meetings. It is clear I think that Queenstown is also mentioned in the

- 7257 -

affidavit, and that witness is not available and he may be led at a later stage. As advised, at this stage, the Crown intends to lead only these..., BY MR. BERRANGE; You haven't got a transcript of the Queenstown meeting? BY THE P.P.; No, we haven't made copies of that. We only have one transcript available, BY MR. BERRANGE; Will you lend it to me? BY THE P.P.; If it is decided no tape recording is avail-able. It is the Queenstown National Conference, 1953« BY MR. BERRANGE; So there are two tape recordings then of which no transcripts are available? BY THE P.P.; Yes. BY MR. SLOYO; Sir, before the proceedings are adjourned, Your Worship will recall that a number of weeks ago I raised the question of the approximate time of this preparatory examina-tion, when it would be over. We then received some approximate undertaking by the Crown that it would finish in the vicinity of the 23rd August BY THE COURT; The Crown had in mind, I think, the Crown evi-dence, that would be subject to the cross-examination. BY MR. SLOVO; Your Worship, I am not criticising at this stage; I just wish to indicate to the Court, based on that general approximation, various Accused including myself had made ar-rangements from time to time which it appears now we will have to forego in view of the fact that the proceedings have not finished by the 23rd. We certainly don't appear to have a prospect of coming to a conclusion at the end of this week either. I would again like the Crown to give an indication whether there is any prospect of finishing either at the end of this week or the end of next week. In our present position, one doesn't know whether they are going to lead new evidence

- 7258 -

which has come to their notice very recently. We have had that experience in the past few weeks which has affected the esti-mate, where evidence has been led obviously which hasn't been prepared at a very early stage of the proceedings. In the circumstances I should like the Crown for my own benefit, and I take it it would be for the benefit of all the Accused, to indicate to the Court now, whether any other type of evidence is going to be led before the end of the preparatory examina-tion BY THE COURT; Which may result in a prolongation? BY MR. 5LPVP; Yes, Sir, which may result in a prolongation. BY THE COURT:Is the Crown in a position to indicate that. BY THE P.P.: Your Worship, I even feel sorry for my learned friend Mr. Slovo, but I think I made myself quite clear at the time, that I was merely referring to the Crown evidence, i.e. evidence in chief, not allowing for cross-examination, and in some cases, lengthy cross-examination, and I still think that the evidence would have been on record by the end of this week if it were not the fact that cross-examination and lengthy cross-examinations were conducted. And then I also had in mind that certain admissions would have been made by the Def-ence and we were informed that they were not prepared to make these admissions any longer. That will mean that further evi-dence...... I at this stage contemplate lengthy evidence will be led. So it is impossible at this stage now to say when the preparatory examination will be finished, BY MR. BERRANGE: I don't think my learned friend when he spoke about these admissions that were desired of the Defence was aware of certain arrangements which I had been endeavouring to make with Mr. Van Niekerk. So for the benefit of the Court and also for the benefit of my clients, the Accused, I would like to reassure them that at the present moment, at any rate, failure to make these admissions, will not, as I can see the

- 7259 -

matter at present, will not prejudice them. The position is this: Certain admissions were sought from the defence; after mature consideration, "both amongst ourselves and also with Mr. Rosenberg, it was found that we were unable to make these ad-missions. We were then informed by Mr. Van Niekerk that in view of our inability to make these admissions, the Crown would need a month — my learned friend says he thinks much longer — in order to get all the evidence together in respect of these admissions. I have also indicated to Mr. Van Niekerk that in order to enable us to prepare our defence, prepare our arguments, decide what witnesses to call, we would require at least three months. So the suggestion was made by counsel for the defence to Mr. Van Niekerk, that whilst we are busy preparing our defence, he can be busy collecting his evidence but that in the meantime available evidence, i.e. evidence that is available to the Crown, with the exception of this evidence relating to the admissions sought, should be terminated, and that could be terminated very soon. After that we would seek a lengthy adjournment, both for the sake of the Crown and for the sake of the Defence. BY THE P.P.: That then appears to be the position. BY MR. BERRANGE: I understand from my learned friend that the available evidence at the present moment, is not of any lengthy nature. BY THE P.P.: This is my last, BY THE COURT; The contemplated adjournment will take place.... BY THE P.P.: At the end of next week or round about the end of next week. COURT ADJOURNS:

- 7260 -

COURT RESUMES 28/8/1957: MR. COAKER ADDRESSES COURT;

Accused Absent: Same as on 27/8/1957, save that Accused No. 56, now returned to Court; Accused No. 129, now returned to Court. Certificates handed in relating to Accused Nos. 132

and 133. LEAVE GRANTED FOR PROCEEDINGS TO CONTINUE: BY THE P.P. (MR. VAN PER WALT): There is the question of the playing of the tape recordings; I don't know what has been de-cided. BY MR. BERRANGE: I advised the Crown yesterday afternoon that we were not as yet ready or prepared to deal with the matter, the reason being, as I indicated yesterday that inasmuch as I represent other counsel here, Mr. Maisels and Mr. Rosenberg, that they themselves should be acquainted with the situation so as to enable them to take a decision as to what the Defence proposes to do in regard to the matter. Unfortunately Mr. Maisels was in Pretoria yesterday and Mr. Rosenberg is sick with the common complaint which seems to be sweeping the coun-try at the present moment, having emigrated from some foreign source, so I haven't been able to discuss this matter with them. I hope to do so, however, today, and I hope to be ready to address the Court tomorrow morning. The Crown was aware of that yesterday. BY THE P.P.: The facts stated by my learned friend are cor-rect. I have no objection to a further remaind until tomorrow. I would like to point out that the witnesses are from Cape Town, and especially the wife of one witness, Mr» Vlok, had a serious operation and he is urgently required so I would be grateful if my learned friend would do his best to proceed to-morrow . BY MR. BERRANGE; Yes, I may at some stage today seek leave of absence from the Court in order to have a consultation with

- 7261 -

other counsel in this matter. One matter — I don't know whe-ther my learned friend is in a position to give information on; I understand he is not — and that is the further cross-examination which was postponed, of this man Mgubasi, and I would like to know when it will he possible for the Crown to produce him for us for further cross-examination. BY THE P.P.; We have worked out a programme, if I may call it that until about the end of next week, and the cross-examina-tion of that particular witness and other witnesses were not included in this schedule. So Mr. liebenberg is actually deal-ing with that aspect of the case, i.e. in connection with the defiance campaign, but he will consider it next week when he thinks it is mostlikely to take place. BY MR. BERRANGE: I would like to ask the Crown to make it as soon as possible, because towards the middle of next month or so, or portion of next month, I shall not be available, and I would like to conclude my cross-examinations as soon as pos-sible . BY THE COURT; Prom about what date do you expect not to be available ? BY MR. BERRANGE; From approximately the 10th as at present ad-vised. I am hoping that all this will have been concluded long before then. BY THE COURT: I think the Crown can keep that in mind, that Mr. Berrange will not be available from the 10th of next month, BY THE P.P.: May I know whether the 9th of September will be suitable? BY MR. BERRANGE: Yes, it will be suitable to me, but if the Crown can make arrangements to have this matter before then, I will be grateful. Actually, I may say for the information of the Court and the Crown that I haven't got very much more that I want to put with regard to this man, but there are a

- 7^62 -

couple of vital points I want to take,

GLADWELL NGCAI. duly sworn, (Mazwai - Xosa/English) EXAMINED BY P.P.:

You have already given evidence, is that correct ? — Yes.

Did you make notes at a meeting held on 25th March, 1956 ? — I did.

What meeting was it ? — African National Congress, And was it held at Sophiatown, Johannesburg ? — Yes. What time did the meeting commence ?—11.30 a.m,

to 2,45 p.m. About how many persons attended ? — About 60. Who was the chairman ? — Simon Tyiki. Is he one of the Accused ? — Yes. (75). Did Resha speak at that particular meeting ? — Yes. Is he one of the Accused ? — (63). Read what he said ? — "Mr. Chairman, Sons and Daughters

of Africa. Last year when I was standing in this platform, I told you about the intentions of the Afrikaners. Early this year I told you that Dr. Verwoerd is intending to introduce the passes to African women. You thought that we hate the Afrikaner Many of you thought that we hate the Afrikaner. We don't hate the Afrikaner but we hate their evil deeds. Today the Police have the right to arrest not you only but even their wives and mothers. On Monday the 12th of this month the police went to Wynberg and told the people that tomorrow you should all send your wives to go and take the passes. On that Monday morning the women did not know what the passes were. They did not know what type of pass. We have always told you my people that we are oppressed. The Afrikaners realise that if we were to get our freedom we would surpass them. Here is a Msutu woman who had never attended school. When I got there last Monday there

- 7263 -

were- already women issued w-i th passos^- There .were women of-years. But there is not even one single woman who is happy with this reference hook. I said to her 'Granny, do you rea-lise that "by taking this reference book you have not dug your-self a grave but you have insulted the African soil.' But she said that 'My child I am sorry because I saw the other women taking the passes.' The Government of this country headed by the socalled lion of the south, Mr. Stri.jdom, and behind him is Blackie Swart, and on his side is Mr. Verwoerd, and in front is all the police and on the back they have all the soldiers. Because they are so evil they start with a small town. How many dirty Europeans Tve find in the market bitten by lie3*, but they will never ask them pa;=saa Friends, why our women must be idantified by dirty vicious and msultable policemen, not by us. How many non-Europeans are being raped by Europeans? How many of them? Besides that, the black man never went to Holland to go and make colour. It is these dirty swines, that you see these coloureds "

You can omit the rest of his speech. (Notes handed in G.1058.) FURTHER EXAMINATION BY P.P.: (9/1/1955)

This is in connection rith a meeting held on 9/1/55 and Sgt. P.J. Coetzee gave evidence in respect of this same meeting. Did you make notes at a meeting held on 9 A/55 ? — Yes.

A meeting of the African National Congress, Sophia-town ? — Yes.

Will you.... do you know whether Sgt. Coetzee was there ? — Yes.

And will you go through your notes and mention the names of all the speakers ? — Chairman Mr. Mane, next speaker Joe Magoma; next speaker Eric Made; next William Ngwendu.

- 7264 -

Is he one of the Accused ? — Yes. (53) Continue — the next speaker ? — Joe Matlou, Is he one of the Accused ? — Yes. (38). The

next speaker Christina Karia. The next speaker was Robert Resha.

Is he one of the Accused ? — Yes. (63.) (Notes handed in G.1059.) (No further questions) NO CROSS-EXAMINATION;

PATRICK MDUNGA, duly sworn, - ?uln /English) EXAMINED BY P.P.:

You have already given evidence ? — I have. Did you make notes in respect of a meeting held on

22nd April, 1956 ? — I did. Was it a meeting of the African National Congr'"'"-

Yes. Where was it held ? — Sophiatown. Johannesburg. Who was the chairman ? — Simon Tyiki. w * — Is he one of the Accused ? — Yes. (75)» The next speaker ? — A. JVIa.shaba. The next speaker ? — H. Tshabalala, Is he one of the Accused ? — Yes. (77) The next speaker ? — T. Magupe. e~

Is he one of the Accused ? — Yes. (26) Yes, the next ? — P. Nthithe. Is he one of the Accused ? — Yes. (57) Was he the last speaker ? — Yes.

(Notes handed in G.1060.) FURTHER EXAMINATION BY P.P.: ( 27/5/56, )

Did you also make notes in respect of a meeting held on 27th May, 1956 ? — I did.

Was it a meeting of the African National Congress ?—

• s - 7265 -

Yes, it was. Where was it held ? — Newclare, Johannesburg. Who was the chairman ? — Sampie Malupe. Is he one of the Accused ? — Yes, (31)» The next speaker ? — Kereleng. The next speaker ? — Bennet Sechiro. Is he one of the Accused ? — Yes. (64.) The next speaker ? — Frans Ndebele. Yes, who spoke after him ? — FishJCeitsing. Is he one of the Accused ? — Yes. (15).

(Notes handed in G.1061.) (No further questions) NO CROSS-EXAMINATION;

CORNELIUS JACOBUS STRACHAN. duly sworn; EXAMINED BY P.P.:

You have already given evidence in this case ? — Yes. On 9th February, 1954, did you attend a meeting of

the S.A, Society for Peace and Friendship for the Soviet Union, Trades Hall, Johannesburg ? — That's right.

Can you say whether Det, Sgt. Coetzee accompanied you ? — Yes.

And also a stenographer, Mr. Davis ? — Yes, the late Mr. Davis.

Did you take possession of certain documents at that meeting ? — I did.

From whom ? — From Philemon Nokwe, one of the Accused. (56).

You hand in those documents ? — Yes, (G.1062.) It is certain notes that he made, handwritten; made by Nokwe, in whose possession I found it.

And the next document, G.1063, what is that ? — It is a letter to the Secretary-General, African National Congress

- 7266 -

P.O. Box 9207, Johannesburg. , dated 25/1/54. Prom S.S.Mokoena, Secretary, Bloemfontein — the address on the top is the Afri-can National Congress, O.F. State Branch, 3297 Maseto Street, Bochabella Village, Bloemfontein. It is a list of names of executive members. (No further questions) CROSS-EXAMINED BY MR. COAKUR:

One thing I didn't hear, Mr. Strachan; who was the* sergeant who accompanied you to this meeting ? — Sgt. Viviers,

Of the Security Branch ? — Yes. What did he do at the meeting ? — He sat next to the

late Mr. Davis. He didn't himself make notes ? — I saw him writing in

a small pocketbook. So he may have been making notes.

BY THE P.P.: May I assist here. Actually, he took down hand notes, Mr. Davis did, and my learned leader, Mr. Van Nie-kerk, asked Dr. Murray to express an opinion on that report submitted by Mr. Davis, and I think he gave the Court the as-surance that that report would be handed in at a later stage. And exhibit number has already been given to that report, but at this stage that report won't be tendered in evidence. BY MR. COAKER: I wonder if my learned friend is in a position to tell me what was the number assigned to that particular document. BY THE P.P.: I have not been able to ascertain that; I will find out what the number is and give it to my learned friend,

1 CR0S5-EXAMIN1TION BY MR. COAKER CONTD.:

Mr. Strachan, the only thing you did at this meeting was to take into your possession the documents you have now handed in ? — Yes, I listened to the various speeches of the different speakers, and at the conclusion of the meeting I

7267 - —

-book possession of thess "two documents. (No further questions) MR. SLOVO: NO QUESTIONS;

JAMES AUGUSTUS P-2TER NUNS, duly sworn, EXAMINED BY P.P.:

You are a detective sergeant, S.A. Police, and also the official draughtsman ? — Yes.

On the 25th and 26th June, 1955, were you at a meet-ing held at Kliptown ? — I was.

Do you remember what meeting it was ? — It was a con-ference of the Congress of "the People.

Did you prepare a plan ? — I prepared a plan showing the locality where the meeting was held.

And you hand in the plan, Exh. 1064 ? — Yes. Did you prepare the plan from your own observations

?—2 I did. Is the plan drawn to scale ? — The plan is drawn to

scale in paces. Will you explain the plan ? — The plan is self-explan-

atory, everything is indicated on the plan. The platform is indicated ? — Yes, the platform is

indicated on the plan, towards the left, i.e. on the west side. Then you also indicate a delegates' enclosure ? — Yes,

that is in the centre of the plan. Then the speace open to the public ? — That is correct. And that was divided by a wire fence and hessian,

about six feet high ? — The wire fence, plus-minus 6 feet high. What I want to know is this; you also indicate the

railway property; is that the railway line ? — Yes, on the west side.

Can you tell the Court what the distance is from the platform to the railway line, or to the fence, a wire fence indicated on the plan ? — The distance from the platform to

7268 -

the wire fence on the railway property is 33" paces. And from the platform to the wire fence and hessian,

dividing the delegates' enclosure from the public enclosure ? — The distance from the platform to the wire fence dividing the delegates enclosure from the public stand is 70 paces. (No further questions) CROSS-EXAMINED BY MR. COAKER:

Mr. Nuns, I see on this plan, 'Particulars by Det. Sgt. Von Papendorp and witnesses, plan by Det. Sgt. Nuns,' Now which of the particulars on this plan were supplied by Det, Sgt. Von Papendorp ? — Those are particulars relating to points A & B on the plan which don't have anything to do with this particular case.

What have they to do wit i ? — They have to do with another case; I don't know which case it was. I went out and these points were pointed out to me and I put them on the plan. That is A and B.

Have you no idea what they have to do with ? — I have no idea.

Have you marked all the loudspeakers on this plan ? — I marked the loudspeakers which I took particular notice of; there might have been others that I didn't see, but the loud-speakers in that particular enclosure were two that I have marke d.

I take it that you knew when you went to this meeting that you were going to prepare a plan ? — I wasn't certain that I was going to prepare a plan, but I did presume that at a later date I would prepare a plan; we usually do.

Your instructions were to acquaint yourself suffi-ciently with the scene of the meeting to be able to prepare a plan if necessary ? — No, the main object of going to this meeting — I am also an official photographer — the main ob-

- 7^69 -

ject of going to the meeting was to take photographs. Did you take photographs ? — I did. Can you remember very much about the meeting your-

self; have you got a clear impression of it in your mind today ? — Well, it was a long time ago, but I can remember it fairly well.

Whereabouts on the plan was soup without meat being served ? — If I remember correctly, food was being served more or less at the back of the platform. There Is one place there where the words 'electric generator1 appear. If I re-member correctly, it was in that vicinity.

Soup with meat ? — I know food was served, but I don't know what kind it was.

There was a good movement of trains up and down the railway line, were there not ? — There were a number of trains up and down, yes.

And some of them blew their whistles and behaved like trains do ? — That is correct.

You, I suppose, paid no attention at all to the speeches that were being made ? — None whatsoever. (No further questions) MR. SLOVO; NO QUESTIONS; NO RE-EXAMINATION;

SOLOMON DUNGA; duly sworn. EXAMINED BY P.P.;

You have already given evidence in this case ? — Yes.

. You are now referring to Exh. G.983 ? — Yes. Did you make a translation of that exhibit ? — Yes,

I did. Prom which language ? — Prom Xosa into English. Will you read from the beginning, the outside cover

- 7270 -

? — "African National Congress, Annual Report of the Cape Pro-vincial Conference held at Korsten, Port Elizabeth, on 18th and 19th June, 1955."

The next is the introduction is that correct ? — Yes* "This Conference is being held at a time of great trial when

peoples' the well-known/leaders are not here amongst you, a fact which will be more seriously dealt with in this report which I have compiled for you in the name of our Provincial Executive. I do hope that I, your obedient servant, that you have appointed to struggle with this great task did not at any time give of-fence to you. The contents of this report are all yours friends which should help to enlighten us all. For all the faults which were my responsibility and ever since I assumed the dut-ies of secretaryship serving my people I most humbly beg for your pardon. Immediately I assumed office as secretary, I be-came the national organiser of the Congress of the People, This latter office therefore demanded my absence at many times from Provincial Headquarters. This was the reason why I could not discharge some of my duties as your Provincial Secretary expediently, especially as far as correspondence was concerned. It is quite clear that such a task of being Provincial Secre-tary of such a big organisation like Congress demands a full-time worker. Correspondence from the various branches comes in tens a day, not to mention the many other duties of the Pro-vincial Headquarters. All these things therefore confronted one man, hence my appeal to you to forgive me for my short-comings. I am quite certain that all the obstacles put in our way by the Government in respect of our movements will not ever discourage us. Congress will/remain strong. Here therefore is your report, the aims of our Provincial Executive Committee are that all members should have this report and it is compulsory for all branches to be in possession of it. Contents (l) Min-utes of last year's provincial conference

- 7271 -

I don't want you to read the whole document. Will you refer to page 5, Elections of Members ? — Election of Execu-tive Committee for the year 1954-55 June.

Read the names slowly, and if you know any of the Ac-cused "by that name, will you mention it ? — Professor S.K. Matthews, President, Alice.

Do you know him ? — I know him. Is he one of the Accused ? — Yes. (109) The names.... ? — Dr. J.Z. Ngongwe, Dr. R.T. Bokwe,

Mr. R.M. Matjie, New Brighton; Rev. J.A. Calata, Cradock. He is one of the Accused (100). Rev. W.S. Gawe, Queenstown, one of the Accused (103); Mr. C.J. Mayekiso, New Brighton, he is one of the Accused, I think. (113). Mr. B.M. Jack, Korsten, Mr. Matomela, New Brighton',' Mrs. F Matomela, New Brighton; Mr. G. Ngotyana, he is one of the Accused (92); Mr. J. Foley.

Now, refer to the heading "A Message to Freedom Vol-unteers" is that correct ? — Yes.

Will you read that ? — "We call upon all the people of this country to stand together and fight against the oppres-sion which is a product of discriminatory legislation. We ap-peal to them to undertake the great task of removing apartheid with all its accompanying evils forever. We call upon all African men and women to pledge themselves as freedom volun-teers. Our leader Chief Luthuli wants 3,000 volunteers and we should not disappoint him. These volunteers will go amongst the people speaking to them We want our volun-teers to take a great step like that of 1952. Then they did a great job of work which will remain immemorable in the history of the country, forgetting all the pleasures of this world and prefer to go to prison. Today we speak not of gaols, we speak

all the of getting/men, women, boys, girls to rise up now and fight for their freedom. Volunteers are requested that in the

- 7272 -

case of all "bloodthirsty mcthoda the police may adopt against them, they should he calm and never allow their pi-Sionsto get the better part of them. They should he determined in whatever they mean to do and never lose the courage to fight for freedom in our lifetime. We call upon all freedom-loving people, let us get 50,000 volunteers in order to fix Strijdom. Let us go for-ward to freedom. This call is made by Chief A.J. Luthuli, national volunteer in chief. Provincial Volunteer in Chief:

of Stuttor^im is ou^ Mr. M. Mjaxa,/Cape Provincial Volunteer in Chief. He was recently elected in succession to Dr. Njongwe as the Cape Volunteer in Chief during March. He is assisted 'ji.rciif"v,r,,',+ by the Provincial Volunteer Board and other volunteer cc^"5 ttees» All the volunteers in chief will have to confer privctt 1̂ Tr Coring this Conference to discuss their programme. The Transvaal vol-unteer in chief Mr. Robert M. Resha. We are waiting the arrival of Mr. Resha the Transvaal volunteer in chief, A chance will be given to this brave son of Africa to meet the volunteers of this Province together withour own Provincial volunteer in chief and to discuss with them such matters as they will find worth going into. Mayibuye Afrika,"

He mentioned Robert M. Resha, Do you know him ? — Yes, I know him.

Is he one of the Accused ? — Yes, he is. (63)

Read on please ? — "Pledge of Freedom Volunteers. I am convinced that I should fight until victory is achieved, all discriminatory laws ~ repealed and the voice of the freedom loving people is heard at the historic Congress of the People and therefore I the undersigned, a freedom volunteer, do hereby solemnly promise to serve my people and my country to the best of my ability according to the recognised policy of the African National Congress. I shall always be ready to perform the duties which I will be called upon to accomplish by

- 7273 -

the African National Congress. I shall at all times obey the orders of my leaders and will faithfully obey the directives of the National Volunteer Board. Date Signed. "

Read the whole document ? — "The Rules for Volunteers. The objects of this rule for volunteers is to force a ...... of service and devotion in the cause which we have undertaken. Volunteers must develop a ....... within themselves of self-help and must be prepared to perform all duties which may be placed upon them. Volunteers should execute all the directives which they may receive from their leaders. Volunteers must ex-pect to be criticised for their mistakes without ill-feeling being created. Volunteers must be an example to the people as a whole in appearance, demeanour and self-denial. Therefore they must keep their clothing, characters and bodies spotless. At no times must volunteers be found under the influence of liquor and should always endeavour to avoid places where law-lessness and immoral habits are prevalent, (c) When volunteers are at work they should always be alert and lively. Volunteers should never allow themselves to be overcome by anger and should exercise the greatest amount of self-control. Volunteers should always be prepared to work at all times," That is the end. (Translation handed in G.IO65.) (Mr. Davis report is G.594) CROSS-EXAMINATION RESERVEDi

HEAD CONSTABLE VAN PER MERWE, beedig verklaar, EXAMINED BY P.P.:

You are a head constable, South African Police, stationed at Moroka ? — I am.

On the 21st April, 1955, did you proceed to the Don-aldson School ? — I did.

Where ? — At Jabavu. Is that where the principal is Edwin Mokhete ? — Yes.

- 7?74 -

When you arrived there, what did you find ?—-Beside the s-chool grounds I found a native constable holding two native women.

Who was the native constable ? — The native constable was Paul Mothlabane.

Do you know the names of the two native women ? — The two native women were Doreen Motsabi and Lucette Mbalati.

Prom there, where were these two women taken ? — They were taken to the Moroka Police Station and gaol. (No further questions) BY THE COURT: Does this relate to a school boycott incident? BY THE P.P.: Yes, at that particular school. The purpose of this evidence is merely to link those two women up with the African National Congress. I am calling other witnesses. The principal has already given evidence that they entered the classroom and chased the children out, and he called the native constable and he arrested them. NO CROSS-EXAMINATION:

JOHAN TABETHE, duly sworn. (E. Mazwai, Zulu/English) EXAMINED BY P.P.:

You have already given evidence ? — I have. During April 1955, did you see two certain women in the

Charge Office at Moroka ? — I did. Who were they ? — Doreen Motsabi and Lucette Mbalate. Do you know them ? — I do. Can you say whether they are members of the African Nat-

ional Congress ? — Yes, I would say that. On the 26th June, 1955, did you attend a meeting of the

Congress of the People at Kliptown ? — I did. Did you make a list of names of persons whom you saw at

the meeting ? — I did; Do you have the name of Doreen Motsabi there on your list

- T275 -

<?— Yes, Is that the same person ? — Yes, the same- person. Did she attend as a delegate ? — Yes.

(No further questions) CROSS-EXAMINED BY MR. COAKER*

Why do you say that Doreen Motsabi is a member of .the African National Congress ? — She was wearing the Congress dress.

I don't understand you — the Congress dress ? — Yes. which is black

By which you mean what ? — That is a dress/with the col-ours of the Congress flag.

And what about Lucette Mbalate ? — Whenever she attends meetings she puts on the Congress badp;a.

Which badge are you referring to ? — It is the pin that is pinned on to the lapel with the first and the thumbs sticking up*

Those are the only reasons why you say that those two persons are members of Congress ? — Yes, and they also speak at the meetings of the Congress.

Both these two women speak at meetings of Congress ?—Yes. And you have notes to that effect ? — Yes, at some other

meetings which I have attended at which they have spoken that would appear in my notes.

I take it these are public meetings ? — That is correct. Public meetings of the African National Congress,

At which it is open to anybody who wishes to to make a speech ? — Yes, that is what would be said.

You have never been present at any meeting at which either of theseiwo women joined the African National Congress ? — No, (No further questions)

- 7276 -

CROSS-EXAMINED BY MR. SLOVO: Do you often go to the Moroka police station ? — Yes, I do How often would you say you go there ? — Every day except

Monday, Friday and Sunday, And I take it that you often see persons there, who have

been arrested "by other members of the Force ? — Yes. I take it that you have on occasions seen, Congress being

such a big organisation, you have on occasions seen members of Congress in there who may have been arrested on a charge of theft ? — Yes, it happens.

That is people you may have seen at any Congress public meetings ? — Yes, that is so.

And you have seen people who have attended any Congress meetings at the police station who have been arrested on a charge of rape ? — No.

Are you sure ? — Yes. Fraud ? — No, Anyhow, have you often seen people who have attended Con-

gress meetings at the police station who have been arrested on a charge of theft ? — No.

One or two occasions ? — No, I have not seen anybody whom I have seen at Congress meetings arrested for theft. I have seen people whom I have seen at Congress meetings at the charge office, some coming to lay a complaint.

You have never seen a Congress man in the charge office who has been arrested on any charge such as theft, rape, or something like that ? — I have never seen anyone.

Or housebreaking ? — No, not one that I have seen of those that I know.

And at any other charge office ? — No. You talked about the A.N.C. Colours. Would you have a

look at this set of colours. On the assumption that the blue

- 7277 -

there is green, are those the colours of the A.N.C. ? — Yes, I would say that because one is green, black and yellow.

In that order ? — No, I cannot remember now whether the yellow is on the top and the green at the bottom; I cannot say.

You can't remember ? — No. But you know that there is always one colour on top and

the same colour at the bottom, but it is always in the same order. In the A.N.G. Flag, or when people wear, as you say, an A.N.C. dress, the Colours are always in the same order ? — I cannot state in the dress how the colours stand.

Lastly, have you ever seen a Congress man arrested on a charge of not having a pass at the Moroka Charge Office ? — No, not one that I know of that I have seen.

Your Worship might be wondering what the purpose of these questions are in relation to other arrests. The witness did suggest to me at first that he might have seen a Congress man on a charge of theft. The question which I was then going to put to him was whether there was any suggestion that that was planned by the National Executive Committee of the A.N.C. That was the purpose towards which I was leading, and it appears that this man has never seen a Congress man arrested for any of these offences I have mentioned. (No further questions) NO RE-EXAMINATION:

FRANS JOHANNES VAN HEERDEN, beedig verklaar, VERHOOR DEUR P.A.:

U het alreeds getuienis gegee ? — Ek het. Op 1/4-/56, is u na Wesstraat 37 Johannesburg ? — Ja. En was daar -n konferensie van die S.A.Congress of Demo-

crats aan die gang ? — Daar was. En het u beslag gel§ op sekere dokumente ? — Ek het.

^ W 4 a

; ' t • • »

Van wie ? — Van Helene Joseph. Een van die Beskuldigdes ? — Ja. (13) Hoe het u die dokumente gevind; was hull© in n omslag of

hoe het u dit gevind ? — Hulle was in -n omslag gewees. En waar het dit presies gele ? — Hulle het voor die Bes-

kuldigde op die tafel gele, Edelagbare, Sers. Von Papendorp het alreeds getuienis

in verband met die aangeleentheid gegee en soortgelyke doku-mente is alreeds ingehandig en identifiseer. I would suggest that I don't ask the witness to identify the documents again merely to hand them in under one exhibit number, the file con-taining documents. Nou, u handig die dokumente in ...... BY MR. COAKER: Before my learned indulges in this procedure, X would just like to get it clear that every document that is now about to be handed in, is the same as something that has

by already been handed in/another witness. BY THE P.P.: You Worship, I wouldn't say everyone, most of them. BY MR. COAKER; Then I must object, Your Worship, because it is necessary for the Defence to know what documents have been handed in. BY THE COURT: The Defence can, of course, know by examining these documents. BY MR. COAKER: Quite so, Sir, but if a particular exhibit is handed in under one number consisting of a bundle of exhibits, then the exhibits may get lost out of that bundle, others may be BY THE COURT: I don't think each exhibit would have to be num-bered separately. They can be handed in in one bundle, I have no objection to that. They must be separately listed, that is what I mean.

- 7275 -

BY THE P.P.: This is about the last witness for the day so we can do it. BY Iv'.-.. COAKER: As long as the Defence are in a position to know now, and as long as it is on record, what documents have been handed in. It is obviously not necessary to assing a number to every document; that is quite another matter, BY THE COURT: They will have to be numbered separately with new numbers, that is the only way of identifying these docu-ments afterwards, if necessary. BY MR. COAKER: Or they could be given one number with A.B.C. and D., that sort of thing. BY THE COURT: I have no objection to that. COURT ADJOURNS: COURT RESUMES: FRANS JOHANNES VAN HEERDEN. nog onder eed: VERHOOR DEUR P.A. VSRV.:

Nou, jy handig in n leer, Bewys. G.1Q66 ? — Sk handig dit in.

Dit bevat die dokument waarop u beslag gele het ? — Dit 1 is so,

Die dokumente word dan gemerk-van A tot P ? — Dit is so. En in die omsfeg is n verklaring deur uself ? — Dit is so. En daarin word die dokumente identifiseer ? — Dit is so. En u verklaar dat daardie verklaring van u is geparafeer

deur my geleerde vriend,.mnr, Coaker ? — Dit is so. Op dieselfde dag het u ook dokumente geneem van wie ? —

Dit het behoort aan J. Hoogendyk, Is hy een van die Beskuldigdes ? — Hy is. (130). U handig in n leer bevattende die dokumente, Bewys. G.

1067 ? — Dit is so. En die dokumente daarin is gemerk van G.1067 van A tot

J ? — Dit is so.

- 7280 -

En in die omslag ook n verklaring van u ? — Dit is so. En in u verklaring word die dokumente identifiseer ? —

Dit is so. En geparefeer deur mnr. Coaker ? — Ja.

(Geen verdere vrae nie,) KRUISVLRHOCR DEUR MNR. SLOVO:

Constable, what time did you arrive at this hall ? — Ek kannie presies se nie.

Was it during the morning or the afternoon ? — Dit was in die oggend gewees.

Had you been keeping observation prior to your entry to the premises ? — Ek is nie seker of ek het of nie.

Have you ever kept observation at those premises ? — Ek het al.

And whjre do you keep observation ? — Van die straatse kant af.

Is it part of your regular duties ? — Ja. And the observation that you kept, was it on specific

days ? — Nee. Or only days when you received instructions ? — Nee,

meestkeer het ek dit op eie in\::iatief gedoen. Were you ever given instructions to keep observation

inside the premise^ ? — Nee. Did you ever do so yourself, on your own initiative ? —

Nee. (No further questions) MR. COAKER; NO QUESTIONS; GEEN H.RVERHOOR:

ANDRIES JOHANNES KRUGER, be"dig verklaar; EXAMINED BY P.P.:

You have already given evidence ? — That is correct. On 1/4/56, did you proceed to 37 West Street, Johannesburg

? — Correct.

- 7201 -

Was there a Conference of the -S.,A,Congress of Democrats ? — That is correct.

Did you take possession of certain documents there ? — I did.

From whom ? — Sidney Shall. Is he one of the Accused ? — He is. (67). And you hand in a file Exh, G.1068 ?-- Yes. Containing the documents you took possession of ? — Yes,

They are marked from No. 1 to No. 14. (No further questions) CROSS-EXAMINED BY MR. SLOVOs

Sergeant Kruger, did you keep observation prior to your entry into the premises ? — No,

Had you on any previous occasion kept observation out-side those premises ? — Yesf I did, on»'<, on 25th June, 1955.

Was that the only other occasion ? — That was the only occasion I can recollect.

Do you recall ever keeping observation inside the pre-mises ? — No, I don't think I was ever in that building before that date.

This was the first time that you entered ? — I think so. You are not certain ? — I am not sure; I can't recollect

of any other time that I went there. (No further questions)

JOEL CAMANE, duly sworn, EXAMINED BY P.P. ;

You have already given evidence ? — I have. Did you make notes at a meeting held on 25th March, 1956

? — I did. Was it a meeting of the African National Congress ? — Yes And where was it held ? — Corner of Griffiths and Hamil-

ton Roads, Newclare, Johannesburg,

- 7282 -

What time did the meeting commence ? — 1.45 p.m. Until ? — Until about 6 p.m. About how many persons attended ? — About 50. Who was the chairman ? — Bennet Sechiro. Is he one of the Accused ? — Yes. (64.) Omit what he said. Who was the next speaker ? — Isron

Moloela. Was there a speaker Fish Keitsing ? — Yes, the third

speaker. Is he one of the Accused ? — Yes.^JJL^. Read what he said ? — "Africa in our lifetime. I would

like everybody to look at this leaflet which is a word to Ver-woerd. We do not want our women to carry passes. Those women who shall carry passes you must know that they are police women because they shall be arrested by police. You heard the Ver-woerd said it is the first time for African women to carry passes, as it is not necessary for them to go to the court.

-If*the women refuse these passes means they shall not be con-vioted according to explanation from Verwoerd. This square here is our parliament. We therefore represent our women as we say we do not want pass. This Government is organising more than necessary. We have chiefs in our organisation such as A.J. Luthuli. We have ministers such as Huddleston who is now ordered to leave Africa. We have nurses and police in this organisation. Last year we said we do not want Bantu Education. Those teachers who did not listen to us were sacked. Why? Because of our words. Africans do not be afraid, this country belongs to you. Africans wake up and organise the police to attend meetings. In 1957 we must take over for freedom. Afrika, Mayibue. In time women refuse passes."

There were other speakers ? — Yes. (notes handed in G.1069.)

- 7283

FURTHER EXAMINATION BY P.P.: (13/5/56.) Did you make notes at a meeting held on 13th May,

? — Yes. Was it a meeting of the African National Congress ? —

Yes. Where was it held ? — Newclare, Johannesburg, At what time did the meeting commence ? — 11 a.m. to

2 p.m. How many persons attended ? — About 50. Who was the chairman ? — Bennet Sechirp, the one I have

already identified. (64) Did he address the meeting ? — Yes. Read what he said ? — "Ladies and Gentlemen, we are

meeting here under the auspices of the African National Con-gress. We come here to speak on what is happening. We see people attacking the Government. We see South Africa is a police state. We see the policemen is between the judge or "before the magistrate. We see Africa is wearing the German dress* We see people being deported by the police, not because of the law. We see people are banned by police. V/e see people are ruled by police on point of the gun. We see the chief is deported but wanted his trial in court. This man is now to go back to his people. In a point of view, who is the judge amongst these three persons. You white policemen you have guns, pistols, when you see the black man you shoot. Is indeed a shame for police guarding us shooting. Even now in this car they have a machine gun. Why they go about with a gun? That gun the African will answer and you will shoot. That gun shall not fail if I take from the owner to shoot. Let us speak to-gether this gospel of African National Congress. To police we say let us all be equal before the law. In tine to come

- -

w'o shall all share in "the country. The Government is trying to " I can't make out the following word, "....the law for Africans to "be defended hy laweyrs. The Government is pre-paring a charge in connection with the high treason. What a funny thing, because there is no war here. I want to say this that it will happen in Germany. It was like that in America, ladies and Gentlemen, let us talk to the Government and say: My dear man, you are digging your own grave. The days are coming to an end. Let us say you may be banned or deported. Some years ago Swarts was given the same medicine that Congress has now. The Court of law is condemning the Minister of Native Affairs and Governor General E.G. Jensen. Today because these people are fooolish they are giving Jensen other powers to be a screw driver to prove that verwoerd was not elected by Africans last year when women went to Pretoria he ran away. This year when the Advisory Board members went to Parliament to see the Minister of Native Affairs Department were not al-lowed to see him. In other words, he, Verwoerd, tells you that he was not elected by Africans. Ladies and Gentlemen, let us come together and look for freedom, not the oppression. Let us put the Preedom Charter before Government and see who is against. If we get freedom we shall not see the policemen up and down with a gun. Under the oppressive Government we see the armed policemtn to go to an armless man, Moses Kotane. The police said to Kotane : We are sent by Government to demand pass and t. x. Kotane told them: I do not carry that. When Kotane told them that he has a tax not other things, he was arrested and put in a big truck. At police station he was ad-vised to pay the admission of guilt. Kotane said he cannot

pay, but he is on bail. We see African men digging " Omit the rest of his speech. Who was the next speaker ? —

- 7285 -

Fish Keitsing. Is he one of the Accused ? — Yes. (15) ) Read what he said ? — "First sing a song. Umzima lom-

twalo usinda amadoda." That means 'This load is heavy, it heats the man.' "Ladies and Gentlemen, you hear the song I •ing is a heart "break. When there is a war you must come first. We are in war of women. Stand on your feet. We talk-ing of somebody very important, Chief Ramakoka was not chosen by any individual but was born being a chief. Strijdom wants to make slaves. Comrades, this is happening at Krugersdorp, where the old lady sentenced to 12 months for failing to go to work. They do not care whether you have somebody sick. You women here the case at Wynberg is on you. There is only one thing we can do their support. Tell the people and policemen that they must join this organisation of African National Con-gress. Africans, there are two routes you must vihoose. You go to slavery to to the freedom. Comrades, you jiust go out of house and fight, because you will die, even in the house. Africans the people are letting us to be killed by the Europeans. Comrades, let us not support our enemy. Today the young police-men are going to house to house. Here are tickets of the A.N.C. they must be finished when we leave here. The Africans who are chased away from Johannesburg to Swaziland, Bechuanaland, and yet the Europeans are all over. It does not matter, the police can shoot me, but I do my work. Let us send our mes-sage to outside people. If I am sentences to the farm the Dutchmen shall cry. I ask the police official to convey what the speaker said. People say shall not carry pass. Afrika, Mayibuye."

Then the next speaker was the chairman,?— Yes. And the next speaker ? — Sampie Malupe. Is he one of the Accused ? — Yes. (31)

- 7286 -

Turn "back, "before Sampie Malupe, was there another speaker ? — Yes, Theophilus Mnv ,

Is he one of the Accused ? — Yes. (40). Was there an interpreter when he spoke ? — Yes, Who ? — Andries Chamile, Is he one of the Accused ? — Yes. (8),

(Notes handed in G.1070.) (No further questions) CROSS-EXAMINED "BY MR. COAKER;

You stopped reading frc^ jp^ech of the chairman, Bennet Seitchiro, at a certain point. ? — Yes.

Will you look on page 10 of your notes, still the speech of Bennet Seitchiro, and you find these words there: "You know that this organisation is a non-violence." ? — Yes.

"let us fight these people with knowledge." ? — Yes, (No further questions) (No further questions) MR. SLOYO: NO QUESTIONS: NO RE-EXAMINATION:

COURT ADJOURNS:

- 7287 -

COURT RESUMES 29TH AUGUST, 1957. APPEARANCES AS BEFORE : MR. COiJClJR ADDRESSES COURT s

Accused Absent i Position Some as on 28th August, 1957.

In default : No. 7, Isaac Bokala; No. 104, J. Jack. No. 116, S. Kalipi excusdd from attendance on 30th August, 1957.

MR. 3ERRANGE ..DOSSES COURT : Before Your Worship proceeds with the witness, there

are some observations that I have to make arising out of that which I addressed Your Worship on yesterday. Your Worship will r~collect that when Mr. Swanepoel was last in the witness box, he had given evidence that a certain tape recording had been made of a certain meeting and thereafter he went on to hand in two Affidavits, G. 1056 and G. 1057 purporting to be signed by the Honourable the Minister of Justice, the contents of which are known to Your Worship, which I do not need to deal with. Sir, Your Worship will also recollect that it was at that stage that we adjourned for the purpose of enabling me to consult not only with my colleagues who are in Court, but also with Counsel whom we are representing and who were not in Court at this time. Such a consultation has now taken place, and I have the following to announce to Your Worship. The Defence, Sir, will endeavour to show at s ome stage or another that tape recording evidence is always vulnerable to criticism, because it is so susceptible to tampering unless elementary precautions are taken to ensure that no tampering takes place. The Defence will also indicate th:.t such precautions were not taken in this particular case. And despite the fact that such evidence, namely tape recording evidence is suspect in the manner in which I have already indicated, the Crown now seeks to put in these two affidavits, signed by the Minister, which

7288 -

has the effect or which have th<= effeot first of all of pre-venting the Crown itself from proving the authenticity of th^ tape recording evidence, and secondly which prohibits the Defence through cross-examination directed towards the manner in which this evidence was taken, from testing the genuineness of these tape recordings. That, Sir, I think will be conceded by everybody, is the effect of the two affid .vits which have been placed before the Court. And Y/e submit th .t Section 233 of the Criminal Procedure Code was not intended for this particular purpose. 7e feel, Sir, thr.t it would be a sorry state of affairs, or it is a sorry state of affairs when the Crown endeavours to take advantage of this Section in the Code whereby the Crown endeavours to put into evidence what it cannot prove, because that is what it really amounts to. However, Sir, after consultation, and having regard to the fact that these proceedings have now taken the better part of a y~ar, and in view of the fact that the Crown has supplied us with the transcripts which are supposed to indicate what is contained on the tape recordings, and because the Defence have found nothing in these speeches which aro recorded on these transcripts which in the opinion of th^ Defence takes the Crown case any further, or advances the Crown case and also because if objection is now taken by us to these Affidavits and to the procedure adopted by the Crown, these proceedings could possibly be delayed for at least a month ibf not more, the Defence has decided that under these circumstances it prefers to s\y "nothing regarding the admissibility or the validity of this evidence, and we do not propose to advance any argument at the present stage in regard thereto. It is of course, Sir, to be clearly understood, that in adopting this course, we are not abandoning any objection which we might later take in regard to the validity of this

procedure or the admissibility of tho two affidavits to which I have referred. At the present moment we are not advancing

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any argument in regard thereto. BY THE COURT s

Are you agreeing to the transcripts going in for the time being? BY MR. BERRANGE :

I am going to deal with that now, Sir. I understand from my learned friend that he has transcripts which relate to some seven meetings, and indeed as I have already indicated those transcripts have been made available to the Defence. And as a result of discussions which the Defence have had with the

*

Crown, we have agreed on behalf of the Defence, that these transcripts should go in as part of the record, and they should go in on the basis that these transcripts are what the Crown alleges is contained on the tape recordings. And as a result, therefore, Sir, of the attitude adopted by the Defence in this respect, the Crown has indicated that it will not be asking for any of these transcripts to be played to the Court or to the Crown and the Defence and the Accused, and nor does the Defence ask for such transcripts to be played over. It is however to be understood that the Crown has reserved to itself the right at a later stage- if it so desires to exercise that right, of playing these transcripts to the Court, and similarly the Defence has also reserved to itself this right. In adopting this procedure, I am happy to say that both my learned friend for the Crown and I feel that we will be able to save at least five days of the hearing. Of course, whatever agreement the Crown and the Defence have arrived at in regard to this aspect of the matter, is subject to Your Worship's concurrence, which we both, the Crown and the Defence, will be forthcoming. BY THE COURT :

Is there anything you wish to add? BY THE P.P. ; (MR. VAN DER WALT) :

Except one thing, I agree with what my learned friend

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has said, and I think we have also discussed the desirability

of reading all the transcripts, and we have cone to an agree-ment, also subject GO Your Worship's approval, that I won't ask the witnesses to read the whole transcript or all the transcripts of the speeches of what was said. That of course, I know, places the Court, Your Worship, in a difficult position, but I think seeing this will shorten the proceedings, there may be an early adjournment, and Your Worship will be given an opportunity to read them here, if it needs Your Worship's approval. BY TH2 COURT s

That is a difficulty that has been raised before, and that is that the transcripts be not read, or portions of them, you will remember. My feeling was that at any rate some of the transcripts should be read so that the public knows what is going on in these proceedings. BY MR^ BERRixNG-E :

The position is this, that first of all, so far as the Court's own convenience is concerned, transcripts ca$ be made available to Your "rr or ship, and of course the Defence, and I think I am speaking on behaof of th_ Crown too, would have no objection to an early adjournment so as to enable Your Worship to acquaint yourself with the contents of these transcripts.

So far as the public are concerned, Sir, the transcripts will now become documents of record, and they will be available to the Press at any time if the Press desires to avail itself thereof. BY THE COURT s

I appreciate that. The position is entirely clear to me and I think we can proceed on the basis as indicated.

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PETRUS CORNELIUS 5WANCPOEL, duly sworn; EXAMINED BY THE P.P. s

I think you mentioned the last time when you gave evidence, that you made a transcript of the tape recording, is that correct? Yes.

And you hwe the transcript now before you? Yes, And you h,.nd it in, EXHIBIT G. 1071? Yes. To which meeting does that relate? - — To the

Conference of the Midlands Region of the Congress of the People, held at th^ Regent Theatre, Pietermaritzburg, on 5.12*54.

There is a heading on the transcript, is that correct? — Yes, the heading was put there by myself.

And there are also names of speakers appearing on the transcript, is that correct? Yes.

Do the n:mes appear on the tape? -—- Some of the speakers are announced on the tape by the Chairman, and others not, The Chairman himself was not announced by anybody, but I Recognised him.

You recognised him, and you put in the name? Yes, on the transcription.

And did you see all the speakers? Yes. Will you just go through the speakers. Who were the

speakers? The first one? The Chairman was Dr. W. Z. Conco. He is one of the Accused (127). Thereafter an Indian male made q, very short announcement. I did not recognise him, I don't know who he was. Then Mr. Robert Resha was the next speaker. He is also one of the Accused (63). Then an unkown Indian male read the speeches - read messages to the Conference. Thereafter Stephen Dhlamini, made a speech. He is also one of the Accused (128). Then Mr. J. H. H. Hoogendyk, who is also one of the Accused (130). Then Mr. N. T. Naicker, who

- .7 2*52 -

is also one of the accused mr.de a speech (141). Those were the only speakers.

And I think we had better m .ke it clear. Some of the speakers spoke in a Native language, is that correct? Only-one speaker, Stephen Dhlamini made his speech in Zulu and in English* He spoke first in the one language, and it was not translated or interpreted by ah interpreter, :.nd thereafter he made his speech in Zulu.

Which language did he speak at first? At first he spoke in English, and then he repeated his speech in Zulu, or he made a speech in Zulu after speaking in English.

When he spoke in Zulu, was that again interpreted into English at the meeting? - — No.

Was the interpreter at any stage used at the meeting? — Yes* an interpreter was used throughout the proceedings.

There was only one stage where the Chairman seemed to think th-t the proceedings were being stretched out too long and he sugges-ted that they do away with the services of an interpreter for a short while, but thereafter they ag .in used an interpreter.

Did all the other speakers spe^k in English and it was translated into English? Yes, they all spoke English. NO FURTHER QUESTIONS.

CROSS-EXAMINED BY MR. BEREANGE : Mr. Swanepoel, I have very little technical knowledge

of tape recordings and things of that sort. I don't know how much knowledge you have got, I hope more than I have. Last night I was browsing through a magazine, which probably I shouldn't have been doing. It is a magazine called Esquire. Have you ever read it? Yes.

And reading through the advertisements in this maga-zine, Esquire., I saw an advertisement for a little gadget which costs 295 dollars. The gadget, as it was described in this

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advertisement was a small pocket tape recorder which can be fitted into one's pocket, concealed in one's clothing, and it indicated that the microphone attached to the tape recor-der, could be either a wrist watch or a tie pin, or even if it is a woman, earrings and then there was also a little hand microphone which was shown. Have you ever seen that sort of advertisement? Yes, I have.

Have you ever seen that sort of a machine? I think I have. I don't know if it is the SEjne type that is being referred to. I have se<=n them displayed in shop windows.

Have you ever handled one of them? No, never. With tape recordings, ordinarily they are taken on a

tape? Yes. It is a magnetic tape? Yes. And by utilisation of a magnet, anything that has been

recorded on this tape, is immediately expunged? One can do it. BY THE COURT s

By what means? BY MB. BSRBANGE :

By using a magnet on the tape which has the recording, by merely applying the magnet to the tape, a sentence or a word or a noise can be expunged. And then of course it is also possible if for instance one wanted to expunge a portion of a speech from a take recording, to use a magnet for so eradicating the speech from the tape, and then cutting the tape and splicing the ends together. That is also possible? It is possible.

So it would be possible, by the use of a tape, to give a speech that was made by an individual, a completely false result? It would be difficult to sort of connect it up at the proper places again. Should you cut the tape and then splice it together again, one would probably have the effect

- 7294 -

that the man would be saying a sentence and then, where the tape is connected one would immediately hear that this is - hear that there is a discrepancy.

What do you mean by discrepancy? You would sort ofmtice that his voice is, for instance, not on the same note on the one word than where it is on the next word. I mean you would njtice immediately that a thing like that had been done. BY THD COURT s

You mean that the splicing would create an interference on the recording? Yes, it would. One would notice it immediately when playing back the recording. BY MR. BERRANGE s

But Why? Assuming that a whole sentence was taken out - let us take a sentence in this speech. Assuming you have this sentence. 'I will call upon the representatives now of the various organisations to give us the messages which they have brought to this Conference, of the Congress of the People'. I am reading from page 11, twelve lines from the top. Then

in the next sentence i 'He is/the Secretariat of the African National Congress. I will call upon Mr. Dhlamini to deliver his message in Zulu and English'. Now if it was required to cut out the sentence 'He is in the Secretariat of the African National Congress' and to make the speech read 'They have brought to this Conference - I call upon the representatives to give us the messages they have brought to this Conference of the Congress of the People, firstly Mr. Dhlamini, A.N.C. Natal,' and then leave out the sentence 'He is in the Secretariat of the African National Congress', and go on with the next sentence 'I will call upon Mr. Dhlamini to deliver his message in Zulu and English'. It would be perfectly possible to cut out that particular sentence, namely, 'He is in the Secretariat of the African National Congress', wouldn't it? I suppose if you could cut it off directly after the word 'Natal'....

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And the word 'I' starting on the sentence beyond the next. That would be perfectly easy to cut out that one sentence,.? It wouldn't be easy, but it would be possible.

But it could be done? Let us leave out the word •easy'. It could be done? Yes.

And it could be done by stopping at the word 'Natal* and starting again with the words 1I will call'? . Yes.

And when that recording is ultimately played back, no one will know that a sentence has been cut out? They would of course be able to see op the tape that the tape has been spliced.

I say when it is played over, no one would be awaye of the fact that the sentence has been cut out? — - I am not an expert on this thing, but I think that where the tape is spaced, as it is played over you will hear something, because

You will hear the splice? You will hear the ^nterfeiance, not a normal sound.,.

An interference due to the splice? - — Yes. I want to disagree with you. Are you sure of that?

—» Yea, because when I played this back, when I made this transcription, my tape broke in one place and you can hear that so easily.

Your tape did break? - — Yes* So you spliced your own tape? And there are splices

in your tape? Yes, there are two in mine. Oh, I see.

BY THE COURT : When did the tape break? When I was playing it

back, when I was making this transcription. You say this one tape was broken in two places?

Yes, there are two places that were spliced again.

-7296 -

BY MR. BERRANGE : Perhaps you didn't do your splicing very skillfully?

I ara not an expert. Do you disagree with me when I say that an expert

could splice a tape in such a way as to make it perfectly in-SiW ! audible? r-,— I would not disagree with you.

I want to m .ke it clear that I am not suggesting that on the two plages which your tape has broken and where it has been spliced that you h .ve omitted anything, but I only want to put it to you that such a thing could be done? Yes, it could be done.

At these two places where your tape is spliced there may be sentences - it would have been x^ossible for there to have been sentences which have now been eradicated? I don't think with mine. I think where the tape broke in mine, it broke in the middle of s sentence.

Well, then, there may be words? Possibly there might be one or two.

Let me put something else to you. Assuming that a speaker were to say 'The Prime Minister of Cambodia is a villian. We should murder him', and assuming that in the course of that speech the word - somewhere or other in that speech, the words 'hero' and 'love' appeared, that sentence which I h :ve just indicated to you, namely, 'The Prime Minister of Cambodia is a villian. We must murder him', could be changed to read 'The Prime Minister of Cambodia is a hero, We must love him'. Could it not? By the use of your magnet?

I do not think so. One would have to get the same speaker to say that word again.

No, because you could take the word 'love' .fter having eradicated the word 'murder' and the word 'hero' after having eradicated the word 'villiah' and you could substitute that word by splicing again. Isn't that possible? I wouldn't

- 7297 -

like to say it is possible. You don't know? No. May I put it to you generally, I don't know how far

your technical knowledge goes. May I put it to you generally, that tape recordings are recordings which can lend themselves to falsification? I suppose by experts it would be possible

Have you ever served on any other Branch other than the Special Branch? Yes.

Have you ever on the Gold and Diamond Branch? • No. Served on the Liquor Branch® No, I have been on

the Criminal and Commercial and Housebreaking, You have never in your young rookie d^ys dealt with

contraventions of the Pood and Drugs Act? •—- No. But you nevertheless do know a little bit of the

procedure and the law in regard to the Food and Drugs Act and the Diamond and Gold Law> Yes.

When a Policeman or an Inspector goes into a dairy because he is of opinion that the milk that is being sold is adulterated, he usually goes in and buys himself some milk,

and then having done so, he tells the unfortunate shopkeeper who he is, and thereupon for the purpose of prosecution, he makes three samples does he not? One for himself, one for the shopkeeper and one for examination? That is so? Yes, I#ve heard that that is so.

And also when you have a Gold or Diamond trapping case, you must know of course, although you may not have been

on the Staffs, that what happens after the trap has been sprung and where the police are lucky enough to recover the gold or diamonds, which sometimes they are not able to do, the articles either the gold or diamonds, arc then taken together with the Accused to the Charge Office, and in the presence of the Accused they are sealed with the official seal on them? Yes

- 7298 -

I know that. And thereafter when the case is brought before the

Court, if the Accused has not been sufficiently lucky to get the case withdrawn, those official seals are broken in Court. You know that? - Yes.

What do you suggest is the reason for adopting this practice» for instance under the Pood and Drugs Act of making three samples, giving the Accused one, keeping another one for yourself and for sealing exhibits such as gold and diamonds what is the reason for that would you imagine? . — I would imagine that it would obviate the possibility of any person being able to tamper with the samples or adding anything to

the samples. Tampering? —<- Yes, In other words, it is done for the projection of the

Accused? • Yes, Tell me, when you had completed your t&pe recordings

of this particular meeting, did you go to any of the speakers and say look, I hc.ve "taken some tape recordings and now in your presence I am going to seal them wixh an official seal? .—- No, I did not.

Did you take any steps to go to the Accused there and then - or to the speakers, they weren't accused at that time and say look, we have taken a record of what you have said and just to be sure that there is no tampering and in order to

protect you, I would like to play these recordings over to you so that you c~n be satisfied. Did you do that? No, 1 did not do that.

So in the case of taking tape recordings, that is never done by the South African Police, that you know of? As far as I know, this is the first time that they have taken tape recordings. I don't know where there are - there are no

Collection: 1956 Treason Trial Collection number: AD1812

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